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Is the writing on the wall for Labour in Glasgow?



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Published Date: 07 July 2008
DAVID Cameron will arrive in Glasgow East today to deride Labour for treating the voters of Glasgow East "like fools" and for relying on a "fifth-choice" candidate in this month's crucial by-election.
The Conservative leader will make the first of what is expected to be a series of visits to the Glasgow East constituency during the campaign.

Even though the Tories are not anywhere close to challenging for the seat, Mr Cameron is aware of how important the by-election is.

A Labour defeat to the SNP would give the Nationalists a massive boost, but it would also help the Conservatives because it would result in massive repercussions within the Labour Party and possibly the removal of the Prime Minister.

Mr Cameron, however, was keen to play down the importance of this by-election for Gordon Brown's future last night.

"This election must be about what we can all do for the people of this part of Glasgow and not about the future of any party or politician," he said.

But he was equally keen to highlight Labour's problems in the seat, which were worsened by the decision of George Ryan, a local councillor, to withdraw as a potential candidate.

Margaret Curran, the MSP for Glasgow Baillieston, agreed to stand in Mr Ryan's place, but only after the candidacy was declined by Stephen Purcell, the Labour leader of Glasgow council, and Frank McAveety, the MSP for Glasgow Shettleston.

Ms Curran's decision to stand in Glasgow East all but rules her out of the race to be the party's leader in Scotland. Her decision makes it likely that the party leadership will be a straight contest between Iain Gray, the former enterprise minister, and Cathy Jamieson, the former justice minister and deputy party leader.

Mr Gray has the support of Alistair Darling, the Chancellor, as well as a number of MSPs and is on the centre right of the party. Ms Jamieson is from the Left and has strong support among the unions.

However, Mr Cameron said it was clear that Ms Curran was Labour's fifth choice for the seat.

"Labour is treating the voters of Glasgow East like fools," he said.

The SNP also hit out at Labour, pointing out that some Labour MSPs had criticised Alex Salmond in the past for his "dual mandate" – remaining as an MP and an MSP until the next election – but they would have to change their message if Ms Curran was elected as the MP for Glasgow East.

Ms Curran has made it clear she will stay on as an MSP until 2011 if she wins in Glasgow East later this month.

The SNP's Westminster leader, Angus Robertson, said yesterday: "Labour are treating the people of Glasgow East with contempt – and the people will have their say on 24 July, and the opportunity to elect an SNP MP who is on their side."

But David Cairns, the Scotland Office minister, hit back for Labour by blaming the Conservatives for problems in Glasgow East and criticising Mr Cameron, who will be touring the constituency with former leader Iain Duncan Smith, who started an initiative to help tackle the worst urban poverty in Britain after visiting Easterhouse.

Mr Cairns said: "The Tories devastated the East End in the 1980s and voted against measures to help people here like the minimum wage, tax credits and pension credits.

"Iain Duncan Smith may be sincere, but he is wrong. His party put thousands of local people on to long-term sickness benefits and was happy to leave them there.

"Labour is getting people off benefits and into work."

However, Labour also came under attack from the Left as Frances Curran, the Scottish Socialist candidate in Glasgow East, accused New Labour of "offering part-time representatives" to the people of the East End.

She said: "Desperate Labour bosses faced panic among potential candidates as one after another refused to face the voters.

"By asking Margaret Curran to stand, arrogant Labour chiefs are trying to impose a part-time MP and MSP on the area which, as one of the most deprived, needs a full-time voice in both parliaments.

"The truth is that Labour is running scared from voters who they have taken for granted for years and who are now feeling the heat of soaring prices and falling living standards.

" A vote for the Scottish Socialist Party will also be a warning shot to Alex Salmond that he needs to deliver for working people before the interests of rich business men like Trump."

Selection debacle has piled on the woes for party

IT WAS, sniped Alex Salmond, Labour's "lost weekend". The party had lost its leader in Scotland, it didn't have a candidate for the Glasgow East by-election and the Prime Minister was refusing to visit the constituency.

However, there was no indication of the furore to come on Friday night, when local Labour activists arrived at the Tollcross Leisure Centre in Glasgow at 7pm for what was expected to be a routine selection meeting for their by-election candidate.

George Ryan, a local councillor, was due to be selected in what was to be no more than a formality. But he failed to show at his own selection meeting. Councillor Ryan had faced allegations ten years ago about housing benefit fraud and had been exonerated.

He had been contacted by a journalist about these allegations last week and did not want to put his family, or his party, through that particular mill again.

Margaret Curran, the feisty MSP for Glasgow Baillieston, agreed to put herself forward and another selection meeting was arranged for tonight.

Labour leaders were desperate to avoid yet another by-election so Ms Curran agreed to stay on as an MSP if elected to Westminster for Glasgow East. Labour had to arrange a hurried meeting of its National Executive Committee to give Ms Curran the go-ahead to stand for the Commons while she is still an MSP.

The end result is that Labour will select its candidate tonight – Ms Curran – and begin its campaign tomorrow a full four days after its rivals. And, in a by-election campaign as short as this one, that four-day delay could make all the difference.

The full article contains 1052 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Nit-Nat,

07/07/2008 00:05:02
The SNP are a cult.
2

ThomasP,

07/07/2008 00:08:08
Britain is a country who still think there a world power.
3

Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 00:12:09
1
So are you.

Almost.
4

,

07/07/2008 00:25:04
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5

Robbie 2,

NZ 07/07/2008 00:27:12
Am I missing something - here at the other side of the World by only getting the On-line editions of Scottish papers - or were these two issues not considered worth commenting on?
‘A Labour MP used almost £500,000 of taxpayers' money over six years to help run an office from his home which was staffed by his wife. David Marshall, 67, who has quit to spark the Glasgow East by-election on July 24, used the expenses to pay for a constituency office and staff.’
http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/news/article-1032385/Labour-MP-spent-500-000-taxpayers-money-running-office-home-staffed-wife.html
And
The speaker, Michael Martin, along with his ‘other perks’ and wife’s taxis, has reputedly:
“On 29 March 2008 the Daily Telegraph revealed that refurbishment of Michael Martin's home has cost the taxpayer £1.7m.”
That’s about four million Kiwi dollars - you could buy a lot of Smarties with that sum.
They may have been mentioned but no real debate.
6

Rodster,

Glasgow 07/07/2008 00:32:56
Hopefully the people of Glasgow East will give the Labour Party the slapping they deserve.
Since 1922 this has been a Labour stronghold and if the people do not grab this opportnity then there is no hope for them or the rest of us .
For if these trough ,sniffing carpet baggers do not get their comeuppance it will be amazing and extremely sad.
7

Al Ford,

Insch 07/07/2008 00:34:55
The following report from allmediascotland.com (http://www.allmediascotland.com/media_releases/2952/eleven_glasgow_labour_councillors_under_investigation) appears to shed light on the withdrawal of Councillor Ryan from the Labour candidate-selection procedure for the by-election at Glasgow East and the apparent unwillingness of Councillor Purcell to take his place.

"Eleven Labour Glasgow City Councillors, including Councillor George Ryan, who last night suddenly pulled out of the contest to represent Labour in the crucial Glasgow East by-election, were reported to the Standards Commission on 18 June 2008 in connection with a controversial land deal in the city centre.

"The complaint surrounded their conduct in relation to the controversial attempt to close down the 150 year old Paddy's Market in the city and obtain land on which the market is currently located.

"The complaint which was submitted to the Standards Commission of Scotland by a representative of Paddy's Market traders claimed that Councillor Ryan misled the council in a report he presented to the council's Executive Committee which recommended the council purchase the head lease of the land where the market is situated and for the historic Paddy's Market to be closed down.

"The report which was presented by Councillor Ryan at a meeting on 20 March 2008, and subsequently led to the council's endorsement of its recommendations, stated that the owners of the land had agreed to provide the lease at a reduced rate to the Council. However, the forty page complaint document submitted to the Standards Commission included information that clearly indicated that no such deal had been made with the council.

"Councillor Ryan also faces investigation for other breaches of the Code of Conduct in relation to this matter along with ten other high profile Glasgow City Council Labour councillors including the Council leader, Steven Purcell.

"Paddy's Market representative, Brian Daly said:
"This mark
8

Al Ford,

Insch 07/07/2008 00:36:09
"Paddy's Market representative, Brian Daly said:
"This market has been here for over 150 years, and my family has been trading here for three generations. The Labour councillors who are intent on closing us down have failed in their responsibilities as elected members to engage with us at any time in relation to this. They have, instead, chosen to make backroom decisions and bulldozer them through without any regard for the democratic process.
"The whole affair has been one of misrepresentation of the facts to the public, the media and to the council itself. We live in a democratic society yet, some of those who we trust to carry out duties on our behalf have chosen to make decisions and disregard the wishes of the electorate.
"Labour councillors refused to share vital information with other elected members from other political parties who also represent this area or include them in the vital stages of the decision making process. Instead there has been a sustained approach by some Labour councillors and council officials to make unsupported claims both in council and through the media locally in an attempt to gain public and council support for their project.
"Elected members who behave in such a way should and must be held fully accountable for their actions, and whilst it would be inappropriate for me to pre-empt the findings of the Standard Commission investigation, I believe the evidence against those Councillors involved is pretty damning. We won’t put up with the bully boy tactics of the council any longer. We very much look forward to the outcome of the investigation."

"(...) The other ten Labour councillors (who) have been reported to the Standards Commission are: Councillor Steven Purcell, Council Leader

Councillor James Coleman, Deputy Leader of the Council

Councillor Aileen Colleran, Council Business Manager Councillor

Stephen Curran, City Treasurer

Bailie Gordon Matheson, local councillor for Paddy’s Market Bailie Hanzala Malik
9

Al Ford,

Insch 07/07/2008 00:37:14
Councillor Stephen Doran Councillor Archie Graham Councillor Ruth Simpson Councillor Shaukat Butt

"The Code of Conduct for Councillors forms part of the Ethical Standards in Public Life etc. (Scotland) Act 2000

"Paddy's Market traders have submitted an alternative proposal to the landowners which, if accepted, would see them take over the head lease and to operate the facility on a community based co-operative system or trust. The Paddy's proposal details how they will regenerate the area whilst maintaining the current market community. It also places a strong emphasis on community involvement and social inclusion plans which would ensure that it continued to assist people from all walks of life."

As I have no personal knowledge of this matter, I shall refrain from commenting on it, save to say that it would appear that Labour's troubles concerning this ill-fated by-election of theirs are about to reach a whole new level of political damage for them. At least the issue is a local one, and they did want to discuss local issues in this election. Did they not?
10

,

07/07/2008 00:38:56
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11

Scotindy,

Los Angeles 07/07/2008 00:41:33
Come on the east end, vote SNP and get rid of the corrupt LEADERLESS labour party and finally leave this discredited union with the bancrupt english government once and for all.......INDEPENDENCE is the only answer.
12

DAH,

07/07/2008 00:50:20
I see that Labour has raised the ugly specter of sectarianism in their campaigning

tinyurl.com/5sjn6h
13

FrancesP,

07/07/2008 00:53:18
Is it just me or does Margaret Curran look remarkably like a weathergirl in that photo?

"Storm coming in from the East, expect it to gradually work its way down to Westminster by the end of the month."
14

Darien,

Panama 07/07/2008 00:54:16
Sure hope the good people of Glasgow East will do the decent thing. Labour have proved they can't deliver a pizza. The SNP in one year have given everyone a taste of what could be. Can't wait to see Mags Curran's face on 24th July. Viva Escocia! Viva Indepencia!
15

TommyKaye,

UK 07/07/2008 00:55:34
Labour MP spent £500,000 of taxpayers' money running office from home staffed by wife

David Marshall used expenses to run an office from his home which was staffed by his wife Tina
A Labour MP used almost £500,000 of taxpayers' money over six years to help run an office from his home which was staffed by his wife.
David Marshall, 67, who has quit to spark the Glasgow East by-election on July 24, used the expenses to pay for a constituency office and staff.
But Mr Marshall's office was in his semi-detached Glasgow home and he employed his wife Tina as his secretary. It is also believed he paid his daughter Christina to work from his home from the same pool of money.
A Commons spokesman said MPs can use their home as an office but only claim for additional costs like 'extra phone lines, heating and lighting'.
From 2001-2007, Mr Marshall claimed £91,000 incidental expenses provision, which is used to pay for constituency offices, plus £400,000 for staff and £11,000 for their travel expenses.
He listed only one member of staff on the Commons register - Christina Marshall. It was unclear if this was his wife Tina or daughter Christina.
Neighbours and political sources said his wife had worked for him - with Labour ex-Minister Brian Wilson saying that Mrs Marshall had worked for her husband as a constituency secretary.
Mr Marshall is said to be suffering clinical depression. Party sources said he felt 'under pressure' over the expenses allegations.
The family refuses to comment on why he spent so much on office expenses, why he ran an office from home and what family members were on his payroll.
16

Pat Scot,

07/07/2008 01:01:34
Looks like labour is really worried.

If their massive majority last time now looks to be overturned by SNP or Lib Dems, then welcome another 10 years of toryism (even if they do vote SNP)
17

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 01:09:40
London Labour have foisted Curran on them at the command of Harriet "the man hater" Harman. Talk about the electorate being taken for granted?

With an outgoing MP feigning illness as a cover for gross negligence/coruption they have an all mighty cheek.

18

urban poacher,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 01:11:44
would some paper like to look into the marshall money preferably before by election. surely there must be something for nacker of the yard to look at
19

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 01:15:50
#19 - you would think so, but it looks like the glasgow mafia and ministry of funny handshakes go way back?
He told the select commitee reporters that he did not employ relatives. It has now traspired he infact employed his daughter and his wife. His wife in a home office, in a constituency with no canvassing or supporter records , to the tune of £500000

He has been in the payroll of us the mug populace for 30 years. This party have got to be having a laugh? The sheer contempt they are showing the voter by foisting curran on them by and bypassing every party rule in the book to achieve their aims. Democracy my bum.

20

urban poacher,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 01:16:21
"http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2026/2424205953_9e266e38c6_o.jpg " surely there should be a caption competition
21

A Better Way,

Scottish Nation 07/07/2008 01:40:47
What the hell is going on here. The media seem to be backing the London Controlled New Slavour Party, by not covering one of the biggest scandals of corruption by the enemy of the Scottish Nation. The rancid dishonesty of these TRASH Politicians is beyond the stage of just being Typical Labour Corruption.

Marshall will walk away having stolen including Pensions between 2.3 million quid of Taxpayers money.

Ryan and Purcell were attempting to embezzle millions from the Scottish Tax Payers.

Michael Martin had his house refurbished to the tune of 1.7 million plus his many many claims for so called expenses.

Between the lot of them, plus the theft by Brown and Darling of £30m for visitors for our auld yins who did their bit. £120 of our share of emergancies funding to build better Prisons. £300m of OUR Money that was to be used to drop the Council Tax levels for every working Scot. The £600m that Wee Jockee gave back to his masters in London along with the £900 that John Swinney fought and got back for the Scottish Nation.

Thats just the tip of the iceberg, of London Labours thieving from the Scottish Nation.

Glasgows Byelection is very important, but getting all these rightwing thiefs out of the trough will do more to build Glasgow and its peoples welfare. Create Jobs for many of those fellow Scots and it will begin the process of fixing up the injustices thrown upon them by two faced lying Englishmen who just happen to have Scottish Accents, because that is all these traitors to the Scottish Nation are. They steal from the poor to feed the rich donors of Labour.
As a former Labour Supporter, I think its time we wipe this digracefull excuse for a political party of the political face of Scotland.

Saor Alba
22

Stepford Nat,

07/07/2008 01:56:08
18-19-20

And if it wasn't expenses, it could be big business, or both! and we wouldn't want parties subbed by big business, not even transport companies. Just because it's not illegal doesn't mean it's not corrupt

www.snp.org.uk - the real alternative to
23

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 07/07/2008 01:58:06
The Glasgow edition of the Harare Herald is not permitting comments on the ZanuLabour attempts to hold onto its constituency of Bulawayoston East. The Bulawayoston member of the local parliament has apparently been selected without the local ZanuLabour members having a say in the selection. They will be checking fingers to see which ones have been coloured red with their own felt tip pens.
24

RossA,

07/07/2008 05:02:06
One Holyrood insider said: “Steven Purcell told a colleague last night that Lesley Quinn was phoned by Gordon Brown asking her to stand. She refused and phoned Steven to alert him.

“He claims he was phoned four times by Gordon Brown over the weekend. He turned him down because he ‘saw his future leading Glasgow’. In fact, he admitted, he didn’t want to sit on the back benches followed by 20 years in opposition.”
25

Pocket Dictionary,

07/07/2008 05:17:47
Why is Labour going through with this local party selection process, when everyone knows who the Labour candidate in the election is going to be? And they complain about Mugabe rigging elections.
If Margaret does win the by-election (and lets not write off that possibility)she said she will only claim one salary. Now, which one will that be, the highest or the lowest of the two?
26

Paul in Oz,

Helensburgh 07/07/2008 05:19:16
I know for a fact that GB did not phone Steven Purcell over the weekend, he was in talks with another big hitter from Labour to contest the seat but family circumstances led to them not standing and so he ended up with the current candidate!
27

steve 1511,

aberdeen 07/07/2008 06:35:58
margaret curran this women must not be allowed to kiss babies and terrify them,she should be made to wear a warning sign
28

yockel,

07/07/2008 07:11:09
It is hard to believe all these committed Labour types would put their own careers and personal advancement ahead of the Party's interest at this desperate time. Lady Curran 2011 is it?
29

BK,

Cyberspace 07/07/2008 07:55:29
Well one sow has opted for a snout in the trough and the John Lewis list!
30

jacquesmac,

Playing with Aase's pony 07/07/2008 08:15:57
Do I detect a sea-change within the Hootsmon?

Are they looking past the next UK General Election, The Edinburgh one (see I am not SNP biased, unlike the BBC--whit?) and the forthcoming Referendum in 2010?
Are they now seeing the scenario that the best way for Highway Tories to win the UK Parliament, maybe the only one, is to back-off the SNP, not support them though, by going for Slab.

UK wise, Cameron takes the heights but the Parliament is hung to the advantage of the SNP? In Scotland the Tories still take he-haw.

Negotiated withdrawl from the Union,perhaps a halway house before real separation, damage limitation, statesman rhetoric, etc and a new "sister" Tory Party is born in Jockland.

Alternatively the Hootsmon is beginning to realise that they are backing the donkey by opposing the SNP in blanket detail.

As for the Das Herald

No Comment
No Comment
No Comment
No Comment

This lot have really lost the plot.
I wonder how many knighthoods, peerages, High Commissions have been promised to the Medja to get all these Labour press releases cut and pasted as independent political comment.

Finally the Slab and ZaNuLab are attempting to close down indepentant comment on the BBC, as they tried before the last Holrood Election, by blatant bullying. The are accusing the BBC of pro SNP bias-whit!

Glenn Campbell, Jeremy Paxman, Kirsty Wark, David Dimbleby, rigged meetings, Labour plants in the audience.

Anyway Douglas Fraser will soon be in the BBC balancing the bias.
31

jacquesmac,

Lectoure 07/07/2008 08:18:49
#13 link now closed

Affie quick!
32

BIG EYE,

Paisley 07/07/2008 08:21:55
The Labour faithful must really be enjoying this one!

Step up Doug Maughan, our intrepid pilot who spends his life on the ground writing letters to papers bravely defending Labour's pathetic record and Cllr Graham another local Labour worthy.

Now flotsam, just hang about while we make a number of desperate phone calls to ensure we don't need to pick either of you!

Now if this is how Labour treat their own members why should anybody even remotely think about voting for them?

I look forward to reading Doug's letter about how this is the right way and best for Scotland.

Finally a word of warning about Glasgow East. Labour will try and stir up religious trouble. I remember a friend of mine who was canvassing up a close in the east end. Like a true professional he had started on the top floor and was working his way down the building.

When he reached the first floor he knocked a door and a guy answered it. Seeing his SNP badge he went into a tirade about the SNP being anti Catholic then slammed the door. My friend then went to the next door and this time the guy opened the door and launched into a tirade about the SNP supporting the Pope. My friend told him to hold on a second, crossed the landing to the previous door and rang the bell. When the guy answered he said " You two need to talk" and made his way down the stairs!

Divide to conquer will be a very desperate Labour Party tactic, all those who care for Scotland must do everything we can to overcome these politics of despair and give our nation the worth it deserves.
33

,

07/07/2008 08:32:05
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34

,

07/07/2008 08:32:48
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35

Ananurhing,

07/07/2008 08:41:56
Meltdown minus 17 days.........and counting!
36

Senga Jean,

07/07/2008 08:50:12
The depth of Labour corruption is staggering. I thought I could never be surprised but £500,000 and Paddies Market amazed be. Margaret Curran is also false to the core. Her education and professional qualifications mean that the "fiesty" gallus tone is an act. BTW is it not amazing that in a quality newspaper bile and bias is such that alone Alex Salmond "sniped" while all other politicians merely "said". Corruption in the Scottish media demeans our democracy.
37

,

07/07/2008 08:52:07
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38

,

07/07/2008 09:02:52
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39

danielrober,

07/07/2008 09:08:34
I and others has stuck with the UK through think and thin, war and peace, boom but maily bust. Now that we have rebuilt our economy after decades of effort, a few politico's want the excitment of an indpendence party. Blame it all on the union etc,etc, etc. I won't be here, its been a century - no more of these stupid political games. Most of us just want to work and get on with our lives. No more political-economic trench warfare.


My family and so many others suffered massive casualties during WWI and WWII, lost everything in the post war/imperial recovery. Yet inch by inch we have improved, entire cities are more humane and civilized than they have been for decades. Yet the squarkers are out. I want, give me more, power, power, power.

The SNP are not been sensible waiting until after 2014 for a vote. Instead they are relying on an anti-war, anti-british and most importantly an anti-america vote. Disgracefull, propaganda, poor engineering, bad science and dodgy economics.

But don't worry the SNP have a plan - cut benefits, raise taxes, increase the productin of oil and for five years enjoy an injection of capital funds.

What then? what about those who pay the tax, need the benefits and don't have a government job? I have asked this question for months now and nothing from the SNP.

I admire the USA, but Bush could have waited may be France would have turned up for the war, may be not. But those few extra months might have bought time for diplomacy and time for some more allies to turn up. The coalition of the willing was not enough that's why we are still in iraq. Yet people in America were killed, murdered, attacked. We turned up and if it costs us our country at least we go down with honor and our debts paid. Many of us are working for jobs for our guys at war 'NOT' a english/scotish nationalist temper tantum, dueto impaitience.

Alec.S coalition of the willing is not enough to see Scotland safely into independence. Alec.S knows thi
40

danielrober,

07/07/2008 09:09:27
# 45 continued

Alec.S coalition of the willing is not enough to see Scotland safely into independence. Alec.S knows this but he will still lead Scotlands Second charge of the ligh brigade. This time into economic dependancy, small pensions and the dole que.

Please wait untill 2014, Scotland is not strong enough.
41

jacquesmac,

faux-cu 07/07/2008 09:10:25
From The Independent Today


Some MPs want Mr Brown to appoint a senior minister as Deputy Prime Minister to aid a fightback. The favourites are Jack Straw and Alan Johnson.

What is wee Doogie not up to the job?

and do you think any politician with an ounce of nous would pick up the poisoned chalice, anyone wanting to be a sitting MP in 3 years time?
42

Silent Hunter,

Fintry, Scotland 07/07/2008 09:13:46
I am appalled at the 'Censorship of the news' being practised by certain sections of the Scottish News Media; I have therefore written to Donald Fraser, Chief Political Editor of the Glasgow Herald, the content of which I set out below.

I would urge EVERYONE to demand that their right to comment be re-instated by the Herald.



Dear Mr Fraser,

I would be grateful if you could advise as to why the Herald is studiously avoiding giving the people of Glasgow a chance to comment on the stories arising from the prospective Glasgow East by-election.

Why has comment been stifled?

If I were of a cynical mind; I could perhaps say that it is because the Herald would not like the avalanche of anti Labour comments that you probably expect.

A sitting 'Labour' MP is caught 'fiddling expenses' to the tune of £500,000 and the silence regarding this matter is deafening from the Herald.

How does this 'censorship of the news' help the people of Glasgow to have the FULL FACTS to hand when making a decision about which Party is best placed to represent them?

I really would be interested to know? I therefore look forward to hearing from you by return. (although; I won't hold my breath)

Yours sincerely,

David Howell
Glasgow
43

danielrober,

07/07/2008 09:19:51
# 49

How sad are you. Still fighting an empire that died in the 1940's. Are you going to blame an empire long gone when you fix pensions over a three year term in the face of high inflation?
44

,

07/07/2008 09:26:49
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45

,

07/07/2008 09:31:14
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46

LEAL,

07/07/2008 09:35:27
Go to Glasgows East End.Have a good look around.If you are happy to see fellow Scots live in these circumstances in an oil rich Scotland,vote Labour.If you think Scotland,an oil rich country, should be able to do better,vote SNP.If you get lost before even getting to Glasgow,vote Lib Dem.
47

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 09:36:45
45 writes:-
“The SNP are not been sensible waiting until after 2014 for a vote. Instead they are relying on an anti-war, anti-british and most importantly an anti-america vote. Disgracefull, propaganda, poor engineering, bad science and dodgy economics.

But don't worry the SNP have a plan - cut benefits, raise taxes, increase the productin of oil and for five years enjoy an injection of capital funds.”

An interesting diatribe of confusion, delusion, half thought out polemic and downright misrepresentation.

Where have the SNP published this “plan” of cutting benefits and increasing taxation?

The SNP have actually reduced taxation in as much as the limited powers of the Scottish Parliament will allow them to so, in the form of freezing council tax, and of course they voted against the Labour Party’s plan to double the rate of income tax payable by the lowest paid within society, introduced at the last Westminster budget.

You may hanker after the nostalgia engendered by thoughts of a forelock touching and cringing mass peasantry, whose main purpose was to act as the cannon fodder of British Imperialistic ambitions.

However, those of us who have had the foresight to cast these shackles aside, see a brighter future ahead for a free, confident, well-educated electorate, with proper meaningful jobs, all contributing to a fairer, well-balanced society.

48

danielrober,

07/07/2008 09:40:22
# 51

I read your and others comments about the future, about Glasgow - nothing. No hope, no new plan just a trust us we are different. You guys all went to the same schools, colleges, uiversities, training progams even job expereince and yet you belive yourselves to be so different. Amazing.

Wait untill after the Commonwealth Games, so the UK can support Glasgow so it has a chance after independence. After this time guys like myself and so many others will be free to help. Right now i and others are commited to other causes.

Alec.S is doing what he said he would not, taking political advantage of the war. It could have been just as easily a conservative government as a labour.

Put a plan online SNP for people to read and assess for your future options for Glasgow. SO lets see what you've got. Its time to show your cards.
49

danielrober,

07/07/2008 09:41:45
# 53

Very relevant for modern Glasgow.
50

,

07/07/2008 09:45:03
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
51

danielrober,

07/07/2008 09:50:07
# 55 bully wee alba,Edinburgh

# 58 Freedom for Scotland,

What have your comments got to do with the modern world. All you are doing is hitting me with your 200 page histroy book. Sticks and stones my break my bones bones but names will never hurt me.

You guys simply do not accept 'INVOLVEMNT' by others outside you club, with the economy and people of Scotland. You'll leap into the abysis screaming 'save them, save the people' and you'll only charge £50,000 a year annual fees. Disgracful.
52

Stepford Nat,

07/07/2008 09:50:07
55 bully wee alba

I don't have any shackles to cas aside, but if I had, I'm sure they'd be really bad shackles.

I am now awaiting my brighter future and education which no doubt will start very soon

www.snp.org.uk Let's all feel oppressed!

53

Wee Fifer,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 09:52:31
Snouts in the trough preceded it all (alexander campaign financing) started the ball rolling in the constituency, and kept the mess going for Labour - couldn't find a clean candidate except Margaret Curran. If they all have their snouts in the trough except for a few exceptions then the voters in this constutency need to be put right.
54

Miss H,

07/07/2008 09:53:25
1 The SNP are a political party.

Are Labour a political party any more? I am starting to wonder.

They appear to be completely dysfunctional. Even their basic procedures like selecting a candidate don't work.

There is nobody in charge, that much is obvious.

A shambles.
55

danielrober,

07/07/2008 09:54:16
# 59 Ayrshire­ Scot™,

Old information, old polices and i can see the exact same points on the Labour, Lib Dem and Conserative info blogs.

In fact the only policy of eal difference is the University fee issue and that one was from the Lib Dem. So why don't you isolate the SNP difeence beyound Alec.S Shout and bore second charge of the light brigade.
56

,

07/07/2008 09:56:48
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
57

Upandunder,

07/07/2008 10:01:27
People of Glasgow East who are dependent on benefits (and there's plenty of them) will, if they are smart, will vote Labour.

This is because Labour is happy to perpetuate the "benefits cycle". Labour knows damn well if it creates a big enough number of benefits claimants and civil servants in "non-jobs" like "ethnicity awareness officers" and "visible services monitoring officers" etc, it can count on these people's jobs. These people are what I call "State-sponsored voters".

The Welfare State WAS a good idea, but was intended as a safety net. Today, sadly, it has become a viable economic lifestyle.

Trouble is, these voters fail completely to understand that Labour politicians are no less snooty than the "Tory Toffs" they are so quick to criticise. One only has to look at all the Champagne Socialists quaffing their wine and decorating their second homes at taxpayers' expense.
58

danielrober,

07/07/2008 10:06:10
# 66 Ayrshire­ Scot™,

With respect i'm not lying. I've read the engineering plans and my heart breaks. The costs are just off this planet and will suck up every penny or cent flowing.

What matters if one or two issues are better if you burn the money. Labour just found that out, with PFI. High fixed costs, expensive design work and running costspaid out of capital. An economic charge of the ligh brigade. If you don't belive commison an independant engineer from outside the club.

You need to wait until 2014, then we have a completly different set of economic conditions.
59

Alan B,

07/07/2008 10:11:23
#danielrober

"You need to wait until 2014, then we have a completly different set of economic conditions."

Are u expecting the tories to have sorted out Browns economic mess by then.
60

jacquesmac,

In a vacuum 07/07/2008 10:13:01
The Spectator is suggesting that Harriet Harman is manoeuvering to take control of the Glasgow East by-election, from Laondon.

Just when you thought it couldn't get any better for the SNP

Cue music

Wagner

Ride of The Valkyries!

Was this not a theme within a film about the fall of the USA in Vietnam.

Quite appropriate then?
61

danielrober,

07/07/2008 10:20:09
# 69 Alan B

No i'm expecting the troops to have either been significanlty reinforced by our Euorpean allies or be pulled. We can not ask our guy to carry this load on our own for much longer.

After 2014 then a vote. The economy will be a lot stonger and politics moe stable. Sowhy can't you guys wait only 4 years? I don't get it.
62

Alan B,

07/07/2008 10:22:38
#danielrober

Seriously the union has not worked for scotland economically. Our growth has been poor averaging less than 2% over the last 30yrs. We have lived with the disasters of labour in the 70s. The pain of the tories in the 80s and early 90s (and are still waiting on the gain). And then the incompetance of labour ever since.

Gordon Brown as chancellor failed to address the north south divide and failed to transform scotlands economy. He had 10yrs long enough to make a difference and he did not even start to address scotlands problems. Why? He was more interested in his own career and for him to be prime minister.

We could also talk about the general incompetence of labour economically. Allowing huge public sector deficits grow in relatively good times so that we are in a complete mess when the global environment turns sour. He allowed huge personal debts and ruined the pension systems with ultra shorttermism. Most of the employment growth was from public sector growth and not the private sector to support that. He allowed property prices to get out of control. The only good thing he has done is make the BOE independent. Even here he allowed the inflation rate to be on the upper side of target for 90% of the time so that when we now have a global inflationary pressures we end up way of target, with commentators talking about stagflation.

While u as a labour support will talk about how the uk has done not too badly economically under labour if u omitt the underlying problems u fail to address that scotland has continued to underperform the uk as a whole.

More importantly the uk has underperformed the small western european countries over the last decade.

Scotland either needs independence or to devolve the tools of economic governance to the scottish parliament. Problem with devolution will that include the freedom to adopt the euro if it is judged to be in our economic interest.
63

danielrober,

07/07/2008 10:25:50
# 71 Jackie Priest,07

Eh, what, where are you talking about. Why won't you guys wait 4 years what's so important about 4 years. You can not wait four years. Why not, what are you afraid off?

By the way i'm talking about the guys fighting now. They are doing their duty just like people did in the past wars. We do owe them, we have a debt, which needs paying. Stop pretending that this war is some how different from others.
64

ThomasP,

07/07/2008 10:28:12
#74

Why should we wait another four years?
65

danielrober,

07/07/2008 10:30:25
# 73 Alan B

I'm not disagreeing with you over some of these facts. We just need to wait a few years and not be driven by a frustrated backbencher, trying to out do Gordon Brown. After 2014, the world would have seen a healthy and sporty Scotland, thats the time to go. Not in the middle of a war.

Besides Labur arn't that bad and they will still be here after independance. You have to learn to deal with them. Many of the working class issue that they are talkig about are absolutely real.
66

danielrober,

07/07/2008 10:32:05
To all.

I'll catch up later. Please consider a change of dates and seek independant advice from outside the club.
67

Paco Luna,

Bo'ness 07/07/2008 10:38:04
#74 -76 +++

Why should we wait for another 4 years ? What will have improved in that time? Labour have been in power at Westminster for 11years now and in that time they havent even started to address the issues around poverty.
Its time . Time to kick out Labour who have been a blight on Scotland for too long . Time to take responsibility for our own future . The good people of Glasgow East can give us a lead on July 24th by booting Labour out.

At least Margaret Curran will still have her seat at Holyrood - at least until 2011.
68

Gaius,

07/07/2008 10:38:24
Glasgow East deserves a full-time M.P. not a part-time M.E.P. moonlighting when she can find the time.

Gordon Brown is smugly presiding over the demise of Nu-Lab in Scotland. What about the Union? Are we indifferent about the Union which has kept the peace for 300 years?

The UK is strong because it is United. Is Germany fragmenting? Or is the German voice louder now in Europe because it united its two factions after the fall of the Berlin Wall?

It is not rocket science.

The UK is too important and successful a model to change.

Why fix what is not broken?
69

Alan B,

07/07/2008 10:39:36
#danielrober

"After 2014 then a vote. The economy will be a lot stonger and politics moe stable. Sowhy can't you guys wait only 4 years? I don't get it."

Do not know why u think 2014 will make the economy stronger and politics more stable.

For me we have underperformed for the last 30/40yrs and nothing is likely to change within the current structure. So why wait with what i regard as a failing system.

My personal view would be to move to a strong scottish parliament first. (Then debate independence after that with a referendum). I want the scottish parliament to have the powers to make a difference to scotland.

It may take a while after getting these powers for scotland to get the answers right. For instance it took 8yrs for the electrate to see through labour and their incompetance. We will have vote one party and chuck them out when they fail until we get policies that actually work.

For me we need immediately the economic powers devolved to the sp. That does not need independence per se but we have seen by browns behaviour that it is difficult to work with westminster were powers are fudged. (eg while i do not believe in lit i do support the right of sp to implement it if it has the support of the parliament and not to have council tax rebate withheld).

As such i would want:
1)fiscal autonomy: would allow scotland to use the tax system to address our economic problems.
2)independent review by scottish parliament on merits of joining the euro. personally i am strongly in favour. (is the uk mature enough to have scotland within the euro zone while part of the uk).
3)competition policy: would personally like to see the glas and edin airports competing and not run as a monopoly.
4)control or our seas and regulation of oil would have lead to headquarters of oil companies being in scotlnad. There is still scope to do this.
5)regulation of electricity transmission charges. Governemtn should control this so that they can take scotland to the f
70

Alan B,

07/07/2008 10:40:00
cont...

5)regulation of electricity transmission charges. Governemtn should control this so that they can take scotland to the forefront of renewables industry.
6)regulations of things like super casinos
7)full control of transport ie trains and track. Current situation is ridiculous.
8)proper scottish economic statistics.
9)also separate scottish news. while this is not directly economically related it would help. scotland for too long just hears what happens in the uk as a whole and do not get enough info facts about scotland. How many times did we hear bbc news telling us the economy was booming when we in scotlnad were actually doing badly. It amazes me the ignorance that people have in relation to the economic recession scotland suffered under brown.
71

ThomasP,

07/07/2008 10:46:27
79 Gaius.

"The UK is too important and successful a model to change. Why fix what is not broken?"

It is broken. You should head south and ask some of the English about current relations. Scotland also elected a Nationalist Government with the Nats expected to make huge gains at the next elections.

And you say it is not broking...something must be wrong.
72

frank mcbride,

lusitania 07/07/2008 10:46:27
# danielrober.

Wait till after 2014.

So we have a morritorium. The people of Glasgow have to wait for 6+yrs,
without hope of change?

6+yrs facing premature, avoidable death?

6+yrs without the possibility of improvements in the living standards?

Yes, the Commonwealth Games may provide benefits for the people of Glasgow. But, does their happening in 2014 mean that Glaswegians should go into stasis for 6+yrs?

The greatest catalyst for breaking the political inertia that has destroyed great swathes of Glasgow would be an SNP victory in Glasgow East.
A victory for NuLabour would only mean more of the same. A bit like your take on things, danielrober, "Jam tomorrow, well in 6+yrs"!!!
73

Alex, Young Laird d' Drumchapel,

Madrid 07/07/2008 10:49:53
So, the guy leaving has a sleaze investigation hanging over him. Two of his possible replacements won't stand for the same reason. Is there a pattern here?
74

Alan B,

07/07/2008 10:50:15
#danielrober

"After 2014, the world would have seen a healthy and sporty Scotland, thats the time to go"

From what i remember the commonwealth games did little for edinburgh. The commonwealth games will do little to transform scotland or glasgow economically.

"Many of the working class issue that they are talkig about are absolutely real."

Not doubting the issues are not realy but seriously doubt they have any solutions particularly in economic terms which for me is the most fundamental as it means jobs and our living standards and has a knock on effect on other things like poverty and health and the provision of public services.

"Besides Labur arn't that bad and they will still be here after independance."

I do actually think they are that bad. It would take wholesale reform for that party make itself a solution to scotland problems. Part of the problem is the fact that it would get voted in no matter how poor it was as a party. Democracy and party politics means parties need to be kicked out if they do not perform. The other problem for labour is the quality of the mps and msps are just so poor.






75

Rodster,

Glasgow 07/07/2008 10:53:38
Danielrober , here's a better idea for you why don't the SNP just disband and leave the Unionists to get on with it , no checks and balances no one sticking up for Scotland , just let Westminster take good care of us the way they have for last 300 hundred years .
I am sure it is only a matter of time before USA , India , Ireland , Australia , Canada and all the other ex empire countries beg and plead to get back under the flag and Westminster
76

Alan B,

07/07/2008 10:58:33
#Gaius

The problem is the union is not working in scotland interests.

What are the actual benefits of the union?

Economically we have underperformed. That is without dispute.

Politically we have seen in the last 30yrs if england vote one way and we vote another we get what england wants. That meant scotland had to endure 17yrs of unwanted tory rule.

When labour got in it was not the labour party that scotland had voted for during the tory yrs but a party who had to throw away its values and policies to appeal to middle england.

Decmocracy is about choosing ur elected representatives and kicking them out if they are viewed to have failed u. UK democracy means that is does not matter what scotland votes other than if england is split.

So where are the tangiable benefits of the union? Education and health are now with the scottish parliament. Bits of transport and the law but both are fudged.

The problem with not having powers to address scotland problems and provide solutions is u get the failing situation we have today.

I personally see the euro as being beneficial to scotland particularly with sterling interest rates being too high for scotland economy over a prelonged period of time. We cannot even consider joining as it is politically impossible in england and probably not in the south of englands economic interest.
77

Rodster,

Glasgow 07/07/2008 11:08:34
~87 Steady Alan B way to sensible and realistic a post for the Unionists on here .
You have committed heresy don't you know that ?
Repeat after me , Westminster and Union great
Scotland and Independence BAD ....very bad
.
You should know we are too stupid , too poor and too weak to have Independence . the oil is going to run out one day soon , The EU will not allow us membership , The UN will refuse to recognise us , all the oil companies will immediately leave the North Sea , Al Quaeda will move in , we will be like Albania in a fortnight , and worst of all we will never see Eastenders ever again , and forget visiting your Aunty Mary in Manchester the border will be permanently closed.
Westminster knows best
78

Daveunderwater,

Young Cumbay Team 07/07/2008 11:17:04
The writing on the wall behind is

SNP ROOLZ Ya B*s

Davy M wuz here
79

Banana Heid,

Ayrshire 07/07/2008 11:17:27
# 88 Rodster, What's wrong with Albania then?
80

Daveunderwater,

Silver City 07/07/2008 11:23:41
More breaking news

AN ABERDEEN MP has become embroiled in the controversy surrounding second-home expenses after it emerged he claimed more than £100,000 for his “second” home in the city when his main residence is in London.

Last night Aberdeen North MP Frank Doran denied any wrongdoing, saying he was within his right to make the claims. Mr Doran, whose partner is Government minister Joan Ruddock, is reportedly under pressure to explain a £104,100 second-home allowance claim over a five-year period up to March last year.

81

Daveunderwater,

North Sea 07/07/2008 11:25:46
Frankie goes to Holyrood

Ye cwidnae mak it up

Howl! LOL! jings!

Help ma Boab!!

82

scotstoun_voter,

glasgow 07/07/2008 11:34:48
I heard mr broon also called boby mugaby but he "said no thanks your to corrupt for me!"
mr brron then called old maggie she said "no ta i enjoy my retirement now."
so whos left for him oh yes mrs curran who said "woohoo iv got something to do now but i still want the leader in north brittain" mr broon said "right hen you can hive it- what every you want".

Sad but so funny shes not even high on the list of choices such a shame bring on the meltdown.

83

Daveunderwater,

John Lewis 07/07/2008 11:41:09
The Roll of Shame, list of those who voted to keep John Lewis happy.

http://timesonline.typepad.com/politics/2008/07/is-your-mp-on-t.html
84

brownlie,

07/07/2008 11:42:35
93 The Spook

Morning, Spooky, what are you doing up so early?

I see you've managed to get my name in the same sentence as "rubbish" again.

HM is doing his dinger on the "oil" site - using his "own" name!!!

Come on, Maggie Curran, bring it on!!!
85

ochone,

sauchie' clacks 07/07/2008 11:52:12
Ah yes, electioneering West coast unionist style, don't you just love it.

Already the Daily Record has made mention of the fact that the SNP man is, 'unmarried', and just today George Galloway in the same paper reminds folk that Margaret Curran is a catholic.

What fun, and it's only just started.
86

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 11:56:12
Why are all these SNP supporters saying 'vote SNP' to end the poverty and deprivation in Glasgow East?

Surely if you really cared about Glasgow's working classes you should be urging everyone to vote for a left wing party such as the Scottish Socialists who would do more to help end the poverty in Glasgow East than a big business-supporting party (Trump, Macdonald Hotels) like the SNP?

You don't care about Glasgow's working classes - you just care about gaining a seat for the SNP and giving labour a bloody nose.
87

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 12:21:53
#103

I'm not AM2

#104

"#102..save your labour bull for the Dandy forum..get with it.."

Are you retarded? I think you will find I was suggesting voters in Glasgow should vote for the Scottish Socialist party - how exactly is that 'labour bull'? - If anything Scottish Socialist votes would take votes away from labour.

I notice that neither of you have answered my query as to why the poor and deprived in Glasgow East should vote for the big-business SNP ahead of the working-class supporting Scottish Socialists... I rest my case.
88

Grahamski,

Falkirk 07/07/2008 12:24:21
101
Ochone,
have you failed to read the revolting mudslinging on these boards by the natz? None so blind as cannot see....
89

Nikostratos,

07/07/2008 12:42:12
______|_GLASGOW_________|_EAST________|__________|_____________
__|________|__________|__________|________|__________
_______|_________|__________|_________|__________|___
______|__________|_________|__________|_____________
__|__VOTE______|__________|LABOUR__________|________|__________
_______|_________|__________|_________|__________|___
______|__________|_________|__________|_____________
__|___VOTE_____|__________|____LABOUR______|________|__________
_______|_________|__________|_________|__________|___
______|__________|_________|__________|_____________
__|_____VOTE___|__________|_____LABOUR_____|________|__________
_______|_________|__________|_________|__________|___
90

,

07/07/2008 12:47:42
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
91

Nikostratos,

07/07/2008 12:49:04
______|_SNP_________|____OUT_____|__________|_____________
__|________|__________|__________|________|__________
_______|_______SPOOK__|_______USELESS___|___AT______|__________|___
______|____FOOTY_____|________|_|__________|_____________
__|_______|__________|__________|________|__________
_______|_________|__________|_________|__________|___
______|____SNP______|_______OUT__|__________|_____________
__|________|__________|__________|________|__________
_______|_________|__________|_________|__________|___
______|__SNP________|_______|___OUT_______|_____________
__|________|__________|__________|________|__________
_______|_________|__________|_________|__________|___
92

Nikostratos,

07/07/2008 12:53:10
______|_LABOUR_________|__Glasgow____east___|_____tour_____|_____________
__|________|__________|__________|________|__________
_______|________|_________|______|__________|___
______|_____cancelled__|________|_|__________|_____________
__|_______|__________|__________|________|__________
_______|_________|________|_________|__________|___
______|__________|_________|__________|_____________
__|________|__________|____cancelled______|________|__________
_______|_________|__________|_____l____|__________|___
____cancelled__|________|_______|________|_____________
__|________|__________|__________|_______|__________
_______|_________|_____cancelled_____|_________|__________|___
93

Nikostratos,

07/07/2008 13:06:28
#117 spook


Ouch !Thanks for that spook anyway must earn income to pay tax to keep u in luxury in Leith



http://www.cartoonstock.com/lowres/dre0502l.jpg
94

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 13:10:53
Has anyone noticed the pre election clampdown of the comments sections on the herald and scotsman?

I wonder if they realise it will only do their papers long term damage?
95

,

07/07/2008 13:20:28
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
96

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 13:27:12
#123 - their outgoing MP and his family have been lifted out of poverty. At least one local won the lottery.
97

Brian M,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 13:29:22
another question for the labourites - why is Broon the buffoon not going to visit Glasgow east and why is he doing his best to avoid even talking about the by-election or even being asked about it?
98

,

07/07/2008 13:35:32
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
99

john z,

edinburgh 07/07/2008 13:40:23
It's pretty obvious the Union is no good for Scotland.

If Scotland were at present independent, and a politician suggested we scots should join a union with England, whereby they get our taxes, oil revenue and complete control over Scotland, do you really think people would go for it? Thought not.
100

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 13:42:16
The 300 SNP canvassers should remind them the SNP was born out of the original Labour movement.

Remind them, a vote for Labour is just a vote for keeping the bedwarm for the tories.

Remind them a vote for New Labour is pretty much simmilar to the tories!

Remind them of their outgoing MPs record on finances
Remind them of 60 years of failure and broken promises
remind them their being taken for granted

Ask them if their forefathers would still vote for Labour now, given their record to date in modern times?

101

john z,

edinburgh 07/07/2008 13:45:30
You know, the people of Glasgow East would be doing themselves a favour if they elected an SNP (or non labour) MP. Think about it, if they re-elect Labour, then Labour is not going to do much for them as they'll feel safe again, but if they elect the SNP, it'll scare Labour. Suddenly everyone in Scottish Labour will be doing their very best to 'deliver' for the long neglected people of East Glasgow, in the hope they can regain the seat for Labour in the (Westminster) General election in a couple of years.


102

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 13:59:10
#129 - the place has been uncanvassed since 1997 and beyond, the locals are taken for granted , their MP has claimed 500000 for an office that looks like it has done nothing for a long time, told parliament he had no relatives employed, but we now know different.

If the people want progress it is time to chuck these useless torags out. Theyve had their chances.


If your still unconvinced watch this.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=OARvE4ZzMCY
103

Talorthane,

07/07/2008 14:03:40
#102 Yeah1

"Surely if you really cared about Glasgow's working classes you should be urging everyone to vote for a left wing party such as the Scottish Socialists....?"

This post reveals a startling admission from a Labour supporter that if you care about Glasgow's working classes, then Labour is not the answer.

The point made is obvious enough, but that even Labour supporters are beginning to realise it is a pleasant and timely surprise.
104

AJ Fife,

07/07/2008 14:03:55
Who's gonna fund the Labour campaign? There can't be too many 'suckers' left!
105

Brian M,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 14:08:08
labour politicians stopped caring about the working class many years ago in the belief that the working class would automatically vote for them every time.

They only care about themselves and their political careers
106

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 14:12:37
#134 - succinctly put.

Shettleston is the best example of this. A local MP that has done nothing t o engage with the populus other than election time.

Laughable.
107

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 14:12:43
#132

"Surely if you really cared about Glasgow's working classes you should be urging everyone to vote for a left wing party such as the Scottish Socialists....?"

"This post reveals a startling admission from a Labour supporter that if you care about Glasgow's working classes, then Labour is not the answer."

Erm.....I'm not sure why you presume that I'm a labour supporter on the basis of me suggesting that people should vote for the Scottish Socialists?

Very strange presumption indeed. I don't see any indication anywhere in my post that I support labour, you are clearly very confused and irrationally making presumptions about someone's political preferences on the basis of no evidence whatsoever.

Or do you think that everyone who suggests voting for anyone other than the SNP is 'the enemy' and therefore 'labour' - there are other parties out there than the SNP and labour you know.
108

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 14:14:14
I am an ex labour voter who by 1998-99 saw the true light of new Labour. The game was a bogey! They were only in it for themselves and a trusty working class vote is a good vehicle for them.

Your forefathers would turn in their graves at New Labour.

It's time for change.
109

Neil Waugh,

Old Strathcona 07/07/2008 14:21:08
Did the Wicked Witch of the East (Glasgow) actually campaign on the weekend? Or is she just going to phone it in?
Where's the breathless story about Mud Flap Mags going amongst the adoring masses handing out the giro cheques?
Come on Scotsman editors. On the ball or on the bus.
110

M.Corleone,

2nd Vatican State...... Coatbridge 07/07/2008 14:37:08
#1
Third letter should be n, not l ....
#116
Thats should be a p instead of a b in "brick in the wall"

Just as Brown is mis-spelt...it should of course begin with cl instead of br...
111

John S,

07/07/2008 14:43:57
Gordon Brown has opted to abide by the convention that prime ministers do not take a direct part in by-election campaigns.
The convention has been flouted only once in recent years, when Tony Blair visited Uxbridge during a by-election in July 1997.
112

Talorthane,

07/07/2008 14:45:50
136 Yeah1

"Very strange presumption indeed. I don't see any indication anywhere in my post that I support labour...."

It's a matter of context, motivation and perhaps even a bit of familirity.

Firstly, this is a story entitled: "Is the writing on the wall for Labour in Glasgow?"

It is about the Glasgow East by election.

Ok, there are other parties running in this by election, but everyone knows that it's a two horse race.

If you are familiar with these News pages then I think you will accept that the posters who will be attracted to initially read this story and then follow this up with by posting their view on the matter are MOST LIKELY to be either SNP or Labour supporters.

The position taken in your post suggests that you are not likely to vote SNP. However, for you to raise the issue of the SSP means you are either an SSP supporter or a Labour supporter trying to deflect votes from the SNP. As there was no indication of SSP support, it looks like you're Labour.

If I'm wrong in all of this, then I apologise.

But if I am wrong, and you are indeed an SSP supporter, then your only gripe with my post would not be my criticism of Labour, but of confusing you with a Labour supporter.

In which case, I'm sure you'll have no problem in taking this opportunity to denounce the New Labour Party.
113

Number 6,

Germany 07/07/2008 14:54:28
#126 More labour lies i'm afraid mate. Was he not all over the Crewe and the Nantwich by -elections ?.

Oh I forgot, they were in Englandshire. The scottish peasantry can go hang, they will vote Labour no matter what, eh Gordon. No , i'm afraid they just can't help themselves when it comes to pathalogical lying , straight in the public's face.
114

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 14:55:25
#143

"The position taken in your post suggests that you are not likely to vote SNP. However, for you to raise the issue of the SSP means you are either an SSP supporter or a Labour supporter trying to deflect votes from the SNP. As there was no indication of SSP support, it looks like you're Labour."

Surely the majority of those who vote SSP will be former labour voters rather than those who vote SNP? It makes no sense whatsoever for a labour supporter to suggest voting for the SSP, as that would lose votes from their own party.

I'm not an SSP supporter but I was merely enquiring as to why people were suggesting voting SNP to help relieve the poverty and deprivation when surely a left wing party such as the SSP would have policies more in tune with the working classes than a big business-supporting party such as the SNP?

Why don't SNP supporters stop using the poverty and deprivation in Glasgow East as a smokescreen and just admit they want an SNP win in order to gain a seat and give labour a bloody nose, rather than pretending its because they care about Glasgow's working classes?
115

Number 6,

Germany 07/07/2008 14:55:40
#142 Would you like to retract that piece of fiction now ?
116

John S,

07/07/2008 14:58:43
#146 why
117

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 15:02:05
#144

"More labour lies i'm afraid mate. Was he not all over the Crewe and the Nantwich by -elections ?."

Actually no he wasn't - Gordon Brown didn't visit Crewe and Nantwich at all. David Cameron was there almost everyday but Brown wasn't - perhaps you should read up on it.
118

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 15:09:38
#146

And actually what John S said is not a 'piece of fiction':

"Parliamentary tradition holds that prime ministers do not campaign in by-elections. Tony Blair broke the convention in the 1997 Uxbridge by-election, which Labour lost to the Tories. Sources say Mr Brown is determined not to follow his example."

As you can see from the above quote from a Telegraph article, John S was telling the truth - I'm sure he will eagerly await an apology from you.
119

Brian M,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 15:14:45
"convention and tradition", so not a rule, so Broon the buffoon could come to Glasgow east if he wanted.
120

Talorthane,

07/07/2008 15:16:39
145 Yeah1

Are you suggesting that you believe that the SSP have a chance of winning this by-election?

If you do believe this then you may have a point, the next question would be about which party would best be able to pursue the interests of the Glasgow East constituents in Westminster; a party with only one member or one backed up by an established team in Westminster and a Government in Holyrood.

If you do not believe that the SSP can win this by election, then it would again suggest that you are a labour supporter, trying to deflect attention from the SNP.

You may argue, here, that it makes no sense for a Labour supporter to advocate to others to vote for the SSP, but if you believe that the core Labour support is solid then convincing some potential SNP voters in the direction of the SSP makes perfect sense.


Other than that, I can assure you that the SNP cares about every part of Scotland.
121

Talorthane,

07/07/2008 15:19:37
Labour are much more comfortable with "convention and tradition" than rules.

In the case of Margaret Curran's nomination for the Glasgow East by election, they have followed their own "custom and tradition" of ignoring their own rule that prevents MSPs being nominated for the position of MP.
122

Number 6,

Germany 07/07/2008 15:31:43
#142 John S. It seems I owe you an apology (sorry).
Now excuse me while I step back from the keyboard.
123

subrosa,

07/07/2008 15:42:48
# 152 'in the case of Margaret Curran's nomination for the Glasgow East by election, they have followed their own "custom and tradition" of ignoring their own rule that prevents MSPs being nominated for the position of MP'

They changed that rule this weekend I read somewhere.

We need to put our money where our mouths are on this one. I've just donated on the website - SNP.org. Feeling better already!
124

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 15:45:26
#151

No I'm not suggesting the SSP can win this by-election.

What I am saying is that the SNP supporters should stop hiding behind this pretence that they want the SNP to win because they care for the Glasgow working classes and want to alleviate the poverty and deprivation in Glasgow East.

Why can't they just admit that they want the SNP to win because it will give labour a bloody nose and gain the SNP a major 'trophy'?

If the SNP supporters really cared for the working classes in Glasgow they would vote for the party best placed to help the working classes, which I would suggest is the Scottish Socialists.

And no, the SNP will not lose any votes to the SSP. Any votes the SSP gain will come at the expense of labour, as always happens in by-elections where the party in government loses out to the protest vote. So if I was a labour supporter I would not be advocating voting for the SSP.
125

Anthony,

Glasgow 07/07/2008 15:54:21
It's easy to have a go at the party in power. Let's look at Labour's achievements, not just nationally, but in revitalising Glasgow. We're not just the Commonwealth Champions - Labour is the champion of millions of hard working families across the country. Just stop and ponder that before you hand blank cheque power over to Mr Cameron and his Eton Club. And consider the economy...Oh damn it...I never wanted to be a Labour supporter...I'm sick of all this spinned-up piss...I wanted to be...a lumberjack!
126

Talorthane,

07/07/2008 15:54:45
Yeah1

"Why can't they just admit that they want the SNP to win because it will give labour a bloody nose and gain the SNP a major 'trophy'?"

I'm happy to admit that. But its not the only rewason, and it's not the most important reason.

It is a additional benefit.

Glasgow East has been represented by Labour for 50 years.

Why is it still among the poorest and unhealthiest places to live in the UK.

The area can do better.

Like many other parts of Scotland, it should be doing better.

Time for a change of representation.
127

John S,

07/07/2008 16:00:19
#154.Number 6,I wasn't in the least bit bothered by your #146 comment so your apology wasn't necessary.

Here are the latest betting odds:
-------------Labour----SNP
Betfair-----13/16-----11/10
Ladbrokes---5/6-------5/6
Paddy Power--5/6------5/6
Sky Bet------8/11-----1
128

The Master,

07/07/2008 16:02:48
Thanks to Mr MacDonnell for putting us straight as to why Cameron's taking such an interest in the seat and the Tories are referring to Margaret as "part time" when this can only boost the Nats.

We now know from this article that a Nat win will suit the Tories' ends as much as those of the Nats and I would ask the good voters of Glasgow East to take note. Well done, Niko at #115. I may be a Tory voter myself, but I'm backing Labour all the way against the chippy separatists. Vote vote vote for Labour in Glasgow East!
129

subrosa,

07/07/2008 16:14:00
# 161

Chippy? Me? Never! I'm a quiet, peace loving pensioner who just wants my country governed by people who care about it and not continue to use it to boost their faded Empire status.

Also I don't believe in nuclear, I want Scotland to have an education system similar to the standard I had in my day, I believe we can be a much better country being independent rather than dependent.

If that's chippy so be it.
130

AJ Fife,

07/07/2008 16:16:38
With reference to the photo, was Curran a weather reporter at one time?

Big Jackie Baillie looks like a weather girl, but that's another story......
131

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 16:19:11
#159

"Glasgow East has been represented by Labour for 50 years. Why is it still among the poorest and unhealthiest places to live in the UK. The area can do better. Like many other parts of Scotland, it should be doing better. Time for a change of representation."

If the SNP win Glasgow East it isn't going to magically make all the poverty and poor health disappear. Nothing will change.

An SNP win won't really make any difference whatsoever to the average working class person in Glasgow East - the SNP don't have any more particularly 'socialist' policies than labour do.

Wouldn't the average working class person prefer Scottish Socialist Party policies such as:

- £8 an hour minimum wage
- £50 extra a week for pensions and benefits
- Freezing of all food prices

Than the SNP who support billionaires such as Donald Trump and millionaires such as Donald Macdonald, owner of Macdonald Hotels?

The SSP also support an independent Scotland, so surely the working classes in Glasgow East would be better off supporting a socialist independence party than a big business independence party?

132

The Master,

07/07/2008 16:20:33
#162: so you're one of those Nats who wants a "socialist utopia", as opposed to those, such as the newly converted Nat Michael Fry, who want to use Scotland as a right wing testing bed and to boost a Celtic Lion economy by cutting business rates etc. I've never got what nationalism's all about in Scotland.
133

Richard,

West Lothian 07/07/2008 16:24:09
The Master,

So arch unionist, the mask slips?

A Tory beseeching the good voters of Glasgow East to vote Labour!

Alright for you, as you know the Tories will come to power in London, come the next U.K. general election but the voters of Glasgow East and Scotland will have to suffer them and voting LABOUR will only assist in this.

Your union is coming to an end and rightly so, for democracies sake!
134

You can stick your independence up your a***!!,

07/07/2008 16:26:07
Don't have much symapthy for Labour but I do have to laugh at the Nationalist drones accusing another party of being control freaks.

Funnily enough if the Dear Leader'sedicts are attacked they leap to his defence.

Hypocrisy in action courtesy of the Cybernazis.
135

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 16:31:21
#166

"Alright for you, as you know the Tories will come to power in London, come the next U.K. general election but the voters of Glasgow East and Scotland will have to suffer them and voting LABOUR will only assist in this."

What a stupid thing to say. How exactly would voting labour in Glasgow East assist the tories in London?

Actually voting SNP is going to assist the tories in London rather than the other way round.

Why do you think Cameron is campaigning so strongly in Glasgow East even though the tories have no chance of winning it? In order to take some votes off labour and let the SNP win - so that the labour government loses a seat and Gordon Brown gets even weaker.
136

Richard,

West Lothian 07/07/2008 16:36:07

Yeah1,

Not a silly thing to say at all.

The only way to combat a Westminster TORY government is to vote for the S.N.P. and other pro-independence parties and definitely not the UNIONIST Labour party.

Think about it moron?
137

Stepford Nat,

07/07/2008 16:41:21
93 The Spook in Leith

I resent any insinuation that I am anything other than an optimistic SNP supporter, unquestioning in my support for Alex and his apprentices as they lead us somewhere.

www.snp.org.uk we're not up our own @rses, oh no, not at all, not even a wee bitty
138

Scottish 'N British,

07/07/2008 16:51:31
According to Salmond, he's up against the 73rd choice Scottish Labour candidate. With such an easy opponent, the SNP shuold win.

Voting SNP on 24 July will mean the end of Broon, a general election and, if polls are to believed, David Cameron in No.10. It's the spectre of Thatcher, all over again.

Vote SNP at your peril.....


139

BIG EYE,

Paisley 07/07/2008 16:54:43
Bookies odds were interesting. Most have the SNP and Labour neck and neck and with it being openly admitted that they had one very large bet on Labour. As the bookie said " I have had a lot of small bets on the SNP and one very large one for Labour"

And all this with the SNP needing a massive 22% swing to win.

My God Labour really are in deep, deep trouble!
140

Richard,

West Lothian 07/07/2008 16:56:34
Scottish 'N British,

That's right you unionists stick together, vote Labour in Scotland and suffer English Tory rule!

You're cringe is showing!
141

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 17:00:05
#169

"Not a silly thing to say at all. The only way to combat a Westminster TORY government is to vote for the S.N.P. and other pro-independence parties and definitely not the UNIONIST Labour party."

Voting for the SNP in the Glasgow East Westminster by-election isn't going to do anything to combat a Westminster tory government. It will merely serve to help the tories by weakening labour still further.

The only way to 'combat' a Westminister Tory government is to vote SNP in the Scottish elections in order to give them a majority in the Scottish parliament.

Voting SNP in a Westminster by-election will merely help the tories.

Think about it you moron.

142

Richard,

West Lothian 07/07/2008 17:06:22

Yeah1,

You're not the sharpest tool in the box?

Come the Westminster general election if we Scots return 30 S.N.P. M.P.s then Scotland is de facto ....INDEPENDENT!

Guess what ...no more Tories!
143

subrosa,

07/07/2008 17:06:39
# 162

"Socialist utopia" - call it what you like. Aren't you even a little ashamed how the standards of much in our country have fallen in the past 30 years? I'm not speaking about all financial by the way.

I lived in Switzerland and Norway for many years and I know what can be done by small countries. Why do you debase Scotland? You are obviously of the thinking that Scots are too stupid to run their own country. Well I do hope I live to see you proved wrong.
144

Richard,

West Lothian 07/07/2008 17:09:44
VOTE LABOUR AND GET ENGLISH TORY RULE!
145

Yeah1,

07/07/2008 17:10:43
#176

"You're not the sharpest tool in the box? Come the Westminster general election if we Scots return 30 S.N.P. M.P.s then Scotland is de facto ....INDEPENDENT!Guess what ...no more Tories!"

What on earth are you talking about? Scotland isn't going to automatically become independent if the SNP win 30 seats at the next general election. Where on earth did you get that obscure idea from?

Why would the SNP winning 30 of the 59 Scottish seats at the next general election make Scotland independent, de facto or not?
146

Publius,

London 07/07/2008 17:14:02
#174 onwards

No point in voting SNP or Labour in three weeks time to spite a Tory government that won't be here until 2010. Whoever is elected wil have to stand again in 2010 anyway. The one good reason for voting SNP in the by-election is to give Labour a good kicking. They deserve it.
147

Richard,

West Lothian 07/07/2008 17:14:46

Yeah1,

AL THE U.K PARTIES HAVE ACKNOWLEDGED THAT IF A MAJORITY OF OF SCOTTISH M.P.s WANT INDEPENDENCE THEN IT WILL HAPPEN.

IT'S CALLED DEMOCRACY?

MORON!
148

David MacVicar,

07/07/2008 17:29:13
The votes should go to the party with policies that best meet peoples particular preferences and to the party best able to implement and stick to those policies.

The SNP have a flawed but overall good record of putting their policies into practice and for being well organised.

Labour have had the last 11 years to turn Glasgow around and invest in the future. They have failed totally - Living standards have fallen and the level of poverty has increased - This during a period of UK prosperity.

Currently Labour are so corrupt and incompetent they can't even organise their own campaign and candidate never mind represent local needs.
Labour are a disgrace. If you don't like the SNP vote for someone else but do not vote Labour.

Remember every single Labour MSP, including Curran voted against Scottish farmers compensation. Not many Farmers in Glasgow's east end. However plenty of consumers who have seen the price of meat go up as a result of Labour incompetence in England and Labour sell outs in Scotland. Corrupt to the core.

Nu Labour are a cancer that needs to be completely destroyed. This is not so the SNP can put the boot in. Its clearly the only way Glasgow East can get competent people looking after their interests at a UK level.
149

Flash67,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 17:33:20
Just read an article on Zimbabwe where an old woman was quoted as voting for Mugabe because 'he got us into these problems so he can get us out..'.
Most of us would scoff at this idea, and think we would be so much smarter..... Until I read above that this area has been a Labour stronghold since 1922 !!!! Seems that, compared to the voters of Glasgow East, the Zimbabweans are geniuses (or even the US elecotrate for electing Dubya) !
Get a grip, Glasgow East - vote for socialist, or SNP or the Tories or the Greens ---just stop voting for the people who you have voted for for the last 80 years plus, and you are still one of the worst off areas in Europe...
150

George Mackay,

Dundee 07/07/2008 17:38:04
What does a gravy train sound like when it hits the buffers?
151

Truely English,

07/07/2008 17:40:51
Why do the Scots get so upset when they are referred to as English?

They do afterall speak English and unless my eyes are playing games this thread is in English as well.

Today we read that over a billion people speak English throughout the world and this number continues to rise thanks to the Sterling work of the Scots explorers, missionaries, educationalists, etc.

The Scots should be proud of their contribution to linguistic harmony worldwide.
152

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 17:50:35
187. Well said, and we in the Unionist campaign for a Labour victory in Glasgow East agree totally. Why oh why oh why can Scots not just accept that they are English, but a second class type of same that are too stupid*/poor*/ oil rich*/ oil poor*/ dependent on oil fluctuation*/ at risk of EU domination*/ at risk of EU rejection*/ dependent on Bank of England*/ dependent on ECB*/ subsidised*/ too rich* (* delete as apprpriate) to run their own affairs
153

westview,

on top of the wurrrld. 07/07/2008 17:58:50
(187), the language you speak in England is a minority dialect. Most folk speak and publish in American or Indian versions of it. Your version is not the majorities lingo. Get overit and learn to enjoy your specialised minority status.
Would it not be fun if M. Curran failed to turn up tonight at the next attempt of new labour to have a selection meeting? PS she speaks in a Scots version of the bastardised language which many use in these blogs.
154

McGinty,

07/07/2008 17:59:01
" A vote for the Scottish Socialist Party will also be a warning shot to Alex Salmond that he needs to deliver for working people before the interests of rich business men like Trump "

She has a point, alhough it was the Labour Party beforehand who first cultivated the Hairdo. Mr. Salmond need have little to do with the Trump as his votes are pretty safe up there, he risks annoying large chunks of the electorate in the rest of Scotland, Trump's developments up to date have been of questionable quality and benefit and Trump doesn't need Salmond's help anyway.
155

ThomasP,

07/07/2008 17:59:09
187 Truely English.

To be quite fair, if you woild like to go dowqn this road, England should be classed as Southern Scotland. Tony Blair was Scottish, Gordon Brown also, and David Cameron comes from a Scottish Clan (apart from growing up in London) England has not been properly governed by an Englishman for quite some time and looks unlikily to another decade under Cameron.
156

ThePeter,

Glasgae 07/07/2008 18:04:48
70 yrs of Labour turning the place into the worst place in the Western hemisphere to live..

And some labour hack still tries to blame the Tories

As a certain burger ad goes "I'm lovin it"

Satire/comedy? I do not know, but I do know that the Labour party is a party of fools....
157

cataibh,

Over the Struie 07/07/2008 18:06:02
Has liebour redone their website, nothing about Alex Salmond having a dual role, or have I missed something.
Could someone enlighten me.
158

danielrober,

07/07/2008 18:15:28
# Alan B

Thanks for the reply, very busy day.

The reason why i ask for vote after or on 2014 is the huge amout of international PR available. Olymipic's in London and the CG in Glasgow, followed by separate team from Scotland at the 2016 Olymipic games. That is good PR, the very best. What Alec.S wants is an independent team for London - thats just pure ego.

The reason why i think we should wait until 2014 is that the Americans would have got on top of these wars. This will be a huge issue at the next American election, that has already produced two candidates who are looking at this problem. SO LETS GIVE THEM TIME.

The reason why i think we should wait until 2014 is the baby boomers would have entered retirement by the 10,000 unit, releasing jobs for younger people. This will be good for the economy as Scotland will be able tell which jobs are woth invesing in.

The reason why i think we should wait until 2014 is that the older generaion who faught in the war's would have been prpared and won't feel the waste of their time by some quite frankly bottelling it politics.

The reason why i think we should wait until 2014 is the economy of the EU would have settled down, ready for an independent Scotland and a drop in strength of the pound. Lots of EU cash is held in pounds until the Euro is stronger.


The reason why i think we should wait until 2014 is plans fo energy and transport would have been decided, by Scotland/UK/EU speading the costs better. If engerland says you have to pay part ofits bill, then You want a high speed Maglev to London, not a TGV designed for Heathrow and Manchester.

But most importantly you need to giveScotland time to produce an expereiinced government. Alec.S just shouts and bores at eveyone. He ignores those that would help and just winds people up.

There's only one reasonwhy the SNP are going for a quick vote its so Alec.S can tell Gordon.B where to go. This is not a good way start a country and will do
159

,

07/07/2008 18:15:40
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Reason:
160

danielrober,

07/07/2008 18:16:04
# 195 cont

There's only one reasonwhy the SNP are going for a quick vote its so Alec.S can tell Gordon.B where to go. This is not a good way start a country and will do nothing for Glasgow.
161

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 18:16:14
194. Gladly.

We in the Unionist campaign for Labour victory last week posted a press release on our Labour website entitled "LABOUR STEPS UP PRESSURE FOR SALMOND TO END DUAL ROLE AS MP"

We in the Unionist campaign for Labour victory (Grahamski et al post on here on our behalf) have frequently and vociferoulsy criticised Salmond for his dual role - even though Salmond told his electorate in Gordon that was his plan before they elected him.

We now see the error of our ways, for no reason related to our inability to find a by-election candidate and the fact that our 6th choice candidate may not have told her electorare of her plans for a dual mandate, and have voluntarily and rather suddenly removed such articles from our website (they are still cached if you search).

We are working on removing the motion lodged by Labour MSP Michael McMahon in the Scots Parliament 2 weeks ago which denounced Salmond's attendance at Westminster as being total neglect of his role as an MSP and denouncing his dual mandate. When we think why Margaret Curran would not be neglecting her role as an MSP if she votes at Westminster, we will further explain this motion - and we urge no one to search motions by Michael McMahon, Labour MSP, condemning absenteeism at Westminster by an MSP who is an MP.
162

,

07/07/2008 18:16:57
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163

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 18:17:15
197. Daniel

indeed, as it was Labour who chose the date for the "quick vote" you are of course quite correct and do not, as usual, look like a total pillock.

164

danielrober,

07/07/2008 18:17:29
So much anger. This is not the way to start a new country in the partnership of the EU. Separation should be about a new life, not moaning about the old and winding people up.
165

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 18:20:37
201. Daniel

well said. As only 1000 Scots pensioners freeze to death every winter in the most energy rich country in Europe, and while life expectancy in parts of Glasgow East are below the average for Gaza or Iraq (post war), we in the Unionist campaign for Labour victory agree anger is misplaced, and urge complacency and apathy as you suggest and promote.
166

Zorbathejock,

Paphos 07/07/2008 18:23:14
It doesn't say much for the other two candidates if they have to draft in another "favourite".If I were them I don't think I would bother turning up to the selection meeting as it is obvious they are not going to be selected
167

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 18:24:11
201. We in the Unionist campaign for Labour victory endorse Daniel's views, and suggest apathy is the best response to a 300% increase in energy disconnections, as apathy will surely ensure OAPs in Glasgow East stay warm with their lights on as their energy spiral and their pension increase in derisory, while an extra £12bn in oil revenues flow south.
168

danielrober,

07/07/2008 18:24:48
I have to point out that i do not belong to either the Labour party or the SNP. Get over it not every one is involved with your two step dance. There are other parties and i've even heard rumors of somthing called independants. I would have thought the SNP would aknowledge our existance considering the route your charging down.

Economic dependancy to the left, small pensions to the right and the dole que straight ahead. Boldy lead by Alec.S and his private club. Stand up for Alec.S - leader of NEW SCOTALND. Soon to be Big Brother AS.
169

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 18:27:38
203. Well, they did turn up at the first seletion meeting, but oddly it didn't go ahead. We in the Unionist campaign for Labour victory reject suggestion that this is because the first selection meeting was a typical Labour stitch up, and when we can explain why the first selection meeting did not simply progress with the remaining candidates, we will explain this.

However, as we have not come up with an explanation for removing our press releases attacking Salmond's dual role as MP/MSP posted on our Labour website, or our coverage of Michael McMahons parliamentary motion condemning same alson removed from our website yesterday, this will have to wait. We are not blundering, vile, desperate hypocrites after all.
170

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 18:28:50
205. Daniel

well done for not apologising and retracting your accussation at 197 that it was the SNP "going for a quick vote" when this was totally false as it was Labour who chose the date for the by-election.



171

Saoghal Beag,

07/07/2008 18:29:16
zorba, peggie sultana is candidate number five....the other four had too much slease associated with them.
172

ThomasP,

07/07/2008 18:30:26
Danielrober.

Your reasons to hold the referendum in 2014 sounds more out of desperation rather then logic.
173

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 18:30:46
205. Danile, re. : "independants" is this a form of bling?
174

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 07/07/2008 18:30:48
Labour has staged a coup d'etat in Scotland because of unfavourable news Reporting Scotland will not be shown and the local news will be from London
175

,

07/07/2008 18:31:33
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176

Dreech,

07/07/2008 18:31:40
Anyone watching BBC1 right now? Reporting Scotland appears to have been stolen.
177

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 18:34:13
208. As a Uninist campaigner for Labour victory, I scoff at your pathetic post, and ask how much sleaze is too much sleaze, and laugh in your face.

The Labour party has admitted 120 counts of law breaking last year and this re. sleaze illegal donations, Wendy Alexander and Peter Hain have been referred to the prosecutors, the Labour MP for Glasgow East has claimed £90,000 in incedental office expenses for which his home office was not eligible and payed his wife £400,000 over 6 years, and a judge described Labour election fraud as "disgraceful for even a banana republic" - we are still standing proud, so we laugh at your notion of "too much" sleaze.....all sleaze is good sleaze
178

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 18:36:42
#213 - indeed i am , the London news. Perhaps their trying to tell us something?
179

,

07/07/2008 18:36:44
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180

Saoghal Beag,

07/07/2008 18:36:52
truely demented troll, it is because we feel associated with the likes of yourself and take that as a great insult.. what you speak is a form of anglo-saxon, as is Scots/Lallans. They share the similar roots and are equal. However those who have not complied with the English state's version have been persecuted and denegrated for doing so. Not somehting to be proud of really.

Scots outwith their homeland but within the UK loose their accent quickly as the english just seem too thick to understand, but we are not so arrogant as to demand that understanding and adapt to local custom.

181

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 07/07/2008 18:37:07
Gordon Brown has taken direct powers to Westminster and Holyrood has been dissolved. Margaret Curran has been declared the authorised Member of Parliament for Glasgow East. The Returning officer for Glasgow has signed the necessary decree. There will be no by election
182

pehman,

sussex 07/07/2008 18:37:48
Dreech 213,

That the very reason I'm loggin in,

The censorship/manipulation of Scottish news is an outrage.

Every night I key in channel 971 on sky +

Tonight I've got bbc london news
183

,

07/07/2008 18:39:02
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184

,

07/07/2008 18:40:24
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185

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 07/07/2008 18:40:45
All comments on news sites will be come illegal from 7.00 pm tonight and all existing comments pulled.
186

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 18:42:08
219- I am watching on telly west/ virgin and its the same London News.

Perhaps Labour are fearing wipeout in Scotland they've sent an edict to cover no news north of the border.Lol
187

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 07/07/2008 18:42:20
A five minute edition of Reporting North Britain will be broadcast at 10.00 pm giving details of curfew arrangements
188

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 07/07/2008 18:43:49
Radio Scotland is broadcasting continuous pop music
189

Dreech,

07/07/2008 18:46:15
Perhaps Jackie had a 'wardrobe accident'.
190

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07/07/2008 18:46:23
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191

,

07/07/2008 18:47:01
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192

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 18:48:30
Can someone from shettleston please rig up a webcam at their door so as we can all see the levels of campaigning and dirty tricks being played?Perhaps make a wee election montage up of the best and most comical canvassers?

SNP take note. I am expecting you and ALL canvassers to take the moral high ground.
193

subrosa,

07/07/2008 18:48:33
# 180

Meths, I love you :)
194

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 18:50:32
#232 & 180 GET A ROOM!
195

pehman,

sussex 07/07/2008 18:51:15

I've got it back on sky +
196

Dreech,

07/07/2008 18:54:51
Well according to Ms Bird it was circumstances outwith their control. Hmmmm....
197

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 18:55:27
Following the Radio 4 piece (on the Westminster hour) last night about the Glasgow East by-election last night, featuring MPs from Enlgish constituencies for Labour, the Lib Dems and the Conseratives (SNP, who they?) which ended with the BBC political editor saying "that is too much about Scotland", and the collapse of Reporting Scotland, we advise viewers in Scotland and those concerned about the representation of the people act to bog right off.
198

pehman,

sussex 07/07/2008 18:55:36

Oh aye jackie, a truncated version, outwith our control


Fecking says it all, GET UNDER OUR CONTROL NOW !
199

john z,

edinburgh 07/07/2008 18:55:57
Is the writing on the wall for Labour in Glasgow?

Yes.
200

The Former Mr. Angry,

Perth 07/07/2008 18:56:05
Says it all when the first candidate for Labour is involved in a sleaze accusation, cleared of it or not. There has been some dancing round this one, but let's face it the genetic voting pattern in this area does not bode well for the opposition.

However a substantially reduced majority might do very nicely and have Broon staring into the abyss as his back benchers ponder the future with their equally shaky majorities.
201

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07/07/2008 18:58:12
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202

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 19:00:18
242. We in the Unionist campaign for Labour victory say that the Rangers/ Manchester riot story is topical and up to the mninute, as is our planned extended coverage of the world cup 1966 for next week and our Falkland's victory ceilidh planned for week after.

203

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 19:04:59
I for one hope that Margaret Curran did not sign Michael McMahon's motion in the Scottish parliament condemning an MSP who is also an MP being absent because they were at Westminster.


I hope Curran is also not a member of the Labour party, coz they had very harsh things to say on their website, up to 4.21pm yesterday, about the whole dual MP/MSP role
204

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 19:24:22
#236 - Naw. Boaking. :-)
205

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07/07/2008 19:27:19
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206

Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

07/07/2008 19:27:25
#239 - pehman - It shows you which Branch of the British BBC controls the switch for news output.Should the peasants in north Britishland revolt. They can launch Shand 24 to make us all feel , all is warm and fuzzy until normality resumes.
207

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 19:31:15
248. What a pearly drama queen
208

brownlie,

07/07/2008 19:36:22
250 Union is Best

Greetings, Mr Best, did you get Alfred E. released at the same time?

Was it him that put the big bet on Labour to win?

The way things are going we need all the help we can get as British Pride has been recruiting for the nats all day on another thread!



The way things are going
209

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 19:40:33
252. Greetings Brownlie. Glad you survivded the office cut backs, I myself am posting now from a portacabin.

The way things are going, indeed..... what with the outing of AM2 and the subsequent demise of several of his associated monikers (alfred has gone you may noticed, and an English voice and his part time oblique efforts as Publius etc don't cut the same (english) mustard)

The way things are going.....No worries, we are going to put the frighteners on them folk in Glasgow East and tell them if they don't vote Unionist they will end up dead poor.... oh, yes, I see... the way things are going
210

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 19:41:21
Has Douglas Fraser joined the BBC already, and the unionist establishment have now extended their censorship to include reporting the news as well as commenting upon the news?

Wait a second; there has always been a form of news reporting censorship in this country.

Where, for example, has the expenses claim record of the retiring MP for Glasgow East ever been discussed openly in the editorials, articles or opinion pieces in the Scotsman, Herald, SoS, Sunday Herald, or on the BBC?

No wonder the Labour Party are so set against the concept of a “Scottish Six” news programme.

They obviously fear that the likes of Mr MacWhirter, Bell, and Ms MacDonald may contribute distinctly off-message pieces, which do not conform to labourite versions of “truth”.
211

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07/07/2008 19:42:34
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Union is Best,

07/07/2008 19:48:22
255. You are a typical shame-faced nat liar. Only one person on here has posted some disgusting site comparing pearly protein to bovine lactation, and it was not I.

And I beg to refresh your memory, but any skancky jeez autobot object to armitage-skank) photos probably orignated from the Leith (Latent) Branch of Natz R Us
213

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 19:50:31
255. LOL

That was her finest moment. I draw your attention to Ms Baillies "neither were you" - as socractic debate
214

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 19:52:05
255. What is this site you posted? Is it a carry on script?

Rhona Brankin: "Can i ask the first minister for poor old Maureen Watt?"

Dirty Lebanese
215

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 19:53:57
I don't think it matters if the writing's on the wall for Labour as they wouldn't read it anyway.

What I would like to know is what colour the liquid will be when they go into meltdown.
216

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07/07/2008 19:58:12
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217

pehman,

sussex 07/07/2008 20:02:00

Glasgow clp have turned down margaret curran !
218

brownlie,

07/07/2008 20:06:55
253 Union is Best

It is going to be rather strange canvassing in Glasgow East.

I understand that they have, what we unionists used to call when we were socialist, poor people there. Have you ever met any?

As you know I used to be relatively poor myself on my salary (£50k+) as a family member until I found out about our expenses entitlement.

This may, and I only say may, be the reason that Marge C. decided to stand.

That sentence should have read 'decided to stand up for the poor in Glasgow East'.
219

Saoghal Beag,

07/07/2008 20:09:45
is there any truth in the rumours that gordie B has redeployed a batalion of the sussex fusiliers in zimbabwe for election management training prior to thier transfer to the new hagshill barracks in a weeks time?
220

George Mackay,

Dundee 07/07/2008 20:14:22
Will the last person to leave Scottish Labour HQ please turn off the lights. On second thoughts, no need to. Electrics been cut off for non-payment.
221

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 20:14:30
OI SCOTSMAN, WILL YOU DESIST IN TIMING ME OUT EVERYTIME I LOG IN TO POST AND THEN TAKE 15 MINS TO READ THE OTHER POSTINGS? OR ARE YOU DEPENDENT ON LOG INS LIKE THE LABOUR PARTY IS GOING TO BE DEPENDENT ON SIGN ONS IN THIS BY ELECTION?

222

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 20:16:58
262. Brownlie

these so called "poor people" as we in the campaign for unionist Labour victory call them, are obvioulsy just too lazy to apply for second home allowances and to claim for their furnishings off the John Lewis list... we can't get our head around them.

Therefor we support the Labour crack down on benefit cheats, and I do not wish that to be taken as a reference to our first choice candidate.
223

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 20:19:07
265. No.

224

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 20:19:48
As I was wanting to say before being rudely cut of (again) by the Scotsman:

Was working in Tollcross up until the beginning of last year. I shall revisit around election time and see the difference the timing of the by election (Labour timed) makes to the general volume of population, through traffic etc.

225

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 07/07/2008 20:21:44
I note that Ladbrokes have both the SNP and Labour at 5/6 on to win what is essentially a two horse race.

William Hill is not accepting any bets on the contest.

But wait; is this not supposed to be one of the safest Labour seats in the country, but yet the party 13,500 votes behind are only offered as odds-on to win?

I wonder why this should be?
226

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 20:22:57
267, Union is Best, thank you for replying to the first part of my 3 part question @265 and refusing to deny the latter 2.
227

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 20:24:24
268. Facinating.

A truncated version of Jock's full comments will be availabe at 10pm
228

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 20:25:02
270. Yes and yes
229

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 20:28:37
269. A two horse race where one horse fell and broke its legs before the race started?

No worries, when we are through telling them blights in the East end of Glasgow about how we will take away their aircraft carrier jobs, how the SNP are going to release all the prisoners and how the SNP are going to push their grannies off the buses, we won't need a horse.
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 20:33:39
271 & 272, Union is Best, not only will I not be having an election tonight (no results by 2200) but I am disappointed in you by not replying that the latter2 was actually 2 questions rolled into 1.

You, Sir, are definitely not AMtwa in disguise.
231

brownlie,

07/07/2008 20:34:01
273 UiB

We've got the nearest thing we could get to one!
232

George Mackay,

Dundee 07/07/2008 20:35:52
Do the SNP give their canvassers language training before they go to Glasgow East? Perhpas they use Parliamo Glasgow by Stanley Baxter.
233

danielrober,

07/07/2008 20:44:12
It realy is vastly interesting what a 2D approach the SNP have to separation. Its as if they see separation as a one party state. The SNP and everyone else.

Any one disagreeing with their time table, even though willing to back separation is just shouted down. I do wonder how long it will be until my details are put online along with AM.

This is not about Glasgow, or spearation, this is about Alec.S and his personal battle with Gordon.B. Come on tell everyone what this is about? Whats the hurry AS?
234

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 20:46:10
276/277

I do hope not... remember our mortification when Peter Mandelson was taken to a chip shop and ordered the 'guacamole'?

I hope the SNP, like us, have no actual members or activists outside of Islington...god the phone bills are a killer
235

ThomasP,

07/07/2008 20:47:25
#277

"Any one disagreeing with their time table, even though willing to back separation is just shouted down."

Maybe because the SNP promised a referendum in 2010.

Why should they change their policies?

236

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 20:47:42
277. Daniel

glad you have chosen not to admit your error at post 194 when you said the SNP had called for " a quick vote" in this by-election, given that it was Labour who chose the time table.

Always remember, obscurantism and refusal to admit an error are our mouldy friends

237

brownlie,

07/07/2008 20:48:05
277 daniel

Your spearation sounds very painful. Is it like the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune?
238

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 20:49:33
279. I think by "shouted down" Daniel meant Labour opposing the SNP plan for a referendum, then agreeing with it, then demanding it faster, then slower, then faster....
239

Truely English,

07/07/2008 20:51:26
Why do the Scots go over the top at being called British or English? One would have thought that they would have been proud of the fact that a Billion people speak the same language as they do and have the world at their feet.
240

Alba Abú,

Dunedin 07/07/2008 20:52:19
Aye! the writing is on the wall in Glasgow,and it clearly says,

LABOUR! sling yer hook and get tae hell oot o Glesga.
241

ThomasP,

07/07/2008 20:52:59
283 Truely English.

Yes. The Scots were very impressed by the way English was forced upon her.

You are the biggest idiot I have seen on here. I doubt you are even English, but a Scot trying to stir trouble.
242

Alba Abú,

Dunedin 07/07/2008 20:55:23
Aye! the writing is on the wall in Glasgow,and it clearly says,

LABOUR! sling yer hook and get tae hell oot o Glesga.
243

brownlie,

07/07/2008 20:56:07
283 Truly

May be a billion people do speak it but not as well as us Jocks. We have to speak English because our neighbours in the South cannot understand Gaelic.
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Alba Abú,

07/07/2008 20:58:34
283...... Albannach is ea me, ni Sassanch me. Phoblacht na Alba go brugh.
245

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 21:00:34
danielrober, read all your protestation about a date on other posts - have you been consulting an astrologer?
246

Jock Tamson,

Truely English is a plant 07/07/2008 21:04:58
Scotland, Caledonia, Alba
247

Union is Best,

07/07/2008 21:05:08
283. Nice change of moniker Dan, but, word from the wise, you need to mix up the order more....
248

Jock Tamson,

291 reminds me 07/07/2008 21:09:29
Scotland, Caledonia, Alba

The online archives from this mighty tome have not been updated for donkeys. Why not?

Nae dosh, eh? That'll learn you. There is an article I am waiting for, from 1975 - and I am prepared to pay for it.
249

Saoghal Beag,

07/07/2008 21:10:50
283 is it that you are trying to say...'Se Albannach a tha mise fhien, chan eil me Sassanach. and if you are speaking to truly english troll you could follow it with...a falbh bod ceann.
250

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07/07/2008 21:16:03
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 21:16:13
Yon Truely English thinks having the world at her feet is something to be proud of. Ask those who are downtrodden and they will say the same thing. My world is higher than that of a cultural imperialist monoglot.
252

yockel,

07/07/2008 21:20:32
#264 Aye George what is the latest on ZaNuBlab's impending bankruptcy? Does the Hootsmon have a hot story waiting for publication?
253

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07/07/2008 21:26:48
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Traquir , Alba,

07/07/2008 21:28:29
This post by: Kadok on the Herald gets
to the heart of the matter in Glasgow East.

Someone has just posted this up on the Guardian blog by Lesley Riddoch. This helps explain the incredible reception I found going round the doors of Bailleston on Saturday:

"I was born and brought up in the East End of Glasgow before moving away to London and then to sunnier climes. My family have lived in the East End of Glasgow for generations, and many of them still live in the Glasgow East constituency. They are working class, 'Catholic' and until recently were Labour to the core. But not anymore. My mother is almost 70, and has lived in the East End of Glasgow all her life. She remarked the other day how for the first time she can ever remember people are excited by the prospect of an election where their vote really can make a difference. I have 9 family members who are entitled to vote at this by-election. All of them used to vote Labour, and all but one are voting SNP this time. They are not entirely convinced that the SNP will prove to be any better, but they are revolted by what the Labour party has become. Although lingering suspicions about the SNP remain, most say they'd vote 'yes' to independence when there is a referendum. My mother, much to my pleasant surprise, has become an enthusiastic advocate of Scottish independence. My father is the one who won't be voting SNP, but it's his attitude which perhaps ought to worry the Labour party most. He's now retired but was a manual worker and a union organiser. It's his proud boast that his grandfather was a founder member of the Scottish Labour party and knew John Wheatley and James Maxton. But he's not proud of what the Labour party has become. He can't bring himself to vote for any other party, but he can't bring himself to vote Labour either. He's going to abstain. He even said that perhaps it might be better for Scotland to become independent as that's the only way there will ever be any chance of Scottish Labour f
255

Traquir , Alba,

07/07/2008 21:29:29
cont.

My father is the one who won't be voting SNP, but it's his attitude which perhaps ought to worry the Labour party most. He's now retired but was a manual worker and a union organiser. It's his proud boast that his grandfather was a founder member of the Scottish Labour party and knew John Wheatley and James Maxton. But he's not proud of what the Labour party has become. He can't bring himself to vote for any other party, but he can't bring himself to vote Labour either. He's going to abstain. He even said that perhaps it might be better for Scotland to become independent as that's the only way there will ever be any chance of Scottish Labour finding its soul again.

When Labour cannot even count on the votes of people like my dad, then as we say in Glasgow - the gemme's a bogey."

see - tinyurl.com/5uooye
256

Traquir , Alba,

07/07/2008 21:31:12


cont. He even said that perhaps it might be better for Scotland to become independent as that's the only way there will ever be any chance of Scottish Labour finding its soul again. When Labour cannot even count on the votes of people like my dad, then as we say in Glasgow - the gemme's a bogey.[/quote]
Someone has just posted this up on the Guardian blog by Lesley Riddoch. This helps explain the incredible reception I found going round the doors of Bailleston on Saturday:

I was born and brought up in the East End of Glasgow before moving away to London and then to sunnier climes. My family have lived in the East End of Glasgow for generations, and many of them still live in the Glasgow East constituency. They are working class, 'Catholic' and until recently were Labour to the core. But not anymore.

My mother is almost 70, and has lived in the East End of Glasgow all her life. She remarked the other day how for the first time she can ever remember people are excited by the prospect of an election where their vote really can make a difference. I have 9 family members who are entitled to vote at this by-election. All of them used to vote Labour, and all but one are voting SNP this time. They are not entirely convinced that the SNP will prove to be any better, but they are revolted by what the Labour party has become. Although lingering suspicions about the SNP remain, most say they'd vote 'yes' to independence when there is a referendum. My mother, much to my pleasant surprise, has become an enthusiastic advocate of Scottish independence.

My father is the one who won't be voting SNP, but it's his attitude which perhaps ought to worry the Labour party most. He's now retired but was a manual worker and a union organiser. It's his proud boast that his grandfather was a founder member of the Scottish Labour party and knew John Wheatley and James Maxton. But he's not proud of what the Labour party has become. He can't bring himself to vote for an
257

Traquir , Alba,

07/07/2008 21:32:06
Sorry for the mixed up posting read 305 then 307 then 306. The Scotsman post limit is a real pain.

Saor Alba
258

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07/07/2008 21:33:49
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259

brownlie,

07/07/2008 21:43:44
309 Alberto

As Ed Balls said when Labour were accused of being a high-tax party "So what!!"
260

Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 21:48:15
311
It's your birthday.

You're entitled.

310
(I let him get 300, OK?)
261

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 21:48:17
Traquir, re your post. As someone who was brought up CoS, in an area where religious difference was just an observation and not a f e t i s h, please let me direct everyone to the definition of catholic:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic

If it stems from universal then why are some christians, who are not catholic but have an imperialistic attitude anyway, complaining and making an issue of it?

Go direct, tell man made religion to bog off and live as a human being.
262

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07/07/2008 21:48:20
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Eve,

Scotland 07/07/2008 21:48:35
#2 ThomasP: What thats new to me!!

Never heard of that country before!!
264

Publius,

London 07/07/2008 21:49:58
#309 Alberto Y Lost Trios Paranoias

You write '27th June 2008 - Voted to spend half a billion pounds on a tram line in Edinburgh - money which could, in part be spent on key transport objectives in Glasgow'.

This is feeble.
(1) The enormous rise in the price of oil makes an electric tram system a viable proposition. I and others who used to oppose the tram now support it. Why can't the SNP have the grace to admit they were wrong and support the tram project?
(2)The SNP wants Scotland to be like Ireland. Ireland's capital has a tramline to its airport. Why won't the SNP support one for Edinburgh?
265

Jock Tamson,

F e t i sh is too mature for the Scotsman 07/07/2008 21:50:18
Scotland, Caledonia, Alba
266

brownlie,

07/07/2008 21:53:02
312 Conan

Nice one

Feasgair math a charsdain!
267

,

07/07/2008 21:54:36
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,

07/07/2008 21:54:48
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,

07/07/2008 21:56:23
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 21:57:34
Scotsman reports and editorialises on 1 million words in the "English" language. How many of them are moderated in the self, same publication online?
271

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07/07/2008 21:58:10
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07/07/2008 21:59:15
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 22:00:34
320, Ayreshire. You might find that quite a lot of Curran's constituents have plenty of undergound links.
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07/07/2008 22:01:55
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07/07/2008 22:03:28
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Publius,

London 07/07/2008 22:06:09
#320
#321

Glasgow Underground (Good thing)
Glasgow extension of M74 approved by SNP (good thing)
Edinburgh tramline to airport (another good thing)

Good communications are essential in big cities.
Why can't you see it?
277

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07/07/2008 22:06:13
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Eve,

Scotland 07/07/2008 22:07:19
#157 Yeah1: Theres one problem with the SSP. It's a big one. They are politcaly niave. I'm sure one day they'll loes it. This sort of thing tends to take a wee while, though.

I'm NOT sure folk living in deprived areas would have there lifes greatly improved any if they were to have a policaly naive repersentive at Westminster.

The SSP have a lot of sorting out to do before they can problerly and effectivley repesent the people of a would be constunecy.
Don't get me wroung, I think one day they will be able to do it BUT it's NOT today, Not next year BUT may just may be 2010.

They have some ideas which sound good at 1st glance BUT then you look at the bigger picture you can see where their good intenions could lead to thing effectivly staying the same. i.e. a year or 2 ago the SSP wanted to do this: Raising the min wage to £8 exsalent idea BUT the only problem is the price of living goes up more often and higher than min wage does. So there is a majour risk if you put up min wage and don't do something to prevent the price of living going up the people are just going to be the same or less well off as a result.
279

Publius,

London 07/07/2008 22:08:38
#322 Ayrshire­ Scot™

EARL was cancelled by the SNP government (perhaps a good thing). The tramline was voted by parliament in spite of the SNP (parliament did the good thing, not the SNP)
280

,

07/07/2008 22:08:50
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,

07/07/2008 22:10:07
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 22:12:21
Ayreshire, I understand peripatetic but peripatetic e is beyond me.

You do not seem like yourself tonight.

btw. I made a mistake about the old spelling of Ayr from the other night.
283

Eve,

Scotland 07/07/2008 22:12:23
#317 Methalions: No I NOT reading random comment or thats what I was doing!!!

No Can't be hear all night need sleep, hand needs rest too. Think I've spraint a finger.

Night night!! I've got go to that borring place in the morning! That some would call work.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Good night all sweet dreams of Scottish independence to youse all.
284

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07/07/2008 22:16:14
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Publius,

London 07/07/2008 22:18:52
Ayrshire­ Scot™

I know little about Margaret Curran, but what I do know I don't like. I certainly wouldn't vote for her.
But I do care about Scotland. The biggest structural constraints on Scotland's economy are poor communications and inadequate education/training. Scotland needs world class communications and world class Universities. I support almost any project that helps to improve them.
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07/07/2008 22:19:47
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Publius,

London 07/07/2008 22:21:41
#340 Yes
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Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 22:21:59
341
Well o K then;-)
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Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 22:22:39
He is a yes man?
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Publius,

London 07/07/2008 22:22:41
#343
Sorry but I can't tell you. Someone might guess my real identity.
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 22:25:09
Areshire. That lays to rest the peripatetic e:

From the ragman roll,

INDEX NOMINUM
A.D. MCCXCVI (1296)

Umframuille, Ingram de - (del counte de Are)

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07/07/2008 22:26:48
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 22:27:54
So you see, Areshire, it is not the e

I was born under a wandering y
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Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 22:28:08
348
Very.

Do you think Publius wears his pants outside his tights?

Perhaps he works for a National newspaper?
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 22:29:27
352 is just another way of describing my wondering why.
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07/07/2008 22:29:43
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Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 22:29:48
350
Ayrshire
Jock just called you a counte;-)
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Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 22:33:59
359
Have a Monte Christo, treasure the moment.

Have you a spoon?
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 22:35:59
Areshire, it gets more interesting,

Dunfres
Anegouz
Pebbles
Rokefburgh
Fyf
Yetham
Edeneburgh
Berewyk

Must scan and publish the full list sometime - it's historic and been kept hidden for too long.
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 22:50:19
360, Conan, as you are the librarian, I challenge you to go to Edinburgh Central library (basement- the Scottish section.) ask for the leather bound volume of the Ragman Roll and pay 10p a copy for every page.

Like I did 20 years ago. Even wrote a song about William Wallace using some of the names on it. Just to highlight the fact that Wallace's name is not on it. My ancestor's name is.

Oh, the shame, the shame.
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Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 22:50:25
363
To hard for me...
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Thistledhu,

Fife 07/07/2008 22:51:30
Labour i beleive will win the bi election. (sadly)
the fact is very few will turn up to vote all of them habitual labour voters (my grandad voted labour their for the working man etc)

to those that do id say look around and think how much improvement has been done and how much more could be done with the 1/2 million expenses the previouse labour mp claimed.!!!

Labour rely on poverty to keep hold of there voter base hard fact.
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Truely English,

07/07/2008 22:51:56
298
Always better to be looked over than overlooked.
English language and culture is rarely overlooked.
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 22:54:29
363, Areshire, Ah well so there it is
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Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 22:55:48
364
http://www.electricscotland.com/history/articles/ragman_rolls.htm

The 21st Century is upon us Jock.
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Jock Tamson,

Truely English has arisen 07/07/2008 22:57:40
Scotland, Caledonia, Alba
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McGinty,

07/07/2008 23:05:24
Jeremy Paxman Kirsty Wark is it just me or does Alec Salmond get treated worse than other interviewees on newsnight, not that he needs sympathy but one would actually favour politicians over journalists on this showing, oh well they earn enough, they'll cope...
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 23:10:48
369, well done Conan the Librarian - I want my money back.

Now here (yawn) is the opening words to my song.

I will not follow les Waleys on the index nominum
Or follow, follow Mareschal or de Malere or Hum
Or Aberdash to Yetham, Val de Esk to Balkaskay
And kneel before and sell my soul
To you, false majesty
Hey, nay

I will not sign the Ragman Roll and live on bended knee

etc tec
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Conan the Librarian™,

07/07/2008 23:25:51
396
Ayrshire
I've got an HM on the cost of oil thread.

He thinks I'm a teenager. Perve.
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 23:33:30
399. Number, Number. He hasn't left any one on here for dead. We are still here - he is not.

Here's tae AMtwa -wha's like him?
The Labour party spin department!
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Candymanxjs,

07/07/2008 23:44:15
boraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraboraborabora
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used car
354

Candymanxjs,

07/07/2008 23:45:37











lol
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 07/07/2008 23:59:20
Number:6, AMtwa has being doing a Scarlet Pimpernel act for a wee while now. He comes, he goes, where from or to, nobody knows.
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Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 08/07/2008 00:02:13
re 414, Here's tae AMtwa
Here's tae AMtwa
Whaur is he?
Wha cares?
Nane

Apologies from Number:6
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Conan the Librarian™,

08/07/2008 00:08:32
416
Alberto
Having a colon in the user name?

You could make a fist of that.
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Conan the Librarian™,

08/07/2008 00:17:29
419
Excellent.

Mind you I thought that wis Daphne Broon up Stoorie Brae.
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Iainbroch,

Moray 08/07/2008 01:36:53
re 399

Oink!Oink!Oink!

I guess Animal Farm will now get banned as incitement to some form or another.

I gues some little piggies will aLways be more equal than other litle piggies?

Oink! Oink ! Oink!
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Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

08/07/2008 04:37:44
http://youtube.com/watch?v=OARvE4ZzMCY - Pretty much says it all about Glasgow east and the whole of Scotlands attitude to New LAbour/Tory takeover of party.
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Raj Persaud's ghost writer,

08/07/2008 04:39:55
Good to here that lying inventer of mistruths is dead on here. Am. I saw hime being taken to part by a statistician one day and then watched his grovelling appologies when he was forced to eat his words. He was a really sad piece of gimpery.
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elizabeth the first ,

08/07/2008 12:25:16
The people of Glasgow East may be poor but they are not barmy,as nearly 50% of people in this area rely on benifits in some form or other,guess Labour do not need to worry,the SNP could not afford you!
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