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Kirk calls for public cash to save churches from ruin



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Published Date: 22 May 2008
LACK of maintenance and under-insurance by Church members is increasing pressure on the Kirk to shed more of its properties, the General Assembly heard yesterday.
But Church members have claimed that spiralling insurance premiums were crippling their efforts to care for and protect their buildings, and called for the Scottish Government to step in and protect the nation's heritage.

The chairman of the Churc
h of Scotland's General Trustees, Finlay Turner, told the assembly that congregations were neglecting their properties and in many cases seriously under-insuring them.

"The trustees have ongoing and mounting concern that the regulations for care of buildings in many cases are not being applied as well as they might, and major problems with buildings continue to arise from long-term neglects and a failure to attend to minor and routine maintenance as it arises," he said.

Mr Turner said there were many cases where work had not been carried out, or where the supervision to ensure it was effective had been "superficial, haphazard or non-existent".

He added that, even if congregations were concerned about the state of their properties, there was an unwillingness to contribute to repairs.

The Rev Gordon Savage, of the Presbytery of Dumfries and Kirkcudbright, said they had carried out a series of insurance re-evaluations on their properties, which had resulted in rises of between 100 per cent and in some extreme cases 500 per cent, and that it was consuming up to 20 per cent of local congregation funds.

He put forward a motion asking that the trustees look at alternative forms of insurance, including under-insurance and self-insurance, in which the building owner maintains a pot of money with which to carry out any repairs, but this ultimately was defeated.

He also said the Church of England received grants from the government to help to cover insurance, because it was recognised that it was caring for the country's heritage, and added that the Kirk should approach the Scottish Government for similar support.

Gordon Jamieson, the Head of Stewardship, which advises congregations on fund-raising, said the Kirk had too many properties which were proving too expensive to maintain.

"I often say to groups: 'We cannot afford all the buildings we've got', and they all nod and agree with me, but if I was to go on and say 'and yours is one of the buildings we can no longer support', then that is totally unacceptable. Congregations and presbyteries have to start to bite the bullet."

He believed, however, that congregations could contribute more to the upkeep of their churches.



The full article contains 442 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 21 May 2008 10:21 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Church of Scotland
 
1

Augusta,

Kirkcaldy 22/05/2008 06:45:57
Demolish the lot.
2

an interested party,

22/05/2008 08:17:08
why not just turn to their fantasy sky god, does he not provide what the righteous need. No what do you mean NO

you mean you want the tax payers to pay for our own moral straight jackets

sshhhhhh
3

Beth Boyle,

Western, NY 22/05/2008 08:19:32
Here the individual congregations have to keep up their own buildings. Augusta, it is so painful to see such bitterness towards the Kirk. Each Presbytery here has churches who struggle but they all maintain their own building. Many families give for long term upkeep as a memorial when they pass away.
4

fife runner,

22/05/2008 08:23:23
as a Bible believing Christian I have to agree with #1. People have become too fixated with buildings and not on what the church really is. To many it is an nice social club.
5

Boy Wonder,

22/05/2008 09:04:08
Pay for the upkeep of something I don't believe in?? Not a snowball's chance!

When I was young, I was taught by my Catholic priests that Holy Mother Church was not necessarily present in the buildings, but in the hearts of the Faithful.

So there's your answer, Churchgoers ... pay for your own superstition!
6

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 22/05/2008 11:46:31
I find the earlier comments quite abhorent. The country's churches, whether currently used for worship or not, are part of our architectural, cultural and religious heritage. In many areas they are the only buildings of substance and often the only ones of any merit. Whether you are religious or not is not relevent, these buildings and those who used them have shaped the Scotland we have today. Would those who wish them knocked down, wish the same fate for Burns' Cottage, the Wallace Monument, or Dunnottar Castle?

In country areas they are often the main landmark of a village and often located in an old kirkyard. With the growth of genealogy in Scotland and in the USA/Australia/NZ etc they are an important element in our heritage tourist industry, especially in 2009 which has been designated for Scotland's diaspora to return and visit their roots

And if the Westminster Government is paying for the upkeep of churches in England why is the Barnett formula not allocating a similar sum for Scotland.

It seems to be a trait of some posters on these boards to be bigotted, prejudiced, philistine and meanspirited.
7

Calum Crubag,

22/05/2008 12:42:45
#5- correct. Cults should cough up for their own superstitions.

Funny how all the pro-God arguments get thrown out of the window when public cash is wanted. What happened to the power of faith and prayer? Won't God sort out your buildings if he sees fit?
8

Brian M,

Edinburgh 22/05/2008 13:25:03
The Kirk should take a running jump. I sincerely hope that not one penny should come from the public purse.

Maybe they should apply for cash from the many national lottery funds.
9

Roger Tichborne,

22/05/2008 13:26:09
Well said Huntly Loon.(Don't mind the other posters - often its either this or Trisha for them).
There are already Government grant schemes for the architecturally / historically best churches. Its these ones that we should aim to save.
Although with genealogy outstripping porn on internet searches, tourism monies should not be discounted...
10

Spicey,

Glasgow 22/05/2008 13:51:49
With falling numbers of bums on pews there are blatantly too many churches in Scotland.

Many of them were built with money and labour from the poorest people and consumed huge amounts of cash, draining whole communities, hence why they are the only large buildings in many small villages.

Why should we keep paying for buildings that are too big, fancy and inappropriate for there supposed purpose? If we wanted something pretty we should build it, and if we want somewhere to pray we should build somewhere suitable, but churches dont need to be as large and as expensive as they are.

As has already been said, God is supposed (i dont believe myself) to be everywhere so why do you need these massive buildings?
11

Spicey,

Glasgow 22/05/2008 13:53:10
#9

Does genealogy really outstrip porn for internet searches? Have to say im quite surprised!
12

Sanny,

22/05/2008 14:43:53
If, as these priests and ministers preach,”God is all powerful and has provided everything we have”. Then it will be no sweat for him/her/it to provide a little extra to maintain what is supposed to be “the House of God!. This country is now a Christian country by habit, not by persuasion.
13

Douglas,

Bathgate 22/05/2008 21:10:30
Spicey #11: Only for those too tight to pay for decent anti-virus and spyware protection. :o)
14

varksoup,

Scotland 22/05/2008 21:37:30
Taxes payers to pay for the Kirk: in your dreams bible-boy.
15

varksoup,

Scotland 22/05/2008 22:08:26
Huntly Loon: Heaven forfend that we should come across as cultural vandals. No, keep & maintain the buildings - as warehouses for removal companies, convert them into flats or turn them into nurseries for kiddies or what not. But if they are going to be used for religions, well the religious with their invisible friends can pay for that.

The scientologists will come begging next.
16

Regal Bankie,

Clydebank 22/05/2008 22:40:32
God loves a trier. :-)
17

saneatheist,

Bixter 23/05/2008 21:38:33
The Churches, both Anglican and Catholic have more wealth than the royal family, how dare they come with their begging bowls!

 

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