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Five months of hell in city centre as tram work steps up

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Published Date: 29 February 2008
DRIVERS and bus passengers are being warned to brace themselves for months of chaos with diversions starting tomorrow for tram works.
Shandwick Place will be shut for five months from tomorrow as part of work for the £498 million tram line with a series of major road diversions put in place.

Dozens of bus services will be affected by the move, with passengers having to get used to alighting at temporary stops.

A squad of around 70 tram staff will be working over the weekend to put the final touches to diversions. All traffic travelling west from Princes Street will be directed up Lothian Road and on to the West Approach Road, while cars and buses heading from Haymarket towards the city centre will be re-routed along Melville Street.

Police motorbike patrols on the diversion routes will start tomorrow morning, aimed at trying to keep traffic moving during the first few days and assisting with any breakdowns.

A team from tram firm TIE will also be on hand to ensure shops get access for their deliveries.

Thirteen bus stops will be closed on and around Shandwick Place and replaced by 12 temporary stops dotted along the diversion routes. A further 11 stops in the city centre will have their normal services changed.

Transport and police chiefs today said every effort would be made to ensure the Capital keeps moving. But motorists’ groups, taxi bosses and business leaders all warned of big disruption in the city centre.

Murray Fleming, secretary of Central Radio Cabs, said: “It will clearly have a significant impact. This is a main artery into the city. To suggest that journeys will run as normal would be fanciful.”

The 19-week closure of Shandwick Place will see parking on Melville Street temporarily removed to accommodate the extra traffic from the eastbound diversion. Buses will go around Charlotte Square, with some services going along George Street, while all other traffic will be diverted along Queensferry Street and Randolph Crescent to join up with Queen Street.

There will also be work on Princes Street from Frederick Street westwards and telecoms diversionary work in St Andrew Square. This phase of the project is scheduled to be completed by the start of the Edinburgh Festival in August.

Bruce Young, Lothian and Borders co-ordinator of the Association of British Drivers, said: “I can easily imagine that the roadworks will add half an hour to journey times across the city. The obvious answer is for people to avoid the city centre altogether for the foreseeable future.”

A total of 136 parking spaces have been lost, mainly on Melville Street, as a result of the diversions.

Graham Russell, chairman of the Federation of Small Businesses Edinburgh, said as well as traders on Shandwick Place, those on adjacent streets such as Stafford Street would also be hit by the works.

He said: “The planning that has gone into the Shandwick Place closure by TIE has been far more thorough than in Leith Walk.

“Traders are worried. It’s a big unknown. Inevitably there will be an impact, but hopefully it will be minimised.”

As first predicted in the News in July, Shandwick Place will be only open for trams and buses when the tram work is finished.

Other major changes include replacing the roundabout at the top of Leith Walk with a T-junction and reopening Torphichen Street to traffic in both directions. Constitution Street will be partially closed to accommodate the trams.

A Lothian Buses spokesman said they had taken steps to try to mitigate the worst of the disruption. He said: “We have the latest information on the Shandwick Place tram works available on our website. We have information on all of our buses along with leaflets detailing exactly how city centre bus services will be affected.

“Where bus stops are affected, our bus stop team have placed yellow panels detailing the alternative stopping arrangements.

“From the commencement of the works our staff will be around the affected areas making sure everything runs smoothly.”

Details of the remaining tram disruption, which is likely to include a complete temporary closure of Princes Street, and the final design of the tram route, are set to be released in April – two months later than planned.

Willie Gallagher, executive chairman of TIE, said: “The successful construction of the Edinburgh tram project and the necessary utilities diversions requires significant temporary traffic diversions. We have identified the optimum traffic management solution that ensures the best vehicle flow for both public transport and other traffic.

“We have also considered the views and needs of residents and businesses in our planning regarding parking and access.

“TIE continues to work closely with the business community and residents in the West End of Edinburgh to ensure practical issues including access, deliveries and service are resolved and that the city of Edinburgh is open for business as the work continues.

“The citizens of Edinburgh and its business community expect and want this work to be done safely, quickly and to budget.

“Our approach to diverting the utilities, coupled with the traffic management measures is the best way to achieve this.”

The full programme of tram roadworks will take more than three years to complete and involves digging up the roads twice – first to move water and gas pipes then to build the tram lines, stops and overhead wires.

The underground pipes and cables are being moved so they can be accessed without disrupting trams, which are due to start running between Edinburgh and its airport in three years’ time.

A police spokeswoman said: “Congestion is expected on the diversion routes for the duration of the tram works. To cut down on the volume of traffic and to ease this, we would encourage commuters to make use of public transport where possible.

“Alternatively, people in vehicles should try to avoid the area. Motorcycle patrols will operate in the first few days to help ensure traffic is flowing freely.”

Councillor Phil Wheeler, the city’s transport leader, added: “While some disruption is inevitable, every effort is being made to keep it to a minimum.

“Members of the public can help by planning their journeys in advance using information about traffic diversions at www.edinburgh.gov.uk and on the Lothian Buses website.”

. . and parking charges are going up too
DRIVERS are to be hit with inflation-busting increases in pay-and-display parking charges across the city.

Streets in much of the central controlled parking zone, in areas such as Tollcross and parts of the New Town, will see charges rise from £1.60 to £2.00 an hour.

The newly-installed peripheral parking zones, such as Marchmont and Morningside, will see prices jump from £1.00 to £1.20 an hour.

Last December, the News revealed city leaders were to increase the cost of parking in prime city centre streets, such as George Street, from £1.80 to £2.00 an hour.

Bruce Young, Lothian and Borders co-ordinator of the Association of British Drivers, said: "The council is putting up the parking charges simply because it is an easy target.

"I think people are already only going into the city centre with their cars if they feel they really need to.

"This is only going to make people think twice about going into town and instead head to the out-of-town shopping centres."

The council provides about 12,000 on-street parking spaces in Edinburgh – 6500 residential parking bays and 5500 pay-and-display spaces.

Councillor Phil Wheeler, the city's transport leader, said: "While price rises are never going to be popular, this is the first time in several years that parking charges have been increased. They are still competitive for a capital city and other major UK cities such as Glasgow.

"There is an incredibly high demand for parking, with an increasing number of people trying to park in a limited number of spaces.

"One way of managing this is to encourage drivers to leave their cars at home and to use the excellent public transport network of buses and park-and-ride facilities.

"However, we know that some drivers will still need to use their cars and we realise the importance to the local economy of providing a choice between public and private transport.

"The charging structure is an important element of the strategy to ensure that there is a regular turnover of spaces."


The full article contains 1416 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Gina Gibson,

Wales 29/02/2008 10:12:03
Of course, it is just a coincidence that parking charges are being increased just as the number of parking places are being slashed.

Surely the decision to increase parking charges could have been delayed till the work is over or am I just using my common sense?
2

PeterPete,

29/02/2008 10:42:25
Shock horror! Roadworks cause disruption!

Clerk St is being dug up for the next 14 weeks - but not a peep in the Evening News about "traders" going to the wall, but then it is nothing to do with trams is it?

My street is to be totally dug up this summer to lay new water pipes. Again, nothing in the paper about people demanding compensation.

Maybe people will realise that Shandwick Place is nicer without traffic, after all, the pedestrianised streets in Glasgow have way more shoppers than Princes St.

And things arent that bad on Leith Walk - most of the congestion, when there is any, is caused by ignorant car and taxi drivers.
3

Queen D,

Glasgow 29/02/2008 10:44:05
Gina , you use inflammatory language!
Common Sense , what are you thinking woman?!
Try greed , try diddlong the public, try Edinburgh council.
Common Sense indeed!!
4

Sheep Worrier,

Lothian Road, directing traffic 29/02/2008 11:06:14
So I presume we will see workers on Shandwick Place 24/7 during these works to get it back open as quickly as possible.

No?
5

Bob 2,

29/02/2008 11:39:13
it will all be worth it as
"A high-quality, modern and efficient tram network is being created for Edinburgh and is scheduled to be running on the Capital’s streets by 2011.
This integrated transport system will offer a reliable and frequent transport choice to Edinburgh’s growing population and business community, boosting the city’s standing as an international destination for tourism and business.

Edinburgh’s tram network will help to reduce car journeys and ease congestion, providing environmental benefits through improved air quality."

and just as the works are finishing it wil be festival time.

Strangest thing is the length of the Tramworks, they vary from 2 to 5 months!!



6

alex paterson,

embra 29/02/2008 12:07:52
Oh dear what a mess the Capital is in,will it ever end.
7

Baroness Fortitude III,

29/02/2008 12:08:35
ooooh are we getting trams?

That'll be nice.
8

Pedantic_Hibee,

29/02/2008 12:15:02
I travel by public transport from Tranent to Saughton each dayand I fear I may have to start including a tent, flask and compass in my man-bag. Splendid.....
9

Mallory,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 12:18:38
Chaos dawns and the excitement builds
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfprA_MM4MI
10

Icebreaker,

newbridge 29/02/2008 12:28:10
A bit of disruption but not Hell.Overuse of language I think.Once the work is complete the slight
inconvenience caused will soon pass into distant memory
11

Sgurr,

29/02/2008 12:29:15
Traders will suffer because the rent that they pay to be in a prime location (eg Shandwick Pl) will not be justifiable over the coming 7 months (assuming that trade will take some weeks or months to return to where they were once "normality" is resumed). For that reason, shops should ask for a % of their ground rent to be compensated by the tram company who will benefit in 3 years time/the msps who voted for this gargantuan waste of money.
12

calum,

29/02/2008 12:31:54
Should be an interesting weekend next weekend with 67+k trying to make their way to Murrayfield for the England game and then coming back into town (via the West End) to enjoy all the rich culture that Edinburgh has to offer. I hope I bump into the lazy and naive Mr. Wallace from Jones Lang LaSalle (letters, EN 28 Feb)and his corporate clients in the traffic jams.
13

Miss Jean Brodie,

29/02/2008 12:32:50
I look forward to a distopian ‘Mad Macs’ future - ‘Aunty Entity Jean Brodie’ to the methane gas propelled vehicles - generated by all the sh*t! spouted by edinburgh-onians! heh heh!
14

Alternative (High Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 12:33:29
Madness. Total, complete and utter madness.

I'm seriously considering moving to Glasgow.
15

Scotish Exile,

29/02/2008 12:36:05
And they wonder why Princess Street is dying on its feet.......
16

David Harrington,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 12:36:30
#11 Great idea, as long as they are willing to pay increased rates after trams bring more people into the city. Lots of worthwhile projects cause difficulties in the short term but that does not mean they are not worth doing.
17

JabbaTheFifer,

Dunfermline 29/02/2008 12:37:46
Remind us again; why exactly does Edinburgh need a tram system? Live there for 5 years and never needed a car because of the excellent bus network, so why the need for trams?
18

Jambo 58,

29/02/2008 12:38:30
Cngratulations to the council. Another job well done, NOT.
Brilliant job you've done on the Maybury Road as well. 40MPH from Maybury to East Craigs, and two lanes to one in both directions from East Craigs to the Barnton, with giant chevrons up the middle. Certainly gonna ease congestion that way. HA HA !!!!
19

David Harrington,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 12:39:11
#14 Please do - you won't be missed with your continuous bleating about anything that will improve the quality of life for people
#15 Because people can't find Princess Street presumably
20

Voice of reason,

EDINBURGH 29/02/2008 12:44:13
Anyone notice the roadworks on the W Approach road which began on Tuesday ? No advance warning , nothing .
21

Martin 2,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 12:44:42
I am normally on this site criticising the tram scheme but I have to say that although Leith Walk looks like a bomb has hit it with the Tram work - the time to travel up and down it on the bus seems faster now than before they started digging it up - fewer stops and the bus moving faster in the single lanes.

I still think reinstatement of the local trains away from roads are the only way to move larger distances quickly around Edinburgh - far cheaper than the tram and better access for lots more of the resident population.
22

Plodjfriss, Hammer of the Numpties,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 12:47:45
HELL!!! CHAOS!!! DISRUPTION!!! Come on, it's not that bad. They've been digging up Leith Walk for several months now and if anything the traffic flow has improved. Perhaps this is because people are staying away or perhaps it's because a lot of the side streets are closed off so that the main flow of traffic isn't continually interrupted. Whatever the reason, it's certainly not chaos. I suppose that things might be different in the case of Shandwick Place if they're going to close it off completely, but let's wait and see.
23

CyclingEdinburgh,

29/02/2008 12:47:58
And they still haven't said which way cyclists are supposed to go. (Not allowed on Western Approach Road.)

http://cyclingedinburgh.info/2008/02/26/another-missed-opportunity
24

Unimpressed one,

29/02/2008 12:51:03
It's probably not coincidence that Ryanair have announced massive expansion of flights from Edinburgh airport which will be in time for the tram project completion.
25

Klaus Dubois,

Ed. 29/02/2008 12:53:37
I like the idea of a modern 'state-of-the-art' transport system, I just wish it was going to be project-managed & implemented with a modern 'state-of-the-art' approach. I expect it to be shambolic (see recent Forth bridge toll-booth removal); it'll cost far more than the current estimate &, after a while, many of us will forget what exactly the cones/diversions/holes in the ground were actually for. How many smelly, slow-moving & under-utilised double decker buses is this going to get rid of again ?
26

brettgallacher,

edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:00:50
dont dare try and criticise the councils best friend the een this white elephant is going to cost the amount of the whole council tax revenue just to get up and running then just like the forth road bridge be private run at tax payers expense forever edinburgh is going to lose an estimated business revenue and related jobs of 1billion pounds then the shops cafes etc lose business thus more people lose their lively hood
27

Bob 2,

29/02/2008 13:01:14
22 Plodjfriss, Hammer of the Numpties

maybe because Leith Walk has still been open, imagine the jams if leith walk were closed to through traffic

take a look at the official map

Can anyone explain how the Lothian Road will cope given that:
ALL the buses and cars that normally use shandwick place will have to have to share the same road space with cars and buses that normally use Lothian Road.

No8....take your tent, you could pitch it in Saughton Gardens
28

klivie,

Chichester 29/02/2008 13:01:57
As a schoolboy who used to travel by tram, what happened to all those intelligent local politicians who decided to do away with them? My wife and I were going to come back up to Edinburgh for a holiday this summer, but in view of the chaos( which will take how many months?), it will be easier for us to go to France.
29

,

29/02/2008 13:02:16
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
30

brettgallacher,

edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:04:01
plus the planned it on ones in other countries which had vast open spaces which it ran along ie blackpool even the chairman of the committee who set this up said and i quote we might as well give it a go thats after pocketing 3million in consultation fees pure and utter raid of public money helped along by the een
31

Victoria Ian,

Gorgie 29/02/2008 13:04:31
#8 Tranent to Saughton each day eh! So you're on daily home visits now you're nearing the end of your sentence!
32

Bob 2,

29/02/2008 13:06:32
Did anyone spot this one "Details of the remaining tram disruption, which is likely to include a complete temporary closure of Princes Street, and the final design of the tram route, are set to be released in April – two months later than planned"

it only gets better

even better

Willie Gallagher, executive chairman of TIE, said: “The successful construction of the Edinburgh tram project and the necessary utilities diversions requires significant temporary traffic diversions. We have identified the optimum traffic management solution that ensures the best vehicle flow for both public transport and other traffic.

Hold on does the Council not have a Transport Dept.

One Question for everyone, Could somone tell me what planet Willie Gallagher is on?

Willie, 2 roads into one just does not go !!

Does anyone remember when they announced the tram line that any roadworks would be no more than some 200m in length, with no more than 7 ? in total.

how things have changed....Ties...Lies and more Lies !!
33

Ron D,

Enybru 29/02/2008 13:06:51
Ban cars from the city centre, permanently.
34

scotsol,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:12:11
I was in Dublin a few weeks ago and took the opportunity to ride on their excellent new trams, which closely resemble what we'll get. I asked a taxi driver if there had been a lot of moaning about expense, disruption, etc during the three or four years they'd been putting them in, and he said yes, it had been constant. But now everybody used them, loved them, and couldn't imagine life without them. I also noticed how quietly the new trams run. They just glide around, no starting with a roar and a cloud of smoke, or stopping with an earsplitting shriek of brakes, like our buses.
35

vote them out,

29/02/2008 13:15:13
tramtastic
36

Think Tank,

29/02/2008 13:16:08

As has been said, despite the claims of apocalyptic chaos on Leith Walk from the tram works, journey times have largely been unaffected. Most people are just getting on with it.

I also love the way that those people who criticise the tram network seem able to simulataneously argue the points that:

a) the proposed tram service doesn't serve anywhere important/busy/useful

b) the tram works cause chaos for hundreds of thousands of commuters on key arterial routes through the city.

I'm sure they'll understand come 2011.

http://news.scotsman.com/edinburghtransportplans/-Trouble-on-track-.3692893.jp

http://news.scotsman.com/opinion/Nice-and-easy-does-it.3813827.jp


37

NorT,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:18:55
Abandon Edinburgh and do all your shopping in Glasgow. TIE could not organise a pissup in a brewery. The centre of Edinburgh is like a bomb site already. Nothing left for terrorists to blow up TIE have done the job for them.
38

portboy,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:20:40
#6.
lucky Pilton isn't affected then isn't it. your in the clear.
funny how the tram isn't earmarked there?
39

Bob 2,

29/02/2008 13:25:10
think tank

leith walk has never been closed completely to through traffic

big difference is that the west end/Shandwick Place junctions are THE MAJOR Public Transport Junction in Edinburgh

Buses to Fife and West Lothain use it
neve mind Edinburghs main bus routes

11/15
3/33
22/26
16/17
4/44
and many more
40

portboy,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:26:38
I like trams, they are brill ! ding ding!!!!!
41

GraemeH,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:27:34
#35 - Trams in Edinburgh do not closely resemble the ones in Dublin. Edinburgh's trams are the biggest built, which makes them less flexible. Route planning is also different with Dublin trams running far more off major routes. My own experience in Dublin is that everyone I met viewed the tram there as a waste of money, adding to the overall congestion problem rather than reducing it. Still at least Ireland got the EC to pay for their system. We have to divert money from other more worthwhile sources to pay for it.

Also, I see that Mr Wil-lie Gallagher from TIE is talking about consultation in regard to planning and access. It is just a pity they never asked the residents of Edinburgh if they wanted this money pit in the first place.
42

Kieron,

Stirling / Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:27:53
What are they doing to our city, I despair of this place these days

EDINBURGH = WELCOME TO HELL!
43

,

29/02/2008 13:31:59
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
44

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:36:12
Stop the trams NOW.

However much money has already been spent, don't carry on throwing good money after bad.

Save our city. Stop the trams!
45

Young Bob,

St. James 29/02/2008 13:37:06
Has anyone sat and watched that Propaganda (I wish that weren’t such an emotive term but there’s no other word for it) they are screening in the St James Centre?

Quite Incredible.

So full of vagaries and down right mis-information it’s almost laughable.

Is that how they sold this obscenity..??
46

Mallory,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:38:39
#23 bleats about the poor cyclists and asks what they should do with alkl the tram closures? Surely they will continue as no ie: riding on pavements, against traffic on one-way streests and crashing through traffic lights at road junction.

Time for PC Plod to book some of these anti-sooial elements as examples..
47

Young Bob,

Here 29/02/2008 13:40:27
Just think how much fun the ned population will have trying to derail them...

Admitt it you've thought about it...

God how much damage would that cause..
48

Findlay Thompson,

29/02/2008 13:40:55
Does anyone know the names of the people who created, authorised and finally sanctioned the Edinburgh Tram line build plan?
49

Humble,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:41:53
Firstly I'm always asked why at the age of 30 I don't drive. Its simple, I moved to Edinburgh 10 years ago and as public transport is good I dont need to.... however the Trams. I would like someone from the council the advise how the trams are going to benefit me? I live on Minto Street and work on Castle Street and if I wanted to use the trams I'd need to get the bus or walk to pricess street and then catch a tram - pointlesss I feel. In addition what tourist in their right mind wants to take a tram and sightsee down Leith Walk - no offence but its not exactly the most well kept area. The same goes for princes street - I can see the attraction looking out onto prices street gardens (Which currently look a state) but not the actual street which is a mass of tacky scottish shops (which seem to have taken over) & mobile phone shops. Do any of the council members shop in Edinburgh? Infact if you did a survey most people head off to glasgow... I think they should start spending more money attracting decent shops and stop being lazy taking rent from the tacky tat shops!!

My conclusion is the only thing that needs updating is the council!!
50

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:43:39
#50, > Does anyone know the names of the people who created, authorised and finally sanctioned the Edinburgh Tram line build plan? <

More to the point, does anyone know their addresses?!
51

Tris,

scotland 29/02/2008 13:44:14


Do you not think that "hell" is a bit of an exaggeration.

It's a fact of life that busy cities are traffic nightmares, but it's how life is.

I doubt if relocating to Glasgow will make a lot of difference.

Edinburgh is the capital of the country; it has changed a lot in the last few years. Some for the good, some for the bad.

It's still one of then the most marvellous cities in the world, up there with Paris and Rome. We should be proud of it.
52

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:45:34
#54, > It's still one of then the most marvellous cities in the world, up there with Paris and Rome. We should be proud of it. <

Agreed. So why is the "cooncil" deliberately trying to destroy it with these trams?
53

Young Bob,

here 29/02/2008 13:46:14
#35

Are you extracting the urine or just flat out lying here?

I went to Dublin last year and was 45mins of the plane when I was getting my ear bent about what a waste of time and money and that no one uses them.

I was told in the tourist information centre that there is a current petition to try to get rid of them
54

a point of view,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:47:38
Summary of the impact of transport policies (I live in Craigleith and work in Melville St):

tram in my back garden
lots of displaced cars parking in my street (making it a narrower and more dangerous place)

bus stops outside the office (and no waiting so deliveries and taxis can't access).

Also (in reference to trams in dublin) - there are 2 short routes that do not connect with each other and in one case does not reach the city centre. in Dublin on Wednesday this week our taxi took two hours to reach the airport from the centre of town. Dublin's traffic is far worse than Edinburgh, and they have trams!
55

Perth to Paisley,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:54:01
As someone who is currently working in a city with a fine tram network system the upheaveal is a simply
Short Term problem that will havee a Long Term benefit.

Get over it!
56

R Corbett,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:56:21
To the commenter above re: where to cycle -

why not just cycle on the pavement like the rest of Edinburgh's cyclists? One more of you breaking the law will make no difference
57

John Knox furr First Meenister,

High St, Embra 29/02/2008 13:56:50
#55 naw, the Dublin trams are grand - I've been over plenty - travelling out from the town centre down to Leopardstown (equivalent of the Gyle, I guess) and the LUAS is excellent. I know that the DART routes don't connnect up but at least they're beginning to tackle the problem.
58

,

29/02/2008 13:57:39
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
59

R Corbett,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 13:58:16
Kick out the trams and ban cyclists - bingo a capital city to be proud of
60

R Corbett,

Manchester 29/02/2008 14:01:04
the manc trams are overpriced, underused, loss making 19th cenruty machines of no consequence - edinburgh doesnt need or want trams, only the labour council did, cos it meant free coffee and biscuits at tram meetings
61

R Corbett,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 14:04:24

Trams are pish - see sense edinburgh
62

R Corbett,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 14:07:53
#23 just go through the red lights and along the pavement like normal. Cycle Hezbollah knows no rules.
63

Kitti Kat,

Newtown Square 29/02/2008 14:12:16
glad I am not booked into a hotel in that area. Life is going to be hell for all living and working there. Do you REALLY need that tram?
64

calum,

29/02/2008 14:23:32
#59
I think you're prentending to know Dublin. DART? LUAS? not the same thing. 2 separate tramLINES in Dublin doesn't a network make. Limited appeal, displaced congestion to the suburbs as #56 says. Paid for by ERU money, not Scottish money like the EDINBURGH tramLINE thius depriving SCOTLAND of investment and services. "Commercial confidence" - In competition with what, please, Willie Gallagher?
This whole TIE project a shambles.
65

Perth to Paisley,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 14:25:18
Shandwick Place closed - Can you still get access to the Strip Bar?
Sums up the city ........... unfortunately
66

Lang Spoon,

Leith 29/02/2008 14:29:36
Don't forget,folks,who forced through this atrocity, and it wasn't the SNP!
I'm just waiting to see the outcome of the inevitable plea for more public funds to bail the project out; John Swinney is on record as stating "not a thin dime more!"
I personally know only 2 people who are in favour of this trainset, and one of them is Councillor Wheeler himself!
67

,

29/02/2008 14:32:14
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
68

Council Insider,

Council HQ 29/02/2008 14:42:00
What about the parking charges. A nice wee bonus for my friends here at HQ.
69

Robbierunciman,

Romney Marsh 29/02/2008 14:44:04
I used to live near Sheffield and much of the comments above were posted in the local newspaper when that tram system was under construction. not many now though. Dublin is not a good example, same mentality as many in edinburgh, I got a car, I wanna use it, I don't wanna pay for its environmental impact cos I pay road tax, I don't care about anyone else!

If many of the above 'travelled smarter' and used their cars less, the roads would not be so congested.
70

scotsol,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 14:55:02
#43 - The people filling up each Dublin tram I saw would hardly have agreed with you. And I've heard the same story in Manchester and Sheffield.

#55 - I wouldn't be surprised if there is a petition in Dublin to get rid of the trams, signed by a tiny handful of idiots like you.
71

Goat Boy,

29/02/2008 15:01:10
This is just “Phase one, the re-routing of utilities”.

Then, just when you thought it was safe to move around the city (again), they will introduce “Phase 2 - network Construction".

Anyone wanting to enter the city will need to wear a hard hat and attend a health and safety briefing.
72

vote them out,

29/02/2008 15:02:46
Live for nothing
Die for something

TRAMBO
73

The Judge,

29/02/2008 15:04:20
Well done Edinburgh Parish Council.

Its official West Edinburgh and Princess Street are closed for business.

If the plans are already 2 months late, imagine how late the tramLINE will be.
74

Young Bob,

In your face Mofo 29/02/2008 15:19:50
#73

RIGHT

PAL

LISTEN

UP….!

I know nothing about Dublins trams, who paid for them, how long they took or anything.

All I know is that on a day trip to Dublin on October that’s ALL the local want to talk about..!!!!

Apparent the city was not that congested, then after their trams were in place the city centre grinds to a halt at rush hour…

If it were just one person you take it with a pinch of salt…

BUT

It was dozens…
75

,

29/02/2008 15:36:56
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
76

Gastric Antral Vascular Ectasia,

29/02/2008 15:37:32
There is no reason to become angry over trams. Life is too short. Become angry over people dying of starvation, or being drawn into war under false pretenses. But trams just aren't worth it.

Peace, everyone. Peace.
77

Watcher Man,

29/02/2008 15:38:56
#14 please leave asap, but its gonna be a bit of a downgrade for you to go from Edinburgh to glasgow












78

Kieron,

Stirling / Edinburgh 29/02/2008 15:52:30
Edinburgh has offically GONE TO THE DOGS!
79

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 15:56:10
#80, > There is no reason to become angry over trams. Life is too short. Become angry over people dying of starvation, or being drawn into war under false pretenses. But trams just aren't worth it. <

Doesn't the waste of £500 million (or £700 million, or whatever) of our money and years of disruption to our city, all for a system of public transport worse than we had before, make you even just a wee bit cross?
80

tomias,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 15:59:54
Jean P Satre- Hell is other people "
Trams in Edinburgh ever since the first ide to their eventual fruition will feature very highly on a uni course of interpretive existentialism.One woders at the coincidence of this weeks press release of anti-depressents real or placebo and depression itself.
Thre could very well be a Phd or Msc waiting for an analysis of these,peri/post tram introduction
81

tumshie heid,

29/02/2008 16:24:50
#72
Did Sheffield already have an award winning bus service in place before it installed trams?
This scheme is insane and we as taxpayers are lining the pockets of a select few in order to create this mayhem on our streets.
As for the congestion issue, I believe that the city traffic planners are creating artificial congestion to help justify schemes such as the SHAMS. (Nonsensical lane closures,reduced speed limits on dual carriageways etc)
82

wolfette,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 16:47:48
By the time the nice sparkling new trams are running, no one is going to be heading into the city centre anyway, and many of the stores will have closed down - maybe even gone bust.

83

Journalistic licence,

Lost on Palmerston Place 29/02/2008 17:03:00
Anyone know SatNav Man's number so I get him to direct me out of here?
84

Farmernot,

29/02/2008 17:22:48
#82 Keiron.....you are correct .........and there is s**t everywhere in this city.

Anyway if we are going back to trams can we have "clippies" as well please........"move right up the tram please"
85

SPG,

edinburgh 29/02/2008 17:45:37
80 Gastric Antral Vascular Ectasia: Why even bother getting angry about that? Who was it said "Life is too short"? Mellow out man. Just mellow.
86

Euan,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 18:17:25
More total cobblers from Willie Gallagher - 'The citizens of Edinburgh and its business community expect and want this work to be done safely, quickly and to budget'

Total garbage.

What the citizens of Edinburgh want is this idiotic, insane and absurd project CANCELLED WITH IMMEDIATE EFFECT.

People lives and businesses are about to messed about with for no good reason other than to create a lovely toy with which to impress tourists with.

The imbeciles that allowed this work to go ahead should feel thouroughly ashamed of themselves.

Hang your heads in shame, the lot of you.

87

gordon aka smoker and proud,

edinburgh 29/02/2008 18:51:54
just a wee though here. closing shandwick place for 5 months to move and replace all the pipes etc and then in the near future have to close it again to install the tram lines and over head cables. now rocket science applied here! why not close it once,move the pipes etc install the tram lines and poles that hold the overhead cables so that all that is needed to be done prior to the opening of the tram system is the threading through of the cables and then the switch on of the leccy? hmmmmmm now theres a thought.whos paying the meter?
88

Andrew,

29/02/2008 18:58:25
Yippee! SSSSHHHHandwick Place without hoards of buses!!
Pity about all the drills and power-hammers!
NO PAIN!!! NO GAIN!!
89

Euan,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 19:04:42
#93, Andrew

I'd like to see you say 'no pain, no gain' to the owners of the scores of local businesses that are going to be severely affected by this insane project.

You would get a hard, fast kick to the stones I can tell you..
90

jdships,

29/02/2008 20:00:56
93 Andrew,
NO PAIN!!! NO GAIN!!

Do you know what percentage of Edinburgh citizens will gain , on a regular basis, from this pointless exercise ?
Estimate 6/8% - a fine return on capital investment !
Was in the company of a Libdem Councillor today and must admit we gave him a hard time !!!!
Liked his final aside -
" Well if nothing else it will be a great tourist attraction " Big smile

Words just fail me !!
91

Catherine,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 20:10:42
Could someone explain to my poor wee brain why the Lothian Buses website and posters on the buses state "8 weeks"? Do they want us to stay calm by trying to psychologically reduce the timescale, while also getting confused at hearing 5 months?!

Do I really care, no. It's easier to walk round Edinburgh these days anyway..........
92

Andrew,

29/02/2008 20:25:07
Edinburgh is the ONLY major WORLD RENOWN capital city I can think of WITHOUT a rail-based public transport system (ie outwith any 'national rail' network). Similar capital cities thrive with theirs:- eg., Berne (CH) Stockholm (S) Oslo (N) Dublin (IRL) etc etc etc
93

Calum Crubag,

29/02/2008 20:37:26
Agree. Leith Walk is affected but people still get on with it. If the local cricket shop closes, then great. Cricket should be banned in Scotland anyway. Why can't these foreigners act like the natives?!

Betch despite the moaning, we'll all use them when they come. Most major cities seems to have them. But we do need some kind of rail system too and proper bike lanes if we want to cut congestion.
94

jdships,

29/02/2008 20:43:04
97 Andrew,

Have you visited these Cities ?
I've been to Oslo, Stockholm and Dublin and in no way do their systems resemble that foisted on us .
I repeat Edinburgh Tram's will benifit just 6/8% of citizens on a regular basis
I appreciate you are entitled to your opinion but personally feel you are defending the indefensible
95

Andrew,

29/02/2008 20:57:44
Answer:- Yes! Yes! & Yes! - but you omitted Berne - THE BEST OF THEM ALL! One ticket - One country - One TOTALLY INTEGRATED (Swiss) public transport network!! WAKE UP BRITAIN!!!!
96

Euan,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 20:58:54
#97, Andrew

That's because Edinburgh DOES NOT NEED, as you put it, a 'rail-based transport system'.

You silly, silly person.
97

THE BPRENTICE,

29/02/2008 21:07:18
the money should have been spent improving the travel up to Inverness - too many deaths and not enough development up that way - instead, the powers that be want to show off how modern ther city is....well, big whoop de doo doo.
98

Euan,

Edinburgh 29/02/2008 21:24:22
THE BPRENTICE

Totally agree.

The disgraceful cost of this tram LINE can never, ever be justified when you look at what could have been achieved transport-wise with the same money over the rest of Scotland.

Sadly, the powers-that-be seem to think otherwise..
99

John Knox furr First Meenister,

High St, Embra 29/02/2008 21:39:28
Ach Euan, its not money wasted. Its employing tons of folks and at least we're getting something for it. Transport over the rest of Scotland? Whit you on about? If you want to go and visit those dumps, make your own way.
100

MoragtheToerag,

Way out West 29/02/2008 21:51:50
Oh, please, no. 81!

My husband's an Edinburgh native and we finally left the place last year due to not being able to afford a decent house for our family.

Went to Glasgow, and couldn't believe we wasted so much time in Edinburgh.

It's FAB, no. 14 - great shops, everything in easy distance and plenty of multi-level car parks.

Imagine that?!

C'mon over, you'll wonder why you waited so long.
101

jdships,

29/02/2008 22:36:42
100 Andrew

OK you too have been there but it appears you have been looking from a different standpoint
I was with colleagues from the Institute of Transport looking from a technical/operational standpoint and I repeat
"no way do their systems resemble that foisted on us ."
Plus with the excellent bus services we have the cost is completely unjustified
I was in the company of a Libdem Councillor today and to be fair we gave him some stick !
His parting comment took the biscuit
" Ah well at worst it will be a great tourist attraction "
Wow ! £650m for a new tourist attraction just shows what you can get away with in the Public Sector
102

Ard Righ,

The Rock Of Edinburgh 29/02/2008 23:00:55
Enforced "lack of flow policy".

1 single operator buses.
2 trafic islands.
3 traffic calming, car wrecking bumps, narrowing, road closure
4 street furniture.
5 pedestrian crossings at round abouts.
6 more road closure.
7 block circulator routes e.g. Charlotte square.
8 more one way systems.
9 obsessive line painting
10 motorway diversions.
11 unnecessary road resurfacing.
12 parking meters in south of Edinburgh as they have ruined the town parking
13 dangerous islands see MacDonald road
14 slow service repairs
15 building contractors allowed to close whole roads.
16 more short cuts closed
17 trams, and all of the preparation that it ensues
18 trams operation, blocking huge areas of road at all times
19 trams rails in the roads for your bicycle to get caught in and people trip over.
20 What next?


Stage one complete, the slowing of the capital, business strained.

Stage two the occupation of the capital by incomers

Stage theee tracking of all movements of everyone everywhere

Stage four, army occupation

Stage five, assasination

Stage six war

Stage seven death


Have you ever considered revolution?
103

Gogzy,

01/03/2008 01:14:56
and this is all going ot happen againw hen they stick the rails down, why dont they just put the rails down at the same time as the pipes since they have the whole street blocked off

or even better close one side of the street and keep the other open and vice versa when one side is done.

but they again TIE and EDC couldnt organise a trip to a brewrey
104

COLINTON.MAINS,

Oakville Ontario 01/03/2008 02:55:34
cancelled my trip home this year my pal and his wife coming here 5 months you say okay lets start counting is there a late charge if not finished on time
105

COLINTON.MAINS,

Oakville Ontario 01/03/2008 02:55:57
cancelled my trip home this year my pal and his wife coming here 5 months you say okay lets start counting is there a late charge if not finished on time
106

Navvy,

01/03/2008 05:49:48
What is new - Edinburgh and Scotland's inability to plan in notorious and scandalous

All over Asia this work is done under temporary metal road decking with the traffic carrying on as usual

Ask Kenny MacAskill who saw it in Singapore

as you can see, this has got me wound up. Why is Edinburgh so inept. Ask the traders to go to these websites to see how it is done
http://www.lta.gov.sg/projects/index_proj_ccl.htm
http://www.lta.gov.sg/projects/index_proj_engaging.htm

Our former colonies have built on what we left them and have overtaken us. To think that Scots built Singapore and much of the rest

Thanks to Navvy for the links. Comparing the work there with Embra's puny efforts says it all really. A Lack of imagination, a lack of consultation and a lack of proven need.

And the clowns are going to dig it sll up again later in the project!
107

Euan,

Edinburgh 01/03/2008 09:20:34
I, and I'm pretty much sure everyone else in Edinburgh is too, are completely fed-up with Willie Gallaghers total bullsh*t.

This man has to be the king of spin in Edinburgh, the garbage that spouts from his mouth is simply unbelievable.

He has been instrumental in the forcing of this un-wanted and un-needed tram line upon us, something which will completely destroy Edinburgh's transport network for the decades to come.

He and his cronies care not one bit about the misery that is going to be inflicted upon local businesses and residents with the building of their lovely, tourist-attracting toy tram.

The man is nothing but the epitomy of sheer incompetence and should resign from TIE with immediate effect.

SCRAP THE TRAMS.

108

Mop,

*********** 01/03/2008 11:10:30
I feel the trams will only benefit certain people.I live in West Lothian and we cant even get a decent bus service into Edinburgh let alone anything else!
Through here they put the fares up-a return to Edinburgh went up by 80p to £4.80 I wouldnt mind if we had the bus service to match the price rise and the buses are hellish uncomfortable.Ill be interested to see how many bus services they "get rid off" as they will no longer be needed.Thank goodness I no longer work in Edinburgh-what a nightmare.
109

Think Tank,

01/03/2008 12:56:39

What a shame for the antitramites that Reporting Scotland's view of Dublin's LUAS system was in keeping with everyone else who's actually been there!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/avdb/news/scotland/video/155000/bb/155833_16x9_bb.asx

Rather than the suspicious "I went to Dublin and within a minute of stepping out of the airport was being told how terrible the trams are"

Not that it isn't in keeping with the anti-tram lobby to make things up when they realise they're losing the argument.
110

Euan,

Edinburgh 01/03/2008 13:28:48
#117 'Think Tank'

The report should not even have been aired. It was nothing more than cheap propaganda.

Trying to compare Edinburgh to Dublin is like comparing chalk and cheese.

Edinburgh's geographical layout simply does not suit trams.

This idiotic project should be scrapped with immediate effect.

111

Bob 2,

01/03/2008 13:53:15
it will all be worth it as
"A high-quality, modern and efficient tram network is being created for Edinburgh and is scheduled to be running on the Capital’s streets by 2011.
This integrated transport system will offer a reliable and frequent transport choice to Edinburgh’s growing population and business community, boosting the city’s standing as an international destination for tourism and business.

Edinburgh’s tram network will help to reduce car journeys and ease congestion, providing environmental benefits through improved air quality."

and just as the works are finishing it wil be festival time...hoorah

Strangest thing is the length of the Tramworks, they vary from 2 to 5 months!!
112

Maxibus,

Long view 02/03/2008 18:14:40
Quote from a Nottingham Councilor:

"The disappointment is that our twin city of Karlsruhe in Germany has built 14 tram lines in the time it's taken us to build one. So please let's get on"
Let us get on with our moaning while other cities are laying the future.

 

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