Help Sitemap Home Skip Navigation Contact Us Disability Statement


Thousands are hit by rail strike chaos

Premium Article !

Your account has been frozen. For your available options click the below button.

Options

Premium Article !

To read this article in full you must have registered and have a Premium Content Subscription with the The Scotsman site.

Subscribe

Registered Article !

To read this article in full you must be registered with the site.

Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image

Published Date: 08 October 2008
HUNDREDS of train services ground to a halt yesterday after signallers walked out in protest at plans to change working rosters.
The 24-hour strike from noon yesterday caused chaos on the network, leaving passengers fuming.

Many commuters spoke of the frustration at being left in the lurch, particularly as the action happened during a tough economic time, and vented their fury at union leaders.

A second 24-hour strike will start at noon tomorrow unless talks that resume today find a resolution. Network Rail and the Rail, Maritime & Transport union (RMT) will meet at Acas again this afternoon in a bid to find a breakthrough.

The walk-out yesterday forced the cancellation of at least 40 per cent of First ScotRail services, including all trains north of Perth.

Network Rail said more trains than expected may run this morning because of the number of signallers who did not take part in the strike. However, the RMT said there had been "rock-solid" support from its 450 signallers and supervisors.

The action is the second by RMT signallers in Scotland in two years. Network Rail said the RMT had threatened strikes 17 times across Britain in the past year.

Business leaders expressed anger at the timing of the walk-out, coming amid the economic downturn, while passengers said they were resigned to more rail disruption. A political row raged over the First Minister's intervention in the dispute.

Richard Cairns, the chief executive of Glasgow Chamber of Commerce, said: "One would expect that unions and management could have got together to sort the situation out before it reached this stage.

"Nobody wins from an action like this, and the costs will be high to both businesses and their employees."

Frustration was shared by passengers at Queen Street station in Glasgow yesterday. John Osborne, a solicitor waiting to travel back to Edinburgh, said: "In the current conditions, seeing such inflexibility is not good. Some people will be grateful to have a job."

However, there was sympathy for the strikers among other travellers. Norman Ritchie, an oil industry executive, who was forced to return home to Aberdeen by coach, said: "From what I have heard, the signallers have not received what they were promised, so they have had no other option."

Network Rail, using unusually blunt language, said the strike was being led by union "dinosaurs" who had misrepresented members' interests.

David Simpson, its route director for Scotland, said the dispute had been "manufactured" by two RMT officials "with a personal axe to grind".

It is understood that he meant John Macdougall and Dougie Hill, who are based in Dundee and Aberdeen.

RMT officials, in turn, accused Network Rail of mismanagement. Bob Crow, its general secretary, who joined a picket line at Motherwell, said the strikers were "determined that Network Rail will keep its side of the agreements we are all supposed to be bound by".

He accused the firm of using "scab managers with scant route knowledge" to staff signalling centres during the strike.

Network Rail condemned the claims as "damned lies". It said: "They always say the same thing. All managers are competent, trained signallers."

Tavish Scott, the leader of the Scottish Liberal Democrats and transport minister during last year's strike, welcomed the resumption of talks, but criticised Alex Salmond's actions.

He said: "The SNP have got to work out what their role is. First they said it was none of their business. Then the First Minister phoned everyone, which was too late. So now the government is involved, they need to stop Thursday's strike."

Mr Salmond said: "It's deeply unfortunate that one remaining issue in the dispute has resulted in substantial inconvenience to the travelling public.

"Both unions and management must do their utmost to resolve their differences."

BACKGROUND

THE routine tests to ensure signallers remain up to the job lie at the heart of the dispute.

Signal staff undergo assessment checks four times a year, because of their key role in ensuring the safety of trains.

The dates of such "non-operational activities" are normally agreed weeks in advance.

However, the Rail, Maritime & Transport union (RMT) said a shortage of signallers has led to Network Rail cancelling some tests, because there are insufficient staff left to cover for them.

The RMT said this had led to a backlog of tests and changes to working rosters at short notice. It fears that staff are not being given enough time to prepare for rearranged test dates.

Ian Macintyre, one of the union's Scottish regional organisers, accused Network Rail of "mismanagement" yesterday and called for vacancies to be filled.

The firm said the union had failed to provide any examples to justify its claims. David Simpson, its route director for Scotland, has said some allegations made by the union "bear as much resemblance to reality as a Thomas the Tank Engine story".

He said: "There is not one iota of fact to support what the RMT says. How can they be more unreasonable?"

The dispute started in May and has since been discussed by both sides at national level, before being referred back to Scotland for further talks.

After the strikes were called, both sides met separately with Acas on both Friday and Monday to no avail.


The full article contains 882 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 07 October 2008 9:37 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
 
1

Voldemort,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 00:16:29
Why don't the government ban something useful for a change and make unions that hold them and the british people to ransom over grossly excessive pay deals for their monkey members a thing of the past!

Every solitary single year there is always a union moaning and threatening to strike for more pay, less work, and excessive perks just so they can justify their existence to their members who are unable to think for themselves.

Shame on every union and their members - it's like having Paul Gadd running a primary school ... sickening.
2

Conan the Librarian™,

08/10/2008 00:43:00
1
Any comments on the greed of the bankers who are currently causing much more trouble, Voldemort?

It would be like Thatcher in charge of milk distribution to children...
3

Voldemort,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 01:17:08
2 - Yes, I hope the bankers get their just desserts too - I have no quarms if a few top bankers get fired ! - I also hope that people learn that credit - even if it is available is not necessarily the way to go.

Not having your currency backed by a commodity is turning out to be a huge mistake - instead the currency can be backed by 'collateral' which in our case can represent the 'promise' to pay - therefore money itself represents credit - which is not sustainable in any way, shape or form - but it is a great way for governments to print their way out of trouble on the quiet. Which we will see shortly ....

As for Thatcher the milk snatcher - can you tell me which party has reinstated milk distribution to children ? Nope ? Why is it, given that it is important and not that expensive that nobody has repealed this terrible decision ? For Thatcher to do it is one thing - but for it to go unchanged speaks volumes ....

Whatever, Conan - the fact that the banking sector is in tatters, and Maggie Thatcher was right about milk, and the fact that the Nazi's invaded Poland or whatever else you want to bring up doesn't make the RMT right for their despicable and selfish actions.

I reiterate that unions are no more than parasitic protection rackets and have no place in our society.

.. Nor do corrupt, greedy or inept bankers if that makes you feel better ...

for your notes - deflection is a fairly blunt little tool ...
4

Helmut Smegma,

Edinburgh. 08/10/2008 07:53:55
Once again held to ransom by the lowly-paid manual workers.They`re striking over rosters yet the economy is in meltdown.
5

Kenny 07,

08/10/2008 07:56:52
1&3. Total anti union I see. You can't be bothered reading the story, but because there is a strike involved, you assume it's about more money. Try reading the story ya plum. It's about health and safety, shortage of employees to cover safety assessments and short notice compulsary changing of rosters which breaks existing agreements. They already agree to work 24/7 365 days a year and if the management have mismanaged their resources that much that they can't release staff for safety assessments, what chance is there of them running the signals during a dispute?
6

Ugly George,

08/10/2008 08:10:53
7 Kenny07
Notice the following extract from the article :

"Network Rail said the RMT had threatened strikes 17 times across Britain in the past year."

I think that sums up Bob Crow and the RMT - always looking for an excuse to call a strike. After one London tube strike, Ken Livingstone (hardly an avid Thatcherite) condemned the RMT as the only union to threaten a strike when "all their demands had been met"
7

,

08/10/2008 08:16:45
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
8

Marcus Fenix,

The Valley 08/10/2008 08:20:56
Unions are a thing of a by-gone era. Unions, and the dinosaurs that manage them, should be committed to the history books.

#7. Last I heard they were striking over "politeness".
It's a bloody joke.
9

Kenny 07,

08/10/2008 08:51:56
Ugly George.
"Network Rail said the RMT had threatened strikes 17 times across Britain in the past year."

Maybe you would prefer to travel on an unsafe rail network, by allowing management to break agreements when they like by forcing employees to work rest days?
Would you like Air Traffic Controllers controlling the skies with enforced working? They are similar type jobs. A lot of those negotiated agreements that management try to break are the result of legal findings in the aftermath of tragic accidents on Britains rail networks. The RMT has fought on behalf of it's members to ensure those agreements are adhered to, and I for one will continue to support them in their fight against managers who try to change them without negotiation. If the RMT has threatened strike action 17 times across Britain this year, it means management have tried to breach agreements by the same amount. The RMT has more than 80,000 members from almost every sector of the transport industry - from the mainline and underground railways, shipping and offshore, buses and road freight. They negotiate with over 150 transport-sector companies, and help protect their members from unscrupulous employers.
10

Stewarty,

08/10/2008 09:04:35
Those who are quick to condemn unions in general and the RMT in particular should ask themselves how they would feel if they were dismissed from employment without the basic human right of a hearing. This tactic is in the "playbook" of Network Rail which has been accused by another rail union of premeditated unfair dismissal against its members. So much so that views are being canvassed on the preparedness of those members to take industrial action.

Network Rail employment practices are archaic and outdated - reminiscent of the age of the industrial revolution where employees went unvalued and treated as a commodity.

RMT has had good working relationships with other rail companies in Scotland. When was the last time its members in First ScotRail took industrial action? A long time ago, I suggest, when National Express owned ScotRail.

If I had been Network Rail's spokesperson I think I would want to conceal the fact that the company had been threatened with 17 strikes by the RMT over 2 years. Against the background of industrial peace between the RMT and other rail companies, people should not rush to condemn the RMT but question if Network Rail's policies are the real cause of the discontent.

As Alex Salmond is now involved, he ought to consider ordering an enquiry into the company's employment policies and practice. It might be all revealing especially if its terms of reference embrace the role of Mr Peter Bennett, Network Rail's Director of Human Resources!
11

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 09:49:24
11 Kenny 07
Do you really think that Bob Crow and his colleagues are motivated by safety. Ask Ken Livingstone - a self-proclaimed socialist who was driven to exasperation by the RMT.
12

Ugly George,

edinburgh 08/10/2008 09:53:31
12 Stewarty
"premeditated unfair dismissal against its members"

Like the case of the driver who claimed he was unfit for work because of a leg injury but was, strangely enough, fit enough to play squash. RMT defended him in his claim of unfair dismissal.
13

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:04:32
Part of the difficulty for the public to judge the rights and wrongs of a dispute is really knowing what is going on.

As we can see from posters above there will always tend to be a knee jerk reaction to either back the unions or rejected them based on a preception of union behaviour in general.

My own position is to generally reject the unions becuase they come across badly and untrustworthy with senior union officials playing power games with wider political agendas. Abit like going back to Scargill who later stood as a communist. Nothing wrong with that but shows that he was overtly political and his agenda was political. If you are wanting to be political get elected.

The RMT in the past have come across badly. As such you tend not to trust them. A few yrs ago in another industrial action their representative was agruing that workers should not have to answer their home phones and they all should get mobiles so they can be contacted. Stuff like that was so ridiculous, that it mean i for one simply would not trust them.

In this case it again looks like RMT is being very petty. But i would quite like for an independent tribunial to look at the issue and see who is lying. As we can see from the article on some of the surrounding issues one or both are lying. Any found lying within this dispute should be removed.

Unions are saying mangement are breaking an agreement. Ok what is the proof. The agreement must surely be written and then we can see examples of a breach of that agreement.

Just from reading the article as soon as unions start talking about scabs I turn right off them. While people have a right to strike, others have a right to work without intimidation and insults like that. individuals have a right to make their own decision. Again it is the union inimidation in the past over workers who may not want to follow the union line that again questions their ethics. It is abit like some of the propoganda about anti union law in the 80s when
14

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:08:02
cont..
some of the changes were about giving the members the vote on whether to strike rather than just being the decision of the union leadership. You listen to the union big wig have sympathy about anti union law and then find much of it is lie and about their own power. As such it is difficult to trust a word they say.
15

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:09:26
#Ugly George

Is it not the unions that want to avoid the safety issues. ie they do not want it mandatory. They do not want changes in shifts to carry out safety issues.
16

Kenny 07,

08/10/2008 10:14:14
13."Do you really think that Bob Crow and his colleagues are motivated by safety". I am sure he is motivated by a lot of things and safety is one of them, what do you think he's motivated by?
It has just been reported on radio "that there was a near miss yesterday, when a train was signalled into Edinburgh Waverley as one was being signalled out on the same track". Management say the union is scaremongering, they didn't deny it had happened though. Remember, it's management that are manning the signal boxes, the ones that can't manage their rosters to allow staff to be safety assessed.
17

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:17:05
#Kenny 07

You talk round the issue but do not really address the point you are making. How many hours in a week are management asking workers to do on avg? How much is voluntary overtime?
18

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 10:18:44
17 Alan B
I think that part of the problem is that the RMT make spurious claims that they are acting in the interests of safety when they are really motivated by other aspects. If you have followed the details of many of the tube strikes in London then you will see that Bob Crow frequently seeks to try to claim that this is in the interests of safety.

However there is a Health and Safety Executive whose specific role it is to determine suitable levels of safety. It is not the role of a trade union to decide what is safe and what is not.
19

Koffindodger,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 10:20:26
I think the issue is more one of timing, the RMT can't seriously expect a great deal of public sympathy at a time like this over an issue like this.

Without public support (and indeed with public hostility)it makes it very easy for a government to crush a union especially in times percieved as a crisis, is that what the RMT want? Unlikely.
20

Kenny 07,

08/10/2008 10:20:46
17. Staff already work 24/7 365 and safety is mandatory. Management can't organise resources to allow mandatory safety assessments to be carried out due to staff shortages. Staff are allowed to have time off to do as they wish, not to have plans ruined because management want the right to cancel rest days.
21

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:20:57
#Ugly George

"However there is a Health and Safety Executive whose specific role it is to determine suitable levels of safety. It is not the role of a trade union to decide what is safe and what is not."

Agree there. That is one thing I have thought for a long time.
22

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:22:25
#Kenny 07

"Staff already work 24/7 365"

So no one gets a day off. A worker does not sleep he works 24hrs every day of the yr.
23

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:26:06
#Kenny 07

"Staff are allowed to have time off to do as they wish, not to have plans ruined because management want the right to cancel rest days"

Is it cancelled or is it moved (a shift swap)? ie are they as you suggest asked to work an additional day without getting compensatory time off? Is that additional day paid? How many additional days a yr will people have to carry out?
24

Kenny 07,

08/10/2008 10:27:20
19. What hours do you work Alan B? A nice 9 till 5 number, guaranteed weekends and bank holidays off. No xmas or new year working?
25

Kenny 07,

08/10/2008 10:35:44
24 & 25.
Most employee will have covered their posts 24/7 during the year, is that simple enough for you?

Employees will be paid as compulsary overtime?
26

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:36:02
#26 Kenny 07

Kenny if you read my post above in #15 you will see that I said that it is difficult for someone from the general public to judge a dispute like (partly due to lack of info and not knowing what is really going on). And as such we tend to judge using our preconceptions of unions.

From reading your post you speak as if you know abit about it. But your posts are vague and avoid any specifics. When asked to do so in #26 you avoid the quesiton and just questioned my own hours which is irrevelent to whether to back one side or the other. If you are involved in this dipute then you are pushing me away from the union position for that reason.

If you really want to know my hrs. 5/6 days a week, no holidays and 3 bank hols a yr.
27

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:39:51
#27 Kenny 07

You tend to be avoiding the question. About how many hrs someone is going to work. You posted that mgt were asking workers to do too much work and that was unsafe. I asked you how many hours they worked and you have skipped the question.

My point about 24*7*365 was it simply was not true. Shifts will cover that period but workers will simply not do that. As such it is completely irrevelent to any argument. It is about what yrs a worker is meant to do not the total coverage. Is that simple enough for you.
28

Stirling Sentinel,

Stirling 08/10/2008 10:42:56
How can anyone try to compare Rail signallers with Air Traffic Controllers ! Rail signalling is pretty simple stuff and I am surprised they even need to have their so called skills assessed. Next thing is that someone will compare train drivers to pilots ! Just think first about the difference between the pilot skills involved in avoiding disaster at Heathrow a few months ago and the idiots who caused the Paddington Rail disaster a few years ago.
29

Alan B,

08/10/2008 10:48:02
#Kenny 07

"Most employee will have covered their posts 24/7 during the year"

I think you do not understand the general meaning of 24/7. By using it out of context it is misleading.
30

Stewarty,

08/10/2008 11:07:57
Stirling Sentinel #30
The "idiots" who caused the Paddington Rail disaster a few years ago were in fact those in Network Rail who designed the track layout and associated signalling systems. In particular, the signal sighting of one particular signal was confusing to the point that a driver over-ran it a red light with the disasterous consequences known to all. Bad design pure and simple and Network Rail were overwhelmingly censured for that at the Enquiry.

Ugly George #13, 14 and 20 - I am talking about unfair dismissal without hearing simply because a person's face doesn't fit. Network Rail's tactics are to dismiss (illegally) then when that person takes them to an employment tribunal they offer a sum of money to keep quiet and go away. Because Employment Tribunals have a bad record of ordering that someone be reinstated (and who would want to go back to a company that treated you like a piece of dog dirt), the person then accepts the cash but finds himself on the bru. He cannot publicise despicable tactics taken by an employer because the money offer is conditional upon a confidentiality clause. A classic move taken by unscrupulous companies.

Whilst I would tend to agree that Bob Crow's PR attributes are virtually non-existent and he gets peoples backs up, you should not automatically assume that the RMT are at fault here. It would not surprise me if the current dispute is entirely down to Network Rail and as a nationalised company any Government could insist upon its practices being open to scrutiny.

You are wrong in your assertion at #20 George. Health & Safety reps in the workplace are enabled and expected to express views on both health and safety situations. This is enshrined in legislation. The Health & Safety Executive expects such representatives to fulfil their role in that regard.
31

The_Doctor,

08/10/2008 11:20:40
# 18 Kenny 07

"It has just been reported on radio "that there was a near miss yesterday, when a train was signalled into Edinburgh Waverley as one was being signalled out on the same track". Management say the union is scaremongering, they didn't deny it had happened though. Remember, it's management that are manning the signal boxes, the ones that can't manage their rosters to allow staff to be safety assessed."

- Almost right. According to the report I have seen, there was an "alleged" near miss. Alleged by who? Why, the RMT of course!

What I'd like to know is, exactly how would the RMT know what was happening in the signal rooms? Weren't they out on strike? How could they possibly see what trains were being signalled where from outside the building?

They couldn't be making stuff up, could they? Or did their information come from inside a signal control room - i.e. from one of the management / supervisory "scabs" that the RMT seem to find so distaseful?

Also, while all signals ARE being manned by managers and supervisors, I believe that they are all also qualified signallers.
32

WL,

livingston 08/10/2008 11:46:08
Sack the strikers.
33

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 11:57:10
This is a typical hallmark of a stupid labour government comming to the end of their term of office.

Firstly we have ridiculously high prices, then we have general dis-satisfaction, then we have economic instability, then we have strikes.

What next? Beer and sandwiches at No10?

Get rid of these fools before they cause any more damage to this country.
34

Stewarty,

08/10/2008 12:02:12
If there was a "near miss" at Waverley yesterday, the RMT has a duty to report it to the Rail Accident Investigation Branch which will immediately send inspectors to look into the incident on site.

The RAIB website will show it as an incident under investigation. Nothing there as yet, and if it does not appear, we can assume that the alleged incident was fiction, or the RMT have not fulfilled their duty to report it. Either way the ball is in the RMT court.

If Network Rail know of an incident and fail to report it to the RAIB, severe sanctions can be imposed upon the company.
35

Kenny 07,

08/10/2008 12:09:26
28.
My point about 24*7*365 was it simply was not true. Shifts will cover that period but workers will simply not do that. As such it is completely irrevelent to any argument. It is about what yrs a worker is meant to do not the total coverage. Is that simple enough for you.
My apologies, I thought my 24/7 365 was self explanatory and any right thinking person would know it would be covered by shifts and not one person.
My point is that as shift workers they over the course of a year will have covered every minute of every one of the seven days in a series of shifts. This is unsociable hours and limits their time off to do normal things like attending family get togethers, weddings, their kids school plays etc. Surely when they are rostered off, management shouldn't have the right to tell them "sorry you're not going, to your golf presentation/ bowling function/ nativity play."

18.
Yes it was alleged by the union! Does this mean it didn't happen? Network Rail haven't denied it have they. Don't you think the train drivers would have reported it to the union?
36

Currency expires at midnight........,

Platform 13 08/10/2008 12:38:06
So the strikers are worried about being asked to sit a test without getting two/three weeks notice. A test which fundamentally boils down to green for go and red for stop.....

Now they can claim health and safety concerns all they like but I'm personally worried that they feel they need three weeks to prepare for a test on a job they do on a daily basis!!
37

BalernoBoy,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 12:45:08
Given that so many people obviously do not understand exactly why a strike is necessary because of rotas, why bother having the conversation - it's never going to be clear because it's in house bureaucracy that Joe Public doesn't understand nor need to. Every Union has to have something to complain about which is why they exist. No doubt the people who are out on strike are still getting paid and if they aren't so what - they chose to do it and inconvenience thousands of people because they weren't around to push buttons. Be careful boys and girls, if you listen to your union much longer you will very quickly be replaced by a very simple piece of software that will cost less and not require regular testing.. Makes you wonder why people still need to manually change signals. Very thoughtless move to make given that the people you service need to get to work to keep this economy going. It's hard enough to hold on to work right now.
38

Marcus Fenix,

The Valley 08/10/2008 13:19:26
Lets hear it for Programmable Logic Controllers who don't need Unions/Toilet Breaks/Smoking Breaks/Lunch Breaks/Maternity Leave/Paternity Leave ad infinitum.

When Superman goes to bed he wears Marcus Fenix pyjamas! Yeah baby.
39

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 08/10/2008 13:19:40
I was going to comment but Alan B has said it all very very.

RMT are playing politics because the Labour Party need the union money.

I was wondering how many possible changes there can be on a particular track at any time. Surely less than a handfull of option. I do not understand why this has not been centranised or automated.

Hard Times for all, no time to be striking because your shift pattern has been changed a few weeks in advance. Many workers do not know what they will be working a week in advance.
40

Alan B,

08/10/2008 13:21:24
#37 Kenny 07

You have still ignored the question over the number of hours expected to be worked to back up you claim that the number of hours being worked is dangerous.

As I said I do not know the details of what is really going on and you offered an opinion that comes across as if you know. But when questioned you seem to ignore the question and refuse to back up your allegations.

"I thought my 24/7 365 was self explanatory "
It is but you used it in the wrong context.

"Surely when they are rostered off, management shouldn't have the right to tell them "sorry you're not going, to your golf presentation/ bowling function/ nativity play"

That is a competely different issue to the one you raised and the one I have questioned you about.

On this new point that is what happens in many jobs. If you choose a job with shift patterns that is a downside. The answer is obviously to have a balance. However from a practical point of view the company will need some amount of flexibility. Again if you really know the situation you are giving so few details to allow anyone to really understand the pros and cons.

So how long in advance is someone rostered. What are the causes of changes to the roster? How ofter is their changes to the roster?

From the bit I saw on the tv it would about change rosters to allow for health and safety stuff to be done.

(In my own area i have done on call cover 24/7 which means 24/7 ie you cover 24hrs a day for all 7days of the week. That means you have to be available at all these times if you are called.)
41

Pete McClelland,

08/10/2008 13:28:19
Not ALL managers are trained signallers. Those at certain London locations are barely qualified in the rules and regulations.
42

Stewarty,

08/10/2008 13:37:01
An Greumach Mor #41
"RMT are playing politics because the Labour Party need the union money."

In fact, the RMT disaffiliated from the Labour Party a number of years ago - so that's that particular fox shot!
43

Pete McClelland,

08/10/2008 13:54:19
Why are some of you mentioning Drivers alongside Network Rail? They don't employ ANY drivers.
44

Pete McClelland,

08/10/2008 13:55:37
#38. You talk absolute rubbish.
45

It's life but not as we know it,

The Oort Clouds 08/10/2008 14:53:48
Sack the lot and employ the Poles who have a work ethic.
46

It's life but not as we know it,

The Oort Clouds 08/10/2008 14:54:58
#43 "trained signallers" ROFL!

Green= go. Red = stop. Rocket science.
47

James C,

Aberdeen 08/10/2008 15:07:53
Just to demonstrate where the likes of Bob Crows priorities lie...
I take it those of us who travel by train on a regular basis know that the Guard can issue tickets onboard with his little machine?
Well, these little machines go back about 20 odd years and had the acronym 'APTIS'. These machines became life expired in the early 2000's and were replaced by the newer, smaller, lighter and more efficient versions you see today (they're a dark purple colour), and are called 'SPORTIS'.
Now, when the RMT found out they were going to change this equipment over they went to the Train companies and demanded - and recieved!! - a one off payment for members to compensate them for the obvious trauma of having to learn how to use a new piece of equipment. This one off payment was a few hundred pounds per man as I recall.
Now, how many of you out there go to your bosses with a demand for money every time you get a new computer/van/electric pencil sharpener etc?
Utter b*****ks is it not?
I'm a Union member, but not with the RMT, although the RMT are a major presence in my workplace, and some of the nonsense the Reps and Upper management come out with has to be seen to be believed.
By the way, I also agree that if someone has the right to strike then a co worker also has the right to work - in peace. The notion of 'Scabs' and the intimidation that goes with that has no place in the 20th century, never mind the 21st!
48

James C,

Aberdeen 08/10/2008 15:17:10
Apologies about my last, I made a mistake with the acronyms (so many buzzing round my head these days).
The Old ticket machines were SPORTIS whilst the new machines are ADVANTIX.
49

danbob,

08/10/2008 16:59:10
50# Yes you also made a mistake about why guards were paid what amounted to a few hundred quid as well. It was because advantix is slower than sportis was and since guards recieve a percentage of their takings in commission it reduced their pay. This was to compensate for that.
50

danbob,

08/10/2008 17:11:09
This story about a near miss at waverley. Waverley is controlled by an IECC which uses ARS. Now I don't want to prejudge if this story is mischief making or not, but if the ARS is in use this should not be able to happen except in certain circumstances. If a train was being signalled in to a platform under permissive working and the train already in the platform was moved without authority. If this is the case then it's the drivers fault not the signaller. Or if an inexperienced signaller by-passed the ARS to solve a problem that was occuring. If this is the case then that is scary and definatly should raise eyebrows as to who is working the workstation. Maybe any signaller on here could shed more light on this.
51

James C,

Aberdeen 08/10/2008 17:18:41
Danbob,
Thats utter tosh. Seeing as the various TOC have increased barrier checks for entry to stations are the RMT now going to go after ATOC due to loss of earnings that way? Or perhaps now that ATOC are encouraging passengers to pre book tickets online?
How far does this "loss of commission" excuse go?
ADVANTIX is quicker at printing, and are you seriously trying to tell me that a substantial amount of commission was being lost?
It was trying to get something for nothing, pure and simple.
52

James C,

Aberdeen 08/10/2008 17:21:12
If there was a near miss at Waverley, as reported by RMT, then I should hope they've taken the details and forwarded them to RAIB (if NR haven't already done so).
If not, then they are guilty by their own account of compromising safety by not reporting an unsafe act, or of course it may just have been fabrication...
53

danbob,

08/10/2008 17:26:30
James 53# I am a guard with northernrail, I know why we were paid £200. Thank you.
54

BalernoBoy,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 19:00:32
Why pick on every rail worker ? Isn't it just the signal workers that are currently on strike ? It's not an opportunity to get at people who are working on the trains everyday for probably not a great deal of cash with grumpy folks that feel the need to whine. The drivers and guards get next to no thanks from the expectant public - why pick on them ? Funny thing tho, while the strike was on this morning, I got to Glasgow from Edinburgh easily, on the return journey - signal failure at Haymarket. Makes you wonder.. Maybe time for the rail network to buy a new Wii to get it all going again.
55

jester,

Somewhere else 08/10/2008 21:08:44
The Doctor No33
Do you think that this information perhaps came from Drivers in the RMT?
56

danbob,

08/10/2008 21:31:59
57# 98% of drivers are in ASLEF. Cannot understand why people think all RMT members are particularly interested in this strike anyway. The RMT covers workers from signallers, guards, bus drivers, cleaners, ferry workers, even some off shore workers.
57

jester,

Somewhere else 08/10/2008 22:10:59
#58
Yes, but there are many eyes and ears willing to help out.
There are precious few secrets in the railway.

What happened at Waveley would see a signaller taken off the job.
58

jester,

08/10/2008 22:11:43
#59
Should read Waverley....
59

Choose a nameSteven,

08/10/2008 22:51:42
They dont know what a real job is. Sack them and get the Poles to do it. Selfish lowlife.
60

nolimits,

Canada 09/10/2008 01:34:58
Don't know what all the fuss is about. Why the hell don't the railroads put in CTC? Its been used for years in North America and in one form or the other in Europe. It just baffles me why the general public puts up with this cr*p. Just a bunch of sheep I guess.
61

carrottop,

09/10/2008 08:20:31
Never mind the Poles quite fancy a nice cushy day in the box myself.

 

Comment on this Story

 

In order to post comments you must Register or Sign In

 
 
 
  

 
 


Sister Newspapers:
Press Complaints Commission

This website and its associated newspaper adheres to the Press Complaints Commission’s Code of Practice. If you have a complaint about editorial content which relates to inaccuracy or intrusion, then contact the Editor by clicking here.

If you remain dissatisfied with the response provided then you can contact the PCC by clicking here.