Help Sitemap Home Skip Navigation Contact Us Disability Statement


Pull of two cultures can create deadly tension

Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image

Published Date: 12 November 2006
I SOMETIMES feel like a pair of 501s at the testing stage. Tugging on one leg, gently but steadily, is the machinery of capitalism and the West. On the other, the erratic yanking of a wild beast is pulling me back to my roots. Like many young Muslims living in Scotland I feel confused, a little lost, distressed and largely powerless to do anything about it.
There is no excuse for the awful, despicable crime committed by those who murdered Kriss Donald. However, we should try to learn lessons where possible. Did these killers suffer an extreme sense of the same frustration I feel - and did that contribute in any way to the warped rationale behind their targeting of an unknowing, innocent victim? If so, what do we need to do to prevent the same thing happening again in the future?

Muslims face a particularly complex set of challenges when trying to integrate into western society. Youngsters are constantly juggling western ideals with traditional values in an attempt to accommodate both their family and their friends. However, as links with their country of origin weaken generation after generation, more and more Muslims are successfully integrating themselves into society and are comfortable with their "Scottish Muslim" identity. On the path to the development of this new westernised Islam, though, there are inevitable difficulties.

Young Muslims are playing both sides of the field and without proper support this can have damaging consequences. The sense of not belonging wholly to one or the other side and the resultant growing dislocation pushes vulnerable Muslims into a cultural limbo - angry, isolated from the mainstream and with no vent through which to channel their pain. Could this pent-up tension have played its part in nudging the three Pakistani youths responsible for murdering Kriss Donald over the edge?

His savage murder came as a shock to everyone in Scotland, including the Muslim community. It marked not only a new level of racial tension, but a role reversal between aggressor and defender. This was a young white man attacked by a group of Asian youths. It is possible nobody will ever know what psychological impulses pushed the killers into committing such an awful crime - but many Muslims will wonder whether the cultural limbo I described earlier can be held partly responsible for what happened on that tragic day.

Can we do anything about it? There are fundamental attitude problems in both communities in this respect. As well as an unwillingness among Muslim parents to allow their children to mix freely, there is a growing complacency within the "indigenous" community that it should be Muslims who make the effort to integrate and that cultural barriers, such as the consumption of alcohol, need to be addressed by Muslims, and not them.

This mutual lack of understanding and communication creates an atmosphere of suspicion and distrust. And in the current climate, especially since 7/7, suspicion and distrust breed fear and hatred. The racially-motivated attack on Kriss Donald will not, I fear, be the last.

There is also a growing disenchantment with the Labour government in Westminster - though this sentiment is generally shared by everybody, regardless of background. From a Muslim's perspective, the Islamic community has been irrationally targeted through the ruthless manipulation of the media by key political figures. Muslim bashing is a vote winner and Islamophobia in the Noughties is where anti-Semitism was almost 100 years ago.

Over the past few years, Islamic households have been subjected to dawn raids, Muslims have been held in custody - often with little or no evidence - and Asians have been targeted purely on appearance.

This basic violation of human rights, coupled with what Muslims see as an inexplicable foreign policy in the Middle East, has polarised the community. The vast majority, despite their frustration, have turned to prayer or have accepted their lot. But in a handful of cases, Blair's propaganda has aided the recruitment of home-grown terrorists to al-Qaeda's network.

In a rare public speech on Friday, Dame Eliza Manningham-Buller, director-general of MI5, expressed concern at the rate at which young people, including teenagers, were being radicalised and indoctrinated. How many more Dhiren Barots are there out there and why are we not talking to them? Surely prevention is better than cure?

Muslims feel misunderstood locally, under-represented nationally and threatened internationally. They feel like their whole way of life has come under attack. Multiculturalism is proving to be a delicate and potentially explosive process. These are important times as Islam grapples with westernisation in an attempt to find a mutually acceptable balance. Both ideologies have a massive contribution to make to the 21st century, but the key is compassion, communication and choice. So what am I going to choose? Well, I'm a believer in taking the best of everything (a cultural "third way", if you like), so I'll just keep on smiling and hope that the jeans don't tear.

Page 1 of 1

 
1

Clansman,

Scotland 12/11/2006 03:13:33

Multiculturalism, first of all, do the people want it, did anyone ever ask. Or is it another one of the West Minsters Wonderful ideas.

This is our countries culture it's been like this for many years, handed down by our fathers through the generations. I for one feel my creed, culture are under threat from Aliens to all of these.

Theses people appear to support terror throughtout the world, have killed many in our country. If the predictions are right will repeat this.

I'm not going to be a target in my country from anyone. The gutless wonders better take notice of this because the clock is ticking. You brought this problem here, you sort it out.

I will be voting BNP not because I like what they do or how they do it, who else stands up for the British. We are disadvantaged in our own country. What about out pensioers contributed for years yet any one entering the country has more access to the welfare state. By the way it will be a one off vote but it's the only way I have have of kicking West Minster.

If you think I'm wrong and I may well be, ASK THE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT. Multiculturalism YES or NO.

2

Mike,

Edinburgh 12/11/2006 07:09:59

I have felt like that my whole life living as a Scot in Little Britian.

And Clansman if the BNP succeed in booting out all the foreign undesirables who do you think they will turn on next as I said in a previous posting it will be the Micks Paddies and Jocks because theyre nothing more than skin headed tattooed bigoted cultureless Little Englanders.
It always cracks me up to see Scots and Irish supporting these clowns because you better believe they despise your culture as much as everybody elses.
Go and get yer ma to zip up the back of yer heid before something falls oot.

3

Cool,

12/11/2006 09:58:44

Wont be voting BNP however Poster 1..has a very valid point,not a big fan of multiculture myself, simple because it doesnt work...every "culture" keeps to themselves, there is no crossing over,so why have it at all!!

4

donald,

weegieland 12/11/2006 10:13:32

Klansman is spelt wrong here. Go put a white pillow slip oan yer heid and get the next train South.

I feel more in common with Scottish Asians than Imperial Brits, whose loyalites lie elsewhere. Our Asians are better placed to understand British Imperialism and see the harm it has also done to Scotland

GeeBee/Yookay imperialism has wrecked untold swathes of cultures and lives around the globe, including Scotland. None of these cultures have done Scotland any harm. London based GB/UKism has.

5

Mike,

Edinburgh 12/11/2006 11:02:18

Cool

Which 'culture' do you belong to?
Clarify that to mean it doesnt work for you personnally.
If your having problems crossing over maybe you should be looking at yourself and not at other cultures.
The world is multicultural no getting away from that matey. If you want to live in a cave as a hermit away from it all dont try and justify it on the grounds its somebody elses fault.

6

tommy,

belfast uk 12/11/2006 12:22:14

An article just full of muslim weasel speak which boils down to :-
Its all the west's fault that islam is a murderous intolerant religion---something the lefties will lap up like the cat that got the cream and then blame the crusades (a defensive action by the west)
Do you know of any other religion that advocates the killing of non believers and is actively doing it world wide
No condemnation of sharia law that is resulting in the persecution of other faiths
No condemnation of the placarded carrying demonstrators advocating beheading and killing
No mass demonstrations against the muslim slaughter in Darfur by fellow muslims --
In fact nowhere is there is there criticism of muslim murders
After every muslim perpetrated tragedy we get the same cry-its because of the way the west is behaving---no mention of the fact that this is how islam behaved from its inception

I want to see koranic proof that the behaviour of Al Quaida and other muslim groups is wrong and that the justification that they use for these actions is not in fact contained in the koran,hadiths etc
I want to see muslim demonstrations country wide condemning islamic violence
I want to see the muslim demonstrations against the treatment of non muslims under sharia.
I want to see a transformation of islam into the 21st century
In short I want to see muslims prove that they are fit to live in OUR society.because the thought of my children having to grow up in a society under sharia law is frightening and the way muslim population is increasing and their seeming wish for sharia it is only a matter of time.

When I saw the television episode about jack straws comments I could not help but notice that the female muslim wearing the headscarf said -- How dare he make these comments----- a muslim attitude to dhimmis if ever I heard it

7

Box Back Blogger,

Edinburgh 12/11/2006 12:43:07

For those confused by the 9/11 attacks, especially poster 6!

http://www.counterpunch.org/chomskyintv.html

8

zauberdachs,

12/11/2006 13:08:53

so poster number 7 what you are saying is that if we expect Muslims to protest condemning Islamic violence we British should protest at our own governments and other Western States actions that are equally terrible?

I seem to remember some fairly extensive protests at the time and since...

9

Box Back Blogger,

Edinburgh 12/11/2006 13:23:51

Poster 8.

I think there are a number of reasons why Muslims don't protest:

1. They agree with bin laden, or more accurately, they don't disagree. To many Muslims bin laden is the best of a bad bunch.

2. al-Qaeda isn't a government remember. There is no accountability. Who should they protest to?

3. Fear of death. Rebellions in the UK are not brutally put down like they are in Iran or even democratic republics like Bangladesh, Russia and China.

What do you think?

10

PETER C.,

Glasgow 12/11/2006 13:24:52

Mosarrof Hussein, thanks for talking to us about what we all need to know.

I hope that you'll meet many fellow Scots (and other human beings of all persuasions) and talk to them as you've written here. And that they'll listen.

And that Clansman (1) and his ilk get a hearing too with their stop-the-world-I want-to-get-off. Don't we all, sometimes?

Tommy and others, I put most of my comments on these matters under another head: the article on sending Imams to prisons to talk to Muslim radicals.

My feeling is that Muslims in the West (and not just in the West) are caught between a rock and a hard place. Most want to live their lives decently and peaceably, but they're pressured by anti-Muslims without and by stone-hearted fanatics within. Both are dangerous, the arsonists and the firemen with flame-throwers.

Don't we need to reach out to one another? We have to live together, can we not learn from the other instead of treating him like a wild beast to be caged or killed?

11

Mike,

Edinburgh 12/11/2006 13:30:31

Tommy Belfast

Belfast now there's a place to talk about murderous religious extremism.

Maybe you can tell us where in the bible its says its ok for Catholics to murder protestants and vice versa.

Would you like to see Islam transformed in the same way you buggers transformed Christianity?

Fit to live in your society? You have got to be taking the p***.

And maybe you could tone down your Orange marches until they become as peaceful as an Islamic demonstration in Gaza or Beirut.

12

Itchy,

12/11/2006 13:33:48

Tommy, great comments.


Ignore anything that Marxist buffoon Chomsky has to say, btw.

13

,

12/11/2006 13:46:43
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason: Scotsman Import, Original comment id: 163194, Article id was mapped to record!
14

zauberdachs,

12/11/2006 14:39:12

hmmm...as entertaining as it is to read you hardmen "burning" each other... no wait it's not.

What is this article supposed to be telling us? That Muslims feel torn between their old culture and the culture of their country? well duh.

Anyone with half a brain knows the problem and can understand what the Muslim community is going through. They might not have the exact same experience but most people have been in the position of choosing between different competeing cultures. Believe it or not most British people have to choose between one fo the various modern cultures of today over one of the various old time cultures of their parents. Many people choose different sub-cultures that put themselves distinctly at odds with their parents values and society as a whole.

So Muslims feel "misunderstood locally, under-represented nationally" and "They feel like their whole way of life has come under attack." This is probably how every teenager wearing bling jewelry and a hoodie feels.

The hard questions, which are really of interest, are what is the real problem and what are the real prospective solutions. I would suggest that the real problem is that people are being influenced by the media to living in fear (just like they lived in fear of anarchists, nilhist, soviet infiltrators, mods, rockers, punk rockers, bikers, IRA..... the list goes on) of a almost non-existant threat. I would suggest that "compassion, communication and choice" is a very vague solution.

15

tommy,

belfast uk 12/11/2006 15:39:49

To Peter and Mike
What the both of you have shown is a complete ignorance of islam and what it is.,You seem to be confusing it with some form of christianity which it most certainly is not ---probably closer to the antithesis of it
and for that matter,other religions

Educate yourselves before its too late
http://www.faithfreedom.org/
http://www.news.faithfreedom.org/
www.jihadwatch.org

16

Mike,

Edinburgh 12/11/2006 16:07:00

15 Tommy

And the worst of it is you sound serious and sincere you poor deluded bugger.

Islam bad all other religions good is that how it goes?

And you livin in Belfast tae.

Go and visit the falls road and Shankhill if you dare because I bet you'll only survive in one of them.

17

Box Back Blogger,

Edinburgh 12/11/2006 16:10:47

Poster 14:

You've made a number of valid points and by in large I agree. Muslims arer not the only minority who feel torn. However, I don't think it's fair to trivialise their religion as the latest fad as comparing it to 'bling' and 'hoodies' does.

Also, you mentin that the author of the article is vague in trying to suggest solutions. I don't think he's presenting 'compassion, communication and freedom of choice as a solution,' but a prerequisite.

Poster 15:

I think you're comment to Peter and Mike is slighty hypocritical as you obviously have little idea of what Islam is. I don't recall that they ever claimed to 'know' what Islam is. They were clear about staining their opinion. You state everything like it's a fact, and you have no evidence to back it up.

18

Box Back Blogger,

Edinburgh 12/11/2006 16:15:16

Oops, sory about the spelling and grammar. Hangover kicking in as usual!

19

zauberdachs,

12/11/2006 16:55:59

Tommy, fantastic links. I've got to admit i've never really taken the time to read the neo-conservative, rightwing Christian, George Bush perspective on Islam. Thanks it was truely an education like you suggested.

my favourite dire qoute from faithfreedom;

"Muslims procreate much faster than any other group and they will soon become the majority. But as long as they are confined to Islamic countries they can pose no threat to others. Their growth will reduce them into poverty and hence their threats will be diminished. The danger is when they are allowed to increase in number in non-Muslim countries. If this trend is not stopped we will lose the battle to Islam in this century and will become second class citizens in our own countries."

and something bordering on sensible from Jihadwatch;

"Well, Islam, like all other religions, should be respected, worshipped and cherished. Whatever they do is up to them and as long as they do not issue threats, kill infidels and hate Jews, it's all good."

20

HIS,

Edinburgh 12/11/2006 18:05:54

Kriss Donald was not a "young white man". He was a child, and he was not killed by cultural limbo.

21

Itchy,

12/11/2006 21:38:57

"Just like you did by posting at 12 fcukwit."

Always good to see someone take the intellectual high ground.

Chomsky is still a Marxist buffoon, btw.

22

Moz,

USA 13/11/2006 06:55:16

Interesting article. I moved to the USA from UK a few years back and have seen some good and bad things when it comes to "multi culturalism".

I am not going to argue whether multi culturalism is a good or bad thing. What I do believe that it is inevitable. Fighting multi culturalism in today's globalizing world is similar to fighting the industrial revolution in the 18th century. It's going to happen. It's in all of our interests to figure out how to make it work, not fight it.

In the US, there are many different cultures who proudly uphold their heritage. People say I am "Scottish American" or "Irish American" or "Polish American", in fact you can append any country or region in from of America. They maintain their sense of identity by organizing their own cultural gatherings and promoting their heritage. And then they just merge into mainstream American society, swearing allegiance to the flag and the laws. I love this model. It allows people to express themselves and still fit into the broader society without anyone enforcing anyones views on anyone else.

More recently however, the US has seen some set backs. Bigoted right wingers from the Bible belt have been trying to enforce their religious viewpoints on the country more firmly, from abortion to the ten commandments in court. This has rubbed off on the country as a whole, with growing need for native folks to exert their "identity". And in foreign affairs, this comes across as a new form of cultural imperialism and us and them struggle.

It doesn't have to be that way. Religion and cultural heritage can be private things, in the hands of individuals to preserve and promote. The country as a whole should have a standard on which it then operates, with no one cutlture being given favor. That's what makes Britain different from France and such a bastion of liberalism in the world. We don't want to lose that.

For those Brits that

23

tommy,

13/11/2006 08:42:37

zauberdachs said
Tommy, fantastic links. I've got to admit i've never really taken the time to read the neo-conservative, rightwing Christian, George Bush perspective on Islam. Thanks it was truely an education like you suggested.

or taken the time to read anything -- probably down to the failing educartion system

24

DH,

Edinburgh 13/11/2006 12:15:29

I read this article and then I read the comments. The two seemed so wildly inconsistent that I read the article again.

What exactly is so offensive about what Mosarrof wrote? To me it seems like a very balanced and honest insight into the life of British Muslims; a nice change from the sensationalist muck that normally gets published on this topic.

25

sandy,

Penna,USA 13/11/2006 16:52:07

#22--moz--our elected officials have given the foreigners a very wide berth, with their own communities, language, policing & no one dare say anything because of "multiculturalism" which embodies all of our civil rights. most foreigners, muslims, mexicans, cubans etc. wave or display their own country's flag in their communities. they don't want to integrate into our American society except to take our benefits. you talk about "bigoted right wingers from the bible belt"? well m'dear they're Americans, born here!!! the "Ten Commandments" is part of our "Judeo Christian Heritage", & many of these groups through the ACLU are trying to do away with it. the radical "fundamentalists" are the minority, but have the attention of the media because they are religious radicals. you say; "this country as a whole should have a standard on which it operates, w/no one culture being given favor". you sound just like ever foreigner in America that wants to change our culture!!!!! we live by our "Constitution" & we have an American culture, accept it or get the hell out!!! the immigrants from Europe at the turn of the century thru the '50's, made this country what it is today. they, however wanted to become,UScitizens learn english & our way of life, they all worked,
& many started their own businesses. they became proud, productive American citizens, unlike those of today that want to take advantage of our hospitality.

26

Moz,

USA 14/11/2006 04:43:44

Sandy - apologies if I offended you in the post. My intention was to convey that the US is where it is today BECAUSE of immigrants. I am sure once upon a time the Irish, Polish, Germans, French etc were all considered immigrants. Most Americans are descendants of these immigrants now. The Mexicans, Cubans and others may one day be considered American too. The same will happen in Britain I am sure.

Contrary to what most people believe, immigrants serve you food, wash toilets and mow lawns. Without them there would be jobs for Americans, but not ones they would like. Immigrants don't take jobs or welfare in the US. They may do more so in UK, which is one reason to curb welfare altogether.

Finally, the US constitution was written with the explicit assumption that church and state do not mix. Revisionist historians may say otherwise, but they should read the text.

Anyways, as #24 says, this article is a little narrower in scope and well written. No need to take it off track further.

27

sandy,

Penna, USA 14/11/2006 11:25:44

#26--Moz--we have two types of immigrants, legal & illegal. the majority of Mexicans since '84 are "illegal" 27mil +, & they aren't interested in assimilating into American life. yes they do those jobs you mentioned, however, they are also working in construction, for sub/contractors, beef & chicken processing plants, plumbers, electricians, brick/layers, retail, & on & on. these are jobs Americans had & were given to illegals for lower pay, & less benefits. that is a fact. i lived in Santa Monica,Ca, & on the corner of 11th & Colorado ave.
6 days a week the illegal day/workers waited to be picked up by the sub/contractors, & that is against the law, but the city officials looked the other way. that & the taxes we paid for services for illegals is why we retired to Pa. we did business w/mexicans who made this country their own w/pride as US citizens, that are angered by the illegals. the muslims, whether legal, illegal, or citizens, from
Arab nations as a whole, will NOT assimilate, although they do take advantage of our services, & good will. most Cubans are here out of fear of Castro, & they have become citizens & have assimilated while keeping their heritage alive for many intend to return someday. these are the differences between immigrants that came thru "Ellis Island" & those of today. BTW, illegals get social security, thanks to the dem. Congress in the late '80's. thanks for your response---------

28

sandy,

Penna, USA 14/11/2006 12:29:23

#26--Moz-- "anyways, as # 24 says, this article is a little narrower in scope & well written. no need to take it off track"---i was responding to your post!
within the article, he writes: "there is a growing complacency within the indigenous community that it should be Muslims who make the effort to integrate". people from other countries SHOULD be the ones to integrate & assimilate into their new country. why were the parents of the 3/Pakistan youths not aware of their "pent-up tensions" & get them help before they felt the need to murder Kriss Donald? "Blairs propaganda has aided the recruitment of home-grown terrorists to al-Qaeda's network". a very regrettable statement, this is.

29

sandy,

Penna, USA 14/11/2006 12:40:00

#6--Tommy--great post!!! the Muslim community, as a whole, in the USA did NOT publicly condem the murders of 3,000 innocents on 9/11/01. their cowards & would never get away w/th type of demonstrations i saw in the UK. we-the-people would object-------strongly--------

30

Box Back Blogger,

Edinburgh 14/11/2006 13:20:31

Sandy:

1. If integration is approached from both sides, the process would be much faster don't you agree?

2. I thought the article made it quite clear that the reason why their parents weren't aware was because they youths were isolated. Also, what help are you suggesting. Are you aware of any such schemes in Scotland that deal with dislocated Asian Muslim youths - you live in the USA don't you. In fact, do you even know where Scotland is?

3. Not sure what your point is here about regretable statements. Are you?

31

sandy,

Penna, USA 14/11/2006 17:04:45

#30--BBB--1.--no, i firmly believe the new immigrants must show their willingness to assimilate & then they will get help from the natives. 2.--from the article: "unwillingness among Muslim parents to allow their children to mix freely"
thats the only time the "PARENTS" are mentioned.
the parents weren't "isolated" from their parents, were they? if not, they should have known the trouble ahead.
3.--the fact that he puts blame on Blair & not at the doorstep of the killers & ultimately the parents.

32

Clansman,

Scotland 15/11/2006 10:41:01

Mike 2
I spend a lot of time travelling around the world, just back from a few days in the Middle East, odd but I have a lot of Muslims who are friends strange, don't you think. One of the great things about the world is the different cultures. I will defends everyones right to live in their country in their culture with their people. Including ours, what's wrong with that.

Our history is what it is, you cant change it, today is now, tomorrow the future. Do you care if your children grow up in Scotland or the UK understand who we are as a nation, is there nothing in our our culture worth defending.

How many of the in about comers are willing to meet us halfway, because upto now it's been one way traffic and not in our direction.

Do you have any values???

33

Budgie,

Scotland 16/11/2006 14:56:27

It is not all Asians who want to mould the culture of the country to accommodate the one prevailing in their countries of origin, and I agree with Clansman when he says that the Muslims brought any problems here with them. The trouble is, they appear to be intent on increasing them, rather than addressing them.
It is remarkable how adherents of Hindu, Sikh and other faiths find that our national culture does not seem to conflict with theirs. The Muslim community - or at least, the malcontents within it - would be well advised to follow their example. if a backlash is to be avoided.
I am not a supporter of BNP, but I do believe that these individuals who wreak havoc among us are also the BNP's best recruiters.


 

Comment on this Story

 

In order to post comments you must Register or Sign In

 
 
 
  

 
 


Sister Newspapers:
Press Complaints Commission

This website and its associated newspaper adheres to the Press Complaints Commission’s Code of Practice. If you have a complaint about editorial content which relates to inaccuracy or intrusion, then contact the Editor by clicking here.

If you remain dissatisfied with the response provided then you can contact the PCC by clicking here.