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City recycles plan for bikes on trams

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Published Date: 22 December 2007
TRANSPORT bosses have pledged to reconsider allowing bikes on the city's new trams after they were ruled out over safety concerns.
The city's transport leader, Phil Wheeler, said an investigation into how cyclists used trams elsewhere in Europe had been reopened.

No other UK network allows bikes on board but off-peak access is allowed on lines in cities such as Brussels, Strasbourg and Basel. Cycle lobby group Spokes has been pressing city leaders to follow their example.

Tram chiefs have already agreed to look again at plans to cut back cycle lanes and bike-friendly greenways to make way for the £498 million project.

However, a report published this week by Transport Edinburgh Limited – the company that will run the bus and tram network – said that at present carrying bikes on trams "cannot be achieved in a safe and efficient manner, without causing undue discomfort and risk to other passengers". Spokes member Ian Maxwell said: "We are still hopeful that an agreement can be reached.

"It seems straightforward enough in so many other European cities, I don't see why it is proving quite so difficult in Edinburgh.

"The problem is that none of the other UK tram systems have taken the plunge with this and I think there is a nervousness about being the first."

The majority of tram stops west of Haymarket and north of Picardy Place will have cycle parking facilities where people can leave their bikes.

Green councillor Steve Burgess challenged Councillor Wheeler at Thursday's full council meeting on whether bikes on trams had been completely ruled out.

Cllr Wheeler said: "This matter is not closed, more work is being done. For example, there has been a visit from a Dutch expert to see how trams and bikes can co-exist."

Cycle groups and officials from TIE, the council-backed firm in charge of the trams, are currently digesting the recommendations of a Dutch traffic expert brought in to assess controversial proposals to cut back cycle lanes and bike-friendly greenways on Princes Street and Leith Walk.

The plans, put forward in October, would involve Leith Walk being reduced to one lane of traffic each way, with the tram running in the middle. There will be a one-metre gap between parking spaces and the traffic lane, but it won't be classified as a cycle lane and cars will be allowed in it.

In Princes Street the pavement on the shopping side will be narrowed, but a decision has still to be taken on whether dedicated cycle lanes will remain.

Neil Renilson, chief executive of Transport Edinburgh Limited, said: "There will be a further investigation into whether any way can be found that would allow cycles to be carried safely inside trams."

The full article contains 463 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

wini.poo,

22/12/2007 12:38:21
Reported
2

alex paterson,

embra 22/12/2007 12:57:58
Get a fold up bike and put it on your back,cannae beat a good walk,and when you are tired, cycle or get a tram.
3

calum,

22/12/2007 13:56:50
What on earth is the justification for allowing bikes on to trams over a route which, with the exception of Leith Walk/Street southbound, is entirely flat?!? A bike within a City is a primary mode of transport and yet we have more pandering to the cycling lobby whose submission by Cycling in Edinburgh was as thin as Posh Spice's left pinkie.
No justification for even considering this garbage.
4

Oilcan,

Edinburgh 22/12/2007 14:22:51
Council should follow Amsterdam's example and split the pavements down the middle to allow cyclists to pedal safely on the pavement and not have to worry about the roads. Would encourage more people to cycle places.
5

,

22/12/2007 14:41:40
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
6

Mallory,

Edinburgh 22/12/2007 14:54:19
So now we're spending £600m+ of public money to enable lazy cyclist to save their muscles...
7

Mastermined,

Minehead 22/12/2007 15:12:17
#5 You can forget about letting cyclists onto the pavements on Leith Walk for a start,they are being reduced in size on both sides of the road and I believe the same thing is being done on Princes Street.
8

Miss Jean Brodie,

22/12/2007 15:16:55
Can I bring my car on the tram?
9

Richard Head,

Hartwood Dangerous Sports Club 22/12/2007 15:21:49
Wow lazy of these bike folk.
I thought the whole point of cycling was to have some exercise?
10

Groucho,

22/12/2007 15:54:51
If pedestrians would walk in the gutter, then the pavements would be free for cyclists. Oh! and by the way could cyclists be given exemption from Income Tax as well?
11

PaulB,

waiting for a tram 22/12/2007 16:24:08
What a load of nonsense - bikes are not allowed on buses so why should they be allowed to clog up trams? Cyclists who cannot be bothered to cycle up Leith Walk should give up! Can't wait for the trams - Edinburgh needs new forms of transport! and keep off the pavement cyclists!
12

Braan Seer,

Warming the planet burning fossils. 22/12/2007 16:27:43
What the hell is going on at this paper. Has Salmond not eaten any babies today or poked some beggar in the eye with his brolly? Surely the SNP must have broken some promises? Did they not promise free travel for cyclists within the first hundred days? This is very anti-English of them how dare they.............
13

Mike_d,

Edinburgh 22/12/2007 17:13:58
The key line in the above is....

"Tram chiefs have already agreed to look again at plans to cut back cycle lanes and bike-friendly greenways to make way for the £498 million project."

So the issue of bikes on trams is only being raised because there's not enough room for the tramlines on the roads and they're going to have to narrow them which means cycle lanes will be lost, so I'm guessing fewer people will be willing to cycle.

Also, why can't car drivers figure out that each cyclist on the road is one less car holding them up, so give them a break surely?

As for the whole tram thing, how on earth are they going to squeeze the tram lines in given our roads can't cope with the volume of traffic on them at the moment? Has anyone in the council actually thought how this is all going to work or did it just seem like a good idea at the time?

I cannot believe its full steam ahead on the tram line which seems to be designed to solve a problem which doesn't exist while ignoring the real problems with traffic in and around our city.
14

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 22/12/2007 18:04:40
Cyclists contribute nothing towards cycle paths being built or, in Edinburgh's tram case, removal. The costs are added to highway development paid for by the motorist.

By all means have dedicated cyclist routes but let the cyclists fund them. No doubt they want the tram facility for their bikes free too.
15

Graham P,

Edinburgh 22/12/2007 19:10:34
What twaddle from Jock Tamson. Cycleways, and all other roads with the exception of a few toll bridges, are paid for from general taxation.
16

Robbierunciman,

Romney Marsh 22/12/2007 20:07:28
there is a good deal of twaddle on this site, its a bit rich having fat lazy and bullying motorists, who would drive to the end of their stairs - if they could, accusing cyclists of anything. I hope when they drive

The trams should carry bikes offpeak and outside the city centre. I have used Brussels trams, whose design is quite old fashioned, and never seen any problems. I think the problem here is good old British not thinking out the box and realizing that what work in Europe will work here, cos we are the same!

Also 17 says, local roads are paid out of general taxation or in Scotland, by English taxes, the only dedicated roads for motor vehicles are called expressways and motorways, these ban pedestrians, bikes and horses.

If the motorists on this site reflect, on their next drive to paper/chip shop, that intelligent motorists uses the appropriate transport at the appropriate time. Many like myself are indeed also cyclists. Rather than see my road tax wasted on another road wideneing or bypass that causes bottlenecks, i would prefer to see investment for the future in cyclepaths and encouraging people who 'need' thei car to get a brain!
17

John Blackley,

Austin, TX 22/12/2007 20:10:30
Let me see - one of the motivators for building tramways and trams was to reduce the amount of private vehicle traffic in the city - thereby reducing carbon emmissions.

So, in order to build these carbon-emmission-saving tramways, the city is proposing to reduce the number of cycle lanes - lanes that are there to encourage cyclists. Let's say, for the sake of argument, that the reduction of cycle lanes encourages some of those who presently cycle to...........dare I say it? Go back to using their cars, thereby partly defeating the purpose of building the trams.

Here in Austin, most public transport vehicles have a multiple-bike rack on the front. Simple, really. You cycle to a convenient bus stop, load your bike on the rack on the front of the bus, ride the bus to the stop closest to your destination, unload your bike and then cycle to your final destination (in bike lanes, I might add.)

Now what is it about that setup that the great brains of Transport Edinburgh Limited can't fathom?
18

Thomas the Tank,

Edinburgh 23/12/2007 00:16:07
#19 - Big problem with your 'reduce private traffic' theory is that the Grand Embra Tramcar System (OK, just 1 line) will only serve some 6% of the City's population. It will, according to TIE's own predictions, deliver about 1-2% reduction in 'congestion' and about the same in 'pollution' - but that's only on the immediate route. They've produced no figures to assess these 'benefits' over a wider area and the effects of displacement traffic. With the shambles on Leith Walk, there's been a massive increase on Easter Road and Abbeymount, and bus timetables are just a joke - and that's before the works hit Princes Street. That's why so many people think the whole thing is a monumental white elephant from start to finish.
19

outsiderlookingin,

South of Niddrie 23/12/2007 08:14:26
The cyclists in Edinburgh must be exceedingly weathy if they want to pay to take their bikes on the tram. It would be easier and cheaper for them just to hang on to the rear of the tram and get dragged along.
20

calum,

23/12/2007 11:13:19
#20 You make an interesting point about polution. Perhaps you can confirm that the trams on the LINE are going to be powered by electricity. Unless TIE intend to use an infinite number of hamsters running in wheels then presumably the means of producing that electricity will come from coal/gas/oil/nuclear produced generation, even by the time the LINE comes on track...2011? Even Greenpeace acknowledge that these awful windfarms are less than reliable and certainly will not make even a small dent in Scotland's power demands. All of these, including wind, are carbon positive so just how is an additional consumer of electicity, i.e. the tramLINE, going to reduce area wide pollution? Just a thought.
21

The Sheriff,

23/12/2007 12:29:49
Will the LRT 22 service be wiped as I believe the tram will follow a similar route?

22

Stone of Destiny,

23/12/2007 12:38:18
As someone who has cycled a lot in Edinburgh, the two most 'frightening' road to cycle down are Princes Street and Leith Walk - despite the cycle lanes (all those buses moving out in front of you).

Number 18 has the best idea - relating to the Brussels example - especially if it extends to teh airport
23

Lord_S,

Edinburgh 23/12/2007 22:28:53
#18 - Erm I've been paying tax for years and was wondering if you could tell me how I could go about getting a refund since I'm Scottish and, according to you, pay no tax.
24

Julian,

EDINBURGH 24/12/2007 03:39:49
rs # 14

There's not many motorists who drive up to a traffic light that's been red for about 15 secs, slow down and then continue to go straight through at red.

That's what he was talking about, but I think you probably knew that anyway.
25

Julian,

EDINBURGH 24/12/2007 03:48:41
Calum # 23,

Surely one of the points about tram pollution is that there will be none on the streets of Edinburgh. Yes, there will be pollution from power stations but by 2020 we will be producing more than half our electricity from non-carbon producing sources. This is a firm goveenment commitment and it will be even higher if the lib dems/tories/greens get into power.
26

calum,

24/12/2007 11:59:00
#29 So let me understand you correctly , it's OK to reduce pollution in the immediate vicinity of the tramLINE but to increase it in the areas where power stations are sited (none of which are in Edinburgh BTW)in order to power the trams. Mmmmmm, what an interesting philosphy for Edinburgh to apply to the rest of Scotland.
27

Julian,

EDINBURGH 24/12/2007 14:24:27
calum # 31,

Yes, given the choice between buses belching out toxic fumes on the streets of Edinburgh and power stations putting out fumes at a much higher level in remore locations, surely the former is better.

And please remember my point that by 2020, over 50% of electricity will be generated from nuclear and renewables.

Ever heard of the expression "lesser of 2 evils"? Comes up quite a lot in the real world;-)
28

calum,

25/12/2007 11:54:40
#32 .....the lesser of 2 evils! So that make it alright then!
Have you ever heard the expression "I'm alright, Jack". Clearly features a lot in your real world. Selfish Greetings to you.(_*_)

 

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