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Published Date: 22 November 2008
MINISTERS should rethink or delay plans to force lone parents, disabled people and the long-term jobless to seek work, a senior government adviser has warned.
But James Purnell, the Work and Pensions Secretary, has over-ruled the findings of a report that said the boot camp approach to forcing single parents and those on incapacity benefit back to work would backfire in a recession.

Under the welfare t
o work programme, benefits would be cut if recipients could not prove they were doing all they could to find jobs.

The plans will put pressure on single parents who have children aged 12 and over to get back to work. At present lone parents can claim benefits until their youngest child is 16 but under the new rules they will only be able to claim Jobseekers Allowance if they are actively looking for work.

While their total income will remain broadly the same, they face benefit cuts of up to 40 per cent if they do not show they are trying to find work.

Sir Richard Tilt, chairman of the Social Security Advisory Committee (SSAC), said ministers should reconsider the plans which risked "falling into disrepute".

He said the reforms could push people "much closer to poverty" and that there was a lack of affordable child care to meet the needs of lone parents.

"Of course, the child will suffer, but it's not the child that has fallen foul of the system," he said.

Putting pressure on lone parents to go back to work could "be harmful and lead to further behavioural problems" for their children, he said.

Unemployment is expected to rise to three million by 2010, and unions and disability charities have urged the government to delay implementing the policy.

Mr Purnell rejected calls for a rethink and insisted the reforms would help people, not penalise them.

"I think it would be wrong, at a time when it may be harder for people to find work, to provide them with less help," he said. "We know that our help works. We know that the help they get from the voluntary sector, from providers and from JobCentre Plus works; it changes lives."

He said the long-term unemployed who had taken up the help had asked why he did not make them do this earlier.

He was backed by the Conservatives. Chris Grayling, the shadow work and pensions secretary, said the changes were essential.

"It would be disastrous for Britain to do a U-turn on welfare reform," he said.

However the SNP's welfare spokesman, John Mason, said the proposals were ill thought out.

"The recession has only magnified this. While measures to support people getting back into work are welcome, these proposals are too draconian.

"It's time for the UK government to return to the drawing board," he said.

• A report by the Prince's Trust and University of Sheffield, released today, warns that young people will be hardest hit by unemployment.

Researchers predicted that at least two in five jobless people will be under the age of 25 if unemployment reaches three million, as business groups and analysts predict.



The full article contains 529 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 21 November 2008 10:00 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Unemployment
 
1

subrosa,

22/11/2008 00:24:29
Where does the Westminster government think these jobs will be? We're going to have over 3 million unemployed soon, many of these people having far more skills than a single parent who has possibly never worked.

What an absolute mess.
2

walter,

22/11/2008 00:39:24
While their total income will remain broadly the same, they face benefit cuts of up to 40 per cent if they do not show they are trying to find work.

So if they are actively seeking employment they will continue to get their benefits even though they do not find employment which in the current climate they probably won't.
This will affect those who do not work and have no intention of ever doing so.
3

BIG EYE,

Paisley 22/11/2008 02:10:58
His greatest fear must be that he wins!

This is just the start he has bankrupted the UK and Scotland.

Much much more bad news to follow.

Watch and learn Labour voters!
4

notime4anovice,

glasgow 22/11/2008 02:19:01
#3
God Brilliant idea !
Let Broon and his puppet win.
Then sit back and enjoy the fun.
Fortunately the British are stronger than that.
We'll take on the burden of Labour incompetence and try and make the UK strong again. It will take about 20 years but we'll do it. Keep Bliar and Broon doing their lecture circuits while strong Brits will sort things out. No time for faint hearts or whingers. Send Labour to their holiday homes while we sort things out.
5

,

22/11/2008 02:27:15
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
6

notime4anovice,

glasgow 22/11/2008 02:32:46
An Independent Scotland is the icing on the cake.
Unfortunately we're in a grave situation which means putting that on the back burner.
The priority is to get Labour out so they can't do any more damage.
Hopefully they will go for max tax cuts and a June election in 2009.
That will allow us to get them out and start to rebuild manufacturing and reduce the public sector.
7

The Former Mr. Angry,

Perth 22/11/2008 08:32:45
#2 agreed.

The fact that the country is in recession may be in no small way due to the prevailing Labour attitude about funding people who'll vote for them and let them do the old drinking smoking and bingo act whilst their day job is lounging around on their DFS sofas whilst watching Sky TV on their HD-ready 42" or more TVs with full cinema sound system and handy cocktail cabinet. And that's only the MPs.

What's needed is a return to values - remember them - where someone who works hard and well is rewarded and those who don't aren't. The "poverty" is all relative and is the usual smokescreen put up to maintain this sub-culture. Those who genuinely need benefits will get them and will do OK if not fantastically well. The rest who choose to cheat the system should be found out and unplugged from the money machine.
8

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 22/11/2008 10:01:32
once believed in the wefare state and was proud that we helped those in need.....

...Then found out what is really going on relating to benefits fraud, benefits plus working cashin hand, incapacity payments for people with nothing wrong with them.

The welfare state should be a saftey net to catch those who fall. It should not be a big soft couch for those who cannot be bothered to sit at home doing nothing all day watching TV with their whole subsidised families and many kids who do not attend school. The only contribution these people make to society is to vote labour and continue the rot.

16-25 cannot find work that is paid then we should find them work that contributes to social well being. There is plenty of government works needing done. They can swap their time for some effort and skills learning in return for benefits. Result no more kids hanging around streets getting high and drunk and acting like idiots to general population.

National Service in a non combat role but more about providing skills, life style change routine and discipline. If you are not working or in education then this is where they should be. The fittest people in society should be doing more for society.

Long Term non incapacitated unemployed doing work within the community brushing streets, cleaning drains, maintaining communal council grounds, painting walls, reclycling activities.

There is plenty that needs done and much that could be done. The labour party have no will to force their electoral supporters to improve society. A party that relies on doom, gloom and poverty to remain relevant is surely a bad idea.
9

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 22/11/2008 10:04:50
#9 Rulesbutnotrulers

Unfortunately there seems to be alot of "free dinners" on the go in the country at the moment.

Free for the people who lazing about and very expensive for those who are having to carry the additional burdon of the lazy.
10

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 22/11/2008 10:10:50
I am looking forward to the comments from the poverty justifiers who will blame the systemm, the lack of opportunities, etc, etc for the fact that so many people in Scotland just do not want a job. These people are a national disgrace and they are the ones who make it so easy for the English to point at Scotland as a benefits sponging nation.

It is natural in nature to fend for yourself not sit around waiting for the government to fend for you. If only Glasgow could stop fighting about which church they don't go to or whether they are Irish or British and just become Scots working men.

The Polish came here and found 1 million new jobs still our unemployed continued to unable to find work.
11

Rev. S. Campbell,

Bath 22/11/2008 10:44:16
#8, #10, #12

Ah, the usual parade of visitors from the Daily Mail and Express, who have no clue of the reality of life for the poor, sick and unemployed in Britain in 2008, and get all their information from a bunch of made-up stories about benefit scroungers with yachts and Ferraris. Where would we be without you?

Poverty is not "relative" if you can't afford a roof over your head. It's just poverty. (Heck, if you insist on measuring it in some sort of ridiculous "absolute" terms then much of Britain is actually poorer than the hungriest Third World peasant, because that peasant might have nothing but the rags he stands up in but at least he doesn't owe Visa or the bank thousands of pounds. Millions and millions of normal people in this country, including those with jobs, are in net debt.)

At least some people can be bothered to do the research - there are 600,000 vacancies in the UK according to the government's Office of National Statistics. There are already almost 2m unemployed, another 1m forecast, and another 1m sick and disabled who James Purnell wants to dump in the JobCentre.

All of you Express-reading idiots: explain to us how 4 million people fit into 600,000 jobs.
12

Top_Dawg,

22/11/2008 10:52:26
Thanks Thatcher for ripping up Scotland and leaving us in the shi -ite.

No jobs, Too many foriegners, too many fraudsters.

Mr Tilt is right, hope they listen to him.
13

,

22/11/2008 11:14:26
Comment Removed By Administrator
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14

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 11:48:09
The usual reactionary nitwits spouting off on a subject they appear to know nothing about. What the story misses out is that those disabled and single parents who cannot find a job - and in a UK which will be in a 1930's style depression soon that will be inevitable - will be forced into ''workfare'' programmes like cleaning graffiti off walls or chewing gum off the streets.

The time to have helped people back into work, who could go back to work, was in the good times, when with the proper support and financial incentives that would have been a realistic objective.

It is not realistic now, all this is going to do is penalise people through no fault of their own.

But it will keep the right wing pitchfork mob happy - how very new Labour.
15

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 12:07:35
19 They already do.

Shame they don't spend as much time chasing tax dodgers.

I've read plenty of stories about people being caught and jailed for benefit fraud. Not so many about people being caught and jailed for tax evasion.

The monetary loss to the Exchequor by benefit fraud is a drop in the Ocean compared to tax evasion, but it's easier to hit wee people, so they are the ones who get hit.
16

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 12:36:01
22 I'm not trying to justify anything I'm just advising you that the Govt do have dedicated benefit fraud Officers who will prosecute where they have evidence. There is a freefone number if you want to report anyone. It was a point of information.
17

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 12:52:54
24 - the large numbers of people parked on various benefits dates to the Thatcher years. Labour didn't tackle the crisis, but they weren't the architects of it either.

You don't get people out of what is now an intergenerational dependency culture by waving a stick at them. You do so by incentivising work and providing support to help them into a working culture which they know nothing about.

If nobody in your family has ever worked then it's not an easy step to take.



18

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 13:18:22
26 You will get no argument from me that working is better than being dependant. It's how you go about changing the culture. I think incentives and support is better than threatening people.

And bear in mind that we are both a lot better off both mentally as well as practically in being people who have always worked. Long term dependancy is a form of depression, you need to treat it.
19

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 22/11/2008 13:42:03
#13 Rev. S Campbell

True to your name Mr Campbell(Twisted Mouth)I suspect it is you have no idea about poverty. I have crawled my way from the bottom of the gutter of shady council schemes to a life of employment. I know many, many, many lazy spongers with nothing wrong with them.

Bad back and unable to work yet excellent at playing tennis on the WII was yesterday's example when I was visiting a family friend.

I have spend most of my life surrounded in poverty, I have even been homeless for a short period while in my teens.

I like many of my friends and family started with nothing and worked our way to stability. I also know in great detail the sob stories of some excellent cider drinkers who cannot find a job.

I said the welfare state should be their to catch those who FALL not those who just LAY DOWN and if you believe that all or even a majority of the unemployed are justified and trying there hardest then you are very foolish.

Take your Glasgow. If all the people who are claiming incapacity are actually incapacitated then Glasgow has the highest physical defects of the entire UK. They are not sick just lazy.

I spend alot of my childhood in Greenock and knew poverty very well. Working class people know the schemes are full of dole spongers. Its middle class do gooders and god squaders like you that have no clue or are so feckless to beleive the stories they are spun.

20

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 22/11/2008 13:45:23
#26 Big Jock

me too I could have spend all my days getting stoned drinking wine with my mates. Instead I worked. I claimed dole for 3 months then worked the remainder of my life much of the time doing two jobs.
21

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 22/11/2008 13:48:16
#27 Observer 1

I agree with you that the threats need to be taken away but the system needs to be clear and productive. At the moment nothing seems to be working.

What is wrong with providing for example work experience and stable environments for 16-25 years old with no idea what to do. The military service concept works very well in other countries. As long as it is non combat.

Our streets and communities would benefit greatly from a reduction in these youths.
22

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 13:54:40
30 There is nothing wrong with providing work experience and stable environments for 16-25 year olds, that is exactly what we should be doing. I think we have to bite the bullet here, there are numerous young people for whom the state really has to act in loco parentis because their own parents are hopeless. If we don't intervene and try and get them young they will just remain a burden on the state forever.

The difference is I don't blame them.
23

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 13:58:47
But any schemes designed to stabilise and help young people into work and productive lifestyles needs to be based on the young person's needs and not seeing them as a source of cheap labour. How you would do that in a recession is difficult to envisage. But one thing I think we can all agree on is that what is on the table is pretty much useless.
24

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 22/11/2008 14:20:41
#31 Observer 1

I suppose I do blame them because I have lived amongst them all my life.

I leave my home and work 60 hours plus nearly every week and have done for years. After kissing my child and wife goodbye I walk passed my neighbours window.

He and his mates are still getting drunk from the night before playing computer. I wave to them and they wave to me but who is the fool.

They spend all day playing with their several kids, I see mine at lunch time or evening and them often have to return to work.

But if all men were like these men everyone would be starving. I just want each and all to pay their own way if possible and to contribute what they can to the social effort.
25

Draco Was a Wimp,

Edinburgh 22/11/2008 14:53:07
#34 An Greumach Mor

Ever considered standing for Holyrood. God, we need your sort of 'Daily Express' common sense there.
26

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 15:00:37
33,34 You, like me, are intrinsically better off than the long term unemployed because they have no control over their lives. They just play the system, they don't make choices. Have you never noticed how they don't have opinions ? And grown ups playing computer games all day ? What's that about ?

It's a form of depression, don't tell me either one of you would swap your lives for theirs for a single minute, you both know you wouldn't.
27

Rev. S. Campbell,

Bath 22/11/2008 15:08:43
#36 Well said. The trouble with these people is that too often they were unemployed for a month in 1974 and think that means they know what it's like now. Nobody buys a 42-inch TV off benefits. They might have owned a 42-inch TV and are now on benefits, but benefits certainly didn't pay for it.

Oh, and most unemployed people have paid their NI and aren't getting a "handout" from anyone. They're claiming on insurance, just like you do if someone crashes into your car.

#28 Doesn't know the first thing about me or my life - I'm about as "middle class" as a box of McCain Micro Chips - but shoots his mouth off anyway because he thinks it justifies his prejudice.

4 million people. 600,000 jobs. None of the pitchfork mob have yet explained how to make the arithmetic of that work.
28

subrosa,

22/11/2008 15:33:52
# 23

Speaking of benefit fraud officers, a lifelong friend of mine has just retired as a senior officer in charge of a county in England. She has recounted how, on many occasions in the past 10 years, she has been told to 'drop' a case. No explanation, no names, no packdrill - just an order from 'on high'. Her team had concrete evidence for these cases.

This goes on all over England btw and the same thing happens with the teams who are responsible for finding illegal immigrants.

Hopefully she'll write a book about it now she's retired but I doubt if anyone would be brave enough to publish it.
29

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 22/11/2008 15:43:09
#37 Mr Campbell

It was you who made the grand statement about my background. You make statement again "the trouble with these people...."

You would rather the whole country was full of salt of the earth unemployed that working class employed. Are you a labour MP.

Anyway you mis represent my point with your socialist idealism.

I will break it down for you.

1. There are people who have never worked who have no reason not to work. FACT

2. There are 16-25 year old who have never worked who have nothing wrong with them who parents also have never worked and there is nothing wrong with them either. FACT

3. Many people dishonestly claim benefits and still work cash in hand. Taking out of the system but puting nothing back in. FACT

The reason I know this is because I know these people, in fact many are relations.

What are doing is twisting the point about the genuinely needy and I and all decent people think they should be cared for but there is a limit.

Imagine we are all pulling a big rope called the ecomony. I want all those that can pull to actually pull. All those who cannot can sit down and be pulled.

What I do not like and cannot stand is those who can pull but opt to not bother. A country is at its best when the best of all the people are working and contributing.

I am so far from elitist and middle class.

The issue is not black and white but a whole lot of shades of grey. We are both guilty of taking polarised positions to make our points.
30

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 16:18:39
38 If I was her I would whistelblow that. But I'm always in trouble ! Still, it makes for an interesting life.
31

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 22/11/2008 16:29:57
40 further to this jocular comment sub rosa if what you say is true, and I don't doubt your veracity, then I am horrified at your friend's actions. We should not stand by and watch public systems being corrupted so that those and such as those can get away with things because those on high decree it. Rubbish. And you will hate this comment even more, when I have been put under pressure to just rubber stamp a decision that I thought was wrong I have always found saying ''I'll go to the Union about this'' quite handy.
32

Rev. S. Campbell,

Bath 22/11/2008 17:37:25
#39 Wah wah wah. How do you fit 4 million people into 600,000 jobs?
33

Jimmy Le Pie,

22/11/2008 17:41:31
Sound thinking from the Unionists again.

Cut benefits for the unemployed then watch the crime rate soar. We can't lock them up as the prisons are overflowing and we've no money to build new ones.

Comrade Broon and his party of self serving conmen have ruined the country.

34

Rev. S. Campbell,

Bath 22/11/2008 17:50:09
Oh, and I haven't made ANY statements about your "background". I haven't called you middle class or elitist. I've judged you purely by your ignorant, ill-informed postings.

So you know a couple of lazy benefit scroungers? I'm sure you do. I don't deny that some exist among the millions of unemployed. But you then extrapolate a sliver of anecdotal evidence and make disgusting sweeping statements about a vast mass of people, and piously shout "FACT" after each one, as if your microscopic experience represents some sort of empirical research findings.

You assume anyone who's unemployed yet owns electronic goods must have had them paid for by the state. It seems that you're only prepared to accept unemployed people in sackcloth and ashes, begging for bread on the streets. I have nothing but contempt for that view. People have paid taxes and NI for there to be a safety net, and the unfortunate are entitled to the miserable pittance that safety net provides, without being persecuted by indignant idiots.
35

,

23/11/2008 08:54:22
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Reason:
36

Lady in waiting,

Glenrothes 17/12/2008 22:21:22
VERY VERY DANGER FOR OUR COUNTRY AND IT POSSIBLE THAT UK PEOPLE BECOME VERY VERY POOR!!!!!!

 

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