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Baptised children to be given priority as RC primaries fill up



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Published Date: 12 March 2008
CATHOLIC primary schools in the Capital face being asked to cap numbers of non-baptised pupils following increasing demand from Eastern European families.
St Mary's RC in Leith, which is suffering major capacity pressure, has already been identified as one which will have to prioritise baptised Catholics from next year.

A number of RC schools in parts of the city, like Leith, are reaching bursting point due to the influx of Eastern European immigrants.

Recent figures show there are 3490 youngsters in Edinburgh for whom English is not their native tongue, with Polish the most common language after English.

In addition to this, RC schools have also become increasingly popular with non-Catholic children, who have the option of attending either a denominational or non-denominational school within their catchment area.

Previously, additional classes have been created to cater for the demand from non-baptised pupils, but now the city council is proposing to stop the practice due to a "combination of accommodation and budgetary pressures".

A report outlining the expected August intake for primary one and first year pupils says: "Accommodation issues are now arising in more denominational schools which are attracting a large non-denominational population and increased numbers of Roman Catholics due to Eastern European immigration.

"The increased demand for places in more of Edinburgh's denominational schools is now resulting in the formation of additional classes (to accommodate] catchment pupils who are not baptised RC pupils.

"Due to a combination of accommodation and budgetary pressures it is proposed that additional classes are not formed in denominational RC schools."

The report reveals St Mary's will only have the capacity for an intake of 30 pupils in 2009 due to the growing demands for places. This year there are 50 catchment pupils registered for the school.

Five other primaries – Corstorphine, Towerbank, Ferryhill, Preston Street and St Mary's in East London Street – are also facing problems meeting catchment needs. The council said measures will be introduced to solve the issues.

Meanwhile, it has emerged that all secondaries in the city will be able to comfortably cope with their catchment demands for the first time, with places being available for all pupils at their catchment school without the need to increase intake limits.

Education leaders say this is the first indication of the knock-on effect falling pupils numbers in the city's primaries are having on secondary schools.

Edinburgh's education leader, Councillor Marilyne MacLaren, said: "The council's aim is to ensure that pupils have the option of attending their catchment school.

"The current figures show that there are six primary schools where we are introducing other measures to accommodate catchment children over the next two years."

Edinburgh City Council website

The full article contains 461 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 12 March 2008 1:32 PM
  • Source: Edinburgh Evening News
  • Location: Edinburgh
 
1

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 12/03/2008 11:38:16
Tell them aw tae run aboot in the rain in the playgroon...that'l baptise them awrite...welcome tae Scotland....
2

Calum Crubag,

12/03/2008 12:22:51
Better idea... close these divisive faith schools that indoctrinate children with one (unprovable) view of the world and a whole lot of Biblical bigotry that accompanies it.

Leave religion to the dark ages.
3

mig,

Edinburgh 12/03/2008 12:27:52
#2 A better idea, surely, is to get the non-denom schools up to the standard of RC schools. The article said pressure is building due, in part, to non-denom pupils going to RC schools.
4

steve 1511,

aberdeen 12/03/2008 12:46:05
any school in scotland should be open to any child no matter their religion they go to school to learn not to be indoctrinated into religion
5

me150,

12/03/2008 13:00:11
Definitely get rid of sepearte schools for different religions but also...........as much as I like the many friends I have that are not from this country it is about time we shut the door to immigrants.
6

Unimpressed one,

12/03/2008 13:00:12
#4, Entirely agree with your sentiments, but this is Scotland, where religion, drink, football and politics are meat and drink to many.
7

brettgallacher,

edinburgh 12/03/2008 13:31:50
now the truth is coming out after the lies the anti scottish led us to believe about falling population rate i quote schools are full to bursting because of mass migrants taking up school places in which they got together and decide lets take over that school and that school and that school where i stay my daughter was refused a place at school that she was in nursery her brother was at school and my family ie cousins brothers sisters nieces nephews had went to for years solely so the migrants could hand pick the school they wanted to take over most of them dont even stay in edinburgh
8

Labradoodle,

12/03/2008 14:06:46
#7 It is maybe not a bad thing your daughter didn't get into the same school you attended..

Migrants aren't getting the pick of schools, their children either go to the local school or they apply for another school just the same as anybody else does.
9

Em,

12/03/2008 14:13:30
Clearly some people have a problem with the fact that Catholic schools exist, why? It's not like these folk are forced to send their children to such a school, yet they wish to deny others the right to do so.
If people didn't want Catholic schools, they wouldn't exist, but the fact that there are so many proves the opposite.
I suggest those who have a problem with this focus on raising their own children and allow others to do the same.
10

brettgallacher,

edinburgh 12/03/2008 14:24:16
ma bum poodle what world do you live in plus i work my oldest daughter works her boyfriend was an asian what you trying to say that my opinion /facts are wrong or cant you read whats in black and white these are facts/ truth plain and simple plus 3490 children costs me a tax payer over 10million just to send them to school never mind the child benfit tax credits nhs treatment etc so wake upand smell the kebab
11

brettgallacher,

edinburgh 12/03/2008 14:27:17
i dont mind if a school is catholic prodestant etc i thought all you were there for was to learn to read and write and basically do your sums but not now countless miilions are wasting on trying to teach our children the migrants language and this is at primary were 99.99% of people will ever have any use for a foreign language
12

NorT,

Edinburgh 12/03/2008 14:54:10
There should be no such thing as a catholic or protestant school. There should only be a school. I thought we were trying to get rid of sectarinism not increase it.
13

,

12/03/2008 15:02:47
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
14

Labradoodle,

12/03/2008 15:03:11
Frank Gallacher, you are barely capable of stringing a coherent sentence together. Perhaps your child would be better off at a school that teaches some degree of grammar.
15

J G W,

12/03/2008 15:06:12
Interesting postmodernist take on punctuation there, Brett.
16

,

12/03/2008 15:12:24
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
17

talk107,

12/03/2008 16:17:16
great post number 2....number 3 is just being a smart-T-pants, albeit correct about raising the standards.

#8 fresian, does CofS stand for Cult of Satan?

Personally I worship Thor..you can get hammered every day...its the way forward....

I can't beleive there is so much store put in a book (the bible) that the final version (author St Jerome) completed 350 years after the death of the main character. Revisionist history or what?

In fact, I want Thor schools everywhere and every Thursday will be a great celebration of Odin and the Valkyries will take away any non-acheivers...that'll keep number 3 happy.
18

FrankyB,

brightdom 12/03/2008 17:00:08
Why do we tolerate this divisive indoctrination?
Why does my taxes pay for this borg-base-assimilation?
Is the act of 'indoctrination' or 'mind programming' not a form of abuse? Can we not call the police?

If religious groups think it 'ok' to ban abortion on the grounds it'll kill a 'child' what about these very same groups having the right to 'poison' our children's minds and claim our taxes to pay for it? Better have them live fettered to religion than die free?
When will they (not us) grow up?
Why are people that don't believe in religion designated as 'a-theists'? If these believers don't believe in fairies do we call them a-fairists? If they don't believe in tooth-fairies do we call them a-toothfairyists? The correct word for atheist is 'bright'. So use it!
People that 'believe' are weak and intellectual cowards (if they they do have the capacity to reason but abdicate this capacity to a theocratic fool that knows know better). They are frightened of their own mortality because they are vain self-centered cowards.

19

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 12/03/2008 17:56:33
10..Em..these schools are primarily for indoctrination not education....and this is soooo wrong because the most important people in all of this....the little children...have their choices removed from them...brainwashed from an early age they (being little vessels and sponges) are filled will religious ideology that should not be forced upon them....

Ban all religious schools and set free the children...
20

Von Trippenhoff,

12/03/2008 18:43:13
'CATHOLIC primary schools in the Capital face being asked to cap numbers of non-baptised pupils'

Who exactly is asking these schools to cap the numbers of non-baptised pupils? Surely all schools have to abide by some sort of anti-discrimination legislation?

#20 All schools are for the purpose of indoctination in one form or another, setting them 'free' of religion only leaves them in the hands of other interested parties I'm afraid.
21

Evia,

12/03/2008 20:28:14
Ban religion in schools, except when taught as a subject, covering all recognised religions.
22

Reckless,

The EU is the new Roman Empire 12/03/2008 21:18:57
Do they have to be baptised into Satan's RC Church?
23

COLINTON.MAINS,

Oakville Ontario 13/03/2008 02:37:22
its the muslims you should be worrying about pretty soon you will be going to there schools
24

zeno,

GLASGOW 13/03/2008 07:46:41
I don't know where this idea that RC schools are 'better' than non-denominational ones (OK I do know who spreads that rumour), but it is unfounded - there is no evidence that they are any better. There are good RC schools - of course there are - but there are also bad RC schools, just like there are good and bad non-denominational schools.

As for the ridiculous suggestion that it's only RC schools that instil morals or values...utter nonsense.

Also, it is not a right of parents to have their children indoctrinated in their religion at the State's expense.
25

Cheradenine,

Edinburgh 13/03/2008 10:17:33
#19 Saying that your an atheist is still a belief statement, you have still made a judgement based on evidence.

Although you can maybe disprove a lot of Catholic you cannot disprove God's existence.

If you’re going to make sweeping statements at least back them up with a sound argument rather than an epistemological mess of a rant. I trust you do have a theoretically sound argument? You wouldn't want to be accused of being a "theoretic fool".
26

A McBay,

Edinburgh 13/03/2008 10:36:52
26#

"Although you can maybe disprove a lot of Catholic you cannot disprove God's existence."

Actually, Cheradenine, it befalls those who claim that God exists to prove that he does, not for others to disprove it. Otherwise you are effectively saying that someone has to disprove to you what you yourself can't prove to them!

Religious believers do themselves no favours by deflecting the argument about the existence of god by hiding behind the "you can't prove he doesn't" argument. It reduces the debate to the level of "you can't disprove there are fairies at the bottom of my garden".

You can't disprove the existence of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, for example.
27

Cheradenine,

Edinburgh 13/03/2008 10:55:40
#27 I don't disagree with that per se, although I don't think that you have to prove the existence of something to believe in it. I do believe in God but I am aware I can't prove it, I don't have to, I have only made a personal judgement based on the evidence.

It is the same with Atheism, you have to believe that God does not exist as you can't prove it. If you don't Atheism is a belief statement there is no point in the term and your either agnostic or you don't care. You have to have an argument and be aware you can't prove anything, there are good ones but #19 didn't use any of them. Again you just make a personal judgement based on the evidence, it's akin to religion (in fact a lot of theologists call Atheism a religion).

I'm am not saying that there are not people on both sides that believe each position blindly, but I think that is a very dangerous position and am concerned that it is the very one #19 has taken. Blind faith can lead to nasty things like crusades or Stalinism.
28

Cheradenine,

Edinburgh 13/03/2008 10:59:18
should read "If you don't concede that Atheism is a belief statement"
29

leith keely,

edinburgh 13/03/2008 11:32:53
personally, i`m an athiest, thank god!.
30

Cheradenine,

Edinburgh 13/03/2008 11:59:00
That must be fresian.
31

Em,

13/03/2008 13:55:53
#20 Doreen

your statement only goes to highlight your ignorance over what takes place in faith schools.

You said "these schools are primarily for indoctrination not education"

If that were the case you would expect these schools to be represented at the bottom of the league tables, but in fact the opposite is true.

The reality is, R.E does not take up a large part of the curriculum and when taught it encompasses a variety of issues including knowledge of and respect for other religions.

One of the reasons parents send their children to a faith school is that they are given peace of mind issues that are contrary to their own principals will not be promoted to their children.
for example, currently ministers are claiming
"children must have compulsory lessons on the benefits of abortion"
Notice they are not pushing for lessons on abortion, but lessons on the BENEFITS of abortion. In other words they wish to promote abortion in only a good light while disregarding the problems that can result from it.
Indoctrination at it's best.
32

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 13/03/2008 17:24:32
I stand by my statement Em....I come from a Catholic family and I know EXACTLY what goes in in Catholic schools...Perhaps these schools are at the top end of the league tables, which is admirable yes, but so what? a better standard of education is much to be desired but at the expense of a free mind?...no thank you...

I come from a hard area of Glasgow Em...where children hate each other for being Catholic or Protestant and they have no idea why...it is drummed into them by their elders and this sorry situation is exacerbated by seperate school playgrounds....how can you, as a child, understand your neighbour when you are isolated from them?....children need to make up their own minds in a safe environment, where they can see that their little Catholic/Protestant neighbour is not someone to be distrusted or hated....

Schools should teach all faiths but practise none...they can organise that outside of school...

As far as the abortion issue is concerned, as far as I am aware you can remove your child from these lessons if you want. If I was a parent I would want to know exactly what is being taught to my child. I would not wish my child to be taught about abortion at primary school, at secondary school yes, but only with my full knowledge of the content of the lesson, and my approval...if this were to portray abortion as something that teenagers can be blasé or nonchalant about then I would be furious....but for the sake of educative purposes then yes...I am for it....let teenagers debate amongst themselves, be given the full information and come to their own conclusions...However as far as the 'benefits' are concerned, this is rather a tasteless description of what is a horrendous, but sometimes necessary proceedure..
33

Em,

13/03/2008 20:48:05
Doreen, As a kid I attended a Catholic school but outside of school around half of my friends were either Protestant or of no faith and it wasn't even an issue.
It is evident however that bigotry is an issue with some kids, but I don't believe this has resulted from seperate schools, I think football has played a role in the divide we see, the whole ethos that if you support this team you're a Catholic and if you support that team you're a protestant only serves to fuel the bigotry we see. there are also plenty of bad parents out there, not only do they not adress bigotry when they see it arise in their child but encourage it by the bad example they set.
My opinion is that the abolishment of Faith schools would do nothing to solve this problem, if we could remove the religious aspect from football we would probably see a big difference but how to go about that, I don't know.
34

A McBay,

Edinburgh 13/03/2008 23:17:21
28#

"It is the same with Atheism, you have to believe that God does not exist as you can't prove it. If you don't Atheism is a belief statement there is no point in the term and your either agnostic or you don't care."

I disagree. Atheism means literally an absence of belief. What you are suggesting here is the equivalent of saying that NOT collecting stamps is still a hobby!

And you are wrong about agnostics. I refer you to George H Smith's book Atheism - The Case Against God in which he explains why agnostics don't get off so lightly. Theism and atheism separate those who believe in a god from those who don't. Agnosticism separates those who believe reason cannot penetrate the supernatural realm, from those who defend the capability of reason to either affirm or deny the truth of theistic belief
35

JPF,

14/03/2008 15:45:15
These schools seem to be more for Poles, Sikhs and Pakistanis than proper British kids. I don't think these schools should be tolerated. They should be sent to the normal schools like everybody else.

Big Kenny Bluenose
36

JPF,

14/03/2008 15:52:15
My post was meant to be ironic before anyone leaps down my throat...

 

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