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MPs made right decision on abortion limit, but the battle is far from over



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The decision to retain the current right to an abortion up to 24 weeks of pregnancy has been welcomed by millions of women across Scotland and the UK.
However, the fight is far from over. Forty years ago my parents campaigned for a woman's right to choose. The fact that I still have to take to the streets to protect that right is frightening.

The MPs who put forward amendments calling for a 20 o
r 22-week limit claim it is a compromise. It is not. Fewer than 2 per cent of abortions take place after 20 weeks, but those that do tend to involve the most vulnerable women and reducing the upper limit could have forced these women to have unwanted children, go through the emotional pain of adoption or seek dangerous "back street" abortions.

Pro-life campaigners use emotive talk of medical advances and botched abortions. They claim more and more babies are surviving premature births. Their arguments are at best disingenuous and at worst dangerously inaccurate. The medical profession overwhelmingly supports continuation of the 24-week limit. The EPIcure 2 survey demonstrates there has been no significant improvement in the survival rates of premature babies.

The pro-life lobby has vowed to continue its fight to curb women's rights. For now, women can be relieved that common sense has prevailed. But tomorrow, the campaign to make access to abortion fairer for women across the UK will continue.

KAINDE MANJI
National Union of Students Scotland Women's Officer
Forth Street, Edinburgh


Recent discussions about abortion have made much of the question of viability. It is seen as acceptable to abort a foetus that is not yet viable. However, the truth is that if the foetus were not viable there would be no point in aborting it: the whole purpose of abortion is to prevent a viable foetus being born as a child. It is the act of abortion alone which robs the foetus of viability.

(REV) GILBERT McADAM
Lumang Bayan Village
Antipolo, The Philippines


I find it very strange that those against abortion cite the Bible (God's revealed truth?) to support their views.

By His own words, is He not a baby killer? He totally destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah. He thus killed men, women and children as well as babies and women in various stages of pregnancy, and thus their yet unborn offspring.

Or were the deaths of non-adults to be treated as Divine collateral damage, and ergo of no theological or moral significance?

ROBERT M DUNN
Oxcars Court
Edinburgh


With regard to saviour siblings, John Deighan, parliamentary officer for the Catholic Church in Scotland, asks: "What happens to the embryos unfortunate enough not to have the correct tissue match?" (your report, 21 May). As he is no doubt aware, they will not be implanted, like the majority of embryos created whenever any IVF is carried out. If his objection is to IVF in general, he should say so, rather than imply something different is happening here.

It is also a misrepresentation to say that creating saviour siblings "requires the exploitation of the vulnerable for the sake of the powerful". It actually involves the creation of a new person who would otherwise not exist, who then saves the life of another person. It's ironic that the Catholic Church regards itself as a pro-life organisation when it would prefer that the existing child die and the saviour sibling never be created.

(DR) DAVID SHAW
University of Glasgow
Sauchiehall Street, Glasgow




The full article contains 596 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 21 May 2008 8:42 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
 
1

Rollo Tommasi,

22/05/2008 01:45:27
Like Kainde Manji says, there has been no significant improvement in the survival prospects for foetuses between 20 and 23 weeks since 1990. For that reason, I am comfortable with the decision Parliament has reached.

But it makes my skin crawl to read people still talking about abortion being a "woman's right". That label makes abortion appear a clean, clinical, straight-forward choice. As someone whose wife has recently endured a medically induced miscarriage, I can tell you it is a long, painful process and one of the most distressing episodes I think anyone should have to go through in their lives.

Ultimately, decisions as to whether to abort a foetus which is unlikely to survive are best left to the mother, sure. But let's end for all the idea of abortion as a "right" and let nobody be in any doubt as to what a horrible experience it must be for those who, whether of choice or necessity, undergo it.
2

StuartAD,

West Lothian 22/05/2008 07:58:06
I think that the "Student Officer" would be better to tell the young women students about methods of contraception. That might be a real help to the very people she is supposed to represent. What a better way to free up medical time & money for other diseases & not social mistakes after a night out.
3

Martinh,

22/05/2008 08:19:45
On this occasion MPs views reflected wider public opinion, not to tinker with the upper limit for abortion, and overwhelmingly against limiting the need for medical researchers to curtail vital investigations using stem cell research. In this case scientific rationalism has prevailed over medieval superstition.
4

Maximus,

Roberton 22/05/2008 08:29:35
No2, Yes indeed - nothing quite like saying 'no' in the first place. Less money on contraception - more money on beer.

Besides what if her parents had said yes to an abortion. She shouls thank her parents for not having an abortion, and hence write the letter.

5

Maximus,

Roberton 22/05/2008 08:31:59
'It's ironic that the Catholic Church regards itself as a pro-life organisation when it would prefer that the existing child die and the saviour sibling never be created.'

Dr Shaw misunderstands the teaching of the Catholic Church on this matter - we were made for eternity, not just life on earth.
6

Maximus,

Roberton 22/05/2008 08:34:37
RM Dunn - Take a look at what S&G were up to, and then look out yourself. But yes - it rains on the just and the unjust.
7

Gilbert McAdam,

Manila 22/05/2008 09:08:33
A ship was crossing an ocean, with 100 children aboard. The crew were getting more and more upset by the antics of the children, and began to consider the idea of throwing them overboard. They discussed their options.

1. Since none of the children would be in any danger so long as they were allowed to remain on the ship, they should not be thrown overboard. This had little support. The children were too much of a nuisance, and the rights of the crew would be infringed by allowing them to remain.

2. Since other children who had fallen overboard within sight of land had been known to survive, these children should be thrown overboard within sight of land. No one supported this. After all, the whole purpose of the exercise was to get rid of the children, not to have them survive with all the potential embarrassment which might ensue.

3. That the children should be thrown overboard in mid-ocean where survival would be impossible. Some simple-minded sailors argued that this would be immoral. More intelligent members of the crew (including Captain Brown, who was very intelligent) were able to demonstrate that the opposite was actually the case. Since no child had been known to survive accidentally falling overboard at that stage in previous voyages, this fact alone justified taking children from the safety of the ship and deliberately throwing them overboard. Their inability to survive the procedure was not an argument against its morality, but in favour of it!

Congratulating themselves upon the profound morality of their decision, the crew began at once to throw the children to the waiting sharks.
8

jj veritas,

22/05/2008 10:32:09
Those seeking abortions should fill in a form indicating how the foetus/baby should be killed - suffocation, lethal injection, left to linger, a swift tap on the head or some other method.

People should be made to think a little more before they make a decision. I knew one girl who had four abortions. It's all too easy and thoughtless a process for all concerned.
9

James,,

22/05/2008 10:50:20
"Pro-life campaigners use emotive talk of medical advances and botched abortions."

And pro-abortion campaigners don't use emotive language? Their arguments are full of appeals to pity - these poor women who are having such a hard time they should be allowed to have their unborn child murdered.

It is quite ironic that the student harks back approvingly to the 60's when her parents campaigned for the right to murder unborn children. Has she stopped to consider they were campaigning for the right to murder her? And she thinks it is "frightening" that some people want to restrict or take away that right!

10

Martinh,

22/05/2008 11:10:26
#9. In law, a foetus is not a child, and an abortion is not murder. MPs recognised this and reached the decision to keep the status quo. With most terminations taking place before 12 weeks anyway, also the timescale for "God's abortions", ie miscarriage, the tiny number of late terminations always involves critical medical or social factors. Not easy decisions to take at that stage, but lets keep things in proportion. Using deliberately emotive language equating an unviable foetus with a new born term baby is wrong.
11

Gilbert McAdam,

Manila 22/05/2008 11:29:26
#10 There we go again - "an unviable foetus". The foetus is perfectly viable provided it isn't ripped from its mother's womb. Only the abortion makes it unviable.
12

Gilbert McAdam,

Manila 22/05/2008 11:31:32
What I find utterly staggering about Kainde Manji's letter is her statement that some women could be forced to go through "the emotional pain of adoption" if the upper limit for abortion were reduced. She clearly believes it is acceptable to deny life to the child than to go through the emotional pain of seeing it handed over to a caring family who would make any sacrifice to give it a loving home. As the father of an adopted child I am simply appalled by that.
13

Puzzler,

Edinburgh 22/05/2008 11:38:32
The argument over abortion is characterised by gross dishonesty on both sides.

The pro-life lobby is fatally weakend by the RC church's opposition to contraception - which simply prevents conception, rather than terminating a pregnancy. If the church were to change their stance it would strengthen their hand immeasurably.

The pro choice lobby sound shrill and aggressive. Abortion is a legitimate topic for public discussion, but they are constantly telling anyone who challneges them to shut up.

There are also a few issues I would like answers on :

How many abortions are related to medical need, or are required by rape or incest victims, compared to those that are simply for inconvenient healthy pregnancies?

How much does the BPAS get paid for each abortion referral, and is it ethical to have an organisation with a vested financial interest in abortion supposedly giving "neutral" advice?

If it's a woman's right to choose, why do so many activists refer to emotive rape and medical crises as examples?

For the same reason, why oppose abortion of female foetus's in the developing world? Any reason is as good as another surely?

If a foetus is not a human being, should we not legalise infanticide, in order to be consistent?

Why not meke as much information as possible about teh facts pof abortion avaialnbel and thenm let people make up their own minds?
14

Martinh,

22/05/2008 11:53:19
I am certainly not a pro abortion activist, it shouldn't be necessary in this day and age with modern contraception, and there is self evidently continued widespread ignorance amongst the population that leads to the huge number of annual terminations. However there will always be unwanted pregnancies, and the 1968 Abortion Act represented one of the most pivotal pieces of socially liberating legislation of the last century. The matter is decided,not by me but by our elected representatives and as with hanging and flogging there is no going back.
15

Gilbert McAdam,

Manila 22/05/2008 12:12:40
#14 (Martinh) "there will always be unwanted pregnancies." -- Yes, that's true. And there will always be infertile couples only too ready to adopt and love the children of unwanted pregnancies. Abortion is not the answer.
16

Martinh,

22/05/2008 14:12:14
#15. Gilbert, I fully respect your opinion, but you cannot force a woman to go to term with an unwanted pregnancy, and all the pre 1968 evidence points to the fact that women would go to almost any length to procure a termination, even when their own lives were at risk. Even today, people who reside in countries without liberal abortion legislation will go to any lengths too,travelling abroad to get what they want. The situation is far from ideal, and the best way forward is through education, such that particularly young girls do not have unwanted pregnancies. Childless couples can still adopt/foster unwanted children,there are plenty of them, but most want a baby only. As I said the decision has now been taken, and I cannot see Parliament revisiting it again for a generation, if ever.
17

Miss H,

22/05/2008 16:19:30
1 It is a woman's right in a legal sense. That's the point. Abortion has always existed and will always exist. It cannot be banned or prevented. Even when it was illegal abortions happened and abortions continue to happen in countries where it is not allowed.

So what people are debating are the legal rights that women have to an abortion not the actual incidence or experience of abortion.
18

Rollo Tommasi,

22/05/2008 19:45:08
Miss H: It's not a woman's "right" to abort an unborn child. A woman's "rights" do not automatically trump the "rights" of the unborn child - otherwise abortions would be legal at 30 or 35 weeks.

This debate is about how we balance these competing rights and the circumstances in which society is prepared to tolerate legal abortions. We've settled on a standard which says that abortion is acceptable until the point is reached where it is likely that the foetus could survive outwith the womb. The evidence says that point remains 24 weeks.

Let's treat abortions as the necessary (or even often unnecessary but forgivable) evils that they are. But don't try to pretend that the mother's interests are all that matters in abortion. Don't try to ignore the distress they can cause mothers and their loved ones. And certainly don't try to ignore the terrible fact that each abortion results in the loss of one potential new life.
19

Shrink,

Dundee 22/05/2008 22:17:18
#17 - "Abortion has always existed and will always exist. It cannot be banned or prevented" - the same could be said for. If that is the arguement then we should legalise all illicit drugs, legalise tax exasion & fraud, stealing, murder. They all exist & will always exist.

 

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