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Road safety focus is shifting from cameras to speed alerts



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Published Date: 01 May 2008
MORE electronic signs that tell speeding drivers to slow down are to be introduced in the Capital after helping to reduce accidents by 60 per cent.
The signs are activated by cars breaking the speed limit, which causes them to flash a message urging drivers to put on the brakes.

Six of the £5000 signs are already in place at accident blackspots, and the city council is now set to double this
number over the coming year. Another 13 signs are also already in use at the police's mobile speed camera sites.

A study of 50 new sites will be carried out by the council to create a priority list, and the scheme could be rolled out again in later years.

The warnings are likely to appear on roads with a 30mph limit, particularly where speed bumps are impractical.

Research shows that a driver is twice as likely to kill someone when driving at 35mph than at 30mph.

A sign was activated at Muirhouse Parkway in March last year, and the number of speeding drivers has dropped by more than ten per cent since then, while a warning on Lanark Road West led to a 5.8 per cent fall.

The six existing signs on Lang Loan Road, Craigmillar Castle Road, Riccarton Mains Road, Comiston Road, Lanark Road and Addiston Mains were erected between 2005 and last February, alongside other road safety measures, and the accident rate subsequently fell by an average of 60 per cent.

Councillors will be asked to approve the increase in speed alert signs at a committee meeting next week.

City transport leader Phil Wheeler said: "Installing further signs at key hotspots should help to reinforce the message that speeding contributes to accidents and will not be tolerated."

The initiative has been championed by Tory councillor Allan Jackson, whose motion calling for an investigation into the wider use of the signs was passed at a council meeting last year.

"It's been my experience that, when these signs are in place, if a driver is exceeding the speed limit they automatically slow down," he said.

"That is something to be encouraged, as it also avoids going through the criminal procedure involved with speed cameras.

"I think this is something that will be welcomed by drivers, pedestrians and parents with young children."

Bruce Young, Lothian and Borders co-ordinator of the Association of British Drivers, welcomed the move, and said the signs should replace cameras.

"This is better for drivers, rather than speedometer-watching," he said. "Speed cameras tend to pick up drivers who have inadvertently strayed over the limit, whereas reckless drivers are careful to avoid areas with cameras." A national study into vehicle- activated signs in 2002 discovered that they led to speeds being reduced by up to 14mph.







The full article contains 473 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Randan,

01/05/2008 12:07:06
Come on Petrol Head, tell us how this is all wrong for the 'honest law abiding car driver'
2

allknowing,

01/05/2008 12:08:06
Love these things esp on Maybury road. Did you know, if you travel at 70, by the time its clocked you and displays '40', you are past it!!!!! Stupid things!
3

Padraig,

01/05/2008 12:16:43
About time too - they are much more user friendly than cameras and don't need operators or £30,000 vans. And they do the job - the only downside is that they don't earn huge dollops of revenue.

Still, with bus lane cameras and the introduction of CCTV cameras fining people for stopping for a moment even on double ellow lines or illegally doing a u-turn,that have raised tens of millions (literally) for Red Ken in London, this problem should be short term!
4

capy,

edinburgh 01/05/2008 12:26:53
i commute from currie to leith and back. i would like the opportunity to get up to 30 mph!!
5

Incandescent,

01/05/2008 12:34:17
These are much better than cameras. Though after driving Muirhouse Parkway 10 times a week for the past twelve years without seeing a single bump or crash, I challenge anyone to provide evidence that it is an "accident blackspot".
6

Voice of reason,

EDINBURGH 01/05/2008 12:43:36
4 - might I ask what is wrong with going to Hermiston Gait park-and-ride and getting the X25 bus and then another one down Leith way ? £2.50 per day .
7

Mongbuster,

Edinburgh 01/05/2008 12:44:33
There is only one speed to travel at in Muirhouse. Answers on a Postcard?
8

Incandescent,

01/05/2008 12:49:56
#7 In mz experience, for those crossing from the meridian to the bus stop on foot, it appears to be a 0.2 mph swagger.
9

Hmm ...,

01/05/2008 12:50:33
... these signs appear to be a step forward. There must be a catch somewhere. For so long, we in Edinburgh have been subjected to speed bumps, road narrowing, unnecessary bus lanes etc., anything to make life more difficult for people (what Autocar this week called "the Robert Mugabe approach to governance) that it is hard to see how it could change.

Is this the first spring shoot of the new LibDem/SNP alliance?

Oh dear no - it was promoted by a Tory!
10

Incandescent,

01/05/2008 12:51:25
What is with the html language today? y for z and so on...
11

r chee bold,

01/05/2008 12:52:59
How can these cost 5000pounds to make,surely they can be made cheaper so more could be installed.
12

Hmm ...,

01/05/2008 12:55:02
Voice (6) said "might I ask what is wrong with going to Hermiston Gait park-and-ride and getting the X25 bus and then another one down Leith way ? £2.50 per day."

Sorry Voice - three journeys to get to work. That's what's wrong.

Now listen to this - an absolute first - when the tram arrives, he will be able to go from the park & ride direct to Leith by tram. The first real beneficiary of the tram project!

Of course, he could do that now using the 22 bus, couldn't he? Or could he?
13

allknowing,

01/05/2008 12:57:10
#6,

Because the bus is full with general low life public, who cant afford a car, so are smelly and ill-mannered.

Plus, why give up a nice warm car, by yourself, compared to a sweaty, hot, stinky bus filled with scum?
14

Dileas,

01/05/2008 13:17:21
Vehicle activated signs are a Good Idea and a vote-catcher too!

Only weakness apart from the lack of revenue-generation is that too many of them would be counter-productive - they would lose their impact.

So they should be used only where there is a real danger IN exceeding the speed limit - not where Plod reckons that too many people exceed it. As Paul Smith of SafeSpeed said, because the rules said that a camera could be placed at a site only if more than 60% of traffic exceeded the limit over a measured period and because these drivers intended to drive safely, cameras could be placed only where it was relatively safe to exceed the speed limit!

I raised the issue with a senior traffic police officer who said "basically I am a law enforcement officer. If people exceed the limit, I want to stop them". Woodentop! What happened to Britain's police's admirable tradition of applied commonsense?
15

Dileas,

01/05/2008 13:27:20
Only 5% of serious accidents are caused by exceeding the speed limit. 34% are caused by inadequate attention or inappropriae response to emerging dangers (figures produced by Department for Transport, 2005) so speed limit enforcement has a low effect on accident rates.

Perhaps instead of showing drivers' speed, these signs should warn "speeding" drivers of the specific emerging danger ahead - sharp bend, hidden junction, blind drunk pedestrians ahead, etc. to help their response.
16

M.T.,

01/05/2008 13:55:16
It was only when I drove past one of the electronic signs that I realised that my speedometer was out. The accuracy of a vehicle's speedometer is not part of the MOT test and I have always considered speed cameras to be unfair and used prodominatly for revenue collecting
17

ejstubbs,

Edinburgh 01/05/2008 14:01:57
The article says "the signs are activated by cars breaking the speed limit". The one on Comiston Road seems to activate well below 40mph, which is the posted speed limit on that stretch of road. Mind you, I don't think it's a particularly good idea to drive past the Buckstone shops at 40mph anyway, but if the limit should be lower then why isn't it?
18

Alternative (High Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 01/05/2008 14:12:51
"Research shows that a driver is twice as likely to kill someone when driving at 35mph than at 30mph. "

No it does not. Research shows that someone is twice as likey to suffer serious injury during a 35mph IMPACT as opposed to a 30mph IMPACT. And the research has been carried out with pedestrian impacts in mind. The initial speed of travel has has nothing to do with it. Besides there is very little chance of a driver being killed in a 35mph impact in any case. Provided they are wearing a seat belt, a modern car will easily protect them.

Why do they put everything down to speed of travel? The most frequent causes of crashes have absolutely nothing to do with speed of travel.

So now, instead of fleecing the motorist, they are going to turn their attention to installing flashing devices to actively distract drivers when they approach a hazard. Excellent idea! Can we get them nominated for the Screaming Lord Sutch award for lunacy of the highest order?

As long as they continue to base road safety policy on speed of travel alone, we are going to see a steady increase in the amount of blood spilt on our roads. People need education, not dumbing down.
19

Alternative (High Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 01/05/2008 14:17:06
MT:

A speedo is allowed to read up to 10% high between 30-60mph. It is not allowed to read low by any amount at any time.

Were you also aware that your speedo will gradually read higher as your tyres wear down? Hence the reason for the allowed tolerance.
20

Nick Nick,

Edinburgh 01/05/2008 14:34:48
#16 & #19 - Another couple of related points:

Because car speedos are generally overoptimistic (by up to 10% as Fuel Head says), that means that when your car odometer tells you that the car has done - say - 50,000 miles, it's probably only travelled about 45,000 miles.

Also, your calculated MPG (whether by onboard computer or pencil & paper) will be similarly overoptimistic about your petrol consumption.

21

Alternative (High Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 01/05/2008 15:00:04
#20:

Correct.

The only way you can accurately measure distance is either by GPS or by means of fixed, known distance markers.

Fuel consumption is a different matter though. Lets say that the means of measuring how much fuel goes into the engine is accurate (because it probably is).

With new tyres, lets also assume that the speedo and mileometer is bang on as well.

Assume under these circumstances that you are returning 30mpg -- indicated and actual.

Now let's introduce worn tyres into the equation. When the trip computer thinks the car has travelled a mile, it will have in effect travelled less than a mile. If the reading was still 30mpg, then this figure would have to be multiplied by the actual mile distance which would leave the actual mpg figure lower.

However, we then have to take account of lower gearing due to reduced rolling diameter. This is also a significant factor and depending upon the driving style, could go either way. This would have the effect of changing the 30mph figure as read on the computer.

In a nutshell, the reading of the mpg figure is approximate and should only ever be treated as such...

...but you knew that anyway so why have I bothered writing all this???
22

James (1),

01/05/2008 15:11:21
#21 because you cannot help yourself, as you believe you know best?
23

an interested party,

01/05/2008 15:47:40
i wonder how often these 'flashing' signs are calibrated
24

Niadh,

Edinburgh 01/05/2008 16:54:35
Got to wonder if they have really looked things in detail?
Has this reduction in accidents really been down to these road signs?
Or has it been down to the fact that you cannot accelerate to a high enough speed around most of the city because of all the bloody road works?
25

Niadh,

Edinburgh 01/05/2008 16:58:29
#22 Perhaps he is trying to give the benefit of the doubt and the question was asked and answered for the rest of the people reading this?
So that people like you who probably don't take much note about the mechanics of a car understand more
26

Scotish Exile,

01/05/2008 17:32:42
Its great to check the accuracy of your speedo against these signs
27

,

01/05/2008 17:40:31
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
28

3 bears,

01/05/2008 18:12:39
It's unwise for pedestrians to do less than 30 in Muirhouse Parkway.
29

eDUCATIon,

01/05/2008 18:32:04
I speed up for corners.......
30

PhredBear,

Linlithgow 01/05/2008 18:39:44
The idea in principle is quite good. It certainly makes me aware that I am exceeding the limit when I am not conscious of it and slows me down. The problem is with placing them appropriately. There is one in Winchburgh which keeps flashing a sign saying ‘Slow Down 40 mph’ whether there are any cars or not. It never varies whatever your speed, even at 20 mph. It has lost its impact and is ignored. There is another one as you come into Linlithgow from SQF which is about 20 yards back from a roundabout so anybody who isn’t already slowing down to considerably less than 30 mph when they pass the sign is heading straight for the scene of the accident.
31

Porty Boy,

Edinburgh 01/05/2008 20:00:38
#17 I'd have thought 70 mph past the Buckstone shops would be more appropriate, to make it harder for them to position a brick through your window!
32

Pond Hall,

01/05/2008 22:55:38
high octane. what are you on?

FACT speed kills

as you've commented on the past

Its OK to speed because you think its safe to do so
Its Ok use a mobile while driving because you think its safe to do so.

Read the Highway Code it may help safe a life, too many people see everyone else as the bad driver, but never themselves.

Amazingly the other day, theres a mum (young child next to her)

Making a left hand turn, On The Mobile in a town centre...dangerous or what.

We've got one of these down our way...same thing waste of time. nobody pays any attention to it, it flashes at anything that moves.

Surprisingly, we had a are sight down our way the other day, out Boys in Blue.. For some reason despite umpteen signs advising people, countdown signs, 40mph and 30mph signs before the stretch of road, People were for some reason still braking.
33

geekpie,

forfar 02/05/2008 11:00:55
"the number of speeding drivers has dropped by more than ten per cent since then, while a warning on Lanark Road West led to a 5.8 per cent fall."

That's not very much. Put them in by all means, but more cameras are needed as well, backed up by larger fines as in Australia / New Zealand.
34

Alternative (High Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 02/05/2008 12:44:26
Pond Hall:

"FACT speed kills"

Only if you live in dreamland. Speed does not kill. Bad driving kills.

The example of the woman with the mobile phone was in all probablity, causing an un-neccessary danger and she would have been ill-advised to do what she did. However, I never said it was safe to use a phone across the board when driving.

Like with everything else whilst driving, including using a phone, lighting up a fag, tuning the radio, having a row with your wife, scratching your nose, etc etc, there are times and places where it is safe to do these things and there are times and places when it is not. Anyone can cite examples of people doing them in the wrong place and at the wrong time. It doesn't automatically follow that these things are therefore unsafe to do at ANY time. It depends on the circumstances.
35

Pond Hall,

05/05/2008 10:50:52
try reality, the real world

as you've commented on the past

Its OK to speed because you think its safe to do so
Its Ok use a mobile while driving because you think its safe to do so.

So she must have thought it was safe using the "High Octane of Driving"

So if she had stopped, then she would have being doing ZERO. Very little chance of hitting wee Johnny jsut along the road.

There is never a safe time to use a mobile phone when driving.

Take a look at anyone using a mobile phone, they're on a different planet, never mind Concentrating on the road ahead or the old speedo!!

Concentration is the name of the game.

Its all the in the Highway Code for one reason or another.
36

celtic4,

USA 14/05/2008 00:13:38
Here there will soon be a law prohibiting the use of cell phones in a moving car, and I am sooo glad! These people are dangerous!
Yes, #35, these people are on another planet never paying attention or even looking at traffic! And I have even noted people having an argument on a cell phone in rush hour traffic.
And #13, I do not now own a car, tho I used to. Had to sell my car to pay for my Mother's nursing home bill, and I am neither sweaty or smelly or scum thank you. Be careful whom you put down, please. All those who ride the bus are not scum simply because they don't own a car! And they are not ALL lowlifes. Gee whiz! A bit judgemental aren't we now?

 

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