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'Trump said jump, Salmond said how high?' - golf row deepens

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Published Date: 25 April 2008
ALEX Salmond was yesterday accused of compromising Scotland's planning system with his handling of Donald Trump's application to build a £1 billion golf resort.
MSPs yesterday debated the findings of an investigation by Holyrood's local government committee, which last month found the First Minister showed "exceptionally poor judgment" with his actions over the controversial planning application by the American tycoon.

During yesterday's debate, Duncan McNeil, the committee's Labour convener, criticised Mr Salmond for meeting Trump representatives after the application was rejected by Aberdeenshire Council.

And he raised concerns over Mr Salmond arranging a meeting by phone with Jim Mackinnon, Scotland's chief planner, while with the Trump representatives.

Mr McNeil also attacked the Scottish Government for "calling in" the application when Trump refused to appeal, adding: "Cynics might say, 'Trump said jump, the First Minister said, how high?'."

He said the intervention on the application for the Menie estate in Aberdeenshire was not a solitary incident, citing ministers' alleged interference in a multi-million-pound hotel application in Aviemore.

He concluded: "Yes, they have succeeded in keeping the (Menie] development alive, but at some cost – the planning process has been compromised and the Trump development is facing further delay and a possible court challenge."

The SNP was quick to dismiss the debate and inquiry, with back-bench MSP Alex Neil calling it a "witch-hunt".

Stewart Stevenson, the planning minister, pointed out that the committee had agreed ministers broke neither the ministerial code nor the law.

He added: "Ministers and officials have at all times acted properly, objectively and in full accordance with planning legislation, the Scottish ministerial code and all other requirements."

Kenny Gibson, an SNP MSP who was denied the chance of summing up in yesterday's debate, even though he is vice-convener of the committee, added: "I realise opposition politicians are excited at the prospect of raising the hazy perception of Scottish Government wrong-doing, even if no evidence is available to support it. It would have been better to await the Scottish Government response before forging ahead."

SNP MSPs yesterday decided to abstain on the motion to note the report's conclusions.

But opposition MSPs were unrepentant about "holding ministers to account". David McLetchie, the Tories' local-government spokesman, claimed the meeting with Trump representatives only took place because Alex Salmond was First Minister.

He said had Nora Radcliffe, the former Liberal Democrat MSP for Gordon, held her seat, it would have been very different, and asked: "Does anyone in this chamber believe that the Trump Organisation would have been rushing to meet Nora Radcliffe?"

He added: "We were asked to believe a decision (on calling the application in] had to be made within such a short timescale because there was a serious risk that this option would be closed off. In other words, it was a race against time. What nonsense."

Robert Brown, a Lib Dem MSP who sat as an extra member on the inquiry, said: "The overall picture of the current Scottish Government is one of breathtaking arrogance combined with staggering ineptitude which could and did imperil this application.

"Not for them the proper balance between competing interests required by the due process of the planning system and by the ministerial code."

COUNCIL TO BACK TYCOON
ABERDEENSHIRE council yesterday rejected a call to stand firm on the original decision of its infrastructure services committee to throw out the £1 billion golf development proposal by Donald Trump, the American tycoon.

Martin Ford, the Liberal Democrat councillor who was sacked as convener of the council's planning committee for using his casting vote to reject the application, claimed that the authority's decision to later support the scheme had undermined the democratic planning process.

However, he failed to secure support from the council to stand firm on the original decision of the infrastructure services committee to reject the application as a meeting of the full council overwhelmingly voted in favour of the Menie estate development for a second time.

The council voted 56 to five to support the Trump application when the controversial application comes before the public inquiry in June.


The full article contains 694 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 25 April 2008 5:10 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Donald Trump
 
1

Stepford Nat,

25/04/2008 00:08:23
Alex can do no wrong! It's as simple as that.
2

doublescotch,

U.S.A. 25/04/2008 00:12:23
#2...Yikes!
3

Jimmy the Pie,

25/04/2008 00:17:32
10 out of 10 for effort Red Wendy, but will it ever dawn on you that you have been out-thought, out-manouvered and out-classed by our Government. Move on.

When are we getting to see the e-mails, Red Wendy???????
4

McGinty,

25/04/2008 00:17:48
Oink oink.
5

Senga Jean,

25/04/2008 00:21:00
Wendy is daydreaming. Her own "government" or (silly word) EXECUTIVE used helicopters all over the land to suck up to Donald Trump. I am not saying they were wrong since Scotland appears desperate for inward investment, I am just saying it is strange that she is criticising Alex Salmond (praise be his name) for wot they done themselves.
6

Senga Jean,

25/04/2008 00:23:02
Irony? I'll gie ye IRONY!
7

,

25/04/2008 00:45:20
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8

,

25/04/2008 00:46:35
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9

brian mcc,

the arctic 25/04/2008 01:12:11
Salmond may take up golf or exercise his unwritten option for a retirement bungalow on the 9th fairway. The trumpster will even provide free lessons.
10

,

25/04/2008 01:28:27
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11

Beth Boyle,

NY 25/04/2008 01:29:47
Salmond is a sucker for ignorant American loud mouths.
12

Phil C,

25/04/2008 01:33:39
#7 Senga

Infamy, infamy!! They've all got it infamy!...

At least the Hootsman has it in for Alex on this one. Labour's dirty mouthpiece is all they are with this issue. It's still a non-story of government trying to encourage and mediate a very big investment in the north east, which Labour themselves were rightly keen to encourage. There's no personal gain anywhere, except maybe the people in that area and Trump if it all works. The question of whether the golf and housing project is right or wrong is another matter, which clearly should be taken right out of the hands of the incompetent local Liberal and Labour councillors who, it would seem, couldn't organise a Sunday school picnic. Labour and Liberal MSPs are not doing much better and are just causing more damage by delaying the necessary decisions.

Labour have come out of all this looking like silly hypocrites and Scotland is the poorer for their daft and childish squabbling. Only the most blinkered of Wendy's clapping seals can approve of their behaviour.

Fortunately for us all, Alex Salmond is maintaining his dignity despite these misplaced attacks.
13

Beth Boyle,

NY 25/04/2008 01:39:13
Hee hee, Salmond never had any dignity to start with courting the likes of Trent Lott and Donald Trump. He is shameless! Salmond is a banker and can't trust them folks.
14

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 01:42:30
Its Simple is it not,?

I have the Power! I will sell my Country for Money!

As the Dollars and Pound notes pass the eyes!

Greed is an unfortunate fact of human nature, is it not,?

Any,..'Bids' for Edinburgh Castle,?

Or better still the Scottish Parliament Buildings,?

I am sure the 'Arabs' would be up for that one! :-))
15

Vivas,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 02:06:33
How Jack of clubs came up trumps for Donald - Scotsman.com News (14 May 2006)

"...based on a dossier of government e-mails, minutes and correspondence between officials and Trump's advisers, obtained by Scotland on Sunday, which reveals the full extent of how the office of the First Minister was put at the disposal of one of America's richest and most controversial men.
...
Under Freedom of Information legislation, Scotland on Sunday has obtained documents from Scottish Enterprise (SE) revealing the government's close working relationship with Trump.
...
The billionaire's golf company was lavished with attention. Two memos released by SE show that - at a cost of £4,800 to the public purse - the agency paid for two helicopter tours of Scotland, taking in the golf course site, as they showed off the country to their deep-pocketed American friends.
...
A further e-mail shows they offered to meet the £40,000-£50,000 cost of a feasibility study into the Menie Links site. Trump's people were impressed, "raving" in August last year about the way enterprise agency officials were courting them. All was set fair for a deal.
...
On September 23 last year, Lorna Jack, American director of Scottish Development International (SDI), an arm of SE, met Trump to discuss what had been termed Project X. "Mr Trump expressed an interest in meeting with the First Minister...to discuss how this project could be brought forward," she wrote in an e-mail back to Scotland. "Could you please ask the minister's team if they would view this as a favourable meeting."
...
SE's courting of Trump was one thing, but for McConnell to get involved personally was another matter.
...
The meeting with Trump was arranged nonetheless. SDI informed Trump that McConnell was "very excited" about his vision for this project."

And so perhaps the headline for THAT story should have been "Trump said deeper, Jack said how much more ?"
16

,

25/04/2008 02:09:11
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17

Vivas,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 02:10:42
http://www.scotland.gov.uk/News/Releases/2006/05/02081820

Trump declared Globalscot, 30/04/2006

"Donald Trump today accepted a personal invitation from First Minister Jack McConnell to become a Globalscot.

Mr McConnell said:

"Donald has shown me a real passion for Scotland. He is a globally recognised figure who can help us to promote Scotland. I am delighted that he has taken up my offer. This is a good bit of business for all concerned."

Mr Trump said:

"As an international businessman I've enjoyed success over the years and I like to think that part of my achievement can be attributed to my Scottish roots.

"Being immensely proud of my Scottish background and recognising that this is a country with world class strengths and opportunity, I recently announced my new $500m golf and leisure development in Aberdeenshire.

"I am also very pleased to have been asked to join the Globalscot network. For a long time I've been aware that Scottish people are fiercely proud of Scotland and that they like to help their fellow countrymen."

The Globalscot network aims to harness the talents, expertise and commitment of the many Scots and friends of Scotland who are active in international business around the world.

The network consists of overseas-based Scots and friends of Scotland or Scots in the UK who operate internationally and have been invited to become globalscots because of their valuable experience and willingness to help Scotland. Members are spread across the globe with representation in all key markets in the US, Europe, Middle East and Asia Pacific."
18

Matt there,

somewhere 25/04/2008 02:14:56
So, it is right and proper for Labour to speak with Mr Trump, but wrong and improper for the SNP to speak to Mr Trump?

Just so long as we know how the "mind" of Wendy Alexander "works"...
19

,

25/04/2008 02:20:37
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20

,

25/04/2008 02:22:36
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21

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 25/04/2008 02:31:13
And meanwhile in the real world Aberdeenshire Council has voted 56 to 5 (Martin Ford one of the five. surprise, surprise) to support the Trump application at the forthcoming public enquiry.
Now there's 56 councillors delivering what their electorate request. As for my own Councillor Ford. Ah well only three more years to go before we wave him farewell on his bike.
22

Jimmy the Pie,

25/04/2008 02:31:58
#11 Truthsleuth

"There is no doubt where funding for the SNP comes from."

Are you saying Trump is funding the SNP? Are you doubting the words of all the investigations(done by all parties MSP's). Do you have any new info?? No I didn't think so. You wouldn't know the truth if it jumped up and bit you on the AS with an R and an E.

You are a buffoon and an idiot

23

Vivas,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 02:33:59
Jack and Donald "were just good friends".

Jack "Donald...I've awarded you the title of Globalscot. What with the golf course and everything and us getting on so well..."

Donald "Eh gee, thanks Jake, sounds great (I guess)...anyway pardner, about that golf course..."

Jack "I love it Donald, just love it to bits. It's going to be soooooooo good ! This is what you guys call a win-win situation. And to be honest the timing couldn't be better, got elections coming up soon here in the worlds best wee country and well ... y'know..."

Donald "I know Jock, I know. The Scotch people are gonna love you for this."
24

Just an opinion,

USA 25/04/2008 03:37:16
Said it before, and I will say it again. Our Ancestors sold us out to the English noblemen for a purse full of silver.
Our ancestory lives on in Salmond who is selling his soul to an American.
The guy is a sophisticated prostitute, maybe he is not selling his body in the physical sense, but.......
25

Guga II,

Rockall 25/04/2008 03:56:48
Marvellous, isn't it? One greenie with the casting vote on a council committee tries to scupper a multi-million pound investment in Scotland. The full council ends up giving him the boot (rightly so) because of his blatant greenie bias.

The Scottish Government calls the proposal in for further examination, and the New Labour Sleaze and Corruption Party (North British Branch) tries to vilify and slander the First Minister for doing so.

They are, of course, more interested in attacking the SNP for having the temerity to win the Scottish elections, than they are for any possible investement or development in Scotland.

The Hootsmon, with its usual bias against the SNP and for the New Labour Sleaze and Corruption Party, weighs in with a biased article with a deliberately pejorative headline, namely: "'Trump said jump, Salmond said how high?' - golf row deepens".

It seems to me that those people, organisations, newspapers and political parties that are hell bent on deprecating out First Minister have no real concern for Scotland, only for attempting to score cheap political points. What makes it even worse is that these people are primarily supporters of a defunct Union that has the sole aim of keeping Scotland as a subservient colony and as a milk cow for this so-called Union.
26

2Right,

On Location 25/04/2008 04:47:24
The FM should be allowed to intervene where he sees fit.
It would be a far better country if all our MSPs stood up to unjust decisions
27

A Better Way,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 05:20:01
Wee Jockee was asked to jump by Trump. His response was that Donald didnt have to exert himself jumping, he would pay for a helicopter instead.

Get real unionists, Do you really think that you lot have the slightest chance of being seen as anything else but cheap little people who have sold out to their London Masters.

Our Prime Minister and Scottish SNP Government are the real deal. Read the comments in the English media by normal English People. They want an English version of Alex Salmond. They are absolutely desperate for England to be run by an English Government who put the English People above all else. Instead they have Gordon Brown and his plague of Greedy little people, who rob the people blind.

There is a very large amount of People all over Europe who want their Countries Independance from authoritanian states like the London example. Get with the programme, revolution is in the air, and the mistakes of the past are being reversed on a yearly basis. Just as the former people of the imperial Soviet, imperial US and imperial former UK empire have sought their freedom to exercise their fundamental right to determine their own future.
28

Ban MacTire,

Weegiestan 25/04/2008 05:21:49
the impression I get from the article is that Trump exercised undue influence on the FM to get this deal done. Trump has repeatedly stated this was not so. If that is indeed the case then heaven help the Liebour & Limp Dem MSP's making acussations against The Donald - as they'll find his pockets are deeper then theirs when it comes to their libel trail - probably held in New York, as any parliamentry privilege would not apply in US courts as Trump is a US citizen
29

Alan Reid,

NZ 25/04/2008 06:01:07
More sh!te from the Unionists morons.
This story really is nothing, and shows how pathetic Labour and the Hootsman are. All they can do is to try and smeer Salmond and the SNP.
Well you failed again so change the record.
30

Strickland,

Dundee 25/04/2008 06:05:35
Another non-story. Gaun yersel Alex.
31

NemarketNDPer,

Taipei 25/04/2008 06:25:57
A real statesman would be able to sell Donald on creating a subsistent eco-paradise that would both protect the environment and attract global tourism.
32

brownlie,

25/04/2008 06:35:07
33 Nemarket

Yes, indeed, it could be based on the eco-paradise which us unionists created in Iraq with our US friends.
33

yockel,

25/04/2008 06:39:51
I see there is no need for me to bother saying what rubbish this is.
34

W U Merchant,

Aberdeen 25/04/2008 07:08:01
Come on Alex - you intervened quickly on behalf of Donald - now you must intervene in the Grangemouth crisis. Get involved for goodness sake. Scotland needs leadership, not obfuscation or pontification (but I must admit that you are pretty good at both).
35

McX,

25/04/2008 07:13:35
I say, I say, I say, what do you call an English owned, English edited, English staffed newspaper with a distinctly anti-Scottish government bias?


The Scotsman.


Tim Bowdler really is laughing all the way to the bank...

Heh heh heh I wonder which £17k a year graduate web based journalist will edit this name away lest his £1m a year boss gets miffed that his name gets mentioned on one of his own forums...
36

Roy,

25/04/2008 07:14:09
Pathetic headline, Unscotsman.

37

1745,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 07:17:07
Scotsman go back to your roots

Sir Edmund Findlay would have sacked the whole of the "subs" for such reporting !
38

steve 1511,

aberdeen 25/04/2008 07:17:27
mcneil and labour are pathetic
39

11+failed,

the pans 25/04/2008 07:22:31
Simple , poseur Martin Ford makes Scotland a laughing stock and Salmond tries to salvage something from the wreckage.
40

Norman C.,

MacLondon 25/04/2008 07:23:59
Appalling that Alex 'Smoked' Salmond should be pilloried, a man who has singlehandedly dragged Scotland up by its keelty strings into the 19th century, transforming it from a bedraggled loser into one of the powerhouses of the known world, feared and loved equally by its rivals, tea-cosy India and bone China, courted by every country where curling is the national sport, and befriended by all from ....... here ........ to ........... there.

Shame on you traducers and denigraters.

Salmond and cream cheese beigel for ever say I. And let every true Scot dree his weird.

Trump is a true benefactor, a Scottish hero, like wee Georgie Wood, who has nought but Scottish welfare coursing through his marrow, an unselfish, modest and unassuming philanthropist, all but a saint. Remember, a dram afore ye gae, many a mickle makes a muckle, many a pickle makes a mickle, many a snickle cakes a wuckle, and too many dickles flake a duckle.

Thankee.

41

Anne, Glasgow,

25/04/2008 07:25:42
Very biased headline. Shame on The Scotsman, so much for objective writing
42

Anne Robinson,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 07:28:54
Stewart Stevenson - Planning Minister??

Stewart was culled from his senior management position in BoS IT, primarily for a failure to plan and manage.

It's just too hard to take the government seriously with people like this in high places.
43

Norman C.,

25/04/2008 07:36:12
Norman C's remarks were spot on.
44

Phil C,

25/04/2008 07:38:08
#36 B U Merchant

From the Scotsman- "Isn't anyone trying to stop all this? (Grangemouth crisis)
Yes. Mr Salmond, John Swinney, the finance secretary, and the UK government have spent the past few days trying to get management and unions to take part in talks to resolve their disagreements. The Scottish Government also arranged for independent pensions expert Stewart Ritchie, president of the Faculty of Actuaries, to carry out a study to clarify the issues in dispute in relation to the Ineos pension fund."

Now shut up with your nonsense already!
45

,

25/04/2008 07:38:50
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46

gus1940,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 07:41:41
Here we go again with more use of single quote marks to give the impression that opinion is fact.

What a disgusting standard of journalism.
47

john z,

edinburgh 25/04/2008 07:44:06
For heavens sake, can't labour just do something positive for Scotland. What you think of trump is irrelevant. What matters is he is willing to dump large wadges of hard cash in northern Scotland. The chance is NOT likely to come again.

Or is it the case hat Scotland is still just a 'silly wee laddie', and wants to take the usual parochial approach of 'let's do nothing'.

Alex salmond did what he did in order to secure this huge investment into northern scotland, but clearly London labour don't want that.

Are you aware how stupid this makes Scotland look from an american perspective. Time for some scottish labour MSPs to grow up.
48

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 07:45:36
Listen Hootsman,

The only *uckers that need to jump high are the Labour Party.

IN THE POLLS,
IN THE STREETS, they need a springboard
49

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 07:48:15
THE INDEPENDENT SCOTTISH LABOUR PARTY

'It's coming yet fer a' that'
50

Suomi,

Salo,Finland 25/04/2008 07:51:41
I watched the committe inquiry and the travesty of the general paliamentary debate on Hollyrood TV.It was clear early on that Alec Salmone,had not attempted to influence the planning processs and if guilty of anything,it is that he cares about his constituents and Scotland.It was evident (as testerday confirmed that Labour and the Liberals deliberately set out to find something that could be used to discredit Salmond.In Labours case the aim was probably to distract the public from Wendy Alexander's illegal donations.For the Liberals,I suspect that the aim was to distract from Nicol Stephens foolish and unsubstanuated allegation of sleeze,and the fury that his statements caused in the north east of Scotland.Their bias was evident by seconding a lawyer MSP onto that committee.Mike Russell was spot on yesterday when he pointed out that the flimsy report confused opinion as fact and that many conclusions were in fact innuendo.He also pointed out that Jackie Baillie ,MSP had yesterday met the planning officer about a planning issue in Dumbarton.

I have no doubt that lessons can be learned about this.For example:
1) Future inquires should be conducted by a neutral body and removed froim political bias.
2) Clear criteria needs to be set that delineates the circumstances under which ministers and MSP's can talk with private investors,or respond to MSP's concerns about the planning process.
3)Training should be provided for MSP's in communication and committee work since some are clearly not up tro the job.

I hope that we can now move on with serious issues,such as child poverty,removing unfair tax systems,developing renewable energy etc
51

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 07:51:42
The groaning baulking hulk of New Labour,

a political experiment in,

'hoodwinking of the electorate'
52

brownlie,

25/04/2008 07:53:58
42 Norman

Your extremely witty - I can hardly type for laughing - posting is an absolute gem and furthers our unionist cause no end. Any one with half a brain - what did they do with the other part of yours - knows that the Scottish government should not encourage any businesses - especially business men with an inappropriate hair-cut - to invest in this country and create employment.

Good idea to praise your own contribution but next time it would be better to remember to use your other monicker to do so.
53

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 07:54:55
What will the Spaghetti Houses of Islington do,

with their customers all at sea???
54

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 07:56:46
Salmond has disgraced himself, the SNP and Scotland. (Again.)
55

McX,

25/04/2008 07:57:25
Shouldn't the headline be, 'Local MSP does job and protects local investment'?
56

roughrider,

Glasgow 25/04/2008 07:59:25
Utter rubbish non story.
When is this pathetic rag going to employ journalists who report the news and not labour lies and drivel?
57

,

25/04/2008 08:00:44
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58

Conan the Librarian™,

25/04/2008 08:00:53
37
McX
"The Johnston purchase, which took The Scotsman back into Scottish ownership for the first time in 60 years, was widely welcomed in Scotland. "I think there was a view that the new owners, Johnston Press, would be more sensitive and sympathetic to the needs of the community in which The Scotsman publishes," says Bowdler."
The Independant 21 Aug 2006

HAHAHAHA

59

JayJay,

Right here 25/04/2008 08:03:05
So, to sum up:-
1. Everyone in Holyrood (bar the Greens) wants the project, supported it in the past.
2. The former Lab/Lib Executive bent over backwards to bring Trump to Scotland and "show him a good time".
3. One guy with a bike in the Council in Aberdeen created a stushie, got binned, the Council and the locals want the development.
4. Wendy Alexander now thinks Alex Salmond is corrupt and craven to Trump.
5. Wendy Alexander represents a party that kow-tows to Bernie Eccleston over fag advertising and receives a £1m donation, has taken donations from multi millionaires posing as their cleaners has ministers having to resign after taking large loans from multi millionaires to buy a big hoose...etc
6. Wendy herself gets into an awful pickle with donations she can't explain, some of which came from tax exiled property developers, some from prominent business types (who "enjoy" job after job on quango after quango), some from people who actually are supposed to police politicians activities.
7. Wendy was hardly cleared and vilified over the dodgy donations affair.
Who is encouraging this woman to go on the attack over a non issue when she herself had to go into hiding for 4-weeks (sorry campaign hard in a consituency she doesn't even live in) when her activities were exposed? Is this what Simon Pia calls rebuilding your reputation?
60

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 08:04:20
brownlie...

Tell me are you on the By-pass with Nicol??

or maybe just the slow boat to China with Brown?

if neither, I hope my good fellow,

your not one of the cyber spooks marshaled by the new Chairman of the Scottish Conservative Party ??

Please forgive me,I forgot 'and Unionist' although nowadays loosely termed.
61

McX,

25/04/2008 08:06:28
# 61 morning Conan, your post won't last. Any mention of Tim Bowdler or Freddie Johnston gets wheeched off as soon as the be-ponytailed £17k a year web based journalist spots it.
62

Conan the Librarian™,

25/04/2008 08:12:03
64
Morning McX
So free speech gets Bowdlerised?
63

brownlie,

25/04/2008 08:18:17
63 glasbennmhor

Yes, my friend, you are quite correct. I am one of these unionists that has never criticised Wendy's inappropriate illegal donations, Jackie's intemperate use of language, Blair's dodgy dossier, the murder of innocent Iraqis, the possession of deadly weapons, the dumping of nuclear waste in Scotland and any negativity surrounding the unionists.

Can I direct you to a little fall-out I had with my esteemed unionist colleague Highland Mighty on this forum two days ago? Could I also ask you to carefully, please, read my posting again?

64

A Crofter,

Western Isles 25/04/2008 08:19:21
So what about the SSSI then? The Lewis windfarm has just been kicked out because of EU law; the same legislation presumably applies to Menie.

The protection of Scotland's natural heritage (on which our tourism and own wellbeing depends) is not negotiable by any dumb Stonyrooder. And all the main parties have consistently sucked up to this revolting Loadsamoney.

These emvironmental laws are nothing new. Why have both the SNP and previous Labour/LibDem admistrations wasted years deliberating these applications? Does the Scottish Government not have any legal experts who could explain this to our representatives?

BTW, is it just me, or is there an uncanny resemblance between our increasingly fat and smug first monster and the Churchill Insurance dog? OH YES!!!
65

Phil C,

25/04/2008 08:24:15
#67 It's just you!
66

JimC,

Kilmarnock 25/04/2008 08:24:46
The same story again and again, guys its getting boring now. No wrong doing, no laws broken let it go. Or are you trying to pi$$ off trump who in turn goes elsewhere and then I predict you lot would jump in saying the SNP lost the contract it was their fault? truthsleuth SNP funding?? Keep taking the meds.
67

David MacVicar,

web 25/04/2008 08:28:41
This is getting beyond a joke its like a Scottish version of the Spanish inquisition!

Where the HELL is the inquiry into Labour ministers dealings behind closed doors with EDF in what was supposed to be a public consultation over UK Nuclear power and multi Billion pound contracts and twisted UK energy policty effecting Millions of UK citizens.

Blows the whole trump squall out of the water!

A consultation that was already taken to court once by green peace and others that the UK Government lost!

Where EDF now has prime position over the contracts.

Where Gordon browns brother is employed by EDF.

etc etc.

Papers like the Scotsman are a total disgrace pushing innuendo in a Scottish context and saying Sweet Funk All about their precious unionist masters are corrupt to the very core!

The elements in 'Scottish' media that are but lick spittle amateur hacks jostling for crumbs from the unionist table are a malaise on professional journalism.
68

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 08:36:53
brownlie.....

Please forgive me Sir,

these forms are derided at times, but they are far more entertaining than the paper,don't you think?
69

Auckland Arab2,

25/04/2008 08:42:09
The FM has the right and duty to intervene in anything he sees fit for the good of the country. I can't believe all this fake indignation for local planning, which everyone knows is an ass. This is a chattering classes issue and most ordinary folk in Scotland can see through this and will see a £1bn investment being thrown away.
70

brownlie,

Scalpay, Harris 25/04/2008 08:43:51
67 A crofter

You're quite right - all politicians should look slim and lissom.

71 glassbenmhor

Yes, I think they are but you were a bit previous calling me Sir as I have not yet made my £999 donation!!
71

beeree,

Local 25/04/2008 08:47:25
You need sunshine to grow bananas. Roll on the banana republic. Perhaps we'll get some good weather then.

However Soutar, Trump, First Group. Notice a theme.
72

PJ Walker,

East Lothian 25/04/2008 08:52:00
The Trumpster is either brave or foolish. Has no one told him we're in the middle of a massive credit crisis. Loch Lomond and Arcerfield are reportedly having some difficult times financially and the new Renaissance club is still 550 menbers short of its target.
Does Scotland reallly need another luxury golf and leisure club right now? The dollar is weak and the London IB boys have stopped jetting up for tartan-edged fun weekends.
Salmond is getting what he wants from all this, his name in lights for whatever reasons
73

brownlie,

25/04/2008 08:52:05
74 beeree

Great post - us unionists thrive on unsubstantiated allegations, which should be repeated ad nauseam, as opposed to proven allegations against our dear Wendy.
74

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 08:53:28
57.Alfred - well said (and welcome back after that wee breakdown the other day -most unfortunate)

You are spot on - Salmond has disgraced something. And you can rest assured that as soon as we Unionists think of a specific allegation of any wrong doing, part of ministerial code broken or part of planning process contravened we will post what we think it is!

Some of you will no doubt be thinking that codes of conduct are not our Unionists strong suit against Salmond given we can't think of any he broke, and what with 120 breaches of law and three investigations by the Standards Commissioner in Scotland ans several criminal investigations in England still pending over illegal donations all against us, but you fail to understand our transference strategy! Some of you may well even be thinking that this is a report on a debate about a committee investigation which found no wrong-doing!

Clearly by putting the Trump thing to a full independent public enquiry the SNP are tampering with the application, I just can't think how or why - but when I do, I will pounce on it with the speed and coiled, tensed inebriation of Lord Foulkes leaping from the gutter at an unsupsecting policeman!

75

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 08:55:05
74. Good effort, but a word of advice - as a judge last year described Labour election fraud as being "disgraceful even for a banana republic" we prefer not to use the "banana" reference at present. Please use some other unspecified smear reference and mud-sling away!
76

Norman C.,

MacLondon 25/04/2008 08:56:58
Dear 55 Brownlie, ta.

I once had a lecturer called Ian Brownie, but he must be 103.

Assume ye knot that the same name and location betoken the same personage. Nae nae neigh. It's like asseverating that because a Scots Gnat politician calls himself Alex Salmond he must be First Minister.

I'm suing for imitation, disinformation and malapropism in corpus delicto.

Fair ye weel.
77

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 08:58:22
Gosh! The First Minister tries to bring jobs and prosperity to Scotland! Isn't that terrible!
78

Sedov,

Scotland 25/04/2008 09:03:40
The SNP are the party of big capital and finance. Wendy Alexander, speaking at the STUC conference, was correct in describing them as such. Nought wrong with that I suppose but lets drop the pretence you NATS -you are supporting a right of centre party which will move even further to the right in the coming few years. Socialism in the SNP? - forget it!.
79

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 09:07:26
81. Well said, we will work that together with our "The SNP are ultra leftist and intent on taxing the rich with their LIT so that company dorectors will leave Scotland" riff. We need to maximise confusion by calling them left wing one day and right wing the next!
80

Professor22,

lochgelly 25/04/2008 09:11:40
Well, the nation is doing its self proud with this one, eh?

If I was Donald, I walk, no ....run away. If this is whats its like before he has started whats it going to be when it gets the green light.?

Id go to somewhere were the suns shines more than 5 days a year anyway...

Gun.....Foot.....loud bang!
81

Phil C,

25/04/2008 09:16:20
#81 Sodoff

The SNP is a broad social democrat party. It is a mix of different ideals working towards a common goal of uniting Scotland and it's people, in their own nation. Silly little labels like you try to attach are superfluous and shallow.

What happens after independence is anyone's guess just now and quite frankly, it is irrelevant. Unfortunately, as things stand, the 'socialists' might take over again. Plenty time to change that though and Labour and their buddies at the Hootsmon are doing their best to alienate support by puffing-up non-stories like this one.
82

Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 09:19:45
Is not this current scottish wing of London controlled Labour just about the most pathetic bunch of chancers
to ever soil the political stage? They and they alone
are the only morons howling at Salmond's saving of this project. Only they complain of the many many jobs this will create and the huge inward investment.

They would rather Scotland stagnated and remained so, in order to remain under the Westminster Yoke. If the Scottish people are sick to the back teeth of them you can see why. Nasty , spitefull tactics and all to cover up their own complete lack of forward thinking policies . What are their alternatives to replace this huge investment? Emmm... Nothing, zilch, just shut up and be grateful for having London to look after us because remember everyone :

WE CANNAE DAE IT ON OUR OWN

WE CANNAE DAE IT ON OUR OWN.

And all because they failed so spectacularly in their own woo-ing of Trump, sitting back waiting for the brown envelopes that never came, and it seems they can't forgive him for it. What a dreadfull dreadfull Party. Shame on every last one of them.
83

The Honest Lad,

Musselburgh 25/04/2008 09:24:38
Well it just shows it dosent matter what your political alliance is that ultimately they are all at it!

Alex Salmond is no better than the rest of them
84

The Honest Lad,

Musselburgh 25/04/2008 09:26:01
Oh and with ref to No 87 I bet if it was the other way about Salmond would be jumping up and down about it.
85

The Honest Lad,

Musselburgh 25/04/2008 09:26:19
doh 85
86

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 09:27:36
I see the McCrononites are in full swing(ers)
87

Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 09:30:19
No sign of the story here, concerning the latest huge financial scandal to hit East Lothian Council, when it was under Labour control I see. Funny, as the BBC are managing to cover it. You can run but you can't hide.
88

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 09:30:56
Has anyone seen the latest frown on Gordon Callaghan's face?

Bye God there's deep deep thought for you.
89

Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 09:32:06
#88 Oh good reply , please stay around to fill these forums with your wonderfull reposts. Head back in the sand beachboy.
90

Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 09:34:37
Oh and for the record, Salmond has done nothing, that's nothing wrong here.To rally behind a low life Labour MP critisism is futile to say the least. The stench
of hypocrasy is detectable from here.
91

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 09:38:23
I think one of the biggest political stories of the present is Labour supporters leaving in there droves.

And I don't think for a second there is the slightest validity in the polling of 33% for labour.

Where ever you go in the country the message for Labour is sling your hook, yes, dire indeed.
92

glassbenmhor,

25/04/2008 09:42:18
the day is coming,

THE INDEPENDENT SCOTTISH LABOUR PARTY,

as come it will for a' that
93

Prof,

25/04/2008 09:42:34
Another anti-Scot Nats rant from the Galashiels owned Hootsman.
94

Phil C,

25/04/2008 09:46:43
#86 etc The Confused Lad

Were you awarded, like my late dad, the honour of being Musselburgh's Honest Lad or did you give yourself the title in your moniker, coz you don't seem very bright!
95

Tweedmouth,

Coldstream 25/04/2008 09:48:06
#27 Guga II
"One greenie with the casting vote on a council committee tries to scupper a multi-million pound investment in Scotland. The full council ends up giving him the boot (rightly so) because of his blatant greenie bias."

Do you have a very selective memory - or do you not just give a damn about 'facts' ?
The vote on the planning committee was a 50-50 split - a tied vote - a deadlocked committee. The STANDING ORDERS of Aberdeenshire Council were that in a disputed application where votes were tied - the Chairman MUST cast his vote for the 'status quo ante', i.e. no change. The wisdom of this rule was that if an issue was so contentious that the committee was completely split on it - then it should be sent to an APPEAL enquiry where a far deeper examination of the proposal would take place - and no hasty decision by a small committee would commit the Council to a bad mistake.

Mr Ford had no choice in casting his vote; he did what he was democratically elected to do. By overturning the decision of its own committee Aberdeenshire has - in the view of many - driven a coach and horses through the planning system and may have broken the law.
96

Lance Boyle,

Linlithgow 25/04/2008 09:49:24
He could go to jail for this.
97

Phil C,

25/04/2008 09:49:55
#91 Glass..

Yes, and have you noticed his new inappropriate smile. He forces it, even when discussing serious issues. Nothing like being told what to do and not getting it quite right!
98

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 10:00:19
Funny to see the usual nat-wits calling flipping burgers and carrying luggage in an American owned golf course "inward investment".

Maybe we can get some more non-english speaking immigrants to do the jobs, cause Shuggie and Kylie sure as hell aren't giving up their brew money without a fight.
99

megz,

glasgow 25/04/2008 10:03:47
is there any particular reason that labour are against this developement now, considering they would sell their grannies to get it when they were in power? Are they now trying to put off any inward investment and development in Scotland? It really does beggar belief that not so long ago McConnell was flying the guy around and declaring him a honorary scot.
100

donald anderson it's me,

25/04/2008 10:04:04
Labour Numps Trumopet old cliches
101

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 10:08:05
102. Well done! I feel the more we Unionists call Scottish people lazy scroungers and oppose any inward investment (clearly burger flippers will be the building contractors of choice for this golf course/ housing development) the more support for the Union we will claw back!

And I hope no nasty Nat now uses your post to deride the pathetic levels of high value added inward investment various Unionist administrations have secured for Scotland in the last 30 years! We certainly don't need all this R&D type/ renewables energy rubbish inward investments Salmond was trawling for in the US!
102

brownlie,

25/04/2008 10:13:09
79 Norman

Yes, young Ian is my grand-son and you are correct he was 103 on April 1st this year.

Co-incidentally I once had a lecturer called Mrs Malaprop who taught me all I know in two 60-second lectures.
103

McX,

25/04/2008 10:14:19
#102 Shuggie and Kylie are shafted after the 10% tax stramash and aren't likely to try for any job now. Well done.
104

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 10:16:01
105 Union is Best

You seem to imply that we need Donald Trump to build houses?

As usual you are adopting the idiotic SNP/Labour stance on this one. We don't need Trump to build houses.

The only sustained boost to the economy that last more than a few months will be the need to mow grass and do gardening around the 18 holes.

The SNP/Labour's vision of the future is to get the lazy scrounging element of society more cash by inventing lawn mowing and shop-keeping duties to be done by immigrants. Then through the LIT and scrapping of 10p band, tax then until their eyes water to extract cash for Shuggie.
105

The Tin Man,

Over he Rainbow 25/04/2008 10:16:01
Once again, SNP running-dog lobotomised apologists out in force again... And what about buying party policy with £500K political donations?..... Just a small fraction of the tax that Brian Soutar avoided with his trust-funds.... Ho-hum
106

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 10:18:53
108. Well said! The last Labour administration built 6 council houses in 8 years! We don't build houses, full stop, so we don't need Trump to support our policy of not building any houses!
107

Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 10:19:27
#102 Nice pain filled post. Now back to the kitchen with you, I smell something burning.
108

Publius,

London 25/04/2008 10:19:57
#84 Phil C
Your write "The SNP is a broad social democrat party". Come off it Phil. Not even you can believe that social democracy involves the speculative development of golf courses and a gated community for the super rich. Yes a gated community. Gates to keep most Scots - including SNP supporters - out.

What Trump proposes is not 'inward investment', like a new factory or research centre or airport. It is just a nasty bit of property speculation.

Fortunately Alex Salmond may be wasting his time with this one. The credit crunch and the fall in property values may well see to this. Trump has already put one of his proposed developments - in Las Vegas, cultural capital of the western world - 'on hold'.
109

Hamish Scott,

25/04/2008 10:22:35
Another piece of vile 'journalism' from the Scotsman.
110

brownlie,

25/04/2008 10:24:21
102 Alfred Eek

Alfie, old chap, some clown using your monicker was on this forum earlier this week claiming that ALL the Trump generated jobs would be minimum waged. Then he went on to say that Trump would weave his minimum wage magic to give Alex a job there - obviously a much better offer than he gave Jack for his helicopter tour of Scotland. I noticed that these postings, obviously while you were doing your Houdini type escape from the jacket, were not, in any way, similar to your usual high standard sensible postings.
111

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 10:24:31
110 Union is Best

Is Trump going to finance his golf course by building council houses?

You really are a silly billy if you think that.

An American buys our land, we buy 20% back at 250% of the price we got for it. He uses the money we gave him to pay us to develop our own land the way he wants and he keeps the profits. We get to mow the 18th green.

Why the SNP and Labour are so stupid as too not realises this is not "inward investment".
112

The Tin Man,

Over the Rainbow 25/04/2008 10:24:32
#113

... it wasnae Alec.... the Scotsman did it and ran away....
113

voltaire's janny,

25/04/2008 10:26:01
Sad as it may be, many Americans see Scotland as synonymous with golf. I rode business class (upgraded - not paid) once with a septic who had been on a 10-day vacation to Scaaatland wherein he'd played fourteen courses.

"You play gaalf?"

"Nope, cannae stand it."

(actually I like watching big events on TV, but I am so bad at the game I lose about one ball per hole including allowance for finders)

"Oh"

....ten hours' silence.

When the politcial furor diminshed, it IS appropriate for large inward investements like this to be called in. The power exists until consent is granted to insert all kinds of locally beneficial, SSSI friendly terms and conditions. Trump et al will respect negotiation from strength in return for 18 lawns of quintessentially golf country.
114

conservative,

Fife 25/04/2008 10:26:09
Another nail in the SNP's coffin. Roll on the next elections when we can be rid of these jumped-up councillor numpties.
115

Senga Jean,

Caledonia; I'm' coming home.! 25/04/2008 10:27:08
Oh wad some po'er the giftie gie us,
The po'er to rule wi sense oor own land.
Caledonia,dear Caledonia, the Unionists mob'
Are oot tae get ye
My, my,and dearie me' where else in the stars'
Hae sic sinners been given the time o' day?

(Trochaic pentameter; for the geeks)
116

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 10:27:55
114 Browneye

I see. Thanks for the information.

What do you think of Salmond bending over to take it up the hoop from the yank?

I think former bankrupts who has quite coldly shafted previous business partners who wants us to clean toilets and do gardening for his rich pals isn't the type of person the Scots need running the show.
117

McX,

25/04/2008 10:31:01
#112 Publius, how many people in Girvan are employed at Turnberry?

How many local suppliers supply the hotel?

How many local builders were employed in the construction of the new houses?

How many locals work part time in the summer when a major tournament is awarded to Turnberry, even something small like the Seniors Open?

How many B&B's, guest houses and other hotels, as far south as Stranrarer and Newton Stewart depend on the draw of Turnberry?

How many cafés and bars increase their takings and need extra staff when a major tour game is on?

I was on the original Wigtown Booktown committee and was struck by what a fellow committee member and the local butcher said about the possible impact of getting Booktown status meant to the town. "If one person get's a part time job out of it, it will be well worth it."

The Trump project, may not be a R&D development, and as you rightly say probably won't go ahead given the 'credit crunch', but developments like these are vital to any economy. To turn on it in with the viciousness portrayed by the WENDY does her and this country no favours.
118

Keir Hardie,

Inverness 25/04/2008 10:33:14
We don't need Trump

We've got enough homegrown arrogant, pompous types without importing them!
119

,

25/04/2008 10:33:51
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
120

Phil C,

25/04/2008 10:36:30
#112 Publicass

Yes the SNP is a very broad based political party with clear views, as stated. They are conducting themselves in government well above most people's expectations, hence growing support and the smell of fear from unionists.

I agree that Trump's development might not be the best development ever, but that's not the point. That for the local people and politicians to decide.

This proposal was inherited from Labour, who had been encouraging Trump. It had a lot of local support, in Alex Salmond's constituency. When a small narrow-minded planning committee turned it down, the government stepped in to look at the proposal properly. They did nothing wrong. Labour and their allies then tried to muddy the waters to the detriment of Scotland's reputation.

The point here is that the Scotsman continues to take a very anti-SNP stance and they support any nonsense (see headline above) spouted by Labour nobodies. Hypocrisy in the extreme.
121

The Tin Man,

Over the Rainbow 25/04/2008 10:38:47
#121 McX

...However, the things you mentioned occur without the licking of developer's bums, and without the stroking of developer's ego's.
122

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 10:39:20
Did you know "h a r d" and "o n" are banned by the nazi-bot?

As in "I think the Scotsman is a bit h*rd on the old censorship."

The moderator on this site is definately a friend of dorothy.

This nazi-bot is just getting stupid.
123

Legacy,

NE 25/04/2008 10:41:43
Keep it up! The Unionists!
*
No wonder the the Unionists of all shades are deserting in droves to the SNP.
124

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 10:44:24
123. Alfred - well said! Given that the Abderdeenshire council voted for the development, the council leader welcomed the call in to avoid an appeal which the council would have backed against itself, and that 80% of local people favour the development, it is typical of the SNP dictatorial attitude through its independent enquiry into the application to force this through!
125

brownlie,

Scalpay, Harris 25/04/2008 10:45:19
120 Alfred

What an unpleasant picture you paint. It is obvious that in our unionist utopia plumbers, electricians, building contractors, hotel management and chefs will all work for the minimum wage. All the Americans will of course bring their lunch-packs with them so that they will not have to depend on local products such as vegetables, salmon, trout, venison etc.
126

Nikostratos,

25/04/2008 10:45:37
#127

Thats only to take it over by stealth and then change its policy's and leader......................c'est la vie
127

Melly,

Sussex 25/04/2008 10:47:19
The headline says "Trump said jump, the First Minister said how high". I thought why would AS say that?. I should have known the Scotsman headline writers meeting had come up with another anti SNP headline. Only when we get down to the 5th paragraph do we find that it was dreamt up by a Liebour numpty Duncan McNeil !!
Another scoop from the Hootsman.
128

McX,

25/04/2008 10:47:57
#125 "...However, the things you mentioned occur without the licking of developer's bums, and without the stroking of developer's ego's."

What like hiring a luxury helicopter at public expense and ferrying the developer around Scotland? Or having a wee special ceremony to confirm the glorious honour of GlobScot?

Like your namesake feller, have a heart.
129

Miss H,

25/04/2008 10:48:13
David Mcletchie was surely taking the wee wee when he said "Does anyone in this chamber believe that the Trump Organisation would have been rushing to meet Nora Radcliffe?"

No of course they wouldn't!

On the other hand they would have rushed to meet Alex Salmonmd whether or not he was FM.

That's why the good people of Gordon elected Alex Salmond to represent them and not Nora Radcliffe.

Doh.
130

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 10:49:34
129 Browneye

You really are quite a pessimist. This is the pessimistic view of the SNP.

We can grow vegetables and cook, and clean toilets and do gardening for other nations because that's all we can aspire too. The SNP and you are wrong.

Scotland should start engineering again, manufactuting precision instrements and so on. That is real work.

But nooooo, all the SNP want to do is send the next generation to college to do "Hotel management with gold business HNDs" so they can work at Trump Camp.
131

Sedov,

Scotland 25/04/2008 10:53:24
#127 Legacy " unionists deserting in droves to the SNP"- I know that the SNP will probably hold on to power for a few more years but this statistic is an interesting one - can you tell me your source please? - thanks.
132

Arfur,

25/04/2008 10:53:58
What a load of p@sh. Salmond went on his own accord to try sort this mess out as it a huge investment in Scotland. Not to mention that over 80% of Aberdeenshire residents want it to go ahead.

I have written 2 e-mails of complaint to the hootsman re their bias, political point scoring and ability to take what has happened (e.g. FMQ) and write something completely different. I have had not one reply but I suggest everyone else do the same.
133

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 10:54:16
133 Missh

"On the other hand they would have rushed to meet Alex Salmonmd whether or not he was FM."

People like Trump prey on the weak, the stupid and the pessimistic who are corruptable.

Trump relies on manipulating these people for personal profit.

For once we. Trump would have rushed to meet Alex Salmond, he is just the little lap-dog he needs.
134

fgreed,

Aberdeen 25/04/2008 10:54:58
Alex Salmond better watch out if he thinks people are going to vote for a party that are so set on proving that an independent Scottish Economy is possible, they are willing to meet the demands of any large businessman no matter how fascist.

The SNP seem so intent on sending out that message to big business, they have missed the point. People visit Scotland because of its untouched scenery and landscapes, destroying this in place of a playground for the rich is totally counterproductive in the long term.


Save the Dunes
http://www.fgreed.org
135

Miss H,

25/04/2008 10:56:15
103 - they are not against it that's the funny thing. Neither are the lib Dems. They are too thick however to work out that as a consequence of their antics most voters now believe they are against the development. That doesn't matter outside of the north east - but in the north east it does matter and we can expect it to become even more of an SNP stronghold than it already is.

136

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 10:57:58
If you work hard at school, maybe one day you can manufacture instrumentation for space exploration.

Or...

Let's shut down the schools and cook, clean, and answer telephones. Yes I like the sound of this "inward investment", that is the SNP way, get others to everything for us and maybe we can eat a few crumbs off his plate.

The SNP are a sick joke.

137

McX,

25/04/2008 11:01:56
The level of Unionist debate on here shows you how phuqued this country has become.
138

Miss H,

25/04/2008 11:03:30
141 It actually shows how desperate they are. They don't seem to realise they come across as a lot of hysterical fools which is a real turn-off for the voters.
139

Phil C,

25/04/2008 11:03:38
#138 fgreed

I don't remember many tourists listing the famous Menie Estate Dunes as their reason for visiting Scotland! It is an unspoilt wasteland. Like much of Scotland's coastline it is remote, desolate and a home for wildlife- wildlife that has legs and wings and can move next door without seeking a new mortgage.
140

Jings Crivens,

25/04/2008 11:04:00
Polititcs is about perception and Salmond and Co are now perceived as dancing to trumps tune. So much for the new way!
141

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 11:04:41
140. Well said. Our Unionist big idea of letting McDonalds award A-levels is the super-high way into the knowlegde economy! It contrasts with the myopia of the SNP proposals for R&D tax credits and incentives, lower corperation tax, attracting high value added investment, the biggest prize in the world for marine renewable research, the SNP campaigning for the carbon capture plant in the North east which the UK government lost.... who needs all that when we have the big Unionist ideas of a burger chain awarding degrees !?
142

brownlie,

25/04/2008 11:09:04
Alfred ad nauseam

It is not in our interests to denigrate essential jobs like cleaning and cooking. Just because we shafted them with the abolition of the 10% tax cut does not mean to say that we do not want them to vote for us at the next election.
143

Phil C,

25/04/2008 11:10:47
#145 Onions are Best

Where's my nearest burger academy? I could do with a qualifications top-up. You and your unionist friends are right. That's the way forward. Those SNP ideas will only create a strong economy and nasty headlines in the Scotsman!
144

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 11:11:48
145 Union is Best

What are snivelling on about this time?

A prize which everyone in the industry acknowledges as irrelevant?

And what is this high value added investment? Oh you mean some clown in a suit just said they "want to do that" or "will do that".

The SNP are as bad as Labour, they just want headlines, to con the stupid (like you) and then to hand them brew money or give them jobs at the council.

High value added investment? I mean what does that mean you idiot? Add value to what?

Ahhh right, take Scotland's proud and ancient golfing history and beautiful lands and remove value for a quick buck.
145

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 11:13:12
147. See UKGov.com for your nearest Burger University (note, not academy, as we want McDonalds to issue degrees and diplomas and such) - this has been the pinnacle of UK government training and skills policy for a decade! Now, excuse me as I must compile a list of high value added R&D and headquarters investments we Unionists have delivered for Scotland in the past 30 years. I may be gone for a second or two.
146

Miss H,

25/04/2008 11:13:22
144 Do you think so?

My impression is that outside of the north east (where most people rightly or wrongly want Trumptown to go ahead) most people don't care about the issue. It's just another yah-booh ritualised insult fest. Exactly the kind of negative politics which most electors detest.

There is no substance to Labour's attacks. They have thrown a lot of mud but none of it has stuck and now they are resorting to pure playground stuff which just makes them look sad and bitter.

As an SNP member I understand that - when you lose an election you do feel bitter, you do want to strike back any way you can. But if you want to win an election you refrain from that kind of behaviour because it makes you look bad.
147

DaveK,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 11:15:29
Alex didn't ask how high! Fat men can't jump!
148

Publius,

London 25/04/2008 11:16:31
#121 McX

You ask about employment, Turnberry and Girvan. You are of course right to point out that Turnberry generates low-skilled, seasonal jobs for people in Girvan, especially during a major championship. But that doesn't mean this should (or would) be replicated in Aberdeenshire.
(1) The whole Ayrshire coast needs more jobs - highly paid, skilled jobs. With some exceptions - parts of Ayr, Prestwick and one or two other places - the coast is very run down and wages are low. Aberdeenshire is not like this: the Aberdeenshire coast is within commuting distance of well paid jobs in Aberdeen.
(2) What Trump proposes is not so much a golf course/hotel as a gated 'community' of expensive houses. The whole idea goes against the grain of Scottish culture and democracy.
(3) Property speculation is not the same as inward investment. (We have Labour to thank for stripping 'investment' of its meaning. I am well aware that Labour flirted with Trump befor the SNP got into bed with him.)

Your comparison of 'Wigtown booktown' (a brilliant, lowcost idea with a strong sense of preserving buildings etc and very well executed) with 'Aberdeenshire Trumptown' (high cost, speculative with destruction of site of special scientific interest) is very silly.

#122 Phil C
I know that SNP inherited the Trump scheme from Labour. But that doesn't mean that it should try to outdo Labour by getting the scheme going.


149

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 11:16:39
151. Good post.
150

Mr Custard,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 11:17:10
145

Crikey, you are hard work. Have you thought of a different approach to sarcasm? Lowest form of wit and all that.
151

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 11:17:54
152. Well said. Putting the application to a full public enquiry was clearly the wrong thing to do.
152

Phil C,

25/04/2008 11:19:08
#149

Cheers! I can see my life changing even as I type. I'm off to enrol- I'll probably be gone for years! 30 stone here I come. Thanks to you your friends for this chance.
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25/04/2008 11:19:57
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The Tin Man,

Over the Rainbow 25/04/2008 11:22:18
Building a golf-course and Westhill-sur-la-Plage is normal, and always goes through the usual planning procedures, just as the Trump development is currently going through the normal planning procedures, with no help from the developers. However, due to the political spin that has been put on the whole business, the only person who currently has any honor is Mr Ford, whilst Mr Salmond looks like a bum-licking apologist.
155

fgreed,

25/04/2008 11:23:00
#138 Phil C.

What happens if next door has been built on by some other billionaire-its that sort of selfish attitude that has led to the extinction or near extinction of so much of Scotlands native wildife.
Furthermore, the Menie Estate is not a wasteland, its a valuable ecological site as well as a great place to go walking. Perhaps if Trump goes home we can look at the real issue here-increasing tourism in Aberdeenshire. This can be done in a sustainable way that allows people other than the super-rich to visit the area.

Alternatively we can sit back and do what the Trump profit machine wants us to do-'think about the benefits to the local economy'.

Save the Dunes
http://www.fgreed.org
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25/04/2008 11:24:50
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brownlie,

25/04/2008 11:25:42
151 Dave

Trump did not say "Jump" and Salmond did not say "How high". Unfortunately this was a lie, highly unusual I know, from some obscure Labour MSP and, in the spirit of "balanced" journalism, printed by the Scotsman. I'm so surprised that some-one of your obvious intelligence fell for our unionist nonsense - we can depend on your vote, I hope!
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25/04/2008 11:26:18
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25/04/2008 11:27:32
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Phil C,

25/04/2008 11:29:32
#159 It hasn't been and we shouldn't let that happen. But niether should we be blinkered in a no-go-anywhere scenario. Just think of the nice walks you could have on the course meeting American tourists instead of lapwings!! OK, you win some of the argument.
163

McX,

25/04/2008 11:29:41
#152 Publius...sigh!

So this particular area of Aberdeenshire is populated with a well educated population all in full employment locally?

Are you sure there is nobody locally who could benefit from a job in the 'service' industry?

I'm not sure why my mention of Wigtown is "silly". I was trying to point that any job is better than no job.

Presumably that's why you choose to work in London as you couldn't find a job to match your skills in Girvan.
164

VinoTinto,

25/04/2008 11:30:11
#158

..."a bum-licking apologist" ...er. are you a friend of dorothy (#126) as well?
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Phil C,

25/04/2008 11:31:35
#162 Alfie

You are leaking a lot!! Just let rip. You'll feel better- to hell with the rest of us!
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25/04/2008 11:32:21
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C­iderman 542000,

25/04/2008 11:34:39
#170. We Unionists when we lose the argument like to disrupt discussion by faking people's names! This relieves our IBS. IBS often comes with either constipation or diarrhoea and sometimes the two alternate. Sufferers experience abdominal pain, bloating or discomfort and a change in bowel habit, and a need to ruin threads on internet discussions by copying people's names when we are getting panned on the actual points.
168

C­iderman 542000,

25/04/2008 11:35:59
Trapped wind is a common cause of abdominal pain, discomfort and bloating in all age groups. Get rid of trapped wind now I say!
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The Honest Lad,

Musselburgh 25/04/2008 11:41:16
No98 Phil C

I think I was awarded the Dishonest lad at some point. Someone could maybe present Alex Salmond with that award this year.

P.S. I am very clever. What does Moniker mean?
171

Suomi,

Salo,Finland 25/04/2008 11:41:23
Of course the aims of many opposition MSP's are to create a perception that Salmond is dancing to Trump's tune.The lack of evidence doesn't matter.This is politics at it's worst.

There were numerous examples of inconsistency,logical flaws and tortuous thinking during the committee investigation,paliamentary debate and in the report.Too many examples to talk about.However lets pick up McLetchie's statement that if Nora Radcliffe had still been MSP for Gordon,that Trump would not have wanted to meet her.Why not,is Mcletchie implying that she was not up to the job?The responsiblity of any constituency MSP is to talk to any person about matters relevant to their constituents.The competency or image of Nora Radcliffe is not the issue,I think that Mcletchie is making a covert attempt to imply that something was sleezy.

Since Alec Salmond did not seeek to influence the planning decision,did not recieve cash,and followed the process provided by his advisors in the cival service,he does not deserve the abuse that he has recieved from some people.Apart from the fact that innuendo is being presented as fact,there is also inconsistency among unionist politicians.Many of them have been found guilty of fraud.Additionally,Jackie Baillie(Labour MSP) met the planning officer about a planning issue in Dumbarton yesterday.I don't have a problem with that.However,it does refute the suggestion that ordinary MSPs cannot have access to the chief planning officer.Inconsistency and selective memory attention,apply here.

The real sadness is not the vicious attempt to smear a highly respected and competent politician,it is the diversion from issues of concern to the public.Our MSP's should remember that people abroad can also observe them at work.Recent observations of some of our MSP's in action are not very pleasant.
172

brownlie,

25/04/2008 11:41:26
170 Miss H

Sadly for us unionists the SNP are not proposing gated communities. This discussion is not about whether Trump's plans would benefit Scotland more than a deserted - there are thousands of them in Scotland - beach which benefits the lone walker who posted earlier. It is really about us unionist opposing, consistently, anything the SNP Government want to do for the benefit of Scotland. We had our chance over an 8 year period and, apart from political posturing, the results are there for all to see.
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25/04/2008 11:41:47
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stan102,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 11:42:35
Bush - said - WMD - in Iraq - Tony B Liar - said - Yes boss.

Let us not forget
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The Tin Man,

Over the Rainbow 25/04/2008 11:46:29
'Miss H'

You are usually a bit of a party-political automaton, so I am confused. However, the level of crime in the Balmedie area does not really warrant gated communities. Also, I am a bit unsure about the current level of unemployment around Balmedie, as it is a bit of an oil executive ghetto, but I am sure that the Poles will do just fine.
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25/04/2008 11:48:22
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kimba,

25/04/2008 11:50:06
140. what is even sicker is the poor mentally challenged hanging on to every word he utters as if it were gospel.
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The Honest Lad,

Musselburgh 25/04/2008 11:51:14
why do SNP supporters come on this forum or read this paper if they think it is so anti SNP. Why not start your own paper so you can have SNP tinted stories?
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VinoTinto,

25/04/2008 11:56:14
#182 ...I guess Laddie, like the rest of us, the only good thing about the paper IS the forum.
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Phil C,

25/04/2008 11:58:18
Time to go. The impersonators are out and so is Kimba!!
181

VinoTinto,

25/04/2008 11:58:38
...now MissH, why were your postings withdrawn yesterday - we want to know!
182

Sedov,

Scotland 25/04/2008 11:59:34
#127 Legacy - Still waiting on the scource to back up your statement that "unionists are deserting to the SNP in droves" - Can't help thinking that this statement is more wishful thinking than actual fact from the NATS -a bit like their party of course. Name or be shamed Legacy!
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25/04/2008 11:59:59
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25/04/2008 12:00:45
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Phil C,

25/04/2008 12:02:14
Because #182 Bad Lad

We live in the real world- warts and all!
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25/04/2008 12:02:27
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Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 12:02:43
#151 And Joke McConnel asked ; "How Much".
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kimba,

25/04/2008 12:02:52
184. Go forth,but please don't multiply,one of you is quite adequate.
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25/04/2008 12:03:27
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Phil C,

25/04/2008 12:05:45
#174 Dishonest Lad

I'll call you Daft Laddie from now on.
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Alan B,

25/04/2008 12:06:14
#182 The Honest Lad

That is just such a silly thing to say. Speaking for myself i would read both this paper and the herald. Why they are the 2 broadsheets that we have?

Why come on to the forum? I like the debate and it is more informative that the article which can be less than informative.

I am not interested in a snp rose tinted stories but do think that is important that in a small country like scotland who cannot support the number of news papers england has it is important that the quality papers do inform the readers about the current situations in the country. Part of having a free press and is important for democracy.

I would critise this paper for its alway putting a negative slant on the snp policy. Also for burying articles that are not supporting its editorial viewpoint. for articles that are generally poorly researched.And also headlines which have little in common with the actual story.

Personally in a quality paper i would like well researched article putting both side of any story putting the advantages and disadvantages of any policy, rising above the silly political games of the parties and then forming its own conclusions which in this paper would not be pro-independence.


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Venachar,

25/04/2008 12:06:55
Morning Vino Tinto

yep much better than the boring BBC pages!!

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25/04/2008 12:07:56
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Phil C,

25/04/2008 12:08:32
#192 Slimeba

I only came fifth but I'm good at multiplying.
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kimba,

25/04/2008 12:08:49
188. STOP this now,you have a ips address so you can be tracked,I swear you will be found.
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25/04/2008 12:10:35
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kimba,

25/04/2008 12:11:08
198.Poor bas---ds,your kids are doomed before they start!
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25/04/2008 12:11:18
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Publius,

London 25/04/2008 12:11:56
#179 The Tin Man

I think there are now two Miss Hs. The second one has put a space before her name - a lot more clever than adding the odd punctuation one which is what most impostors do.

That said I can't work out whether the new Miss H is an SNP supporter trying to discredit opponents (like Union is best) or just a sh.t stirrer.
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25/04/2008 12:12:05
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Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 12:14:30
The Unionistas are stringing this whole affair out as long as possible, in the vain hope that somehow Trump will walk away. Pathetic utterances about property prices falling, when of course they are not in Scotland
or that somehow they will actually find something Salmond has done wrong here. Again a futile hope. As of yet, they have failed to land a single punch, and the bell for the last round is just about to ring.

What you can't seem to get through your tiny, spiteful,
envy filled minds, is that Trump eats jumped up cooncillers like Alexander and her sort, for breakfast.
He positivley revels in sending them scuttiling back to where ever they slithered out from.

The fact is this project will go ahead, will create jobs and as the whole of the business community says
will be hugely beneficial for the area. Weep and wring your hands , tear at your own skin if it makes you feel better, but get used to it. Scotland is no longer
CON- trolled by Labour , or any other unionistas.
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25/04/2008 12:15:32
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Publius,

London 25/04/2008 12:19:17
#167
I work in London because the company I work for - HQ in Edinburgh - sent me there. They keep promising to recall me to Edinburgh. They haven't done yet. The only places in the UK where my kind of job is done are Edinburgh and London.
I've nothing against Wigtown and I like bookds - new and old. I think the 'Wigtown booktown' initiative was brilliant, but what Trump proposes is nothing like it.
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Publius,

London 25/04/2008 12:22:48
#207 Number 6

It doesn't matter property prices are falling in Scotland or not - though they very likely will. Scotland will hardly be immune from the illness that has now affected the USA, Spain, Ireland and England.

What matters is that credit for speculative builing has almost dried up.
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25/04/2008 12:22:48
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Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 25/04/2008 12:24:25
Perhaps the anti-SNP brigade will only be happy when Trump sells on his Menie estate to Ineos to build a non-unionised refinery there. After all the pipeline from St Fergus to Grangemouth is only a few miles inland.

Be careful what you wish for.
210

VinoTinto,

25/04/2008 12:24:54

Morning to you. I'm surprised you haven't joined earlier, some very SNiPpy stuff happening here!! However it's all becoming a bit anal.
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beeree,

25/04/2008 12:27:04
#76 Unsubstantiated?

Don't you mean unsubstantial? 1/2 million (that's a lot of ££££) is neither insubstantial nor unsubstantiated.

With the 4 legs good 2 legs bad mentality of the snippers the banana republic will be in safe paws.
Now where's that trough?
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25/04/2008 12:28:29
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Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 12:36:40
#211 Assuming prices don't fall , and i'm afraid you cant, as much as you would like to, make them fall, what exactly is YOUR problem with this project. Please not what you think or wish will go wrong, but facts . Why turn down this opportunity, denied under LABOUR, to develop the area. Do you think the area should be left to stagnate, forcing new generations to move away , or should investment be made?
What would you like to see done to help the area?Any ideas from the unionista perspective ?

Any of you ?.
215

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 12:37:43
216,217 et al. Oh my, one of ours is having some kind of paranoid breakdown.

Brownlie - can you have a word in the back office - a bit of compassionate leave may be in order!
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VinoTinto,

25/04/2008 12:38:25
#185...let me repeat. Miss H, if you are so smart why were your postings removed yesterday? We still want to know!
217

AlecJ,

Aberdeen 25/04/2008 12:38:43
I think Martin Forde has been very badly treated by his fellow councillors and the press in this matter. He seems to have behaved honourably throughout this matter. He had the CASTING vote in a tied decision, and decided that the development should not happen; it should then have gone back to the full council, not called in. Trump seems to be of the opinion that anything he decides must come to pass, and he brooks no changes in his decision - it has to be exactly what he decreed. It has been a rough awakening to him that not everyone (the Big Fish excluded!) jumps to do his will.
It is possible that there will be some housing development on the Menie estate, but even though not contiguous with Balmedie, it would create an extra large township which would require massive council investment not currently budgetted. If it goes through, your council taxes will have to go up by large amounts to cover this. Certainly Trump would not pay these costs. He is a "pile 'em high, sell them expensive" merchant.
218

Union is Best,

25/04/2008 12:40:33
218. Our problem with this project is we do not want Salmond and the SNP being seen to succeed at anything!

Our problem with this project, even though we backed it to the hilt when in office, is that it was being reviewed when we were up to our neck in the illegal donations hoo-hah and it was a convenient distraction. A few job losses in the North east if we ruin this is a price worth paying to restore Unionist fortunes by distracting from our sleaze!
219

brownlie,

25/04/2008 12:43:31
219 Union

Sorry, I'm being intellectually hammered by Ciderman on another thread and even being accused of printing your usual tripe under my monicker. I worry about you having to handle HM's nappies if the above posts are anything to go by.
220

overton,

balmedie 25/04/2008 12:44:35
I hope Donald Trump doesn't think we are like the residents of Gardenstown!

Mind you the performance of the Lib Dems locally in Aberdeenshire and combined with the Labour reps in the Scottish Government is pretty embarrassingly parochial.

This extended pantomime is grossly offensive to the right thinking people of Aberdeenshire and I just hope that it doesn't send Mr Trump to another more appreciative site with his investment capital.

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25/04/2008 12:46:26
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Union is Best,

25/04/2008 12:48:45
223. Brownlie - haha! That "build your vocubaulary" calendar I got for Ciderman is really paying off! He is a force now!

Good grief, you being accused of posting my tripe? Damn tasteless Nats can't discern quality!

I fear from the paranoid ravings at 216/217 that we may need to hose him down outside again when he is finished.
223

Calum Crubag,

25/04/2008 12:50:19
Labour have short memories. Cash for honours? Paying family members as 'staff'??

Is Wendy one of the worst Labour leaders ever? She's woefully slow and always seems to lack relevant and challenging questions for AS.
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25/04/2008 12:54:13
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overton,

balmedie 25/04/2008 12:55:26
221 AlecJ,Aberdeen

Martin Ford has acted totally dishonourably towards this project and to the electorate of Aberdeenshire from day one.

Indeed both he and his side kick, Debra Storr,have been active in creating a website that is opposed to the development and even now run an e-mail forum for those few constituents who still seek to undermine any progress with the application.

Neither Ford nor Storr should have been on the ISC but at the very least both should have declared their involvement with Sustainable Aberdeenshire and the Ellon Focus Website prior to the voting and both should have abstained.

Aberdeenshire Council were correct to sack Ford and should have removed Storr from any positions as well.

226

The Master,

25/04/2008 12:57:50
It’s the genuine Master here: accept no spaced out fakeys! Duncan McNeil is quite right to highlight Alex’s conduct in arranging a meeting with the Chief Planner while with the Trump representatives. Why did Alex feel the need to do this, unless to show that he’s the big man who can put wheels in motion? This can only be described as a stunt designed to ingratiate himself with Trump and drop a subliminal hint that he was pushing against an open door. If he’d wished to avoid this impression, he could simply have passed on the Chief’s contact details without making it clear that he was bringing his influence to bear.

Tick! Tock! Nat sleaze is currently being drowned out by the unpopularity of Brown! What unbelievable luck for the TT, but we all know that this can’t last!

#228 Miss H: aw, please don't go, you prissy prig!
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25/04/2008 13:00:46
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Laird o' Glenrothes,

25/04/2008 13:05:30
I've only read a few of the comments on this page, I wish I had the time to read more!!! Let's just get this course built, let Trump invest his money in our country, let the wealthy golfers come and play golf and spend their cash. I really can't believe all the hoo-ha spouted in these rooms.

Let's just get the bloody thing built!!
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25/04/2008 13:16:00
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Miss H,

25/04/2008 13:17:34
My goodness, I have become a celebrity. I have my own stalker!
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Miss H,

25/04/2008 13:25:27
I am the real me. I am un-fakeable. But I am going to go away until you all calm down.

You guys are really rattled aren't you?
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VinoTinto,

25/04/2008 13:25:59
Miss H you need a course of "Preperation H"
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Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 13:27:46
232 SLEAZE? Can you be more specific, what sleaze,
please make it clear for us imbeciles who can see nothing wrong in this affair , just as the inquirey
will find.

Now if you want sleaze, pop over to East Lothian where
labour are yet again under investigation. The difference here of course is that it involves hundreds of thousands of tax-payers money. The BBC will put you straight, as again this paper has missed a massive labour financial scandal.
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25/04/2008 13:32:22
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ochone,

Sauchie, Clack's 25/04/2008 13:35:47
I see that the unionist crews at Holyrood, their pals at the Scotsman and their hangers on in these contributions still have no evidence of what they claim and are still reduced to lies, smears and insults, meanwhile back in the real world, the latest opinion poll shows what the people of Scotland think.

Keep up the good work unionists.

BTW, as I didn't see it, could somebody tell me how many questions the leader of the main opposition party in Scotland managed to ask yesterday?

Yes, I do mean Wendy!
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Conan the Librarian™,

25/04/2008 13:38:37
At last! A normal post.

I agree ochone, the unionists are running scared and resorting to cheap scandal.
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Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 13:39:49
257/258 is this the latest unionista tactic , rather childish don't you think?.
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The Master,

25/04/2008 13:43:53
#253 Miss H: don’t come back until you’ve sat down and given some serious thought to all the separation garbage you routinely spout. You don’t seem all that convinced of it yourself as, in the absence of any concrete case, you routinely resort to fatuous comparisons between Scotland and countries such as Ireland and Denmark! You’re able to tow the line of the non independence policies of the SNP, but I get the impression you can’t help betraying the fact that you’re far from convinced by the separation agenda that just refuses to be fudged. Am I right or am I right!

#261 Number 6: it's the SNP's outdated and completely anachronistic independence agenda and their complete refusal to modernise it that's childish! End of!
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 Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 13:44:11
261 Number 6

Please don't contact me again.

Cease and desist, begone with you, and stay gone.
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Publius,

London 25/04/2008 13:49:56
#218 Number Six

You ask what is the wrong the project. Easy. It is simply a piece of speculation which may make profits for the speculators (Trump and friends) but will leave a permanent eyesore and ruin an area of special scientific interest.

You also why should the area be left to stagnate. Your question is absurd. It can't be more than 20 miles from Aberdeen. The people who live there can easily be absorbed into Aberdeen's economy - if they aren't already.

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Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 13:51:46
For those still not aware:

LABOUR are under investigation in East-Lothian for handing out what they call an "Enhanced contract"
to a slum Care-Home. They block-booked the accomadation
atinflated rates. This led to the owner raking in hundreds of thousands of pounds extra for empty beds.

This was only stopped once the SNP/LIBS took power.
The Home has since closed after an inspection found a catalouge of failures that the owner refused to rectify.

This investigation will uncover sleaze and mis-management, that's the difference. Have you got that
#263.
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Mora,

25/04/2008 13:52:17
Aberdeen's environment committee decision was clear and should stick; send Trump off to some degraded land, say on Clydeside, where his millions can build a golf course whilst rehabilitating damaged country and bringing employment and visitors close to existing transport; or even better, send Trump packing from Scotland altogether - there is no place for unsustainable development in these times of acute climate change.
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25/04/2008 13:54:07
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Number 6,

Germany 25/04/2008 13:55:33
#265
May make profits...(WHAT A CRIME)

Leave a permanent eyesore ? Not if the plans are anything to go by. You have taken the trouble to have a look at the plans, have'nt you.

Any sleaze you can detect ?
266

Findlay Thompson,

25/04/2008 13:59:44
Union is Best...

I applaud you. The way you handle the Poster from 'Mad Magazine'. I've never enjoyed this comment board so much in a long time!
267

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 14:00:08
> The dunes, stretching for more than 12 miles from Aberdeen to Ythan, also provide habitats for 19 nationally important species of lichen and fungi and a wide range of plants and invertebrates. <

The Guardian

Of course! Lichen and fungi are far more important than people's livelihoods.

Maybe we should evacuate Scotland altogether and let lichen and toadstools take over?
268

Highland Mighty,

25/04/2008 14:02:03
Miss H, are you okay?

You seem to be all over the place today!
269

Sgritheall,

Switzerland 25/04/2008 14:02:46
We'll gladly sell this country if the price tag is high enough. Now THAT'S independence!

Any more offers?
270

William Wallace,

25/04/2008 14:07:13
Alex Salmond can do no wrong in my eyes. He has quickly realised that being in office means cutting corners, cutting beauracracy and phoning a mate to call in a favour.

Scotland currently makes lots of money from golf and a place like this would not create new business, it would only reallocate existing Scottish business to an American company.

That is what independence is all about. Take Scottish business and Americanise it.
271

Publius,

London 25/04/2008 14:11:45
#271 Number 6
(1) The profits will come from the speculation itself, not from long term income. Trump will build the thing, sell it off in bits and run for it.
(2) However you look at it, the development will be a blot on the landscape.

Incidentally the papers are now speculating that Euroland will feel the credit crunch next. (There is a long historic pattern. The US enters a recession first, then Britain, then continental Europe. If things follow that pattern, it's your turn next.) The Euro fell against the dollar yesterday. From today's Telegraph:
David Owen, an economist at Dresdner Kleinwort, said Europe would soon be engulfed by the twin effects of a "collapse in export volumes" and a slow motion credit squeeze. "The wheels are coming off the eurozone economy," he said.

BNP Paribas warned clients yesterday that the "decoupling story" was no longer credible. "We see Europe in the early stage of a credit crunch, and if we are right credit supply will shut down," it said. Key governors of the European Central Bank began to back away from their hawkish stance of recent weeks, clearly disturbed by the market perception that they are mulling a rate rise to choke off price rises. Inflation has reached a post-EMU high of 3.6pc on surging oil and food costs.

#273 Urban Guerilla. Your argument is absurd. Aberdeenshire's prosperity will (does?) come its closeness to Aberdeen, not from destroying plantlife.
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Vivas,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 14:14:37
#273 ... correctomundo.

"Let them eat lichen" I guess !
273

Liberal for life,

Dunblane 25/04/2008 14:17:35
Todays relevent quote -Holyrood's local government committee, last month found the First Minister showed "exceptionally poor judgment" with his actions over the controversial planning application by the American tycoon.

This is the crux of the whole thing with regards to Alex Salmond - the man might have sensitive political antennae for the populist impact, but when it comes to a balanced judgement on how a leader of a country ought to behave he lacks the necessary guile and nounse, and ultimately sense of fair play thats eseential for anyone in that position.

For example- Jo Bloggs might have a bit of land he wants to build a house and a few holiday homes on coming up next week and a couple of neighbours object as its close to their pigeon loft - is Mr Salmond going to intervene on this application as well, and if not why not?

The rots set in thats for sure.
274

Publius,

London 25/04/2008 14:18:19
From today's Scotsman:

ABERDEENSHIRE Council yesterday backed plans for a massive £115 million golf and housing development on the outskirts of Aberdeen.

The full council unanimously approved a plan by the Muir Group to turn the estate of the historic Blairs Seminary, on greenbelt land in the Dee valley, into a luxury hotel, golf course and residential development of 280 homes.

The championship course will be designed by Aberdeen's Paul Lawrie, the last British golfer to win a major championship – the Open in 1999.

The development – still to be ratified by Scottish ministers – would secure the future of the threatened Blairs College, once Scotland's only junior seminary for training Catholic priests.


All this - and Trump as well!
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,

25/04/2008 14:21:10
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Zillionaire,

Glasgow 25/04/2008 14:23:28
Boring story....Boring newspaper
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,

25/04/2008 14:26:10
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,

25/04/2008 14:28:20
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Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 14:31:20
#277 > #273 Urban Guerilla. Your argument is absurd. Aberdeenshire's prosperity will (does?) come its closeness to Aberdeen, not from destroying plantlife. <

All things considered, I'm still inclined to put people before lichen.
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,

25/04/2008 14:32:13
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brownlie,

25/04/2008 14:33:16
279 Liberal

Nonsense, we unionist have the monopoly on rot and a nose for sleaze even when there is no evidence for it.

As for your analogy, if the vast majority of people in the area were quite happy with the plans and a jumped-up clerk interfered with the democratic process then he should intervene especially if he predecessor okayed the plan.
282

DaveK,

Edinburgh 25/04/2008 14:42:42
I spoke with Donald Trump a wee while ago, he told me he had toliet paper with Alex Salmonds face on it.
Now that would be a smear campaign! Wonder where you can buy it? Or perhaps he prints his own in the same place he prints his money.
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,

25/04/2008 14:53:27
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25/04/2008 14:57:51
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25/04/2008 15:00:00
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25/04/2008 15:00:02
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Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 15:00:38
Thanks for taking some time to spam us poster with no name.

What do you think about Alex Salmond and sleaze? Just as bad as Labour you say, I wouldn't have gone that far, but you may be right.
288

,,

25/04/2008 15:06:52
Scottish Nationalist Party, The
Party of NE Scotland, Broken Promises (and the “national” conversation fudge cake)
Major donor: Brian “private bigoted referendum” Souter
Status: friendly billionaire to go with the Donald

17/3/07: £500K
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,

25/04/2008 15:07:17
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Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 15:07:27
I see in amongst the spam I have been faked by methalions again.

He is some character that one. Faking Miss H all of today to try and cover his tracks from the day before when he faked me.

You really need to learn to relax buddy.
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Highland Mighty,

25/04/2008 15:07:34
286. I prefer the term ned-nats.
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,

25/04/2008 15:08:04
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,

25/04/2008 15:11:39
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fgreed,

25/04/2008 15:12:05
#311
haha the new 'green' conservatives you mean? The only thing green about the tories is the snot on Cameron's arm. If the conservative party were in charge in Scotland, God forbid, chances are this development would already be getting built.

With regards to the fuel debate-the conservative party aren't exactly a workers party, its not like they would to turn round to the oil giants and say, 'enough, stop bleeding the world dry for profit, think about your workers pensions!' Its got nothing to do with running out of fuel, its about the rights of those employed at Grangemouth that are clearly being flaunted. The SNP need to back them and not the corporate giants!

Save the Dunes
fgreed.org
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,

25/04/2008 15:12:56
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,

25/04/2008 15:13:41
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,

25/04/2008 15:14:43
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Saruman,

25/04/2008 15:16:49
#315 no name: that reminds me of the Nats’ abrupt “u-turn” on bus regulation (completely unconnected to the Souter, of course, according to the Nutty Nat Fanatics!) If I were a Nutty Nat Fanatic, I’d repeat my “sleaze, what sleaze?” mantra at this point!
299

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 15:21:08
Scottish National Party - Scottish Parliament election 03/05/2007

Expenditure by type England Scotland Wales Total
C. Unsolicited Material to Electors £0.00 £323,580.00 £0.00 £323,580.00
300

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 15:21:45
Poster with no name is obvious SNP.

They just love spending time and money spamming people.
301

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 15:30:02
I think we will see more and more SNP voters having total mental collapses on this site.

Every time the SNP get caught with there hand in the till, or dumping a pledge, or cutting services to the poor and vulnerable, they just start screaming about Labour being just as bad.

I think they are right of course, the SNP are no different from Labour. I think the difference is that the Labour voters had enough dignity to dump Labour and vote SNP.

So I have no doubt these same voters will be dumping the SNP and voting elsewhere/not voting at the next elections because of Salmond's and the SNPs non-stop barrage of sleaze, lies and broken promises.
302

steveh3,

Sutherland 25/04/2008 16:04:32
Last week wendy couldnt ask all the questions she could, now she can't even ask the important questions.
Hasn't she noticed there could be major problem with the countries fuel supplies, talk about blinkered vision, She piddles while the buses don't run, Labour are lossing it.

PS. Who was that numpty on newsnight talking for the SNP about the new southern general hospital.
Talk about not knowing the subject and very poor TV style she looked very foolish and amaturish come SNP make sure they are competant before they go on TV.
303

Alfred E. Neuman,

25/04/2008 16:15:30
359 Methalions

Thanks for the important update.

You've calmed down again. Are you ready to talk about Alex Salmond and the SNP's sleaze honestly yet?

If it still hurts too much, I'll understand.
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,

25/04/2008 16:17:32
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25/04/2008 16:22:32
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25/04/2008 16:24:33
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25/04/2008 16:25:53
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25/04/2008 16:27:32
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25/04/2008 16:32:25
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25/04/2008 16:37:14
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VinoTinto,

25/04/2008 16:47:34

I thought it was Miss H who found it had walking today because of nocturnal equine activities - maybe I'm wrong. Can't find it anyway.
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,

25/04/2008 16:48:56
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Russell339,

25/04/2008 16:58:11
It's laughable to hear about the calls of inward investment and such rubbish. IT'S A GOLF COURSE !!!

We have a planning process which everyone has to abide by, why should the Trump organisation be any different.
314

VinoTinto,

25/04/2008 16:58:24

Silly me, it's obviously because I think you are one and the same!!
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,

25/04/2008 17:01:45
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The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

25/04/2008 17:01:48
These fakies are getting on my nerves - I wish they could find some way of stopping them. Somebody said something the other day about blocking IP addresses but I don't think that would work - especially if you use blueyonder/virgin.
317

,

25/04/2008 17:03:25
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The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

25/04/2008 17:04:53
#369 Actually you are wrong Russell - the golf course is just an excuse to build a gated community. If the golf course and hotel were not included then the plans to build 500 exclusive homes would have been knocked back straight away.

 
  

 
 

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