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Published Date: 12 October 2008
ALEX Salmond is demanding an extra £1bn from Westminster in an attempt to protect the Scottish economy from the worst excesses of the global financial crisis.
As the Scottish economy is swept up by worldwide financial turbulence, the First Minister has identified money held in the UK Treasury that he believes should be handed over to Scotland to boost the economy.

Salmond will convene a special Economic Cabinet on Tuesday in an effort to drive his proposal forward and exert some influence over an economic situation that is already out of control.

His plea for more money will infuriate those who believe that Scotland already receives more than its fair share of funding from the Treasury. Salmond's opponents will also interpret the move as another SNP bid to drive a wedge between Holyrood and Westminster.

The First Minister has earmarked a series of funds which he believes should be subjected to the Barnett Formula, the controversial mechanism that allocates Scottish funding and results in Scots receiving £1,500 per head more of public spending than the English.

"We are facing extraordinary and highly volatile circumstances, and everything that can be done must be done to protect jobs, investment and household incomes," a spokesman for the First Minister said.

"The SNP Government's priority is protecting Scotland's economy. We should also be in a position during these difficult times to use Scotland's resources much more fully. That's why the Economic Cabinet will identify additional resources which could form a potential £1bn programme of investment to help reflate Scotland's economy, including accessing Scottish Government funds currently held at Westminster.

"At a time when the UK Government's own budget rules have effectively been set aside in an attempt to get to grips with the financial and banking crisis, it makes every sense for the tight and unfair Westminster controls on Scotland's budget to be relaxed – so that we can invest in a package to support the real economy and stave off the threat of recession."

All Cabinet secretaries and junior ministers with portfolios looking after transport, climate change, enterprise, energy and tourism will attend the meeting to be held during the parliamentary recess next week.

Ministers will claim the Barnett Formula should be applied to the London Olympics regeneration spending fund, action that would result in Scotland receiving £33m per year until 2013. And, if applied to the £1.2bn Carter Review of Prisons Spending in England and Wales, the formula would net Scotland £120m.

Similarly, there would be £40m of Barnett consequentials for Scotland between 2008 and 2011, if the formula were to be applied to police and firefighter commutation costs south of the border.

Salmond will also call for the relaxation of Treasury restrictions that are currently preventing the release of more than £120m from the Fossil Fuel Levy surplus.

Another source of income would be found by bringing forward the Scottish Government's £42m underspend, which is currently held at Westminster until 2011.

According to the SNP, a further £476m, which Scotland lost out on as a result of the suspension of the Council Tax Benefit mechanism, ought to be made available. The mechanism was introduced at the outset of devolution so that the Treasury could claw back money from the devolved administrations, which were expected to charge a higher council tax than England. In reality, Scottish council tax rates and rents increased at a lower rate than south of the border, resulting in money being paid out to Holyrood.

To the anger of the SNP, the arrangement was ceased in 2005 in exchange for a one-off £57m payment. The SNP estimates the resulting loss has been running at £100m per year.

Salmond envisages that the cash will build on the package announced in August during the Donald Dewar lecture, when plans to bring £100m of affordable housing investment and £180m from European structural funds into the Scottish economy were announced.

Last night Andy Kerr, the Labour shadow finance secretary, said the package was a reheated and recycled set of discredited demands.

Kerr said: "You have to ask what is the point of the SNP? All they do is constantly refer to others when they want something done and it is usually the UK Government. It is dishonest to claim for funds that are not available.

"Meanwhile Labour has spelt out clearly once again to Alex Salmond what he can do. He should abandon his proposals for the Scottish Futures Trust and get on with capital programmes and infrastructure development. The Parliament's Economic committee was told last week by representatives from the construction industry that delays in SFT were creating a black hole in Scotland's infrastructure programme.

"Labour has given Alex Salmond specific examples of what he could start with such as trunk road maintenance, Scottish Water improvements, Bishopbriggs prison and investment in skills and training. It is entirely in the SNP's hands. What Scotland needs now is a government that can act instead of reheating old, unfounded grievances."


The full article contains 834 words and appears in Scotland On Sunday newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 11 October 2008 7:29 PM
  • Source: Scotland On Sunday
  • Location: Scotland
 
1

The Answer,

Glasgow 11/10/2008 21:11:56
Didnt the English tax payers bail out RBS and HBOS at a cost of 25 billion English pounds!

What a cheek "the fat one" has.
2

Thomas79,

Ayrshire 11/10/2008 22:01:24
Hold on The Answer, the whole 25 billion is not just english money, it is english, scottish, irish and welsh money. It is UK money, and about £2 -2.5 billion is scottish taxpayer money, you should know that. Besides, that is not the issue, the real answer is to give Scotland full financial freedom, all taxes raised in Scotland to be spent in Scotland, then the SNP will not ask, or blame, westminster for anything.
3

Vivas,

Edinburgh 11/10/2008 22:01:55
It's Toom Tabbard who borg-like repeats the "whatever it takes" mantra.

So go for it Alex, and ask for "whatever you can " and do "whatever it takes" !
4

Peter Curran,

Kirkliston 12/10/2008 00:15:59
"ALEX Salmond is demanding an extra £1bn from Westminster in an attempt to protect the Scottish economy from the worst excesses of the global financial crisis. As the Scottish economy is swept up by worldwide financial turbulence, the First Minister has identified money held in the UK Treasury that he believes should be handed over to Scotland to boost the economy."

What a wicked, unprincipled man! Asking for money he thinks the people of Scotland are entitled to! Iain, Annabel, Tavish - you must speak out against this outrageous demand. And where is our bright and smooth new Secretary of State for Scotland?

Now's your chance to show your mettle, Jim. Make sure Scotland doesn't get this money that they are entitled to it might help to protect them against the recession. Horror of horrors - some of it might go to help Glenrothes.

Show them what a UK Secretary of State is really for, Jim.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giUZYyxKE0g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ey-5ymkm784
5

subrosa,

12/10/2008 00:58:10
Andy Kerr: It is dishonest to claim for funds that are not available.

What a ridiculous comment. Surely he meant 'It is dishonest to withhold funds which should have been made available'.

6

Edward,

12/10/2008 01:24:25
Story now beginning to emerge in the Mail on Sunday, is something I’ve being saying all along about the handling by the government and subsequent share slump in the Scottish Banks, especially the Royal Bank of Scotland. Was the briefings given to BBC’s Robert Peston and how he seem to be able to come out with a running commentary.
From the Mail on Sunday ‘The BBC’s business editor Robert Peston has broken a string of exclusives on the financial crisis which have led MPs to demand an official investigation into the source of his information. A massive row broke out after Peston reported on Tuesday morning that bank chiefs were seeking capital from the Government at confidential talks with Chancellor Alistair Darling and Bank of England Governor Mervyn King. Two banks – Royal Bank of Scotland and Barclays – issued denials, but it was too late to prevent the value of bank shares plummeting. Shares in RBS fell by a staggering 39 per cent, wiping £10billion off its value’
Turns out that ‘The BBC journalist has excellent contacts in the Square Mile and in Government, including leading City PR man Roland Rudd, who represents Lloyds TSB, and Schools Secretary Ed Balls, one of Gordon Brown’s closest confidants. Peston met both men while working at the Financial Times in the early Nineties’
‘One writer on the Financial Times’s Alphaville blog later claimed of Peston’s Tuesday morning report: ‘Working from an old script (ie the practice followed by their boss John Kingman) junior treasury officials briefed Peston . . . While Kingman’s people might have hoped their briefings would smack of strong government, what took a real beating was Royal Bank of Scotland.’
It also transpires that there were some curious dealings with Northern Rock as its revealed in the same article ‘Mr Kingman, 39, has also been involved in two other aspects of the credit-crunch crisis – the nationalisation of Northern Rock and the Lloyds TSB takeover of HBOS – which were the subject of Peston scoops.
7

roughrider,

Glasgow 12/10/2008 05:18:43
Thick as dog dirt the waste of space clueless Kerr said: "You have to ask what is the point of the SNP? All they do is constantly refer to others when they want something done and it is usually the UK Government. It is dishonest to claim for funds that are not available.
Andy Kerr is a joke a thick ponce who milks the public purse for everything he can get.
Thicko KERR tried and failed to get the taxpayer to pay for repairs to his garden wall,the tax payer has paid for everything this ponce owns.
Aint that right Kerr.
8

donald,

glasgow 12/10/2008 05:19:58
Ben Dover Hoose wherefore art thou?
9

corrigenda,

Harpenden 12/10/2008 06:46:29
Wouldn't you have thought that after the need to rescue HBOS and RBS, after the collapse of Iceland's economy (where their GDP per head had been nearly two and a half times that of Scotland) and now with Salmond bringing out the begging bowl yet again, that those who harbour dreams of Scottish Independence will finally begin to see the light? Let the message go out that the thinking Scot on the other hand is thankful for the capability of the Union to help all in the UK at this difficult time.
10

,

12/10/2008 07:01:05
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
11

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12

steve 1511,

aberdeen 12/10/2008 07:27:23
were doomed with broon doomed i tell you,get intae them alex get as much as possible for scotland,as for fat andy kerr a man who thinks mcdonalds burgers are healthy eating,dishonesty is taking a freebee to wembly from a burger company and only declaring it when caught out red handed
13

roughrider,

Glasgow 12/10/2008 07:33:05
Kerrthicko knows all about dishonesty.
It,s labour policy to tell lies.
14

Rob,

12/10/2008 07:37:37
It's embarrasing really. Salmond's usual reaction - let's get someone else to pay because it's "no fair" and "hasn't been for years."

You call this governance? Westminster will tell him get lost - quite correctly.
15

Patrick O'Reilly,

Coatbridge 12/10/2008 07:44:29
Alex Salmond? Who he? Is this the "First Minister" who has been missing for days? Scotland deserves better than this oaf.
16

roughrider,

Glasgow 12/10/2008 07:49:46
Looks as if the labour trolls have been given their orders to post the usual tripe.
Pathetic little unionist @rse lickers.
17

John S,

12/10/2008 08:01:21
Andy Kerr, the Labour shadow finance secretary, I thought he was the leader of Labour in the Scottish Parliament, so who is the present leader of Labour in the Scottish Parliament ?
18

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 08:01:59
When is Salmond going to stop embarrassing the Scottish people?

Does he have no sense of embarrassment himself?

The man is a disgrace. Out with the begging bowl at every opportunity.

Maybe if this toe curling embarrassment of a First Minister never wasted money on,

name/signage changes for the Scottish executive,

Islamfests,

200 yard taxi trips

jollys to the Ryder Cup

then he could maybe put the begging bowl back in its cupboard.
19

daveserviceman,

edinburgh 12/10/2008 08:08:28
I wonder which Muslem Group Alex Will be giving this Billion UK Pounds To
20

roughrider,

Glasgow 12/10/2008 08:16:16
Ruffes t dung dweller you and your ilk are an embarassment to the Scottish people.
21

Keir Hardie,

Inverness 12/10/2008 08:33:44
#18 don't make the mistake of thinking people of all opinions work the same as the potty-mouthed puerile nat trolls that post playground jibes and bullying on every subject with ruthless efficiency. Why argue the issues when you can all agree to call opposition politician X a smelly bum or something over the years?
22

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 08:46:06
#22 Roughrider

Great post. Keep up the good work. Your mother will be very proud of you.

23

Gtj,

12/10/2008 08:59:49
The onlything that is embarrassing here is the level of bitterness and small mindedness of some of the posts here.
24

TWC,

Ayrshire 12/10/2008 09:01:01
Before the next GE Scotland will be offered some Fiscal powers(but only as little as the treasury think they can get away with).
If this is not Full Fiscal Independence then there will be a landslide to SNP.
The lack of regulation and lack of control on credit has nearly ruined the country. Brown needs to go; he's desperate for the rcovery so he can claim the glory but he was part of the cause.
We need to look after our own money. Like him or loath him Salmond has been calling it right before Westminster (along with Mr Cable)
25

porker!,

Stirling 12/10/2008 09:07:05
#23 Oh the purity of the unionist comments!
26

albanman,

12/10/2008 09:10:40
#21 daveserviceman: If you're going to spout nonsense, at least learn how to spell. The word is Muslim, you cretin.
27

Rodster,

Glasgow 12/10/2008 09:12:57
Financial meltdown , massive job losses , house repossessions , bankruptcies,higher taxes , fuel poverty , hungry pensioners , more kids below the poverty line .
all great news if you are a Labour Supporter in Scotland , because the upside is you can trash the Nationalists and talk up the union .
The human misery who cares ?
a glimmer in hope of saving the union is worth it , you can really go to town now on the old platitudes of too weak , too poor , too stupid oh the joys .
we can keep the jobs for the boys we can keep up the dependency culture
Today is a great time to be a Unionist!!!!
28

porker!,

12/10/2008 09:13:03
#1 Stupid comment from an ignorant arrogant colonialist English colonialist.
I am sure that you are no hypocrit and will move to England after independence.
29

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:21:51
Does anybody trully believe the Barnett formula covers our nation in these circumstances???????????
Was the Barnett formula derived with global meltdown taken into consideration?????
If not then obviously more cash is needed it isnt rocket science and you dont have to be an economist to work it out. In fact all Scotland really needs to do is stop sending any cash down South and stop receiving cash from Westminster.
Let Scotland operate on its own resourses and let Westminster cope on theirs.
Now how can any unionist worth his salt disagree with that proposal??
30

Andra, Dundee,

12/10/2008 09:22:28
I'm pretty sick of Salmond the whinger now.
We could really do with a break from his pathetic stirring. There is so much in Scotland that he is neglecting - why has he stopped building schools?
31

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:25:08
5

Strange how funds became available to invade Iraq and Afganistan.
They could scrap the trident project and use the money as a cushion in these turbulant times.
32

Andra, Dundee,

12/10/2008 09:26:15
#2 Thomas79
We know that some of the £25bn in Scottish money - but where would this money have come from in your Scottish Utopia?
I think we'd be in a Iceland like crisis and our two banks would have either gone bust our been bought for English pennies. The Brown/Darling plan is a good one for Scottish jobs and will hopefully keep one of not two world class banks HQed in Scotland.
This Union dividend works both ways but it's certainly working in Scotland's favour on this matter.
33

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:27:07
33

Alex Salmond isnt a builder nor archetect he is the First Minister of Scotland and it isnt in his remit to actually build schools he only provides the funding to allow others to do so.
As you are so obviously an imbecile you can be forgiven for not actually knowing that.
34

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:28:24
35

No we would be in the same crises situation as Norway.
How are they coping by the way?
35

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:30:12
35

"This Union dividend works both ways but it's certainly working in Scotland's favour on this matter."

Care to go into detail and explain just exactly what this union benefit is for Scotland? and do you think this union benefit would do Norway any good as well?
36

Me, myself and I,

Livingston 12/10/2008 09:33:09
The world is going down the toilet and Salmonds answer is, as usual, "Westminster it's your fault gie'us more money to create Brigadoon".

It's like a wee boy trying to pick a fight in a death camp. Futile and pathetic.

New Labour is done for whatever but I certainly wont vote for this charlatan.
37

Rodster,

Glasgow 12/10/2008 09:34:07
I'm pretty sick of Salmond the whinger now.
We could really do with a break from his pathetic stirring. There is so much in Scotland that he is neglecting - why has he stopped building schools?

not that you are having a whinge at Alex eh Andra .
one thing I love about you Unionists is your double standards.
and perhaps the answer to your question is financial prudence .
All the schools ,hospitals bridges etc etc built on PFI schemes are now coming home to roost .
It is time to pay the "credit card" and we have no money left Brown and Blair spent the lot on illegal wars , Millenium Domes ,Wembley , Jubilee Line ,bailing out London Spivs etc etc etc .
But feel free blame The SNP and Alex Salmond for all the troubles.


38

eric,

lothian 12/10/2008 09:35:41
Edinburgh is being turned into Blackpool of the north,
39

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:37:57
39

Charlatan? and you with so many logon accounts to a newspaper blog eh? New Liebour trolls are us have just accused the First Minister of being a charlatan.
You could cut the irony with a knife.
40

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:42:34
By scapping the Trident project the UK treasury would save 76bn of which 6 billion would be Scotlands proportional share so Alex is actually being very very reasonable with his request of only 1bn when we are actually entitled to so much more.
41

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:43:27
43

And England will end up like Zimbabwe without the charm and popularity.
42

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 09:48:07
#40 Rodster, nobody is blaming Salmond for the worlds financial woes.

We are just blaming him for being a whinging idiot.
43

Me, myself and I,

Livingston 12/10/2008 09:49:56
#42

1) One email and log in.

2)I just said I wont support or vote Labour (never have, indeed I voted SNP mistakenly).

3)Bitter? Twisted? Because Saint Alex has appeared a mug through this whole period that even the Grey man has bested him as FMQs.

4)Didn't daddy hug you enough that you need an unquestioning father figure?

Open your mind.
44

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:50:41
46

So with your obvious talent and expertise as a whinging idiot how would you rate the FM relative to yourself then?
45

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:52:15
46

I mean do you think he has the stuff to become a Liebour cybertroll after his 6 months training of course?
46

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:53:28
48

Phuq off ya lying troll. No matter what logon you use the slime trail is the same.
47

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 09:53:53
Looks like Parcel has woken up.

Insults, drivel and multiple monikers making the same puerile points about to appear.
48

Linda,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 09:55:32
Scotland has much more incommon with Norway than Iceland.

UK Treasury is massively in debt and has previously borrowed from IMF. This obviously proves UK is too small to be independent and should form a new country called Europe. How many British Nationalists would enjoy that scenario?
49

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 09:57:26
What a disgrace. At a time we need governance Salmond does what he always does and accepts no responsibility and tries to focus attention on Westmisster for his OWN gain.

Not a man to put Scotland first pursuing something that is completely unrealistic and detracting attention ffom his own inaction and complete insignificance. The SNP and Alex salmond are a complete joke party.
50

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:58:33
52

The rest of us are still waiting for you to wake up.
What kind of a w*nker trolls for such a despicible shower of sh*te such a New Liebour?
51

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 09:59:15
Oh it has already started.

I did not expect to be so right so quickly.

Sit back and watch the idiot in action.
52

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 09:59:41
suchaparcelofrogues doing his work to promote Nationalist bigotry again, your a credit to the SNP, but an embaressment to Scotland.
53

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 09:59:55
55

Ah you think he wants to keep the 1bn for himself in a Swiss bank account? or maybe even a safer Norwegian one eh?
54

TWC,

Ayrshire 12/10/2008 10:01:03
Me Myself and I you are talking rubbish, even us non Nats know that the Treasury holds the purse for Scotland. We received a less than just settlement from New Labour /Brown and now all parts of the UK need more than was originally calculated.
For England it will just appear but because of our settlement it needs to be formally handled.
If you can't put a X in the right place then keep well away from Economics.
Financial Independence is what we need.
55

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 10:01:55
58

And what would a London Liebour cybertroll know about Scotland? apart from it being somewhere North of Watford?
56

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 10:04:55
#53 sounds great, where do I sign up?
57

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 10:05:29
63

Liebour cybertrollings finest moment. I may print that post in anticipation of its future value to literacy.
58

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 10:06:51
#63 You had a typo.

Surely you meant rectum.
59

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 10:08:04
66

First ladyboys now rectums? the pattern emerges and so does the link to the Duncan account.
60

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:08:07
North of Watford? More north of Stirling.

suchaparcelofrogues you should be so proud of your bigoted rants, if there an example of the type of people who support the SNP, then I will stay well clear.
61

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 10:10:26
68

Aye right I bet you think Stirling is a currency.
62

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:11:16

Heriot Watt university student association come on to have anything to do with person is ridiculous.
63

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:13:46
No thats Sterling. Looking at the Wallaces Monument just now emabrressed that there are people like you in Scotland.
64

The_Reiver,

12/10/2008 10:15:50
Typical of the 'greed and grievance' policies of the SNP. Is Salmond now admitting that Scotland needs subsidies from the UK tax payer to survive? What about the poor in other parts of the UK? Why should Scotland have preferential treatment at their expense? This man becomes more incredible daily as he tries to delude the people of Scotland with his tissue of lies. Salmond's real aim in life is simple; to continue to nurture and inflate his own ego.
65

,

12/10/2008 10:17:47
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
66

Linda,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 10:19:04
The SNP must remind folk at every opportunity that it was lax financial reulation by Brown and Darling that caused the Banking Crisis in the first place.

UK is broke and heavily in debt.
67

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 10:20:18
75

Scotland will always need subsidies from the UK as long as it remains within the union and has to hand over every penny it generates as a nation to the Westminster treasury and tries to survive on the fraction of that it receives back from the Barnett formula.
68

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:20:59
75. Typical of the irrational and supine Scottish unionist position. The SNP want Scotland to be independent, but unionists talk of "subsidies from Westminster" when it is only unionists who want Scotland funded by Westminster.

Now Unionists object that the first minister is standing up for Scottsih interests. They still wonder why the SNP is leading in the polls, when the alternative is craven and pathetic supine unionist logic that would not defend any Scottish interest and just leave it all up to Westminster
69

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 10:21:57
77

Not forgetting the personal debt of over 2.1 trillion pounds with no small thanks to the "prudent chancellor" now PM.
70

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:23:30
77. Indeed -it was Brown who created a new financial regulator in his first month in office, and who created and presided over the lax regulation which has caused alot of this situation.

As usual, like with Iraq, Afghanistan, losing half the countries data, putting up tax on the poorest, sleaze and illegal donations New Labour do not take an iota of responsibility and just spin like tops.
71

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:24:20
And the SNP would have done any differently, when they are trying to grow the financial sector in Scotland? I sincerely doubt they would as these companies would not have come to Scotland if the regulations were stricter.
72

TWC,

Ayrshire 12/10/2008 10:24:39
#77 Linda,
It's not just the SNP who have been let down by the poor Governance of Brown & Darling the charlie.
Not all socialists are New Labour. We also believe in Fiscal Autonomy fo Scotland. That was what Devoloutoon was supposed to lead to.
73

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:24:46
80. and not forgeting the gold fire sale, and catastrophic PPI schemes, courtersy of new Labour / prudence Brown
74

TWC,

Ayrshire 12/10/2008 10:25:34
OOPS Devolution I mean
75

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:25:45
82. These companies, like Northern Rock, are going bust becuase of the New Labour lax regulations....
76

,

12/10/2008 10:26:00
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
77

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:26:20
Kyle N Carrick if you want complete financial independecne you would reduce the Scottish budget.
78

The_Reiver,

12/10/2008 10:28:02
#58 Ewen

Well said:

There are certain classes of people we should not tolerate:
1. Bigots
2. Racists
3. Fascists
4. Sexists
5. Homophobes
6. Anti-Semites

Persons displaying all these characteristics are to be found in the ranks of cybernats who regularly post on this site.

If we're not careful in a few years time we will witness the likes of suchaparcelofrogues and Christopher Harvie wearing their jack-boots and tartan shirts marching arm-in-arm down the high-street in Edinburgh waving their SNP flags and singing flower of Scotland and smashing any shop windows that bear an English name.

79

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:28:33
86 like I say would the SNP have done differently?....Absolutely not or these companies would not come to Scotland. Even Salmond has not been suggesting this and trying to bloat his ego even more.
80

,

12/10/2008 10:30:31
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
81

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:31:41
Heriot Watt university student association looks at suchaparcelofrogues comments to answer your questions. I doubt even the SNP would want anything to do with it.
82

Rodster,

Glasgow 12/10/2008 10:32:34
Mainly for you Ewan M I copied my earlier post .
but it is equally relevant for all other unionist apologists on here ..

Financial meltdown , massive job losses , house repossessions , bankruptcies,higher taxes , fuel poverty , hungry pensioners , more kids below the poverty line .
all great news if you are a Labour Supporter in Scotland , because the upside is you can trash the Nationalists and talk up the union .
The human misery who cares ?
a glimmer in hope of saving the union is worth it , you can really go to town now on the old platitudes of too weak , too poor , too stupid oh the joys .
we can keep the jobs for the boys we can keep up the dependency culture
Today is a great time to be a Unionist!
83

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:32:35
I agree with you the gold sale was a shocker.
84

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 10:32:59
Scrap Holyrood, sack all the MSPs and move all our budgets to London.

The cost savings will be huge.

The Scottish Executive is a waste of tax payers money.
85

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12/10/2008 10:33:08
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86

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12/10/2008 10:36:01
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87

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:36:31
Rodster you are a misguided person. Do you think Scotland would fair better in a GLOBAL financial crisis being independent. I suppose Iceland is doing pretty well for itself!!Scotland would have went bankrupt trying to support HBOS and RBS on its own and if you don't accept that you will never be convinced. As of tomorrow the UK owns 70% of HBOS and 50% of RBS. Deal with it.
88

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12/10/2008 10:38:46
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89

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:38:50

Bird of Prey, Will watch what i say your banter aint that great.
90

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12/10/2008 10:38:55
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91

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:38:57
90. Yes the SNP would have done differently - they would not have particpated in an illegal war of agression in the middle east then denied any responsibility for escalating oil prices, they would not be spending £96 billion on new nuclear WMD while the UK is is in massive debt and the SNP would and are standing up for Scottish interests, as this article makes clear..
92

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 10:39:47
#89 Reiver, that is the post of the day so far.

Parcel/jackie priest/spanners (all one person) is all of these things in your list.
93

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12/10/2008 10:40:10
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94

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:40:23
I suppose Alex salmond never compares Scotland to other small countries ever! I will pass you over to the desperate section I like the factual section I am sitting in!
95

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12/10/2008 10:41:19
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96

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 10:41:55
New Liebours record in Government to date:

War in Iraq
War in Afganistan
76bn to spend on Trident
Increaced terror threat to nation
Local taxation increaced by 89%
Income taxation 10% level dropped
Cash for honours
Illegal party donations
Expenses scams galore
Personal data stolen on an unprecedent scale
ID card legislation
42 days detention legislation
Financial meltdown
Cost of living soaring
Standards of living plummeting
Local services continuously cut
Pensions raided
savings wiped out
Personal debt at record levels
National debt at record levels
Dodgy arms deals with Saudi Arabia
Broken covenant with our armed forces
Abolished the Army regiments

More than enough above to have anybody charged with treason. And here we are on a blog which wants to discuss why the FM of Scotland has to ask these criminals in Westminster for some of the money back taken from Scotland in taxation and revenue in order to get through a situation created with the help of their corruption and incompetance.
97

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:42:13
100 "your banter aint that great" - my, my what a socratic and magisterial rejoinder, bet you are a riot at supine-Westminster-knows-best, Labour-may-be rubbish-but-so-is-everyone-else unionist jamboree outings
98

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 10:43:36
96

I doubt you will ever witness anything in Edinburgh in fact I doubt you could even point to it on a map.
99

Rodster,

Glasgow 12/10/2008 10:43:57
we have not witnessed so many Unionist Uncle Toms on line since the Glasgow East by election.
Kind of sums up Unionism when things are bad come on a spread doom and gloom , revel in real people's fear and misery .
Talk down your country and enjoy being a lackey for all that is Westminster .
UK the second largest debtor in the entire world .
Great huh? Norway the 7th richest with no world debt and over $64 trillion of cash available
UK no 186 out of 188 with over $119 trillions of borrowed money and debt and this does not include credit card debt only government debt.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/rankorder/2187rank.html
but you can invent a so called £11 billion supposed "black hole " in Scots economy and say how that makes it impossible for Independence .
Much better to have £119 trillin of debt in UK another Union dividend!!!
100

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 10:44:03
#102

Ah, its 'illegal' war time again.

Next post will no doubt mention the 'historic' concordat or the 'unfair' council tax.

I must sign up for the SNP jargon course.
101

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:44:04
103. The islamophobic, racist Rufus T (English voice, Stirling Sentinel etc) speaks....
102

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12/10/2008 10:45:06
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103

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:45:49
112. try - "illegal donations" and "lying, sleazey formula one cancer advertising back-handers" and "Mandelson lying, sleazey loans and backhanders for passports" while you are at it
104

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 10:46:04
Kyle N Carrick your a pcifist that will never get in the REAL world.
105

Rodster,

Gl;asgow 12/10/2008 10:46:21
so tell me Ewan who is the deluded person you or me?

186 out of 188 of the most indebted governments in the world ???
106

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:46:53
107. Great post - a concise summary of the "Union dividends" supine unionists who want Westminster to nanny them pine for
107

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12/10/2008 10:47:03
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108

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12/10/2008 10:49:13
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109

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:49:58
116. Is that the "real" world where we would be welcomed as liberators in Iraq, the real world where torture and rendition do not lead to more terrorism, or the real world where spending £96 billion on nucealr WMD is OK but a first minister standing up for Scottish interests is not?

Is that the real Unionist world where Labour daily spin about council cuts, but then complain when Salmond seeks more of Scotland's money back for Scottish spending priorities?

The unionist "real" world is a supine, hypocritical world of selling out Scottish interests and wrapping it in negativity and pessimism about our country.
110

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 10:53:28
The scottish economy is bankrupt. Our 2 banks, which are incidently our 2 biggest employers, stand on the brink. They will be in huge debt to the Uk government.

The oil price is dropping every day.

25% of people in Glasgow are on incapacity benefit.

Everybody else works in the public sector.

The case for independence is as dead as a dodo.

Scotland is now an economic basket case.
111

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:55:30
122. And there we have the Unionist manifesto for a better Scotland..... but what i can't understand is that Scottish unionists said we would go bankrupt if we went independent...now they are saying we are bankrupt within the Union.

Post 122 is not a good advert for the Unionic economic dividend, is it?
112

TWC,

Ayrshire 12/10/2008 10:56:23
New Labour achievements -- worth repeating

War in Iraq
War in Afganistan
76bn to spend on Trident
Increaced terror threat to nation
Local taxation increaced by 89%
Income taxation 10% level dropped
Cash for honours
Illegal party donations
Expenses scams galore
Personal data stolen on an unprecedent scale
ID card legislation
42 days detention legislation
Financial meltdown
Cost of living soaring
Standards of living plummeting
Local services continuously cut
Pensions raided
savings wiped out
Personal debt at record levels
National debt at record levels
Dodgy arms deals with Saudi Arabia
Broken covenant with our armed forces
Abolished the Army regiments

Add on poor regulation and a Leaky treasury in case we forget what happens when you move away from your natural politics.
113

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:57:12
122 - The Unionist Economic Manifesto for Scotland - doomed and bankrupt independent, doomed and bankrupt in the Union. Thank for your visiting scottish unionist. com and we hope you enjoyed our positive, proactive vision for Scotland!
114

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 10:58:42
#113 Kyle

I am no Islamophobic. I already said that Holyrood should be turned into a mosque.

For the record I only have 1 signon.
115

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 10:59:46
124. In fairness, you forgot some new Labour achievements:

- cutting inheritance tax for millionnaires
- sacking 10,000 disabled workers at Remploy
- closing 1000's of post offices
- privatising air traffic contrl and NHS services
- the Millenium dome
- farce of Scottish elections 2007
- detaining children at Dungavel
- collaboration with rendition/ torture
116

Richard M,

Scottish Raj 12/10/2008 11:02:50
£1bn is loose change set against the £500bn pledged so far to bail out the banks
117

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 11:06:22
#123 We are not bankrupt within the union.

You should pay better attention.

Our 2 banks are being bailed out. Something that Scotland could not afford to do.g
118

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 11:09:17
129. Rufus - you say "We are not bankrupt within the Union" and yet at post 122 you state "The scottish economy is bankrupt"

Are you confused? Or is it just the usual unionist tactic of pathetic scaremongering and negativity about Scotland has rendered your already clearly diminished faculties more useless and spinning than usual?
119

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 11:10:41
129 "The scottish economy is bankrupt"

Were you just lying, spinningg and fear-mongering at post 122 then when you said "The scottish economy is bankrupt" - gather round folks and marvel at the consistency, logic and positivity that is scottish unionist thinking.
120

ehlndh,

London 12/10/2008 11:11:08
Well said #2 (Thomas79). Too many English people (and too many non-British people, probably thanks to the afore-mentioned too many English people) think the UK = England, and that UK financial resources = English financial resources. They are not.
There is a profound need for the historic relationships between the various present elements of the UK, of which England is only one, to be recognized, and for new relationships accurately reflecting current realities to be established.
Comment #6 (Edward) is also interesting. I've been concerned for some time about the BBC's and particularly the journalist Peston's reporting and am glad it's being explored, journalistically at least.

121

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 11:14:42
"ALEX Salmond is demanding an extra £1bn from Westminster in an attempt to protect the Scottish economy"

Many people (including many in Scotland) have complained about the amount of taxpayers money that has gone into bailing out banks with £billions to buy equity in them. This is money being spent on these banks as opposed to the money that was lent to Northern Rock to ease liquidity as Northern Rock was basically acquired for virtually nothing.

It seems pretty clear from all reports that the two biggest recipients of this current bail out are going to be HBOS and RBS - the two banks based in Scotland.
If Alex salmond then asks for a futher £1bn he is likely to be given a two word reply.
122

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 11:18:11
133. But menwhile Sottish unionists complain about council service and funding "cuts", while also pposing Salmond and the SNP's attempts to get more of Scotland's money back for service spending.

Scottish unionists - all negativity, all hypocricy, all the time.
123

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 11:19:15
#130 Are you on drugs or are you deliberately trying to misunderstand my post?

See if you can find an adult to explain it to you, then come back.
124

TWC,

Ayrshire 12/10/2008 11:21:03
132 ehlndh, Good post that guy Prestonappears to be in the know and if it came from politicians somebody should go.
BTW KylenCarrick don't assume all unionists think like Rufus and these other Scaremongers, some people agree that Scotland is being short changed by the Union and support Full Fiscal Autonomy.
125

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 11:23:20
#121 I am sure you and Alex Salmond would both be very welcome in Kosovo it was unpardonable folly to save people form ethnic cleansing I suppose!

~136 full fiscal autonomy would me less money! Unless you believe the Pie man!
126

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 11:26:13
130. Rufus - your inadequate mental apparatus has clearly crumbled as a result of posting dreary negativity non-stop and playing out the depressing pantomime of your own low opinion of Scotland on here.

You said at post 122 "The Scottish economy is bankrupt" - but then you bizarrely, for all to see at post 129, say "We are not bankrupt within the union"

We expect inconsistency and lies about Scotland from Unionists, but to display both within a few posts is going beyond the call of negative, spinning, doom-mongering Unionist duty, even for you.
127

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 11:28:41
#117 Rodster we have the fifth largest economy in the world so it would make perfect sense we have a high monetary value of debt. You ned to look at the debt ratio to see if we are over saddled with debt. Looking at that we are no where near your assertaion. Did you go to the ecconomic school Salmond went to?
128

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 11:29:36
137. No, it was folly to rely on an air campaign which killed hundreds of Kosovo refugees and blew up the Chinese embassy, and which allowed time for the ethnic cleansing to gather pace, a point of view shared by many NATO allies and commanders....

I suppose the UK will now be rushing to the aid of Darfur, Somalia, and the 800,000 refugees from Iraq and make reparations for the 1 million civilians killed as a result of the Iraq invasion? Or do Unionists just use humanitarian issues selectively?
129

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 11:31:25

Kyle N Carrick your points are terrible. scotland would be bankrupt if we needed to support HBOS and RBS at the level the UK is doing. That is undeniable!!!

Rufus is telling you because we are in the UK we are not bankrupt because the debt is spread across the UK. You have the finacial sense of Salmond!
130

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 11:31:57
Richard M
"£1bn is loose change set against the £500bn pledged so far to bail out the banks"

That £500bn is an injection of liquidity i.e. it is an amount availabel to land to the banks so it is not spending as the govt aim to get it back. Alex salmond is asking for money for spending.
131

Ewan M,

12/10/2008 11:34:32

Kyle N Carrick woooshhhh. You can't reason with someone this brain washed. I wish the UK would go to Darfur i am sure the Salmond would have!!!I am sure you and the rest of the pacifists would have helped them!!
132

TWC,

Ayrshire 12/10/2008 11:35:47
#137 Ewan M.

I don't understand your post but if you are suggesting Scotland would be poorer then you are just being silly.
Any proper studies show that Scotland would fare at least as well and if oil remained at a high price they would fare very well.
The Best study done was by The Herald a year or so ago.
Remember also that no one has access to Tax information in detail because lots of Scots pay their taxes directly to English Tax offices via PAYE.
Gers uses a ratio in it's reports;so there may be more bonuses there.
133

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 11:36:45
141. Ewan - Rufus wrote at post 122 "The Scottish economy is bankrupt". That you try to spin this into the opposite is pathetic. Unionists tell us we will go bankrupt independent, now they tell us we are bankrupt in the Union... how many different ways will Unionist's invent to be negative, depressed and depressing about Scotland?

Unionists complain daily about council spending "cuts" but oppose the SNP government trying to get more money for Scotland...

Scottish Unionists - all spin, always talking Scotland down, all negative - all the time.
134

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 11:38:10
143. The first three words of your second sentence are at least true in regard to your output.
135

dude,

wishaw 12/10/2008 11:41:34
Go to it Alex get tell them to hand over our money now, get the first train in the morning and rattle number 10s door and go in, you are the FM of Scotland and should be heard, and as for all these so called unionists (who i like to call orange bigots myself) should start sticking up for your country and stop this self hatred of yourselves and Scotland
136

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 11:44:36
144 TWC
"Any proper studies show that Scotland would fare at least as well and if oil remained at a high price they would fare very well."

Please read the proper analytical studies carried out by CPPR at Glasgow Uni and Oxford Economics rather than the journalistic one carried out by the Herald.

And then bear in mind that north sea oil/gas production is falling at a rate of 8-10% per year with production in the larger older fields running out and production being more and more dependent on smaller, more expensive fields. Then think what the situation would be in 5-10 years time.
137

Kyle N Carrick,

12/10/2008 11:47:52
149 - Makes you wonder why Scottish unionists complain about service cuts then if spending here is higher anyway? Are they just spinning?
138

dude,

wishaw 12/10/2008 11:49:19
sm753

Alex Salmond and his pathetic agenda

asking for money that is ours by right
sticking up for the interests of Scotland
no lying down to new labours dictats

yup in the eyes of unionists everywhere the man is a clown, most right thinking people will congratulate the man for this, the system need change and Scotland will heve it with the help of unionists or not
139

John S,

12/10/2008 11:50:11
"Off Topic"
Gordon Brown's eyesight is causing concern among aides
Insiders also revealed that Mr Brown's memos are in huge print and triple spaced while his own handwriting is getting larger. One senior official said: "If I want him to reply to an email, I always make sure it's in at least 36 point." That is five times as large as standard print size.
There is mounting anecdotal evidence that Mr Brown is battling a serious disability. As this newspaper revealed last month, the Prime Minister has been daubing black ink all over the Commons' dispatch box during Prime Ministers' Questions. Telegraph 12 Oct 2008 ;http://tinyurl.com/3ofbyf
The above was sad to read
140

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 12:11:14
127

Youre absolutely correct I did forget about the rest.
Its mindboggling to have to admit that because there is so much wrong with this government you cant remember all of it at once even the big events such as
the attempt to rig the Scottish elections and the rendition flights take a back seat to even worse scenarios created by this government.
I doubt its possible to create a worst list even for the Zanu PF party or the Taleban.
141

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 12:18:48
154

What you are is a lying deceitful grubby little party political troll with no ethics nor credibility.
A pathetic little cyber merc willing to whoore itself to a political party.
You post about a country I doubt you have even visited with the knowledge past to you by others.
I seriously doubt you have an original nor personal opinion on anything. All you have is somebody elses platitudes to post. What a whoore.
142

Liberal for life,

Dunblane 12/10/2008 12:35:48
Kerr is right - What is the point of the SNP?

The curse of nationalism is an insignificant factor at times like these when "pulling up the drawbridge" is not a genuine option in such a global crisis. Sure we can all help by buying more locally produced goods, where there are any to be had (post Thatcherism), but apart from that even Salmond knows he is powerless and ineffectual as his plans for so-called independence crumble. We depend upon each other and a strengtening of our relationships with our UK wide cousins is what will save our Scottish economy.
143

European Scot,

12/10/2008 12:42:41
150 Ugly George

"Please read the proper analytical studies carried out by CPPR at Glasgow Uni and Oxford Economics rather than the journalistic one carried out by the Herald."

"And then bear in mind that north sea oil/gas production is falling at a rate of 8-10% per year with production in the larger older fields running out and production being more and more dependent on smaller, more expensive fields. Then think what the situation would be in 5-10 years time."

Good afternoon Ugly George !
Well there do seem to be different conclusions being drawn here :-

'Some experts believe that up to 30billion barrels are still in the ground.

And following evidence that 300 fields off the coast of Britain are still to be explored and tapped properly, reserves could be even greater, it is thought.

Explaining the size of reserves in the North Sea, Alex Kemp, professor of petroleum economics at Aberdeen University, said: 'There is still a substantial amount left. The remaining reserves on central estimates could be 20-22billion barrels equivalent, and on optimistic estimates could be over 30billion.'

Professor Peter O'Dell, of the Erasmus University in the Netherlands, agreed.

He believes there are 44 years of oil left. '

It all seems to depend upon which experts you choose to listen to.
144

dude,

wishaw 12/10/2008 12:44:00
Kerr has never been right in his life, he sold his soul to new labour and gets told what to think, the point of the SNP will become clearer to you when you get rid of the chip on yer shoulder
145

Liberal for life,

Dunblane 12/10/2008 13:04:57
#160 - thatnsk for the advice - in that case the point of the SNP will never get clearer as I'll just keep the chip on my shoulder!
146

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 13:07:00
159 Europen Scot
"It all seems to depend upon which experts you choose to listen to."

Hello there

Yes your comment is true but the situation I mentioned of the decline in production is a current trend. There may well be substantial reserves left but the oil companies only have plans to recover 10bn barrels of oil equivalent (i.e. oil and gas) between now and 2030(figures from UK Offshore Oil Assoc)

Further extraction would require substantially more investment and it is not clear whether this investment will arrive or when. The new fields you mentioned are virtually all small fields as the oil companies went after the bigger, easier fields first. But small fields are, by their nature, less efficient and therefore more expensive to exploit. This means that rates of production are much lower and revenues considerably smaller.

"He believes there are 44 years of oil left". '

The crucial aspect is not how long the oil will last but what the rate of production will be. There may well be oil extracted in 40 years time but if the amount is only in the region of 100,000 barrels per day then it will not be significant in terms of revenue. The point that analysts from UKOOA and International Energy Authority make is that, on current trends and investment plans, the decline in the rate of production will continue.
147

dude,

wishaw 12/10/2008 13:17:32
161 Liberal for life

well the point of the SNP is clearer for more and more scots, if you want to be left behind with your head in the sand thats up to you, its time
148

mr angry,

ayrshire 12/10/2008 13:29:11
35#. Stick to learning your 2x tables, you might get there some day.
149

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 13:30:51
Alex Salmond is quite obviously mischief making here. The govt is using £bns taxpayers money to bail out banks and all accounts indicate that most of the money is going to bail out the two Scottish based banks. Obviously many UK taxpayers are not happy about this. So what does Alex Salmond do, he asks for another £1bn of taxpayers money for Scotland. This would appear to be an attempt to wind up taxpayers in other parts of the UK and cause resentment against Scotland thus furthering his aims.
150

Stuntman Mike,

12/10/2008 13:31:51
A bit of raw meat from Supernat to keep the fundamentalists within his sweet little movement happy. For the rest of us, yawn!
151

mr angry,

ayrshire 12/10/2008 13:47:23
153# Its a load of bal**ocks, they are just looking for a good excuse, so when the dumpling retires on health grounds rather than stand at his first ever election where he would be thrashed. Getting things set up for a cowards way out.
152

mr angry,

ayrshire 12/10/2008 13:48:56
154# you thicko, why should anybody care a jot over the great fat bully boy Brown. Its stringing up he needs.
153

Andra, Dundee,

12/10/2008 14:01:28
Salmonds "Arc of prosperity" is now more a "Ring of Fire".

The SNP's new theme tune will be "I fell into a buring ring of fire. If fell down down down into the deepest mire"
154

B Greig,

Shropshire 12/10/2008 14:47:57
As someone who once lived in Scotland for many a year but now returned to Engalnd it must be said that it'll be a non event day should Scotland finally lands it's full independance. No one South of the border really has any interest in the topic so thats purely a Scottish question of if or when. An excellent opportunity will present itself should independance be achieved; to emulate Iceland! I'd much prefer IMF funding to be employed to offset Scottish recession than my own tax money but beyond that who really cares.
155

Andra, Dundee,

12/10/2008 15:11:17
#40 Rodster
I accept, I'm having a little whinge about Salmond.
However - does his constant whinging and whining not get on everybody’s nerves? He certainly does Scotland's reputation no good - Scotland is becoming a byword for whinging and whining thanks to Alex Salmond.
And the worst thing is that this negative attitude is rubbing off on Scots - we are now brainwashed by the SNP into thinking we are losers.
156

Son of one of Stirlings finest,

Weston S Mare 12/10/2008 15:24:17
Rufus T Firefly & Ewan M, I so much enjoy your spirited comments, I cant be bothered to argue anymore, some Scots Nationalists seem to only have two brain cells, and when they collide, it is blame the English time. Tolerance must be something of a strained quality in if being a unionist Scotland =traitor.
157

Western Gael,

12/10/2008 16:22:10
Pigs will fly before this happens.
158

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 16:25:41
This 'Iceland' comparison is getting on my wick.

In population, landmass and economic diversity, comparing Scotland to Iceland is like comparing the UK to Norway.

Anyone promoting this idea, including Salmond, is way off the mark.

And on subject, why should Scotland receive any more money? People in Scotland should remember not to ask for anything. We should be grateful for anything Westminster gives us and just shut up. We should remember that it's a privilege to be part of the UK, and that such privileges are sometimes worth more than a fair share. Andy Kerr has got it right.


159

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 16:35:42
Ewan M, thank you for explaining my post at 141.

The fact that thicko Kyle cant understand it is astounding.

There is absolutely no contradiction in my posts.

As the thicko says, its there for all to see.
160

IainGlasgow,

12/10/2008 16:39:46
#170

Don't worry your £12bn a year North Sea oil tax revenue will be safe (actually £30bn this year but bear in mind the price is falling) and there's still as much as 45% of the oil left to extract. Post independence the Scottish Government won't be able to get its thieving mits on a penny of it.
161

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 16:47:46
Independence is now officially dead.

It is a busted flush, using SNP terminology.

Can you imagine an independence referendum in the current climate? They would be lucky to get 10% of the vote.

Turkeys voting for Christmas and all that.

Rule Brittania!
162

IainGlasgow,

12/10/2008 17:12:40
#178

If so then unionists must be thinking their next 10 Christmases have come at once. Who cares about all the jobs this economic crisis will cost? A small price to pay for proof that Scotland is too wee and too poor and get one over on the SNP.

Keep up the faith. Your beloved Gordon Brown will ensure that a GB football team is in place for the 2014 World Cup. Holyrood won't last much longer either.
163

Media 1,

cape town 12/10/2008 17:20:22
Salmond the failed economist asking for money!
This man really is unbelievable.
He knows that Scotland receives far more than she puts into the union, he also knows that the billion he is asking for is impossible for westminster to deliver on, which is why he is asking to begin with.

Salmond heads up a party that is essentially a freedom fighting movement. His support is fanatical and he knows how to stir their emotions by asking for the impossible. Scotland could be given 3 billion more than she deserves and Salmond could ask for four in the knowledge that his fanatical support will chant his name in the belief that their deity is right.

Salmond - for goodness sake give it a rest!
164

vimto,

12/10/2008 17:29:55
Tell you what alex,on behalf of the people of England GO F==K YOURSELF!
165

tommyboay,

12/10/2008 17:37:18
Having retired recently (well semi really),I am a new observer of threads such as this. I firmley believed that the best laughs and reasons to wonder @ the logic of my fellow man were to be found on the football threads...now I am not sure !!! Anyone who wishes to pick up on my spelling or grammer feel free .....but please bear in mind communication is all.

Regards... the ever growing cynic
166

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 17:41:33
181

Tell you what Vimto ...............
167

vimto,

12/10/2008 17:45:41
183. You were saying.......
168

Longdirk Maceth,

Aberdeen 12/10/2008 17:45:52
180 Media 1, I wish you would give it a rest, fool.
Scotland put in 55 Billion last year into the UK and we got back 30 Billion as a “subsidy”
107 and 124 well said.
169

Media 1,

cape town 12/10/2008 17:52:54
"and sent them homeward to think again" Now that is what I call immature and entirely focussed on England as opposed to focussed on Scotland...

"Whas like us" A tremendous list of achievments that are not celebrated, but rather over shadowed by the fact that the brunt of the joke is aimed at England and an Englishman....

The SNP = Whas like us and sending them homeward tae think again activists.....
170

vimto,

12/10/2008 18:00:57
185. WRONG! It was 44.4 billion as of the 10th 0f october scotland has recieved back from the uk government 39.7 billion.
171

IainGlasgow,

12/10/2008 18:07:09
Well at least he's doing something proactive. If Jack McConnell was still FM and asking the Chancellor for more money the situation would be:

JM: Can we have an extra billion to help our best wee economy in the world?

AD: Sit down and shut up Jack we'll handle this!

JM: (cowers, head bowed) Ohhhhh-kaaaaaay

AD: If you're bored you can always put on a pin stripe kilt and go to New York for a few days.
172

Patrick O'Reilly,

Coatbridge 12/10/2008 18:12:55
Alex Salmond = oaf.
173

Pilrig,

Livingston 12/10/2008 18:18:45
Broon will save us ! (each of us in hock to the tune 18,000 quid)

mair jam the morra !
174

Pilrig,

Livingston 12/10/2008 18:19:56
181 - well you can always get rid of Scotland if you want....
175

Patrick O'Reilly,

Coatbridge 12/10/2008 18:21:24
191

Pray tell us Pilrig, what would have been your solution? Turn off the lights and hide under the blankets? Your informed opinion would be welcomed.
176

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 18:28:07
184 I'm sure you've filled in the blanks.
187 Links please
177

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 18:29:15
190 Patrick

Great debating skills. Where did you learn them?
178

vimto,

12/10/2008 18:30:16
192. Nothing would give me greater pleasure,unfortunatly it's not my call,but i can assure you the mood in England is "lets cut the bas==rds loose"!
179

vimto,

12/10/2008 18:32:13
194. Find them yourself,i'm not doing all the work for you.
180

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 18:33:39
196

Any more abuse hidden in there? Come on, out with it...
181

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 18:35:04
197 So your peddling half-truths now?
182

Scythia,

Glasgow 12/10/2008 18:38:01
Mr Salmond should consider slashing the bloated public sector before asking for funds. There are now 50,000 social workers (1 every 100) in Scotland , try slashing that number by 75% to begin with.
183

Ugly George,

12/10/2008 18:55:20
185 Longdirk
"180 Media 1, I wish you would give it a rest, fool.
Scotland put in 55 Billion last year into the UK and we got back 30 Billion as a “subsidy”

Completely wrong I'm fraid. You have only quoted some of the expenditure in Scotland and ignored many others. If you do not believe me study the analysis of those who have studied this issue in detail e.g.

CPPR unit at Glasgow University
Oxford Economics
Current SNP Scottish Govt (GERS 2006/07)
Taxpayers Association

All of these studies will confirm that your assertions are incorrect.
184

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 19:17:52
159

Another lying spewing party political post on North sea oil production.

"And then bear in mind that north sea oil/gas production is falling at a rate of 8-10% per year with production in the larger older fields running out and production being more and more dependent on smaller, more expensive fields. Then think what the situation would be in 5-10 years time."

Do you phuqs sit up all night to come up with this utter p*sh?

FACT: The "smaller oil companies" meaning those with the turnover in the billions and 10s of billions are AGRESSIVELY drilling for the oil and gas left behind by the big boys those with turnovers in their 100s of billions who moved over to pastures new abroad in Azerbaijan Alaska and Algeria.
Companies such as Apache, Perenco, The Abu Dahbi National oil company have moved in big time into the Forties and Brent fields and brought them up to FULL THAT IS FULL I SAY AGAIN FULL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PRODUCTION. And this state of affairs is going to last for decades to come.
700000 barrels a day into Grangemouth alone with presently another 400000 comming into Sullom Voe soon to be taken up to 900000 to 1.1 million its full capacity when the Abu Dahbi oil company gets started on the Brent assets.
And that is only 2 of the existing 13 oil terminals in the UK and only 10 of the existing 250 oil production platforms in the UK sector of the North sea and these phuqs will have you believe there is only 1.6bn barrels comming in a year.
But even taking that figure at face value means the UK government are deliberatly holding up the full potential of the North sea oil production capacity which seems incredible considering the dire straights the economy is in.
Or else somebody is telling whoppers. Guess where my money is?

FACT: There is at least if not more oil and gas still in the North Sea UK sector than has already been taken out and new exporation in new areas around Orkeny Shetland and even the West coast in the Atlantic.

The very fac
185

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 19:23:42
162

Here is the FACT again just for you UGLY there is at least the same amount if not more oil and gas in the North sea UK sector than has already been extracted with more exporation and likely finds due thanks to new technology and new methods of extraction.
The new estimate is 60 to 100 years with FULL FULL FULL FULL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PRODUCTION.
Its funny how nobody talks down Norways oil production outlook for the future their government have planned their economy for the next century on their oil and gas assets and yet they have less than have the production potential of the UK sector.
No matter what logon you use yer still full of sh*te.
186

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 19:31:40
204 Parcel
Putting something in capital letters does not lend it any more credibility. What is the source of the fact that you claim?

I quoted the UK Offshore Oil Association as the source of my info. Are you claiming that they are "full of sh*te" considering that they are the people who actually do the job. What is the source of your info?
187

Ugly George,

12/10/2008 19:35:51
Parcel
"Brent fields and brought them up to FULL THAT IS FULL I SAY AGAIN FULL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PRODUCTION. And this state of affairs is going to last for decades to come."

If you believe that the Brent field is producing the same amount of oil as it did in the past then you are in a minority of one. May I suggest that you put your assertion to the company extracting oil from the field and see if they keep a straight face when answering.
188

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 19:36:54
Looks like Parcel's blood pressure is starting to rise.

Excellent.

Ugly George, keep up the good work.

You are running rings around Parcel who once again is losing the plot.
189

Ugly George,

edinburgh 12/10/2008 19:38:13
203 Parcel
"FULL THAT IS FULL I SAY AGAIN FULL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PRODUCTION"
It does not matter how many times you say it or shout it. It is not true as anybody who has lookeed at these matters will confirm.
190

yoric,

12/10/2008 19:44:24
Again Salmond's idea of an independent Scotland, one that is funded by the English taxpayer.
191

Ugly George,

12/10/2008 19:45:59
203 parcel
"700000 barrels a day into Grangemouth alone with presently another 400000 comming into Sullom Voe soon to be taken up to 900000 to 1.1 million its full capacity when the Abu Dahbi oil company gets started on the Brent assets."

To be consistent with your previous claims, please remind us of how much of this oil is transported from north sea oil platforms to land by truck. Even if your claims on production were accurate, the oil is not going to do much good when the trucks sink.
192

vimto,

12/10/2008 20:06:52
198. Funny how you turn fact into abuse!
193

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 20:08:35
Lloyds takeover of HBOS is OFF!

What will Salmond do now?
194

vimto,

12/10/2008 20:11:13
199. Half truths? Think if you do your home work you'll find it is the whole truth!
195

Ugly George,

edinburgh 12/10/2008 20:13:57
214 Fed Up
"you're just another internet goat going mma maaaaa maaaa maaaa"

May I congratulate you on the sophisticated, eloquent and erudite nature of your abuse and insults. It may come as a surprise to you but insults such as this are not going to hurt me grievously. I'll survive.

Insteead of resorting to gratuitous insults, why do you not attempt to respond to the points I made, which are (as I pointed out) based on ifo from the experts in the field
196

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 20:25:29
214 Fed Up
PS Your knowledge of the frequencies with which members of the animal kingdom can articulate through vocal expression is obviously limited. "mma maaaa" can in no way be described as being reminiscent of the oral product of a goat evenif, as you appear to assume, that the goat has a stammer.
197

Thistledhu,

12/10/2008 20:42:25
Labour supporters pointing fingers at the SNP for mischeif makeing?

so why are Unions at the behest of labour forceing public sector strikes that are only happening in scotland funny that eh?
198

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 20:51:26
cant get over the stupid unionists who say alex salmond would lead scotland to bankruptcy but fail to acknowledge that broon has led the whole UK into the very same situation. politicians from westminster crowing about iceland nationalising their banks when broon has done the exact same thing.

THE UK IS BANKRUPT MORALLY AND FINANCIALLY.
199

Saxon Yolk,

12/10/2008 20:52:41
214

So YOU are the TRAITOR that defaces Her Britannic Majesty's Bank of England notes by having her appear to sing the "secret" Rebellious Scot crushing verse of our national anthem.
200

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 20:54:30
wow the snp supporters on here are really growing in number.
201

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 20:56:11
226 oh look another english labour party worker that doesnt know scotland has its own currency and has had since the act of union.

we print our own notes dummy.
202

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 20:57:44
229 no im spartacus.
203

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 20:58:32
#228 Yes and these notes are not legal tender.

A bit like my kids Noddy in Toy Town Money.
204

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 20:58:32
I write the web address of the mcrone report on notes and i also write about our biased press word is obviously spreading.
205

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 20:59:52
231 i think you will find they are and like all notes are only worth the paper they are written on when rime minister broon hasnt screwed up failed to regulate the banks and the banks then go bust.
206

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 21:01:10
232 Thats very interesting.

What an exciting life you lead.
207

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 21:01:30
218 I want to see where you did your homework.
208

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 21:02:51
234 oh i only do that when im not using my sexual powers to convert unionists.


its working dont you know


209

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 21:03:27
#233 Of Course they are Ksren.

Keep taking the tablets.
210

Davie from Irvine,

Ayrshire coast 12/10/2008 21:03:46
Every time the first minister stands up for Scotland, there are always unionists with negative comments like post 1, who would prefer that we just lie down and accept, let Scotland sink and be grateful. The money which Alex Salmond is demanding is our money being held back by the treasury,residents of Scotland pay taxation, and the subsidy story is a calculated myth.
211

Saxon Yolk,

12/10/2008 21:04:00
229 230

Marshal Wade and his men shall rush like a torrent to crush you both.

God has decread it so!

God Save the Queen!
212

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 21:04:29
237 where too? i usually put them in the drinks?
213

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 21:05:16
239 which god?
214

vimto,

12/10/2008 21:05:30
225. Think you will find it was the good old U S of A WHO START THIS,NOT BROWN.
215

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:06:20
206

No I am not phuqwit The Abu Dahbi National oil company are right now aggressively recruiting via Woodgroup for all the platforms in the Brent field which they have recently purchased from Shell. Their intention is to get the field up to full production in the same manner that Apache has with the Forties and Perenco has done with the gas fields in the Southern north sea and that you grubby dishonest little party political troll is a HARD FACT!!!!!.
And when Brent gets back into full production you are looking at 1.1 million barrels a day through Sullom Voe alone.
Now spin yer lying 1.6bn barrels per annum through those HARD FACTS phuqer.
And these companies are here for the long term.
216

vimto,

12/10/2008 21:08:09
235. It's official then, you are a numpty!
217

karinxxx,

12/10/2008 21:08:24
238 quite right davie. (are you the guy with the big ah hem one from irvine or am i thinking of another davie)

i am so glad the queue of unionists is getting smaller im quite tired out this week.
218

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:11:47
205

No you dishonest grubby little troll the only sourse you have ever posted on here originates from the UK government and nowhere else. The same discredited lying sourse exposed by the McCrone Report and the same sourse that gives us misleading and lying inflation figures unemployment figures and immigration figures. Unless you want to argue with me on the accuracy of any of the above??
219

Davie from Irvine,

Auld Irvine Toun Ayrshire 12/10/2008 21:12:27
thanks Karen @245, your thinking of another Davie.
220

vimto,

12/10/2008 21:12:57
243. North Sea Oil has not funded the Scottish spending gap, despite Scottish Nationalist claims to the contrary. In only five of the last 23 years have North Sea Oil receipts exceeded the cost of higher funding paid to Scotland. Even with current high oil prices, the income from the Scottish share of North Sea Oil only just covers the spending gap, and North Sea Oil output is projected to fall by 50 per cent by 2020.
221

worlass,

Sandbanks Dorset 12/10/2008 21:14:18
To all SNP supporters,cast your mind back,if you are caapable of such a complicated task and was it not Iceland that your failed bank clerk was holding up as a model for Scotland's economic future?Was the now sacked and disgraced head of RBS one of Salmonds economic mentors?
Wake up Scotland you've been taken for a ride by a political opportunist whose only aim in life appears to be holding out a begging bowl and making Scotland a laughing stock of Europe.
Take your granny on a cruise Alec and let the real economists get on with the job.
222

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:14:53
220

When I start to see sense in yer posts then and only then can you accuse me of drinking.
So are you going to continue to be pathetic for the rest of the night or have you got anything of substance to enrich the blog with?
223

Thistledhu,

12/10/2008 21:16:54
under the barnet formula the highest subsidiesd area of the uk is london, followed by the se of England then Northern Ireland
224

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:17:04
249

And just exacty where was the UK government holding up as an example of an economic utopia? surely not London and New York? I dont see any evidence of Iceland asking to join our happy union even in the state its in no doubt it recognises its situation can get worse after all eh?
225

Conan the Librarian™,

12/10/2008 21:17:16
245
Karin, I'm a Union man.

I'm in Unison.

;-)
226

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:18:17
248

Fine now prove it with reliable data sourses for a refreshing change.
227

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 21:18:35
Karen, when you go out for a meal do you prefer KFC, Burger King or Mcdonalds?
228

vimto,

12/10/2008 21:19:06
249. No, they just wait for the Russians to bail them out.
229

Thistledhu,

12/10/2008 21:19:42
worlass real econimists !!! such as who Brown or Darling who told you that one Jimmy Tarbuck?
230

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:20:13
248

Lying troll the only people predicting falls in the NS oil production were the same fools who predicted the price of oil would be less than 10 dollars a barrel over the first 20 years of this millenium and that North sea oil would run out about 5 years ago.
231

Thistledhu,

12/10/2008 21:21:05
Conan the Librarian, membership of Unison? you have my sympathy
232

vimto,

12/10/2008 21:21:46
251. Identifiable public spending per head in England is £7,535 pa (2007-08). But in Scotland it is 22 per cent (£1,644) higher, Wales 14 per cent (£1,042) higher, and Northern Ireland an extraordinary 30 per cent (£2,254) higher. Don't talk c==p.
233

vimto,

12/10/2008 21:23:04
258. The truth hurts, ah well,you'll get over it!
234

Conan the Librarian™,

12/10/2008 21:24:04
249
worlass, Iceland is not Scotland, demanding what is rightfully ours is not begging and "worlass" is probably your worst moniker ever.

Ever.
235

Westfield Bairns,

falkirk 12/10/2008 21:25:48
Andy Kerr, god how does he get voted in. Has he ever actually voted for anything thats in Scotlands interest, looks and sounds like a dodgy car salesman
236

suchaparcelofrogues,

12/10/2008 21:27:00
248

Are you referring to the "Scottish spending gap" invented by the UK government? the same sourse which gave us the credible figures on unemployment? immigration? Inflation?
The same sourse mired in sleaze? corruption? scandal?
The same sourse that gave us the 40 minute warning on WMD attacks from Iraq?
The same sourse that denies rendition flights?
The same sourse that denies torture of prisoners in Iraq and Afganistan?
The same sourse that told us it would be whiter than white?
Is that the sourse you want to base you arguements on is it? and still try to pretend yer just an ordinary voter fae somewhere in Scotland and not a party political cybertroll logon working fae London Liebour HQ London???
237

Conan the Librarian™,

12/10/2008 21:27:12
259
Thistledhu. Aye, a blunt knife, but the only one available.
238

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:27:51
261

Oh well now that you have proven it beyond all doubt we can move on.
239

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:29:00
260

Identified by who?
240

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:30:31
267

I see so being pathetic is actually a compulsion and not a choice?
241

vimto,

12/10/2008 21:31:20
264. NO!
242

Conan the Librarian™,

12/10/2008 21:31:45
267
sm753
Eh? Did I miss a post?
243

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:33:05
270

So who made it up then yer mum to get you to sleep?
244

Thistledhu,

12/10/2008 21:34:10
Conan the Librarian in the same boat i search often for an alternative
245

Rufus T. Firefly,

12/10/2008 21:34:29
Hey Spanners, how do you post with all these multiple ids at the same time?

Do you have to keep logging off and on?

It must keep you busy you phukwit Troll.
246

subrosa,

12/10/2008 21:34:49
# 249 'To all SNP supporters,cast your mind back,if you are caapable of such a complicated task '

I didn't read any further. Those who start a discussion with insult don't have anything I wish to read or hear.
247

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:34:50
272

Thats hilarious or is it hilairous or hillarious or hillariouss I cannae remember maybe you can?
248

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 21:35:33
248 More figs and predictions from the Vimto Policy Unit
249

worlass,

same as before 12/10/2008 21:36:16
#262
Your too quick for me,so you have noticed the difference vis a vis Iceland-Scotland but it was the SNP's Tony Hancock lookalike that stated "We could in Scotland be economically as successful as Iceland is"(was)
Explain please the "moniker"comment,it's the only one I've used on these boards.
No comment on RBS then.
250

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:37:48
280

One single discredited unreliable corrupt need to hide the true figure S-O-U-R-C-E only.
The UK government and nowhere else.
251

vimto,

12/10/2008 21:40:05
278. Quite frankly i couldn't give a t=ss, you are obviously one of salmonds minions,so have your fantasy that scotland is solvent,the people of England are working their butts off to keep it that way!
252

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:40:18
281

Well imagine if we said we could be as successful as the US or Germany or Japan or China lets face it we could have picked any nation on the planet and the point would have been the same. You simply cant make hay out of that one.
How is Norway coping by the way relative to the UK or the US or Japan or China??
253

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:42:46
283

Yep I think it was you who originally pointed it out.
Also Saxon Yolk posted exactly the same post as Smeagal less than a minute apart word for word.
254

IainGlasgow,

12/10/2008 21:44:01
#249

Do you mean the real economists who devised the BBC RBS oil index which has been in use for the past 20 odd years?
255

worlass,

bedtime 12/10/2008 21:46:29
#285
Typical SNP I suggest,face the truth:
SCOTLAND NEEDS ENGLAND,ENGLAND DOES NOT NEED OR IF THE TRUTH BE KNOWN,WANTS SCOTLAND.PLEASE DON'T FORGET YOUR CRY FOR INDEPENDANCE,THE ENGLISH WON'T
256

Conan the Librarian™,

12/10/2008 21:48:14
279
Evening Col...Dunnie will be jealous..;-)

281
worlass, sorry, I assumed you were one of many unionist monikers assumed by one particular person.
Why does someone from Dorset have a Geordie moniker?
257

suchaparcelofrogues,

Scotland 12/10/2008 21:48:58
280

700000 barrels a day through Grangemouth alone by pipeline from the Forties and comming into Grangemouth by truck from other locations throughout the UK.
There are a total of 13 oil refinaries in the UK of which Sullom Voe in the Shetlands is the biggest which can handle up to 1.1 million barrels per day.
The pipeline from the Brent fields feeds directly into it.
You and yer UK government are simply full of sh*t.
At least the UK government has an excuse they are politicians whats yours?
258

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 21:52:01
284

And here we have it. The truth at last. Those lazy, good-for-nothing, state-sponging, insolvent Scots.

And who says I agree with Salmond? Your world is full of false stereotypes, your tongue filled with venomous abuse.

Obnoxious Troll.
259

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 22:06:00
A cringer asks, “You have to ask what is the point of the Scotland? All they do is constantly refer to others when they want something done and it is usually the UK Government. It is dishonest to claim for funds that are not available.”

Perhaps someone should take this balloon aside and explain to him that the attitude displayed in the above statement is the reason his party is being chased at every available opportunity.

We don’t need your PFI brown envelope scams.

Go back to your constituency, and prepare for your next job, as an advisor to a company in the private health care sector.
260

IainGlasgow,

12/10/2008 22:12:04
If the funds are not available to give the Scottish Government the £1bn then that must mean the UK is insolvent. So who's putting up the £500bn to bail out the banks?
261

Eve,

Scotland 12/10/2008 22:17:15
#288 worlass: Is that comment supose to make sence!!!

Marketing appear to be far away from being yer strongist subject of knowelge areas. For a start you can't tell people that you've never met, what there Needs & Wants are. Because that information is stored in the "consumer" black box or in this case the indaviduals political/ opinion black box. You can't tell what someones political opion, needs or wants by looking at them, never mind geussing.

I really dought that any nation has a need or a want to be ruled (or aledgely looked after) by another nation.

Oh and by the way yer CAP LOCK appears to be stuck on!
262

Conan the Librarian™,

12/10/2008 22:37:38
288
Jeez worlass, has someone hit a nerve?

And it's Independence.

With an e.

263

Conan the Librarian™,

12/10/2008 22:39:07
Pity Spook isn't commenting.
264

IainGlasgow,

12/10/2008 22:40:23
#297

None. The Barnet Formula is pegged to public spending in England so it would be reduced or increased by proportionate to whatever public spending cuts or increases are made there?

However if we could keep our share of the £500bn in Scotland (about £45bn) to invest wisely instead of bailing out failed bankers we could do alot for the economy, not least of which could be to establish a new national bank without bad debts. The failed banks could go to the wall and all the credit card and motgage debt that people in Scotland owe them could be written off and considered settled. Homeowners would have more money, that would get them spending money they have rather tnan money they've borrowed which would enhance economic growth further and reduce unemployment.
265

Conan the Librarian™,

12/10/2008 22:41:19
300 for the Spartans.
266

Conan the Librarian™,

12/10/2008 22:41:57
B*gger.
267

Saxon Yolk,

12/10/2008 23:20:36
301 Spartans

Pah!

My English longbows would make mincemeat of them.
268

brianmca3,

auld reekie 12/10/2008 23:58:05
in 1999 the figures below were released and then with drawn under the foi act
1:london gets £8,404 per head for year/scotland gets£8,623 per head/irish get£9,385 per citizen a year
2 londons civil service jobs,are not counted by westminster as gov spending in london ,that includes mod dept of culture,foriegn office etc
3 museums institutions that are classed as national resources arent counted as gov spending in london
national gallery gets £26 million a year
£45 million a year to natural history museum
£45 million goes to british museum
national museum of scotland which the gov doesnt count as its classed as being only for scotland gets £15 million a year (oh what a surprise there eh)
4 BBC annual budget is £4 billion a year almost half the sum spent on health in scotland
bbc report states that they made 44,234 hours of tv in london compared to 2,495 hours in scotland ,they spent,a tiny £106million in scotland out of just £505 million outside london that leaves a hell of a lot in london and it was a scotsman who invented the tv
5 olympics the millenium dome cost £789 million roughly twice what it cost to build the scottish parliament
lottery is now ready to fund london with the olympics which have been estimated at a cost of £5billion this in 1 city alone
6 london underground new tube line cost £3.5 billion thats 3.5 times what the cost of a new bridge over the forth in scotland
scotlands entire transport budget is £2.3 billion and covers one third of the land mass of the uk

so we see who really are the subsidy junkies yes westminster feeds billions into london and sod the rest of the uk citizens
no wonder scots are wanting away when all our tax money and oil revenue seems to be proping up england,and to add insult bank of england was established by a scot bet hes spinning in his grave
so before you whine about scots again remember we gave the world the tv the phone tarred your roads,bicycles,etc etc
well pay us the royalties on tv and phone alo
269

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 13/10/2008 00:05:44
brianmca3
Please read the recent study by Oxford Economics which analysed this whole issue. It stated the amount paid in tax by people in London was much more than the total amount spent by govt there to the tune of £2000 per person.
270

John1,

Stirling 13/10/2008 00:33:40
Salmond never misses a chance to stir up trouble,does he? Here the world is in the greatest financial crisis for decades and all he can think of is getting a row going in the hope that he can annoy the English into breaking up the UK. The SNP's irrelevance to the real world and the wishes of 'ordinary' people never fails to surprise me.
271

livilion,

livingston 13/10/2008 01:22:12
#307 John1,Stirling

Scotland standing facing another 1974 and all you can say is Alex Salmond is picking a fight because he is trying to stand up for folks' livelihoods in Scotland.

Get a grip of yourself, just because Scottish First Ministers in the past have grabbed their ankles and thought of England at the first sign of trouble, that wasn't what they were actually elected to do.

Takes some getting used to I suppose, but stick with it, when its your job that goes and your home about to be repossesed I'm sure the penny will begin to drop.
272

livilion,

livingston 13/10/2008 01:35:04
305 Ugly George
Aye well if Oxford Economics say Scotland Is too wee and too poor and Scots are too stupid to run their own country it must be right, eh?
I expect Alex Salmond to disband the SNP forthwith, the gemme's a bogey.
273

Mandy Jones,

Plymouth 13/10/2008 09:48:11
as you'd say up there 'on ye bike paddy'
- Scotland already takes much more than you give to the union... you aint gonna be getting 'nay' more of our money so so you can moan and watch repeats of braveheart.
274

Mandy Jones,

Plymouth 13/10/2008 09:52:15
P.s. to everyone who talks about 'oil' its not scotland's oil - it's Britains oil.
I own it as much as any of you do, so I don't see why you all think you should include it in your calculations.
275

Hadrien,

Worksop 13/10/2008 14:05:40
Sorry, Mandy - "It's Shetland's oil!"
(Wouldn't that be one in the eye for the Jocks - if Shetlanders and Orkneans vote to rejoin the Kingdom of Norway!)
276

vimto,

13/10/2008 15:20:36
312. Sorry Hadrian,but as things stand Shetland and Orkney are still part of the UK,so Mandy is totally correct!
277

Thomas79,

Ayrshire 13/10/2008 15:30:11
Why do the unionist parties continue to talk scotland down. I do not mind a debate about independance but when they resort to us being bankrupt, small, subsidy junkies and the rest it annoys me. Scotland is a proud nation and is a capable nation, its just that too many of us have lost confidance in our own abilities, and some of the unionsit parties must take the blame for that. The SNP can be accused of many things, but they NEVER have, or never would, talk our country down.
278

vimto,

13/10/2008 15:37:09
314. You have a population of 5.2 million, London alone has 6.7 million,your GDP is only 3 quarters of Londons,so yep, small subsidy junkies is about right.
279

Thomas79,

Ayrshire 13/10/2008 15:48:43
Your right Vimto, about London having a larger population than Scotland, thats true, so England has more people than Scotland. But its us Scots running the show down there, every job of importance is occupied by a Scot, from the Prime Minister and Chancellor on down. England is like a large elephant, and we Scots need to guide it.
280

vimto,

13/10/2008 17:37:35
316. Actually the chancellor was born in England!Born 28 November 1953 (1953-11-28) (age 54)
Hendon, London
281

vimto,

13/10/2008 18:06:55
316. You should check your facts before opening your venomous mouth!
282

Thomas79,

ayrshire 13/10/2008 21:02:08
Alastair Darling was born in London but has scottish parents, was brough up in scotland, educated in scotland and represents Edinburgh as an MP, but I assume you think he's really a cockney. but dont worry vimto, you can claim Mandelson and Boris.
283

terry osser,

morden 14/10/2008 05:53:27
316 thats what pisses the english off

ps uk is technically bankrupt and was even before brown spent 25 billion trying to win glenrothes
284

St George`s Batman,

Gods Country 15/10/2008 08:46:11
Nah,,,What pisses the English off is Jock the Backward forever on his knees with the begging bowl, trying to look like he`s doing us a favour..W******!!!

 

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