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Churchill's 'black dog' would have kept him out of Number 10

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Published Date: 10 February 2009
WINSTON Churchill may never have made it to the top if he had lived in modern Britain, according to a report released today by former Number 10 spin doctor Alastair Campbell.
Mr Campbell, who was Tony Blair's director of communications, said the wartime leader would most likely have been stigmatised because of his depression – which he referred to as his "black dog".

In a report highlighting the issues around mental i
llness, Mr Campbell said other great public figures such as Florence Nightingale, Abraham Lincoln, Charles Darwin and Marie Curie had some form of mental problem and may never have achieved great things if they had been subjected to today's intense media glare and often unforgiving public scrutiny.

Mr Campbell, who was open about his depression during his time working for Mr Blair, had his first breakdown in 1986 when he was a journalist.

In the report, written on behalf of Time to Change, a campaign from leading mental health charities, he said: "In the 21st century mental health problems are a big taboo and many of those affected find themselves sidelined, kept out of the top jobs and treated as incapable.

"Today, more than 60 per cent of employers say they wouldn't consider employing someone with a history of mental illness. Perhaps they don't realise what talent they are missing out on.

"Had this discrimination applied to Churchill, Lincoln, and Nightingale we can safely say that today's world would be a very different place."

Mr Campbell said Britain could not have afforded to write off such an important leader as Churchill.

"But how many other potential great politicians with mental health problems have been sidelined and stunted because of social stigma, or stay out of the front line because of their fears of how their so-called weaknesses will be exposed and attacked?" he said. "Could the next Churchill be missed?"

The report, A World Without, was co-authored with historian Nigel Jones.

An accompanying poll found that 29 per cent of members of the public think someone with a mental health problem is unable to do a responsible job.

In addition, 60 per cent of employers said they would not feel able to employ somebody with a mental health problem, which affects around one in four people in Britain at some stage in their lives. The campaign is backed by £16 million from the Big Lottery Fund and £2 million from Comic Relief.

Mr Campbell will be fronting press adverts for the campaign alongside comedian Ruby Wax and broadcaster Stephen Fry.

Mr Campbell said: "As I watch politicians and other public figures deal with the pressures of modern leadership, not least dealing with harsh 24-hour scrutiny, I sometimes wonder how these great historic figures would have fared had they been alive today.

"Churchill with his depressions, drinking and long lie-ins; Darwin with his severe anxiety and mental torment.

"I am not convinced that a modern politician who admitted to mental health problems would be able to get to the top.

"I know from my own experience how important employers are in the process of recovery. When Tony Blair asked me to work for him in 1994, I told him about my breakdown and my drink problem.

"He said he wasn't worried. If a Prime Minister can have that attitude, then I think it is about time the six out of ten who say they wouldn't consider taking on someone with a history of mental illness join the four out of ten who say they would. It is time to change."

Sue Baker, Time to Change director, said: "We've got to realise that stigma, discrimination, and outdated attitudes wreck lives. But it doesn't have to be this way. This is the beginning of a social movement that can change things for the better."





Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 09 February 2009 11:41 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
 
1

,

10/02/2009 00:49:20
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
2

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 10/02/2009 01:26:56
David Blunkett is OK though every 14 years or so.
3

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 10/02/2009 01:37:48
Apart from that earlier aside, I wonder how much "mental illness" is attributed to people of mental magnitude which is exploited by people of lesser mental magnitude.

More, more, more. Causing mental exhaustion which is diagnosed as mental illness.

Treated as horses.

If you add in those who work on the emotional plane and use their mental magnitude in parallel then you begin to see the correlation between burnout and mental illness.
4

,

10/02/2009 01:40:26
Comment Removed By Administrator
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5

Dark Lochnagar,

Symington 10/02/2009 01:43:10
This is Campbell starting to spin for MugaBroon who is reportedly not at his best mentally. Mark my words.
6

Mercutio,

FALKIRK 10/02/2009 06:03:41
Chuchill's "black dog" did not overcome the "bulldog" and that is what made him great!
7

 sm753,

10/02/2009 07:38:14
#9

Two words for you:

David

Icke.

Bwa-ha-ha-HAH!
8

Stan Butler,

10/02/2009 07:38:31

One thing you can say for the cyber gnats.

They certainly lack class.

9

Astonished,

Inverclyde 10/02/2009 08:13:56
Two things you can say about the labour poster(s?) -

Some are paid

And they all tolerate corruption.


I agree with 6 Dark Lochnagar : I think labour are preparing the ground.



P.S.One thing you can say about "Alex the dalek" ;


He has a lot of monikers.
10

Gdgy,

10/02/2009 08:22:21
Mental health problems like depression may carry stigma but other facultative difficulties are obviously favoured in the SNP....e.g. inability to count, spontaneous outbursts of fantasy
11

Filosofo,

Kirkcaldy 10/02/2009 08:26:33
#4 - Sorry JT: I don't quite follow your argument:
"If you add in those who work on the emotional plane and use their mental magnitude in parallel then you begin to see the correlation between burnout and mental illness."
What do you mean?
12

TWC,

10/02/2009 08:35:59
If Churchill was PM Campbell would not have gotten in to number 10, that's for sure.
Mr Brown is about to be moved on by his New Labour creeps.
13

Stan Butler,

10/02/2009 08:49:23

There will be no mental health issues when Scotland is independunt.
14

TWC,

10/02/2009 09:03:41
16 Stan Butler, Why are you leaving?
15

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 10/02/2009 09:11:20
Actually, if Churchill had been around nowadays it may not have been his depression that restricted his political career but his use of the word "black" in describing it. This would have had the PC brigade up in arms.
16

Macuistean,

Isle of Tiree 10/02/2009 09:36:00
Does acohol play a part in depression? Does Campbell have a drink?
17

Stan Butler,

10/02/2009 09:38:32
#9 Central Scrutinizer

'Churchill was a Freemason'

Was he a life long member?

Or did he publicly resign from the masons?


18

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 10/02/2009 09:39:44
19

Yes, it's cyclical. Drink to get drunk, feel happy, go to bed. Wake up the next day hungover and down - have a drink, feel better etc etc.
19

57vintage,

NE 10/02/2009 09:48:38
This is no laughing matter.

The reference to the preponderence of lions being led by donkeys is accurate and is a recognised stressor.

I even felt sorry for Donald Findlay QC when he succumbed to the black dog, and I have no other affinities with the git whatsoever.

Poor Nick Drake perhaps summed it up best:

A black eyed dog he called at my door
The black eyed dog he called for more
A black eyed dog he knew my name
A black eyed dog he knew my name
A black eyed dog
A black eyed dog.

I'm growing old and I wanna go home
I'm growiing old and I don't wanna know
I'm growing old and I wanna go home.

A black eyed dog he called at my door
A black eyed dog he called for more.


A little compassion wouldn't go amiss on this subject.
20

JWW,

Whitburn,West Lothian, 55.86667 -3.68500 10/02/2009 09:57:03
Was it the black dog character in Churchill that caused the profound contempt for the working class and the calling for the armed forces to put down the 1926 General strike by any means necessary?
21

British flag,

10/02/2009 10:01:32
Campbell talks such a load of cr=p,churchill was the best PM we ever had! "black dog" and all.
22

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 10/02/2009 10:11:54
24

He was the right man for the job during the War. After the war, he was most definately the wrong man for the job and was ousted.

He served the country well during WWII, but was not able before or after that period.
23

John Cameron,

St Andrews 10/02/2009 10:16:51
This is a most extraordinary statement. Brown is probably the most mentally abnormal PM we have ever had. His behaviour resembles that of dear old Adolf in the Berlin Bunker in 1945: screaming obscenities at his subordinates, slamming doors, chewing the Axminster, throwing pieces if furniture around, directing imaginary armies, saving the world, etc etc. A PM suffering from from mild depression? We should be so lucky.
24

Stan Butler,

10/02/2009 10:47:15
#27 Central Scrutinizer,

Did Churchill leave the masons?

Yes or no?

Did he do so publicly?

Yes or no?


25

Stan Butler,

10/02/2009 10:49:26

#23 JWW

No it wasn't clinical depression that led to Churchill having those views?

Was there a point you were trying to make?

26

Stan Butler,

10/02/2009 10:52:31

#26 John Cameron,


The lack of balance in your post suggests you might have your own issues to deal with.
27

Lance Boyle,

Linlithgow 10/02/2009 11:02:56
Have you nationalists no shame? Ridiculing depression and depressives does you and the SNP no favours.
28

Raymond Thomas Brooke,

Leven England 10/02/2009 11:09:07
Alistair Campbell has been through out his life a man who lived o0ff this society and openly encouraged revolution/war aginst every thing we have achieved he lied and lied and lied and when people got fed up of his ranting he turned to Tony Blair and his cronies to be his mouthj piece he bears avery close resemblance to Hitler by getting other people to do his dirty work for him.the sad thing is that through the Labour Party people got to believe him.
He is an out and out evil man
29

,

10/02/2009 11:12:27
Comment Removed By Administrator
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30

 sm753,

10/02/2009 11:18:29
27

"Is mentioning David Icke supposed to be some form of derogatory put-down? "

Yes.

Your blog makes it absolutely clear that you, like him, believe that shapeshifting reptilian aliens control the world.

Carry on though, I find you amuysing.
31

TWC,

10/02/2009 11:30:10
Depression. A word that has a double meaning to Labour supporters - medical & Economical.
A visit to Holyrood to watch Elmer Fudd and miss Jolly(Margaret) would depress any Labour supporter. Did anyone hear Watson's wind-up on Friday it portrayed Caythy Jamieson saying "that Iain Gray, wi the one eyebrow, every time he speaks I think somebody has slipped me a Mogadon".
32

Mercian,

UK 10/02/2009 11:44:44
The stigma of mental health problems is sadly all too apparent in society, and used distastefully as weapons on this board. There is still very much a 'them' and 'us' attitudes, in my experience, even among mental health professionals.
33

Dark Lochnagar,

Symington 10/02/2009 11:45:35
#27 You go too far. Churchill had his flaws but he was one of the finest war leaders we have ever had. I would hold him in the same esteem as Wallace and Bruce.
34

Rodster,

Glasgow 10/02/2009 12:09:25
Churchill may have been suffering depression but he was still the right man for the right job at the right time .
.
Brown on the other hand is making the rest of us depressed.
and he ain't no Churchill, I preferred Vince Cables description more like Mr Bean .
Being mentally ill is his only excuse either that or he is the most incompetent chancellor and PM ever
35

The Master,

10/02/2009 12:09:49
In Scotland, we have a group of MSPs, whose whole belief system is based on a misplaced inferiority complex.

It is, of course, Natz politicians to whom I allude, but it apparently hasn't dented their popularity or led to widespread allegations that they are unfit for office (for now!)
36

TWC,

10/02/2009 12:19:23
41 The Master,
Get a grip and stop trying to drect it away from the Campbell Brown problems. This story is not about the nats, who certainly aren't suffereing from depression.
Brown is no Churchill and Campbell is not a politician and he was given far too much power for an adviser.
37

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/02/2009 12:21:21
25 Correct. He was pretty disastrous before WW2 (tanks in George Sq anyone? Gallipoli ?) and was rightly voted out after it ended, but was a good nominal leader during the War.

I doubt very much that the black dog would have held him back, after all the bevvy didn't, this is just Alistair Campbell kidding on he's nice and making excuses for Gordon.
38

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/02/2009 12:42:52
44 I'll, err, take that under advisement....
39

Tartan Viking,

10/02/2009 12:44:48
If they were ever to do a remake of 'One Flew Over the Cuckoos Nest' then Alastair Campbell would probably do a good Jack Nicholson.
40

Rodster,

Glasgow 10/02/2009 12:55:26
#44 talking of mental cases !!!
41

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 10/02/2009 13:08:55
Churchill would never get near 10 Downing Street today. The moral fascists of the Guardian, etc, would be looking for a non-smoking, non-drinking vegetarian.

(Erm.... didn't one of those lead Germany between 1933 and 1945?)
42

livilion,

livingston 10/02/2009 15:41:32
#44 Central Scrutinizer

Well spotted sunshine, not many before you have seen the 'London Establishment Zionists and the Bank of England' goosestepping through the annexation of Austria, on to the Sudetenland, Czechoslovakia then sending panzers and Stukas into Poland the Low Countries Greece, Yugoslavia, North Africa and the USSR as well as Manchuria, Indo-China and the Asian Pacific.

Those London Zionists, what were they like, eh?
43

livilion,

livingston 10/02/2009 15:58:29
#43 Observer

We await 2017 for the files to be released on Rudolph Hess's flight to Busby girls club(now the masonic lodge), where on the evening of May 10, 1941 he began his first night of Allied captivity, care of the local Home Guard unit.

Churchill was reported to have been decidedly underwhelmed at the news of the capture of the Fuhrer's second in command, and his extra-ordinary attempt to land at Dungavel House airfield near Strathaven.

Was he expected and why? Breath baited...
44

livilion,

livingston 10/02/2009 16:42:48
#26 Stan Butler
Churchill joined the freemasons to please his father and his friends as was the fashion in London Society of the day.

According to the Freemasons own on-line magazine MQ, Churchill did not actually leave the masons, but probably did not regularly attend lodge meetings on account of his well documented busy and demanding lifestyle.

He eventually resigned from his 'mother' lodge due to the pressing duties of his high political office in 1912.

Under the Freemasons' English Constitution I understand it is the custom for those who cannot regularly attend their lodge meetings to go on the 'country members' list, meaning that for a reduced annual subscription to the lodge they can attend whenever, but have no voice or vote at meetings.

If they do not wish to pay annual subs then they can resign from the lodge, although remaining freemasons, but with no rights to attend meetings without bringing their subs up to date.

Finally, if they do not pay their annual subs on time, without satisfactory explanation, then they can be expelled from the lodge and, in extreme cases, the order itself.

'...In November 1904 Winston Churchill accepted honorary membership in the Hawthorn Lodge of the British Order of Ancient Free Gardeners in Glasgow.

He is also recorded as a member of the Loyal Waterloo Lodge of the National Independent Order of Odd Fellows in Manchester in April of 1907, and of the Albion Lodge, Oxford of the Ancient Order of Druids in September 1908, (his father was also a member of the Woodstock Lodge of Independent Order of Foresters).

Churchill's association with Freemasonry must be placed within this context of his membership, and almost certain equal inactivity, in all these various organisations... '

http://www.mqmagazine.co.uk/issue-3/p-10.php
45

Alternative (High Octane) Fuel Head,

Germany - 1935 10/02/2009 16:56:35
At least Churchill believed in free speech, free thought, freedom of choice, freedom of action and the need for the individual to take responsibility for their own actions---and he trusted them to do so.

Additionally, he didn't feel the need to lie his way out of trouble, neither did he feel the need to take the UK to war on the basis of lies.

No matter what Churchill's shortcomings, he was an outstanding politician. All that stupid labour have done is to embrace the very tyranny that Churchill fought against. How dare Campbell allude to him. He is not even worthy to breathe the same air that Churchill did.
46

Stan Butler,

10/02/2009 17:02:24
#48 livilion


The masons overplayed their hand in boasting of the Churchill connection (curiously they are more reticent about members like Alistair Crowley and Kenneth Noye).

Their exaggeration of Churchill's involvement has led to some heated correspondence from the Churchill Society from which I quote:

'You may not know, but for a short period very early in his career, Churchill became a Freemason, but publicly resigned. He proved his independence of character by publishing his letter of resignation whatever the consequences to his future might be - something quite unheard of before or since'

http://www.churchill-society-london.org.uk/lttrs.fmasons.hall.html


47

livilion,

livingston 10/02/2009 17:03:43
#45 Cynicus in Exile

No, President Abraham Lincoln was never a freemason.

http://www.freemasonry.bcy.ca/biography/wannabe/lincoln_a.html
48

Calvinist,

10/02/2009 17:08:44
Attitudes towards mental health and what constitutes ‘normal’ behaviour in this country are bizarre. Every week we are invited to watch a display of immaturity, rage and bad manners which is called First Minister’s Questions and this is considered quite acceptable, whereas a depressive or schizophrenic would presumably be barred from any office in this country on the grounds that they are somehow defective.
49

lulach mac gille coemgain,

10/02/2009 17:14:14
This kind of reporting drives me Nuts!
50

,

10/02/2009 17:17:27
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
51

livilion,

livingston 10/02/2009 18:13:49
#50 Stan Butler,

You and the Churchill Society have a basic misconception of masonic membership.

Once initiated into 'the Craft' they remain a freemason for life, unless they transgress its rules to such an extent as to be expelled from the order.

Resigning 'in good standing' from an English lodge avoids the obligation to pay annual dues, it does not infer resignation from freemasonry itself.

A freemason must be in good standing in all the lodges or constitutions of which they are a member to take part in any masonic meeting.

Churchill may well have fallen out with his Grand Master for denying his request to have a lodge named after one of his aquainances, but he would have remained a fremason, albeit inactive, until they screwed the lid down on his coffin.

All freemasons are de facto lifetime freemasons unless expelled by their governing grand body.
52

livilion,

livingston 10/02/2009 18:27:50
#50 Stan Butler
I quote from your link:

"...Your letter to the HRH the Duke of Kent complains that we have published erroneous information on our web site concerning Winston Churchill's career as a Freemason.

That is incorrect, as is also your claim that Churchill was a Mason only "for a short period early in his career".

The fact is that he was a Mason for very many years although he rarely attended meetings. A more careful reading of what we actually published on our web site would have shown you that we did not claim that he was a "life-time Freemason" either, as you incredulously assert.

We simply quoted the term of his very long life, 1874 - 1965, as indeed we did for every other person mentioned there. I enclose a copy of the relevant page so that you can check this.

I also enclose a copy of the third issue of our magazine MQ which contains a full and accurate account of Churchill's involvement in Freemasonry, from which you will also note that we also say that it did not seem to have had much influence upon him.
There is no evidence to support your other statement that he "proved his independence of character by publishing his letter of resignation whatever the consequences to his future might be - something quite unheard of before or since", and I am afraid that this is just nonsensical..."

enough said?
53

,

10/02/2009 19:53:40
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
54

Stan Butler,

10/02/2009 20:17:22
#55 livilion

'You and the Churchill Society have a basic misconception of masonic membership.'


On the other hand we do know the meaning of the word infer which, evidently, you don't.

55

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/02/2009 20:51:43
Central Scrutunizer been red penned again? Dunno why they bother. Wonder what he'll call himself next time. It takes all sorts etc I'm not in favour of this deletion policy.
56

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/02/2009 20:52:59
ah ha is that you at 57 - don't worry I won't tell.....
57

Billiam Wallace,

12/02/2009 02:48:03
All very interesting but of far more interest is any news of an inquiry into the loss of the register of votes in Glenrothes. That story seems to have sunk without trace. Sorry in advance, but I will be posting this a lot.

 

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