Help Sitemap Home Skip Navigation Contact Us Disability Statement

 
 
Saturday, 11th October 2008

Premium Article !

Your account has been frozen. For your available options click the below button.

Options

Premium Article !

To read this article in full you must have registered and have a Premium Content Subscription with the The Scotsman site.

Subscribe

Registered Article !

To read this article in full you must be registered with the site.

Sign In
Register

John Swinney: Local income tax will create a fairer and wealthier Scotland



Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image

Published Date: 21 July 2008
THE issue of how local tax is collected is an important one for Scottish business as well as the general public. That is why improving the deeply unpopular situation inherited from the previous Labour/ Liberal Democrat administration – which in turn inherited the council tax from the Conservatives – was a key manifesto pledge for the SNP, and is now a priority for the Scottish Government.
Since 1997, the council tax has increased by more than 60 per cent – causing real hardship for individuals as well as cutting spending power in the economy – which is why we moved in our first year to freeze this unfair tax.

We delivered a free...



The full article contains 941 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 20 July 2008 8:09 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
 
1

AM2,

Scotland,UK 20/07/2008 22:13:45
To be blunt, Mr Swinney, I don’t believe you. Here are five reasons for that.

1. COUNCIL TAX INCREASES

You claim that “since 1997, the council tax has increased by more than 60 per cent”.

But the increase is actually 47 per cent across all bands. The average band D bill has gone up from £783 to £1,149.

2. THE LIT RATE

Alex Salmond’s spokesman said: “Let us be clear that the local income tax will be 3p, not any more or less” and you try to sell us on “avoiding the administration costs that would apply with 32 different rates”.

But an SNP statement said: “We shall set a rate of 3p in the pound for all local authorities in the first instance. In the longer term we will move towards allowing local authorities greater flexibility in setting the local income tax rate.”

3. WINNERS AND LOSERS

Last June, you claimed that “90 per cent of Scots would benefit from our proposals”.

But this March, the SNP’s consultation document said: “Our analysis estimates that in 2007-08, under a LIT, 67% of Scottish households would have experienced an increase in net income.”
2

AM2,

Scotland,UK 20/07/2008 22:14:00
4. COUNCIL TAX BENEFIT

An SNP press release of April 2006 said: “Retaining the [council tax] benefit is based on the following section of the Burt Report on local government funding, which recommended scrapping the Council Tax: “14. Following discussion with DWP officials and receipt of legal advice, we would not expect eligibility for Council Tax Benefit to be affected by the proposed changes." - page 140, Local Government Finance Review, (Burt Review), November 2006.”

But in fact chapter 14, which includes page 140, relates not to LIT, but a local property tax (LPT) which, being property based, can legally be seen as an amendment to the existing system. The press release therefore misrepresented the truth.

Elsewhere in the Burt report, it explicitly stated that “if in Scotland the council tax were replaced by a local income tax, Council Tax Benefit would cease.” You have always known this.

5. THE SCOTTISH BLOCK

The SNP claimed in a March 2008 press release that Council Tax Benefit forms “part of the Scottish Block”.

That was a false claim based on an obvious error in a pre-devolution Treasury funding statement. Council Tax Benefit was erroneously listed in Appendix A as part of the Scottish block, as had originally been the plan in the run-up to devolution. The incorrect listing was carried forward for several years without being noticed, until the SNP found the error and started trying to use it to deny reality. At that point the document was corrected.

The fact is that CTB is legally part of the Council Tax system. It’s a GB-wide function of the Department for Work & Pensions. Both CT and CTB were established by the Local Government Finance Act 1992. There’s no separating the two, as you well know.
3

,

21/07/2008 00:42:11
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
4

Coileach an taobh Tuath,

21/07/2008 01:00:59
To be blunt, Mr AM2, I don’t believe you. Here are five reasons for that.

1. COUNCIL TAX INCREASES

A 47 per cent across all bands....... the average band D bill has gone up from £783 to £1,149 - Great point there AM2.


2. THE LIT RATE

You are aware that no proposals has yet been mad, the consultation paper looked at a number of scenarios.. What exactly are your comparison of quotes is that both recognise this fact about? - Is there a secret plan to raise taxes Am2? Are you terrified?

3. WINNERS AND LOSERS

Simple way to find out if it benefits you, do the sums, it would benefit 72% of Glaswegians.


4. COUNCIL TAX BENEFIT

This one is particuarly bad, in the next point you reiterate the treauries argument that baecause it isn't called 'council tax' you can't get the 'council tax benefit'

You defy that logic here by saying even though you change the system to a 'property tax system' you can keep 'council tax benefit'

Make up yer mind AM2, which is it...... you'll be performing in a circus soon with all these back flips.....


5. THE SCOTTISH BLOCK

The SNP claimed in a March 2008 press release that Council Tax Benefit forms “part of the Scottish Block”.

Am2 suggest that this is an 'error' - erm, ok then AM2........ a £400 million a year typo..... that's a first!

tinyurl.com/ywyp9j

Funding the Scottish Parliament, Welsh Assembly and NI Assembly:
Statement of Funding Policy
October 2007


Spending programmes forming part of the Scottish Block
(shortened for posting,s ee full list at link above)
Domestic agriculture, fisheries and food (after devolution)
Industry, enterprise and training
Roads and transport
Housing
Law, order and protective services
Education
Health
Nationalised Industries (after devolution)
Council Tax Benefit (after devolution)******************
Local Authority Expenditure
5

,

21/07/2008 01:06:49
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
6

AM2,

Scotland,UK 21/07/2008 01:38:56
#4 Coileach

1. If you’re conceding that point then John Swinney is wrong.
2. The salient point is that the SNP issued contradictory statements.
3. Again, you’re missing the point. The SNP’s 90% claim was false.
4. Absolute nonsense. I can only suggest that you read the act:
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/ACTS/acts1992/Ukpga_19920014_en_20.htm#sdiv9
5. Of course it was an error. Those funds had never been in the block.

#5 Doonhamer

The article was posted around 9:30pm. You just didn’t know where to look.
7

a proud doonhamer,

Dumfries 21/07/2008 02:13:04
6

Not so laddie, it was not posted online until much later as well you know.
8

AM2,

Scotland,UK 21/07/2008 02:26:20
#7 Doonhamer

Fine. Deny reality. Cling to your conspiratorial delusions. No skin off my nose.
9

Geomac 1,

Scotland 21/07/2008 12:06:36
Before I start on challenging the specific economic illiteracy of this article let me ask one highly pertinent question>
WHY DO POLITICIANS NEVER EVER TALK ABOUT REDUCING TAXATION RATHER THAT TRYING TO JUSTIFY EXTRACTING EVER MORE IN THE LEAST PAINFUL WAY? A 60% increase in council tax since 1997 is a disgrace - and for what? As far as I can see, it was largely to fatten up bureaucracies in councils.
Now to specifics:
o if this tax is being applied nationally, it is NOT a LOCAL tax
o if four out of five households will be better or no worse off, then the remaining one fifth will be significantly worse off - are these the type of people we wish to lose from Scotland?
o Swinney makes a claim, namely: "Our scheme represents an overall £281m tax cut compared to the existing council tax........" Where does this number come from?
o how are they going to compensate for the lost £400 million currently paid by central government for council tax benefit - not a word from Mr Swinney!
10

The Tin Man,

21/07/2008 15:11:27
#4 Coileachan

You really can't sit there and say that 74% of Glaswegians will benefit from LIT on one line, and then say that the LIT rate has not been set on another line.

The fairest form of local taxation is a mixture of income tax and property tax.

Don't worry, the LIT proposal is at the consultation stage - you don't have to regard the initial proposal as an order that has to be obeyed at all times.
11

The Tin Man,

21/07/2008 15:25:19
Problems with the abolition of individual property-tax and relying entirely on PAYE income-tax:

- All retired people are removed from the tax base (20% of the population of Scotland). Everyone else would pay for the reduced revenue.

- Income would vary much, much, more than CT - eg. if public sector workers are given a below-inflation pay-rise, income-tax has to rise, accordingly. Note the significantly reduced income-tax take this year, and the associated debt.

- The very rich are removed from the tax base.

The comments about the CT rises: your income tax can de exactly the same, except without an invoice through the door, so less obvious.
12

Anti Corruption Party,

Glasgow 21/07/2008 19:15:03
How to stop the NWO/Masons crimes immediately

You must fight for and demand a public register of Freemasons, Co Masons and The Order Of The Eastern Star (female Masons)

This would comprehensively prove if they are a good charitable fraternity or a criminal organisation.

Freemasonry portrays itself that it is all good. It should not have a problem with a public register of their good? members.

After all, wouldn't you like to know if your best friend, family, lawyer, policeman, doctor, emergency services, neighbour, military forces, social services, politician, judge, dentist, tradesman, vet, supermarket, council, postman, religious leader, care worker, etc, is a Mason ? Fact, Freemasonry flourishes on the abuse of your trust.

First of all, write to your local lodge (via signed for letter), we guarantee they will ignore you. Then do a Freedom of Information request (via signed for letter). Then take your results to your Politician (ask if he is a Mason). If you get nowhere, you now know for sure that everything we say is true. Next, you must educate everybody. Start petitions and send/fax/print off copies of this email to everyone in your street, workplace, library, waiting rooms, supermarkets, public transport etc. Knock on the doors of your local lodge (local house of corruption) and ask them questions. Make sure you have a witness, voice recorder and video-cam. Ask them for a public register or about someone you suspect of being a member. We have to waken up immediately, we HAVE to fight this as we are running out of time. Get rid of this Masonic mind-controlled virus and the NWO will fall. No Masonic foot-soldiers = no power. Direct any doubters to the websites below (and follow the links) or get them to read the David Icke newsletters.

Freemasonry is the main tool for the Illuminati - Oil Barons - Bankers - Royalty - World's Richest Families (mainly American/Israelis). These people are responsible for a trillion, trillion crimes (underestimated)
13

democracy,

Scottish Borders 21/07/2008 22:33:04
AM2,Scotland. I am an SNP member and lets say I disagree with John Swinney and agree with you instead.
Now you take the place of him and tell the electorate that LIT is bad for you and the best way forward is the status quo,one of the reasons New Labour lost the election in the first instance.
Now tell me where you are in this debate??
14

back from huttcity,

22/07/2008 01:08:52
@5. lol doonhammer you got him bang-to-rights, I always check the RSS feed now. Very interesting to see which comments are deleted...

 

Comment on this Story

 

In order to post comments you must Register or Sign In

 
 
RSS Feed of this article's comments
Delivery formats: RSS, Atom, Javascript & Email
 
  

 
 


Sister Newspapers:
Press Complaints Commission

This website and its associated newspaper adheres to the Press Complaints Commission’s Code of Practice. If you have a complaint about editorial content which relates to inaccuracy or intrusion, then contact the Editor by clicking here.

If you remain dissatisfied with the response provided then you can contact the PCC by clicking here.