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Michael Gove: Iceland has shown up Salmond as a Darien dreamer

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Published Date: 12 October 2008
Even the most unlikely figures turn to the Union in tough times
NEVER get into a fight with a chimney sweep, my mother always warned me. To which she might have added, and never get into an economics argument with Alex Salmond.

The First Minister has many talents, but perhaps pre-eminent among them is an abili
ty to spin almost any financial development to his advantage. A former chief economist at the Royal Bank of Scotland and, no less notably, a newspaper tipster with a bookie's eye for calculating the odds, Alex can intimidate even the most self-confident critics. And I should know. When I was a callow reporter for the BBC in the Nineties, I tried to take the SNP leader on in an interview designed to test the robustness of nationalist economics.

After 10 minutes, the producer had to halt the interview for humanitarian reasons. The Buchan Bomber had made mincemeat of me and my arguments. The flower of the SNP sent me homeward, or at least to Queen Margaret Drive, to think again.

Since those days, Alex has, hard though it may be to credit, only grown in confidence. And it would seem that only the brave or the foolish would wish to confront him on his chosen ground of economics.

But these are turbulent times, economically, in which all manner of assumptions are being challenged. The ground is moving beneath our feet. And the position Nationalists find themselves in looks less commanding than even a few months ago. Of course, the SNP retain significant political strengths. The momentum from Glasgow East gives them hope in Glenrothes. The First Minister is a resilient, and practised, performer. The prominence of economic, and financial, news in every bulletin creates a media demand for his particular blend of banking experience and political self-assurance.

But the crisis which is consuming all our attention, global in scope and mammoth in its ramifications, is also undermining the political appeal for any small country of striking out on its own. The reality of the worldwide financial crisis is that economic insecurity now undermines the ground on which the Nationalists had hoped to advance.

It's a historical fact that nationalism has flourished on the back of economic optimism – from the dreams floated on North Sea oil in the 1970s, to the SNP victory last year on the crest of the UK boom. The prospect of constitutional upheaval somehow seems less fraught when other political factors look favourable. The flipside of the phenomenon, however, is that when the economic skies darken, then secession seems a much more risky business.

Nationalist support plummeted as we went through dark times in the late Seventies and early Eighties. The SNP boomlet of the late Eighties – fuelled by the Sillars breakthrough in Govan – died away in the recessionary days of the early Nineties. Indeed it is often forgotten that in 1992, in the depths of economic bad times, a Unionist message of constitutional stability secured electoral gains for the Conservatives in Scotland.

In these difficult times, the case for the Union will again appear stronger. Edinburgh is rightly celebrated as a centre of dynamism and innovation in financial services – and it has grown in importance under devolution – but the future of both HBOS and RBS is more secure this weekend as a result of access to the resources of the UK Exchequer.

Scotland has developed a more diverse and flexible labour market over the last two decades, but with unemployment rising, there is an extra level of security in knowing that the UK-wide welfare system provides a safety net which is as generous in Bathgate as it is in Birmingham. Speed of response matters at these times in getting your policy properly aligned, but when your country's voice needs to be heard, as the EU big four meet, or Washington looks to co-ordinate interventions, then the UK Prime Minister's words carry weight in a way that, for example, no Scandinavian leader's ever can.

And, talking of Scandinavia, the example of Iceland will concentrate minds. The revelation that Scottish local authorities have had millions of pounds worth of savings evaporate in the mid-Atlantic deals a significant blow to SNP plans for frozen council tax and free school meals. The fact that Salmond has already asked Westminster to support the councils in trouble underlines how even the most unlikely figures turn to the Union in tough times.

Iceland's woes do more, however, than just threaten council finances. The bankruptcy of a small Nordic nation, which resisted political union, and which just months ago seemed to have a strong economy based on tourism, energy, fish and finance, will have many reverberations. Few of them, however, are likely to strengthen the case for Scotland seceding from its own union. When the SNP cited Iceland as the sort of nation Scotland should emulate by joining the Atlantic "arc of prosperity", they may have looked smart and visionary. But then so, presumably, did those in 1700 who thought Darien was the investment opportunity of the century.

Most of us who are Unionists support the Union because we think Scotland's strengths complement those of other parts of the UK. The relationship works to everyone's benefit.

It's a positive message, rooted in a belief that co-operation, not division, is the way to advance. But positive as the vision is, the reality of darker times only makes the argument for the Union more powerful. So powerful, in fact, that I suspect even a politician of Alex's ingenuity won't want to make "Let's Go It Alone!" the message of this moment.

Michael Gove is shadow secretary of state for children





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  • Last Updated: 11 October 2008 8:35 PM
  • Source: Scotland On Sunday
  • Location: Scotland
 
1

Richardinho,

12/10/2008 01:16:38
Alex Salmond is a Westminster MP at the moment. The SNP has always believed in engaging with Westminster because as long as we're in the union then they have to use all means to fight Scotland's corner. As long as Scottish tax revenues are sent to Westminster, then the SNP has every right to make sure that we get our fair share.
I can only speak for myself, but this current crisis only strengthens my belief in Scottish independence. I'm not convinced that Westminster isn't trying to bring down Scotland's banking institutions. In a crisis when it's 'every man for himself' you are better relying on your self rather than on others. This crisis has only underlined how helpless Scotland is.
2

Colin Wilson,

Aberdeen 12/10/2008 07:59:29
"Most of us who are Unionists support the Union because we think Scotland's strengths complement those of other parts of the UK. The relationship works to everyone's benefit. "

The UK was not created to work for everyone's benefit, and it does not. For political reasons, the UK destroyed Scotland's manufacturing base in the 70s and 80s, and replaced it with an economy based on banks lending money they didn't have to people who couldn't afford to pay it back. If we weren't ruled by the UK, we needn't have been in this mess in the first place.

We HAVE to get this country free from the UK.
3

Linda,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 10:03:23
An independent Scotland would have had much stricter financial regulations and Brown and Darling's inaction plus deliberate government leaks caused the run on the Banks. Norway has no Banking crisis and we have more in common with Norway, size of population, mixed economy, oil gas etc.
4

Mrs Numpty,

East Sussex 12/10/2008 10:04:44
N0 2 The UK destroyed Scotland's manufacturing base, actually should read "Thatcher destroyed Scotland's manufacturing base" along with manufacturing in yhe whole of the UK, it is called capitalism and it stinks.
5

Farq,

London 12/10/2008 10:25:04
2 unfair comparisons in this article. The first comparing a future independant Scotland with Iceland - most Scots want closer links with the EU, Iceland is firmly isolationist. The second, suggesting that the failure of the Darien colony was the fault of poor economic decisions on the part of the Scots - Darien failed thanks to an English blockade.
6

malcolmcean,

12/10/2008 11:02:56
This is a really disappointing article.

Once upon a time there was a party known as the Scottish Unionist Party. They used to regulaly gather over 50% of the vote in Scotland. They followed a mantra which proclaimed that, yes, Scotland could easily manage to run an economy on its own, but why would it want to. The idea of union to them was to promote Scotland's interest in a global imperial environment and maximise its potential through these vast economic and political networks.

The Scottish Unionist Party decided to join the Conservatoive party of England. Year on year this new Scottish Conservative and Unionist party has slowly drifted away from its core principles and fimr attachment to its constituency. It is now no longer a cheerleader for the promotion of Scottish interests. It now no longer has the confidence that Scots could run their own affairs if they wished.

If Michael Gove's article is to be considered the next step in the evolution of Scottish tory thinking, then we have now reached the final stages of the process of the extinction of the ideals of the old Unionist party. To sum up: Scotland is an English dependency and any attempts to move outwith this sphere will end in disaster.

The Tory party, like the Labour party (who have done so because their low opinion of the Scottish public convinces them that people need to be beaten with fear for their own good), have now stepped outside the disource which has an optimistic and positivist view of Scottish potential.

I cannot see how this attitude will do anything other than further break the emotional attachment in the minds of Scots with the political attachment to the union.

It is now all about the economics of the wife beater: you've no where else to go if you leave me.

They do have somewhere else to go (the EU - an area which provides that global economic and political framework which the empire did); and, as evidenced by the rise of the SNP, they will not long tolerate such a n
7

malcolmcean,

12/10/2008 11:03:18
...such a negative message
8

Bolivarian Scot,

London 12/10/2008 11:10:55
Nice try, Mr Gove, but the Tories haven't a snowball's chance north of the Border, even in these difficult economic times. That's largely due to your heroine, Lady Thatcher, whose "great leadership" exacerbated the North / South divide as never before, and gave the nationalist cause a massive boost. Also, both Tories and New Labour are big on "free markets" and "deregulation", which are no longer flavour-of-the-month in the UK as a whole, never mind Scotland.

If you doubt that Lady T is guilty of breaking up the UK, you should read "50 People Who Buggered Up Britain" by Quentin Letts, the Daily Mail's Westminster diarist. Plummy-voiced Home Counties public schoolboy Letts is a hypocrite when it comes to attacking the Glaswegian Michael Martin, and mealy-mouthed / half-hearted in his criticism about Rupert Murdoch (surprise-surprise); but his criticism of the Blessed Margaret - that she split the UK by pursuing a politically-motivated strike against the NUM / the coal industry - is spot-on.

(By the way..... I'd like to make it clear that I didn't actually BUY Mr Letts' book. That would be ridiculous! As a canny Scot, I did some speed-reading in Waterstones....)

Interesting that you see the 1970s as a period of "economic optimism" based on North sea oil. Doesn't Tory mythology say that the 1970s were a period of unmitigated national decline and shame? Or are you suggesting that North Sea oil dug the UK out of a deep hole?
9

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 12/10/2008 11:14:25
Michael Gove should stick to scaring little children, or whatever it is that shadow secretaries of state for children do.

Perhaps the reason that Alex made "mincemeat" of your arguments is not that he is some sort economic super genius, or that you are some idiot way out of your depth. No the reason your arguments got turned into mincemeat is that none of them are rooted in any sort of logic.

Just like your silly argument that Icelands economy is in anyway similar to Scotlands.
Sure they have Energy, but when you occupy the middle of the North Atlantic and that Energy is Geo Thermal it is pretty difficult to export. The other arguments about tourism and fishing being mainstays just shows how little of anything they actually have.

Iceland used to have a few banks but the three of them combined would be dwarfed by Clydesdale bank.

An Independent Scotland will still be the member of a larger economic union, The European Union, in which will have much more control over its own economic destiny. It has gained nothing in this crisis from being tied tide the millstone of lax UK regulation which bears a great deal of responsibility in allowing this disaster to happen in the first place.

So away with you and your empty headed arguments, "homeward, or at least to Queen Margaret Drive, to think again."
10

Bolivarian Scot,

London 12/10/2008 11:33:20
........ And if North Sea oil dug the UK out of a deep hole, Mr Gove, why is your party, and its supporters in the UK media, going around repeating the lies that SE England subsidises Scotland, that Scots are a shiftless and lazy bunch of ingrates etc? Every Scot in the SE of England (indeed, every Northerner) runs up against this malicious and mischievous Unionist nonsense at some point, and counter-arguments about the difference between "identifiable" and "non-identifiable" public expenditure, generally fall on deaf ears. The Sun, Mail have spoken; end of story.

As for Iceland - it's simply untrue to state that everyone thought it was a sound economy. The ridiculousness of a multi-billion pound banking sector based on a country of just 300,000 souls has long made Iceland the typical subject of UK banks' country risk stress-testing scenarios. As a Tory boffin, you must have heard the rumours (and presumably spoke out about the folly of investing in Iceland).

Unfortunately the ratings agencies were a bit slow in downgrading Iceland, with sadly predictable results. But other small nations seem to be doing OK, eg Norway, Sweden etc, while some of the big ones are struggling.

As for the failure of the Darien scheme: well, to the comments of #5 Farq, London, I would add that the Scots colonists not only had to deal with an English blockade but also a rotten choice of site, hostile natives, the Spanish and of course Mother Nature. "A perfect storm"!
11

ochone,

Sauchie, Clack's 12/10/2008 12:11:44
How nice, though unexpected it would have been if Scotland on Sunday had given the SNP the right of reply.

Then again that would be democratic, so no chance there then.
12

Mr. Lachie Todd,

Edinburgh 12/10/2008 12:22:17
We are all aware, the Scots Tories only have one Westminster M.P. out of the present 59 and periodically have to ship in English Tories in support of the hapless and lonely David Mundell, the Shadow Secretary of State for Scotland.

However, IF, I was David Mundell I would be greatly concerned about the anti-Scottish views expressed by Mr. Gove, the M.P. for leafy Surrey Heath, who simply serves to remind the Scots Electorate about the real variety of Conservatives the Scots will have to deal with in years to come!

The Tories keep talking down Scotland at their peril!
13

Richardinho,

12/10/2008 12:35:13
The reason that Alex Salmond probably made 'mincemeat' out of Michael Gove was because his arguments happened to be right. You'd have thought Mr Gove might have learned something since then, but clearly not since he's still invoking the Darien disaster of over 300 years ago as if that's remotely relevant to today.
No less a figure than the former tory leader David McLetchie said, talking about the economic argument for independence, that 'you might as well hand it to the SNP right now'. In fact, the unionist argument invariably is an emotional one, ranging from waxing lyrical about 'rule britania' (sorry, but that just doesn't impress me much) to the kind of fear mongering we see in this article.
14

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeenshire 12/10/2008 15:53:06
The author seems to lack any depth of argument.

He picks off Iceland, a poor comparison to Scotland with only two real industries (banking and fishing), with a population the size of Fife. And then not mention Norway, Finland, Sweden and Denmark. Are they better off together or apart? Individually or collectively, they will be more resilient than the UK over the coming months. Not because they are small nations, but because they have relied much less on the financial sector than the UK. But Iceland has not, and because it does not have the same diversity of industry as the UK, is finding it much, much tougher.

The big hypothetical question used time and time again by unionists is:
"Would Scotland be able to bail out HBOS and RBS by itself?"

Fair question, however it's hypothetical.

My questions to them:
"Would Bank of Scotland and Halifax be one bank if Scotland were independent?"
"Would RBS have grown in the manner it did if Scotland were independent?"

Selective hypothesis can be used to argue any case.
15

Itchy,

12/10/2008 16:33:17
"4 Mrs Numpty,East Sussex 12/10/2008 10:04:44
N0 2 The UK destroyed Scotland's manufacturing base, actually should read "Thatcher destroyed Scotland's manufacturing base" along with manufacturing in yhe whole of the UK, it is called capitalism and it stinks."

You curiously absolve the Heath, Wilson and Callaghan governments of blame in the decline of UK manufacturing.

And where was the capitalism you are talking about? I thought we were bled dry with taxes.
16

PL,

12/10/2008 18:00:15
This column is beneath Michael Gove (who tends to speak some sense for a Tory) for three reasons:

Firstly: if (hypothetically) the UK was in a spectacularly parlous financial position and America suggested that the UK joined its union, would Gove cede the freedom and self-determination of the British people for financial security? If so, okay: but I suggest that he would not. If he wouldn't, his argument is specious. If the opposite is true, the future of Britain is more precarious than he cares to admit -- and is threatened by politicians like himself.
If one's nation is Scotland, not Britain, and one believes in the principle of national self-determination, money is not the decisive factor. Gove should acknowledge this or commit himself to the doctrine of money before national self-determination. I suggest that David Cameron will never say: "Britain is expendable. It's the money in out pockets that counts."
Gove produces arguments which expose him to ridicule.

Secondly, I find his reference to the reassuringly "generous" welfare system incredible. Tory policy will criminalize some of the most wretched members of our society, including the unskilled and the misfits with personality disorders (many of whom have degrees) who employers reject. Significant numbers of these people are legitimately unemployed for more than two years. These unfortunate individuals will endure humiliation on our streets as garbagemen (David Cameron refuses to rule out luminous vests: that is for the private sector to decide). To many former professionals, the notion of picking up rubbish is a hideous, unthinkable fate. Tory welfare reforms will criminalize the most wretched of the law abiding and employ humiliation as a tool of public policy: they will reduce graduates to trashmen (and many of these failed individuals are borderline suicidal before welfare reform). This is not only inhuman, it is foolish because it will provoke massive opposition when the political tide has
17

PL,

12/10/2008 18:04:57
(cont) turned in a few years. A draconian Tory would force the unskilled and the misfits to work for their benefits (and not a penny more) in roles which at least acknowledged their former status. If a former businessman is forced to work as a menial data entry clerk for £0, is this not an overwhelming incentive to find paid employment? Why use humiliation as a tool of public policy -- when it is so utterly unnecessary?
To speak of "generosity" is really quite obtuse: a politician's language should never provoke the politically neutral with its sheer falsity.
Thirdly, there is no meaningful comparison between national self-determination and Darien, as Gove knows. A gifted and seasoned politician seldom descends into brazen politicking.
18

Tom R,

12/10/2008 21:47:31
Michael Gove says "It's a historical fact that nationalism has flourished on the back of economic optimism."

Others have accurately blasted the utter nonsense of this article, so I will simply restrict myself to pointing out that the highest ever vote for the SNP at a Westminster General Election was in 1974 when the economy was in such dire straits that one SNP political broadcast at the time used the slogan "SOS" standing for switch on Scotland, reflecting the failure of the then Government even to keep the lights on.

 

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