Help Sitemap Home Skip Navigation Contact Us Disability Statement

 
 
Wednesday, 9th July 2008

Premium Article !

Your account has been frozen. For your available options click the below button.

Options

Premium Article !

To read this article in full you must have registered and have a Premium Content Subscription with the The Scotsman site.

Subscribe

Registered Article !

To read this article in full you must be registered with the site.

Sign In
Register

Cardinal to claim media biased against Catholic education



Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image

THE leader of Scotland's Roman Catholics is expected to express "disappointment" at the lack of positive media coverage given to Catholic schools in Scotland.
Speaking at the Catholic Headteachers' Association of Scotland conference today in Crieff, Cardinal Keith O'Brien will praise the dedication and commitment of Catholic teachers.

But he will claim there is a "determined and blatant bias" against Catholic education in the Scottish media.

He will also call on the leaders of Scotland's political parties to follow Alex Salmond's lead by celebrating rather than tolerating Catholic education.

In a strongly-worded call he will say: "I challenge them – quite simply – to tell the truth about Catholic schools in Scotland: to acknowledge their considerable contribution to Scotland's welfare, to recognise their distinctive provision, to praise their achievements and to pledge their support."

He will also say the time for grudging acceptance and outright hostility toward Catholic schools is in the past.





The full article contains 160 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Boy Wonder,

01/05/2008 08:52:33
O'Brien would like us all to go back a few hundred years when his type ruled in Scots homes, whether we plebs liked it or not. Fat Chance, Cardy! Even ex-catholics like me have seen you lot for what you are!

End religious intereference now!
2

James,,

01/05/2008 09:04:02
Simple answer then - don't send your children to a Catholic school. No-one is forcing you to.
3

zeno,

www.thinkhumanism.com 01/05/2008 09:24:09
Perhaps, James, but I am forced to pay for it.
4

James,,

01/05/2008 10:05:59
zeno #3,

Everyone pays taxes. Why should the education system we all pay for reflect your wishes and not mine?

If schools do not have enough pupils, simple economics will dictate that they close. Catholic schools, which no-one is forced to attend, are obviously popular with parents.
5

Calum Crubag,

01/05/2008 13:02:56
Isn't the Cardinal and his church 'biased' i.e. predjudiced against a whole raft of people and issues.

Remember what these people did when they had the power.

We really need to leave tribal supersticions (i.e. madness!) in the past.
6

,

01/05/2008 13:28:14
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
7

,

01/05/2008 13:29:16
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
8

,

01/05/2008 13:34:48
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
9

,

01/05/2008 13:38:44
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
10

,

01/05/2008 13:46:05
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
11

An Honest Wifie,

01/05/2008 14:29:27
Most comments about Catholic schools usually come from ignoramuses who have never actually been inside a Catholic school.

They just use it as an excuse to let their bigotted bile spew forth.
12

zeno,

www.thinkhumanism.com 01/05/2008 16:45:06
An Honest Wife: I sincerely hope neither of your comments was aimed at me, but were based on some stereotypical image you got from somewhere. However, your ad hominem attack does nothing to advance this discussion.

James said: "Why should the education system we all pay for reflect your wishes and not mine?"

I don't know why you assumed that, but that's not what I would argue for. The tax payer should not be funding any ideology - Catholic or otherwise. Schools are for education - they are not for "daily prayers, liturgies and Masses" as O'Brien claims in his speech. The place for those - if parents must - is in the home or church.
13

James,,

01/05/2008 17:02:40
#12,

If tax payers must pay for the education system (and they must) then the education system should meet the taxpayers' requirements.

If a sufficient number of tax payers want the education system they pay for to offer the option of Catholic education, then I see no problem with public funding for Catholic education.

It should also be remembered that the position of Catholic schools is protected by the 1918 Education (Scotland) Act, which transferred the ownership of the already existing Catholic schools to the local education authorities.
14

zeno,

www.thinkhumanism.com 01/05/2008 17:57:23
James: So by your logic, if a sufficient number (whatever that is) of Muslim taxpayers want the education system they pay for to offer the option of Muslim education, then you would see no problem with public funding? Or Moonies. Or Raelians. Or Pagans.
15

Calum Crubag,

01/05/2008 20:26:29
#11 HOnest Wifie. Don't fool yourself. Go to the shared Dalkeith campus and find out about the bigotry of the Catholic head there. Even the teachers aren't allowed to mix in the staffroom - the 'non-doms' will 'pollute their spiritual purity'. Pics of the Pope and crucifixes have also appeared in shared corridors.

The Catholics bring bigotry onto themselves. If two weeks ago i'd complained about paedophile priests, i'd have been called a bigot. Now the Pope himself has finally come out an apologised, then it's ok.

Get your own minds. Sheep.
16

Corky,

taking a short break from revisionville 01/05/2008 23:40:33
Mr Crubag,

I've gone to Catholic schools all my life and nothing you write reflects my experience. I've had a great time. I don't understand why you are so aggressive. You seem to live in a completely different world from me. I just don't understand why you say such horrible things.

17

James,,

02/05/2008 12:52:22
#14,

A fine use of reductio ad absurdam.

There are one or two state-funded Muslim schools in Britain, and whereas I am instrisically uneasy about the concept, I accept the right of Muslim taxpayers to have state-funding for the schools they want. They have no option after all to have the "education" portion of their taxes refunded.

How likely is it though, that "pagans" would demand their own schools in sufficient numbers to make such a school financially viable?

If a sufficient number of taxpayers demanded it, would you support humanist, or atheist schools?

Finally, your argument does not by itself prove that state-funding for Catholic schols should not be allowed. Why do you have a problem with Catholic schools, if Catholic taxpayers are contributing enough to the system to support them?

18

zeno,

www.thinkhumanism.com 03/05/2008 00:42:43
James: There is no right for Muslims to expect state-funded Muslim schools. Under current education law, there is, unfortunately, a right for the Catholics church to control state-funded Catholic schools, but there is no such right under the European Convention of Human Rights that O'Brien mentioned in his speech. Also, the discrimination that is carried out by Local Councils on behalf of the Catholic Church is contradictory to equality law and common sense.

You need to ask yourself what is it that makes you uneasy about Muslim schools. Is it anything to do with indoctrination? Understand this and you may understand why many of us oppose state-funded Catholic schools.

Why does the fact that you think pagans are not likely to ask for state-funded pagan schools affect the argument about whether they should be entitled to them?

No, I would not support 'Humanist' schools (nor atheist schools). Indoctrination of any kind is anathema to education - regardless of whether I align myself Humanism, Catholicism or whatever.

Catholic schools are propped up by the State: if catholic control was to be removed from state-funded Catholic schools, then the overall bill for education would be less, because of the current significant overlap in staff, buildings and other resources.
19

Calum Crubag,

03/05/2008 09:03:08
#18 - agree, though an atheist, it's important that children are taught to think and consider. Not just to blindly follow whatever parents or teachers tell them, especially one set of religious beliefs.

If the religious are so strong in their faith, why do they need to indoctrinate children and not leave them to make up their own minds when old enough?
20

Em,

03/05/2008 10:32:05
zeno

Education at Catholic schools is not just about adding prayers to the curriculum, one of the reasons so many parents send their child to a catholic school is that they are given peace of mind that issues that are contrary to their own principals will not be promoted to their children, for example, recently ministers have been claiming "children must have compulsory lessons on the benefits of abortion"
Notice they are not pushing for lessons on abortion, but lessons on the BENEFITS of abortion. In other words they wish to promote abortion in only a good light while disregarding the problems that can result from it.

Could this not be classed as indoctrination? and would you be happy for your child to be exposed to these issues in such a one sided manner, or do you think all children should be controlled by the state and parents should not be allowed any say in what is taught to their child?

21

zeno,

www.thinkhumanism.com 03/05/2008 18:48:45
Em said: recently ministers have been claiming "children must have compulsory lessons on the benefits of abortion"

Sources for this please.
22

Corky,

04/05/2008 02:06:59
Mr Crubag,

You really are very silly as well as rude. My education has taught me to think and consider, how dare you suggest otherwise?

In fact atheism is a complete myth, a fairy tale, a sanctuary for a feeble mind. Do you indoctrinate your children with your fundementalist atheist clap trap or do you allow them free thought like my parents and teachers allowed me?

Proper analysis can only result in agnosticism as no-one can prove or disprove the existence of God. However the freedom of thought given to me by my Catholic education allows me to examine the problem from a position of knowledge, a position you would deny.

Agnosticism is a spectrum, from people who profess total faith to those who profess atheism. These extreme positions are feeble, you are feeble, nothing more than a ranting bully. Most intelligent people live on the middle reaches of this spectrum. On a recent TV programme where men lived in a monastary for a period of time, the Abbot was asked do you ever doubt your faith, he answered truthfully and wisely "Yes, often just after I have said Holy Mass."

The most offensive, disgusting and odious aspects of your posts here and elsewhere are your intolerance, ignorance, rudeness, shallowness and bigotry. You are appear to be very clever but have little wisdom or kindness.
23

Vincent-W,

04/05/2008 20:58:10
Corky - Calum can only be described as 'damaged goods.'
24

James,,

05/05/2008 10:02:41
#18,

"Catholic schools are propped up by the State"

As are non-denominational schools. Paid for by taxpayers money. Catholic as well as non-Catholic taxpayers.

"if catholic control was to be removed from state-funded Catholic schools, then the overall bill for education would be less, because of the current significant overlap in staff, buildings and other resources."

If you get rid of a Catholic school, what are you going to do with all the children who attend it? You can't just shove them into the nearest non-denominational school, which will have neither the staffing, nor the accomodation to cope with the numbers. You still need to provide a school for them, and that school will still have to be paid for by the taxpayer.

25

zeno,

www.thinkhumanism.com 08/05/2008 12:33:34
"If you get rid of a Catholic school, what are you going to do with all the children who attend it? You can't just shove them into the nearest non-denominational school, which will have neither the staffing, nor the accomodation to cope with the numbers. You still need to provide a school for them, and that school will still have to be paid for by the taxpayer."

I said nothing about closing down any schools. All that needs to happen is the Catholic church's control to be removed. Same schools, same pupils, same teachers, same paymaster. Over time, some may be consolidated/merged with current non-denominational local schools and other resources shared.
26

James,,

12/05/2008 17:23:03
#25,

"All that needs to happen is the Catholic church's control to be removed."

All that needs to happen is that you either accept that Catholic schools provide a good education for the
children in their care, or they do not.

If they do not, then prove it and we can close them down. If they do, there is no reason to close them whatsoever.
27

zeno,

www.thinkhumanism.com 17/05/2008 10:59:47
As I said, it's nothing to to do with closing them down, just removing the discriminatory religious control over them!

 

Comment on this Story

 

In order to post comments you must Register or Sign In

 
 
RSS Feed of this article's comments
Delivery formats: RSS, Atom, Javascript & Email
 
  

 
 


Sister Newspapers:
Press Complaints Commission

This website and its associated newspaper adheres to the Press Complaints Commission’s Code of Practice. If you have a complaint about editorial content which relates to inaccuracy or intrusion, then contact the Editor by clicking here.

If you remain dissatisfied with the response provided then you can contact the PCC by clicking here.