1. Why was he allowed into Britain in the first place ?
2. Asylum seeker ?
3. Why was not in jail or deported if he was judged a risk ?

Here is a probable answer to your questions #1

1We now let anyone in

2 probably

3 It would have been a breach of his human rights

Pathetic, but alas very true.

But Jock, you forget something. Even if he is an illegal and wants to murder thousands of us in cold blood, we cant send him back to Iraq as it might infringe HIS human rights

You couldn't make it up...

i read in the Scotsman that they weren't allowed to fingerprint or get DNA from those under "control orders".....i agree with #1, why wasn't he deported??.....
i suppose we'll have all the, it was Bush/Blair's fault this happened..that's what the dem's are saying here now.....what a sad lot!!!

thank goodness they weren't sucessful & no lives were lost...

At least I am glad these would be terrorists were not competent enough to make the bombs explode.

It is scary to hear the police already knew they were in final stages of a bomb plot but let them run loose.

We don't have the resources to put people suspected of plotting bomb attacks under constant surveillance?

Maybe we ought to rethink our priorities.

I'm so glad we're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them here. That policy sure worked a treat, eh?

A Merc with 60 lt of volatile petrol inside, a bag of nails and some green not exactly inconspicuous propane cylinders a "potentially viable" (if it had a means of detonating it) device.

Are we supposed to take this seriously?

Perhaps we should all wait until the facts have been established before starting our rants?

Is this the same man I commented on last week?It's obvious control orders don't work. I told people there to be on the lookout for a suspect who could not be identified for legal reasons. I guess public safety comes in second to a would-be terrorist's rights.

Do Britons feel that this could never have happened? The IRA showed that eventually your enemies will come looking for you in your own backyard. The difficulty now becomes how to protect yourselves while balancing a reasonable adherence to your traditional rights.

Nabbed a suspect but lack the evidence to charge them? The U.S. devised a solution to such quandaries. It's called Guantanamo Bay. Certainly not ethical, but quite effective I suppose.

War is hell folks... get used to it.

You can't expect to muck around in someone else's backyard without them paying you a visit.

Get some backbone, chin up, cheerio and all that.. Blimey good war isn't it?

Judas Priest.... abandon a car and the entire nation is turned into a chicken coop. Same thing here in America.. we're just a bunch of frightened schoolgirls... same as you Brits.

Aren't we glad that our previous generations who fought Hitler and Tojo had more spine than our generation?

Good God... can you imagine how many Londoners would be wetting their pants in the eeeeevel Al Qaeda had a fraction of the firepower that Germany unleashed on London back in the real war?

#16 Easy for you to say -- from the safety of Wyoming. "Back in the real war", geez.

I'm with Conan on this one. ( #9.) It is very fortunate that the car did not go off, with all that petrol and nails etc... And what happened to the issue in Parliament about foreign nationals committing crimes on British soil and how they were going to be deported - should this be the case?

I actually cannot believe some of you people who think this is just another little ploy to keep us on the alert and scared - you really don't think it will happen in your own land??? Why have we swept the London bus bombings under our rug of memories already???? To think that the ISLAM extremists only want to live a life of peace and practice their version of Islam is putting your head in the sand. They do not believe in OUR right to exist in their convoluted world of extremism- get used to it people-we give the rights that we law-abiding citizens should have to the criminals everyday, and all in the name of political -correctness. I hope Brown has a backbone - because I fear this is just the beginnings of a much greater threat to the way we are used to living -i.e. - feeling safe in our own lands away from the messed-up world most of the middle east is forced to endure as everyday happenings. I read weekly about all the bodies found in the streets and on the banks of rivers in Iraq-killed by their very own Muslims - branches of extremism exist in the Islam world that seek to wipe out anyone who doesn't conform to their way of thinking. AND we only hear a little blip about all the bodies found also tortured and beheaded) because it doesn't sell papers the way blaming the US and Britain does.
#16- hope you feel totally safe in WY- if you do, please thank the guys who are out there defending the idealogy of freedom everyday - by the way - also VOLUNTEERING to protect FREEDOM-
As for me- yes, I do feel pretty secure here in the US, but time has a way of making us complacent doesn't it???? I can NEVER forget the WTC bombings but the event does shift to memory and we did get on with our lives - that in and of itself is a testimont to the citizens who grew up in freedom- at this point we are still able to travel as we wish, take jobs as we wish, worship as wish, have children as we wish, buy and sell as we wish- can you say that for the rest of the world??

#15 Dutch, "War is hell folks... get used to it."

Don't you worry about us pal, we're well used to it. Just worry about yourselves. Saying that, your pretty safe were you are, Wyoming? Were the fooks Wyoming

#19 Hi US Mother! It's just that I think going to war in Iraq was extremist.

Deport him, torture him first to find out who else amongst his swinish brethen are planning things like this, and deport them to.

I will vote for anyone preapred to stand up to these filth and keep our country free and safe for our children.

(number 19) AAAHHHHHH YES everybody else in this world are able to live and have children and sell and buy stuff as they want. Its not just usa

#23 You better lock me up cos I know some Muslims.

Didnt Alec Salmond vote for the control orders also on the Terrorists Human Rights he seemed to abstain in a lot of the Votes also against the Dawn Raids ???? Maybe Scotland is a Haven to these lunatics with the Supprt old AS gives to them on their "Human Rights "

Good onyer #23 I'm with you, they come to our country sample and enjoy our freedoms and try to blow us up

Get them out NOW

#16 There are not many Londoners left in London.

When were you last in the West End ...or even worse ..The East End?.... where racial crime isnt reported in The Scotsman.

#19 & 27 er...."live in peace?"
"feeling safe in our own lands away from the messed-up world"
"please thank the guys who are out there defending the idealogy of freedom"
"keep our country free and safe for our children"
" they come to our country sample and enjoy our freedoms and try to blow us up"

These could all be things said by decent, law-abiding Iraqis trying to live while invaders fight an illegal war in their country....

As long as WE continue to be in thrall to the US, prostituting our army, our soldiers and our Justice system in the cause of THEIR grimy political agenda, this sort of thing will continue to happen.

Thought this report would bring out all the nutters,where did the met say an Iraqi is responsible for these car bombs.The PM said let the police get on with it and don't jump to conclusions,but some of you nutters as usual know better than the pros.You are either having a laugh or are sick in the head.

"Police say they are looking for an Iraqi who went on the run from a control order "

Tell the damn truth, "He ESCAPED".

No amount of prettying it up with fancy words about running will change the fact.

Yet again more proof that LONDON your precious precious LONDON is out of control and we are still throwing money at the place like its going out of fashion.

I am not surprised that people are wanting to cause havoc. Everything in this country seems to revolve around LONDON I am sick of it! any policy that Government makes these days is centred on LONDON, all the politically correctness that is coming out these days emanates in LONDON>

Why are people so obsessed with such a dreary place where nobody smiles and are all so busy either on mobile phones, blackberries or fliipin I pods, I just don't get it at all, all Lemmings if you ask me, stay there as far as I'm concerned and get a LIFE!!!!!

Welcome to Britiain's incompetent Home Office and Justice system

"19. US Mother, middle US /
you really don't think it will happen in your own land???"

Let me open your eyes a little bit darlin'

We in Europe have had CENTURIES of our lands been torn apart by various groups/Governments BEFORE YOUR PATHETIC LITTLE COUNTRY WAS EVER THOUGHT OF.

A couple of buildings get knocked over in New York, and all of a sudden you think you are battle hardened vetrans with more experience than ANY one else in the world.

Oh my oh my, just hark at their superior knowledge.

Swivel on your two buildings darlin'

When terrorism and violence gets exports , then guess what; that same terrorism and violence will hit home. I’m sure the British have caused the death of thousand of Iraqis directly or indirectly. We shouldn’t be there. Its not our war.
Peace to all

#13 Bob

"Another neo FBI tactic to keep everybody in fear!"

Neo FBI? Oh, yeah, that guy in The Matrix. It's just a movie. Don't get worked up.

Boudica#
What a pathetic creature you are, you are obviously hurting in spite of the democratic process.

#23 "We are at WAR with Iraq"

Are we? So why are we training their army and police?

I'm sorry to say that I think one of these attacks will have to get through before the country wakes up.

All the Brazillians better not run or make any false moves or they will be gunned down.

For all our USA posters ;
London is quite used to this sort thing after they had this for years with the US funded and supported terrorists the IRA.

#34 VS

VS said:

"Let me open your eyes a little bit darlin'

We in Europe have had CENTURIES of our lands been torn apart by various groups/Governments BEFORE YOUR PATHETIC LITTLE COUNTRY WAS EVER THOUGHT OF.

A couple of buildings get knocked over in New York, and all of a sudden you think you are battle hardened vetrans with more experience than ANY one else in the world.

Oh my oh my, just hark at their superior knowledge.

Swivel on your two buildings darlin'"

Now, when you say, "We in Europe have had CENTURIES of our lands been torn apart by various groups/Governments BEFORE YOUR PATHETIC LITTLE COUNTRY WAS EVER THOUGHT OF," are you bragging? You seem to be. I think it's an odd thing to do. Bragging that you were a ravenous pack of demented predatory hyenas before there was ever a US? This in some way makes you superior? It's hard to tell, but you seem to be a Brit ex-pat living in Germany. If that's the case, you have made a technical error.

While Germans may have been laying waste to the Continent for a couple of thousand years, they didn't do it as German nationals until the founding of Germany as a single nation-state in 1871. Not only that but they did it while simultaneously knocking the snot out of the French, both sides practicing up for what was to come. Nonetheless, the US is an older country than Germany.

As for the tacky insults, we're used to it and it doesn't bother us. The only thing that would bother us is that, as an insult, it's lame. That's it? Pathetic little country, in caps? That's your shot? Oookay, if you say so, but if you're going to claim that someone else is pathetic you need to demo your power. Cardboard arrows won't do. Got something else?

'26. boudica, Glasgow / 7:05am 30 Jun 2007'

'Didnt Alec Salmond vote for the control orders also on the Terrorists Human Rights he seemed to abstain in a lot of the Votes also against the Dawn Raids ???? Maybe Scotland is a Haven to these lunatics with the Supprt old AS gives to them on their "Human Rights"'

Boudica, that is possibly the lowest comment I've ever come across in this deranged pile of pigswill.

This near miss tells me three things, that really flow from one thing - that the UK has a backwards approach to fighting terrorism. It needs to follow a model more like France and less like the USA. What do I mean by this? It needs to take a much harder line against Islamic communities in the country already and those wishing to migrate, but it needs to disassociate itself with American foreign policy. You can say what you will about the Banlieu riots from '05, but those kids were only a third from a Muslim background - and anyway, they were more inspired by 50 Cent than Allah. The first influence is much more manageable.

The USA can, to an extent, get away with its foreign policy - failures and all - because it has such a big military, it is very far from the middle east, and the Muslim communities in the US are usually middle class and wealthy migrants or Malcolm X-style converts. Brtiains' Muslim communities are very different demographic profile, with Muslims from poorer backgrounds, larger numbers of Muslims, and have a much easier time reaching the country.

I hate to say it, but Blair's policy - which was too lenient towards Muslim communities in Britain and those wanting to migrate and is too closely associated to the US in the foriegn realm is going to leave this nation paying a price it needed have paid for years to come. I expect there is going to be several incidents like this for years to come. Its not to say that there was no threat before the 2001 or the Iraq War - of course there was. Its that the combination of failed policies implemented in recent years have made the problem much worse.

round them up roll them OUT

Gizzabreak is right on at least one score - any muslim dangerous enough to be under a 'control order' should have been interned as Germans were in WWII. Preferably somewhere remote - an uninhabited Orkney island would be a good place, or perhaps South Georgia. We are at war with Iraq - and covertly with Iran - which is supplying most of the projectile bomb devices in Iraq.

Thanks to our treacherous Labour and Lib Dem politicians and an utterly gutless opposition, we in effect have open borders in the UK and thousands of Pakistani, Iraqui. Iranian, Somali and Afghan muslims are still arriving every year - mostly legally - some illegally. Together with the millions already here we have the perfect conditions for a 5th Column to flouirish - a huge network of ostensibly peaceful muslims with the guerillas swimming freely from safe house to safe house. Even among the 'peaceful' ones - over half still believe the London bus bombings were an MI5 fake. Islamism is never going to compromise with liberal western values - it dreams of conquering the west and annihilating the decadent liberal culture of the west. Until we stand up to them, deport them, intern them, jail them and above all STOP letting them in through non existent borders.

#34 think again.
All Europe, including the whole of the British Isles, would be speaking German today were it not for these wimpy Americans.
You'd better be glad we give enough of a damn about the rest of the world to get out there and do something about intolerable circumstances.
We may not always do it right, nor wisely, but on the whole we seek to improve the lot of our world, and you personally are one of the beneficiaries of that effort.

#44
the idea that only a third of the rioters were muslim and that they were more inspired by 50 cent is a Guardian-readers fantasy. If you are going to repeat bs like that then lets see some sources.
If you had ever been to any of these banlieues you would know that the youths there are predominantly north-african muslims.

#46 and others - many Jewish German refugees were interned in WW2, people who had escaped from the Nazis in fear of their lives. It was a panic stricken measure then and would signal the same now. And how do you determine who to intern? The London bombers were British-born. How many generations of peaceloving Muslim British people do you intern before you feel safe? What do you do about people with false passports which say they are, say, Hindus? Or Philipinos? or South Americans?

The counter to this terrorism is to get out of the illegal, indefensible war in Iraq and stop toadying to the USA.

Half a million people expected to march through London for the 'Pride March'.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6256338.stm

The idea that Islamic jihadism is caused by our Iraq policy or our relationship with the US is ignorant and laughable. Jihadism is a perverted totalitarian ideology - like Fascism and Communism - which abuses the Koran for its deluded goals.

Mohammed Siddique Khan was radicalised in 1999 before Iraq and 9/11. Richard Reid (shoe-bomber) was caught before Iraq war and there have been over 15 attempted attacks since 1999. Not to count the dozens of attacks in the 90's (Atlantic plane bombings for one).

Mr Bin Laden and his friends declared war on the West in the early 90's, not just because of the 'infidel presence in muslim holy land' (Mecca), but because of his anti-democratic, anti-secular totalitarian ideology.

Democracy is 'blasphemous' (impedes Sharia Law). Secularism is 'un-Islamic' (Everyone has to submit to extremist Muslim rule or be killed). If you want an idea of what these fanatics want for our society - just look at what they did to the people, culture, architecture and society of Afghanistan. (And look what they're doing to their fellow Muslims in Iraq or Lebanon or Somalia..etc)

It's simple-minded to reduce it to Iraq and America. How can blowing up 'slags' in nightclubs, killing British novelists, attacking Danish cartoonists or declaring 'Islam will conquer Europe and you will submit to Sharia' (Mohammed Sidique Khan) - be a response to Iraq.

We need to support the Muslim reformers, moderates and democrats (who face this daily) and stop giving credence to jihadist propaganda and loony left stupidity.

what if is isn't an AWOL Iraqi, what if it i someone from Leeds that did it?

#50
Thankyou!

Common sense at last!

I just wish some of the other posters would brush the chip off their shoulders and take a reality check.

What I want to know is why was there a traffic warden out at 2:30 in the morning?

Sorry.....

Genuinely pleased that everything was foiled, by whatever means.

I'm not a man of religion or politics - I have no time for either the left or the right (especially the racist far right) so please do not stereotype me as such when you read of my opinions of ho the public should deal with this threat among us.
Within our midst there are people who loathe western culture and society - make no bones about it or blame it on the illegal occupation of Palestine or the illegal (probably) war in Iraq. They hate us regardless. Those things are but an excuse. They feel free to murder and terrorise the community at large because they know that the community at large is far to civilised to mistreat the only part of the community that they actually care about. they have their cake and they can eat it. Within this community there are people who know who these individuals are - they number no more that a few thousand hrdline extremists - yet there seems to be no rush to give them up to the police.

I will never resort to abusing people in the street but it is my bsic right to decide where I spend my money. I will not spend my money in a shop or on any product where I beleive the owner to be Muslim. Harsh - not when I sit worrying about my flesh and blood, not my own getting blown all over the street, but those who I love, every single day.
If moe people were to boycott the muslim and spend their money in other shops then we will get a result in one way or another. They will either give these people up to the authorities or they will sell up and move out. That would be sad, as I beleive a multicultural society is beneficial in general..but Im not naive enough to believe than all or an culture has great things to offer. Certainly what the muslim community offers in a positive way is in my opinion outweighed by what it now offers in a negative way.

Its a sad day when a moderate, in every aspect of the word feels the need to express these views - but I feel it has come to that.

Anyone who thinks that we can believe anything we are told by the government, secret services or police is extremely naive.
We know NOTHING about who stole the two cars and parked them in London. The 'Iraqi on the run' story is pure speculation. How many times have we been told that the police/secret services have uncovered a plot - which later turns out to have been invented or imagined.
Remember the 'liquid explosives' plot? It was a government scam. It isn't possible to make liquid explosives on a plane.
Of course it's about fear and control - letting us know that things are not going to be any different under Brown.
Get real - the CIA and MI6 have been doing this kind of thing for decades in Europe. Has everyone forgotten 'Operation Gladio'?

50 - Perseverance - you are a revisionist fantasist. British ships were being torpedoed off the coast of the USA in the early 1940's by the Germans and the USA done nothing. The USA inntervened when the Germans dclared war on the USA - In other words, the USA had no choice but to team up with the European Allies to make sure the Germans never captured the UK. Otherwise, the whole of the USA would now be speaking German. Persevere a bit more with your historical facts and try to use these facts to make the basis of your opinions!

The 'terrorist' was a very reasonable person. He timed it well (Friday night) so as NOT to distrupt London financial capital, which would have otherwise costed dearly. (all closed during weekend, perfect for police to extract CCTV footage and trace him)

#54 what did you do when the terrorists were IRA? Refuse to shop in Irish shops?

To condemn everybody YOU think is or might be a Muslim is so ridiculous, I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
What criteria do you use?

Eleven years of compulsory education in this country, and this is the end product...

Some of our judges have become "enemies of the people" , to use a traditional phrase,for the way they continually hinder the Government in it's fight against terrorism.

C,mon you people at SIS get a grip, twenty years back you would have had these muppets under control and out of the country before anyone even knew they existed.

Isnt that what SIS is all about, we dont play by the rules thats what SIS is all about, get these illegal immigrant terrorists of the streets and back on the first RAF flight to Baghdad.

#56, I think you mean the whole of the UK would be speaking German don't think they would have been able to conquere the US to vast and to much ocean in betweeen to make it viable.

Nell, I'm not condemning every single Muslim - why would I - thats frankly ridiculous. My view is that ony the Muslim community can deal with these people, nobody else. And the sooner the better for everyone.

Nell - what criteria do I use?........I am fed up going to work everyday wondering if my girlfriend will be blown up or if I myself will die. The fct that my mother worries herself sick everyday and is in turmoil when she sees such stories in the news. This makes me feel physically sick and extremely angry.

Being from Falkirk myself, originally, I know you don't face such dangers on a day to basis so I much easier for you to hide behind poitical correctness. You dont have such decisions to make - the theory and practice dilemna.

And as you seem to be so concerned with the welfare of people then I'm sure you arent disagreeing with my basic human right to spend my money wherever I chose to? That is freedom of choice.

So whose with me - Boycott anyone? We all know that money talks and 'Nells talk' walks....money is the only true dynamic force in any society so lets use it!

I'm off to Central London now to do some shopping because its the only day I can - theres probably been plenty of twisted minds fantacising over the last few years about blowing up the West end on a Saturday afternoon full of shoppers and the ensuing chaos and misery it would cost. But although I am scared - Im determined not to let these twisted sinsiter freaks have a victory, however small it would be!

"Rajeshree Patel, who was in the nightclub, said the Mercedes was "parked at an angle at the door of Tiger Tiger with all four doors open and headlights on."

"They saw what appeared to be smoke and a glance through the window was enough to make them call the police."
Statements from the report above,see any thing strange about them?

"Police say they are looking for an Iraqi who went on the run from a control order only 11 days before yesterday's failed bombing attempts." And....?

"The man, who cannot be identified for legal reasons,". What are these oft-quoted 'legal' reasons?
If we take this report at face value, this would seem to have been a rather inept bomb attack, no booby traps , not very well hidden.
Brave people who disarmed it.
The people who towed away the second car and saw, heard and felt nothing strange in the cars "feel" when they moved it? ??????
Re-read the report and look at the statements of "fact".
This is either lazy journalism or we (and the Journo's) are being told a 'story' to create an effect in our minds. You decide!!

#56 I think you were meaning Perseverance '#47'

If not, then I've badly missed something.

Cheers

Border Controls.

The present government have failed in the protection of our borders that allow many criminals/terrorist into this country. The Essex Police rightly requested modern patrol vessels to patrol the Thames Estuary and coastline - an essential ingrediant in protecting shipping and preventing drug smuggling, illegal importation of drugs and criminals. The present government financed one vessel instead of three which is the minimum requirement.

It is a serious issue that money has been wasted on the Dome, decorating government accomodation, entertaining and most serious of all taking the UK into a illegal war that has increased terrorism and brought about death, injury and distruction abroad and in the UK.

The UK will pay for the illegal war in various forms for years to come.

#56 Hugh , absolutely right, enough of this historical revisionism, what about the 20m Russians who died saving Europe. We ALL played our parts not just one nation.

47

The anti americanism frequently displayed is a mixture of real inferiority (a very few) plus sensitivity after the decline of the British Empire. You are certainly right that the US effort in Europe (41-45) had a significant if not crucial effect on the defeat of the Nazis. Hitler might well have defeated the Russians if the USA had not been in the European war. I would almost certainly be speaking German as a subjugated inferior and am grateful to the men and women from America who came thousands of miles giving priority to Britain and Europe whilst their countrymen fought a Dday time after time across the Pacific.

The loss of life of all the Allied soldiers in Europe was a dreadful price paid to deal with a megalomaniac and his criminal supporters who managed, via democracy no less, to command a nation.

The miraculous decision of the Americans to devote the majority of their effort to the European war flew in the face of every instinctive reaction they undoubtedly had.

Franklin Roosevelt was the greatest American president of the twentieth century if not of your entire history. Thanks to him and to your fellow onetime Europeans who came to our rescue. He should be properly honoured by your country and Britain for the war effort and by Americans as the founder of the modern America which gave ordinary people such an improved life.

...Could somebody remind me when we finally finished paying the US for their assistance in WWII? Until it was politically desirable for your fathers to get involved, the USA sat on the sidelines and left us to it. Only when the war came to you did you realise that there wasn't much option any more. Don't dress it up as a kind gesture to the rest of the world.

The real heroes were the Eagle Squadron men who came not because they were sent, but because they believed it was right.

Me and Mrs were in Londinium the past couple of days, went to Leicester Sq on the Thursday, glad we did cos theatre-land was oot of bounds on the Friday. This would-be bomber laddie has nae consideration for tourists.
Also Temple Church was shut on Friday (renovation) and the Golden Bough wisnae on display at Tate Britain, what's with London ? Not exactly welcoming to the discerning tourist.

White Cliffs of Dover and through all the Ph***ers over. No boat no paddle. NO Pc correct world No Human rights, just send all the suspected over, we are far too soft and molly coddle in this country

68 - I've always wondered why FDR (the US's greatest president imo) has never been commemorated by having his features carved into Mt Rushmore. Some diddies would prefer Ronnie Reagan instead !

71 - whatever happened to concise English ?

Brilliant. Nutters try to blow up London, and Brits and Americans immediately start attacking each other.

Sometimes I wonder if we deserve to survive.

HH 62 - chill oot man, me and Mrs P were on the town (London) the past few days and we never felt the slightest bit threatened, just annoyed that it might inconvenience oor sightseeing. If you worry about the 'what ifs' and let it change your life then the buggers have won.
Give the bunnies a cuddle for me : )

46 - We're doomed ! doomed, ah tell ye !

Jock MacSprog # 1
quote : " Why was he allowed into Britain in the first place "
why british armed forces entered his country in the first place ?
I am always anti terrorism .

paulpsd7, California
quote :" I'm so glad we're fighting them over there "
war results in war and bloodshed . ask Mr Bush to pull all American troops out of the middle east and to close all military bases in the rigion . you must be happy for this .

#46--Tweedmouth & #50--DrinkSoakedPopinjay--

the two of you seem to *get it.....i would feel quite safe if you were at the helm of 'national security... better yet, world security...

Sadly, I have to agree with the sentiments of Poster No.23.
when freedom - including freedom of religion impinges on our general safety, then I suggest, it is time to review these freedoms, and perhaps proscribe the practicing of the Muslim religion.

#78--Faramars----why would we want Pres. Bush to pull all American troops out??
perhaps so Ajad would have free reign in Iraq??
that is what he ultimately wants, right??
you tell your buddy Ajad to stop training & supplying the terrorists in Iraq, for he is responsible for most of the civilian deaths from his IED's...

#68--Brian Boru----thank you.

no Sandy .
US presense in Islamic countries is the main cause of terrorism . when you have military bases in Saudi arabia in which Kaba is located expect some exterimists to attack you . leave middle east and save the world . this is my idea

#80---Budgie---""sadly, i have to agree with the sentiments of Poster No.23.""..ditto..

"42. 57Nomad, california
#34 you seem to be a Brit ex-pat living in Germany. "

Do NOT insult me with the label of being EVER a "patriot" of that piece of **** laying of the coast of France.

"Now, when you say, "We in Europe have had CENTURIES of our lands been torn apart by various groups/Governments BEFORE YOUR PATHETIC LITTLE COUNTRY WAS EVER THOUGHT OF," are you bragging?"

Not as much as the U.S Americans, that seem to think they are the only ones in the world to have experienced a minor building or two being knocked down, and expect the whole world to feel sorry for them.

"47. Perseverance,
#34 think again.
All Europe, including the whole of the British Isles, would be speaking German today were it not for these wimpy Americans."

And, would THAT be a problem?

"All Europe, including the whole of the British Isles, would be speaking German today"

actualy, the British DO. (As do YOU)

English is a GERMANIC language.

But I would not expect a U.S American to be so highöly educated as to know that.

#53--CraigieD---""what i want to know is why was there a traffic warden out at 2:30 in the morning?""

well, Craigie, perhaps because of all the late night heavy drinkers roaming the streets, driving while inebriated!!!!
nothing sinister! just looking out for the public's interest...

With all due respect to our 'anti-terrorist' Iranian friend #78, I don't think a lecture on foreign policy is necessary.

The Bush policy, 2003-2006, has been a disaster but they are trying now, at last, to secure Baghdad properly and help the DEMOCRATICALLY ELECTED government provide security for all the people.

Unlike the Iranian government who is training and arming Shiite militias to kill American and British troops (working under a UN mandate and with Iraqi goverment authorization).

Perhaps if you're so 'anti-terrorist' you would like to bring that up with your President.

Or bring up Iran's support for Hamas and Hezbollah terrorism against Jewish civilians in Israel.

Or the Syria/Iranian assassination of democratically elected Lebanese politicians like Prime Minister Rafik Hariri.

Or Mr Ahmadinejad's declaration to wipe Israel 'of the face of the earth' and 'destroy it's allies'.

Or stop issuing fatwas against our novelists.

The root cause of Islamic terrorism isn't America.

What has Sadr's death squads killing Sunnis got to do with US presence in S.Arabia? Or car bombs in Baghdad markets? Or Buddhists being decapitated in Thailand? Or Algeria being bombed by Islamic radicals? Or Hindus being blown up by Jihadists in India?

The root cause of Islamic extremism is the belief in Holy War and Jihad to all non-Muslims, apostates and heretics. Nothing else.

Back up, everybody. I think von-Scharnhorst is about to blow.

DrinkSoakedPopinjay,
dear friend
a long comment require a long response . Now i have to go out . be sure that i will post a comment in some hours .Regards

I hope mayor livingston would be the recipient of a bit of shrapnel he is the one who would deserve it.

Pity nobody stopped these terrorists from murdering more children.

A near daily ocurence now in Afghanistan and Iraq.
Or is this just what the knuckle dragging islamophobes want?
Read below

The US-led coalition and Afghan troops have apologised after they launched airstrikes against a compound suspected of housing al-Qa'ida militants in eastern Afghanistan, killing seven children and several militants.

Coalition and Afghan troops launched the airstrike yesterday on a compound that also contained a mosque and a madrassa, or Islamic school, in the Zarghun Shah district of Paktika Province, a coalition statement said.

Brian Boru, nicely put. For those who don't know, prior to 1941 America did a great deal to help us driven by one of (imo) the greatest American Presidents FDR. This was mostly in the form of providing us with much needed weapons and supplies at the risk of their own neutrality at the time. Many Americans travelled off their own bat to the UK and signed up with the British Forces prior to America's formal declaration of war.

American isolationism of the 30s and 40s was caused among other things by the huge damage of the financial collapse of the late 20s and early 30s but FDR among others knew in 1939 that they would eventually enter the war on the side of the Allies. He had to have an excuse to do so to overcome this isolationism and Japan eventually provided that excuse. The more illiterate among the commentators may even be able to see that Japan just happens to be in the opposite direction to Germany from the US......!

We in Europe have a great deal to be thankful for, our freedom and democracy today was a gift of the many thousands of American lives lost in our defence and we should be humbly grateful for that fact.

That however has nothing to do with the present situation. The Iraq war was an ill considered and mostly indefensible act carried out by political leaders of miniscule stature compared to the likes of FDR and Churchill.

It however, as others have pointed out, has little or nothing to do with radical Islam's attacks on western ideals of freedom and democracy.

Condemning all Muslims on the basis of the actions of a few is as stupid as condemning all Irishmen on the basis of the extremist members of the IRA.

There are many Muslims serving in our Armed Forces putting themselves in harms way in defence of our liberal democracies so please cut out the 'lets deport them all' comments from the numpties.

Oh one other thing, how do you identify these Muslims you want to intern/throw out etc? Far as I know yo

#90 DrinkSoakedPopinjay, Scotland

George W,
I thought you gave up drink!
Jim P

To continue my long rant (a serious subject deserves serious comment).

The only way to win long term is to ensure that your forces are better armed, better equipped and better trained than your opponents and you have to learn to fight them on their own ground using their rules but just be better at it.

So if you want to have a go at someone ask your MP to explain why our armed forces are going into action in ancient outdated equipment.

Our RAF are flying tankers that are 50 years old, our recon aircraft are of a similar age (and blow up when being refueled). Did you know that our pilots have to provide their own escape and evasion packs, at least in the Battle of Britain they got a compass and a silk hanky with a map!

Our navy is taking on Iranian gunboats with blow up boats for goodness sake.

Our army patrols in softsided landrovers and gets blown up regularly.

These are just a tiny few of the things our sons and daughters are having to deal with at the behest of our government.

Ask your government why the budget for the intelligence and police services has been cut and cut again, ask why their rules of engagement have been so proscribed that we apply 'control orders' to suspected terrorists and have insufficient manpower to stop them hopping in and out of the country when they feel like it.

And finally remember that we won the last war by devoting the entire country's efforts towards that end regardless of the consequences. Unless you, individually, are prepared to devote the same effort in time and money to the defeat of Radical Islam then they WILL win...

Nuff said

#93--Leon--are they the same Al Qaeda terrorists, that much like the Hezbollah & Hamas, consistantly hide behind their women & children because they are cowards?? are those the ones your referring to, Leon??? ummmm??

#95

Thanks Jim, but I'm actually a secular liberal.

I didn't realise being anti-totalitarian made me a right-wing Neocon Republican.

(And I don't watch Fox News either, before you start.)

Cheers

It seems the stolen car was spotted in Scotland a few days ago,and makes me wonder if Scotland had ever been a target or if the plotters were living here. With 400,000 illegal aliens running about in UK, kind of shows how vulnerable and exposed the country is . Politicians should hang their head in shame for devising such a reckless immigration "system", allowing these terrorists and others easy access.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/crime/article200...

Sounds to me like these people made a common error, they forgot that all explosions require an ignition source, something to burn and an oxident, filling a car with fumes or gas prevents the oxident being made available, the precursor used abroad is an explosive and not petrol as seems to have been used here. And no I'm not giving information to terrorists a two year old could see why it didn't work. Never mind how we got here it is time to get out and that means leaving Iraq and the middle-East to those who have sown the wind, ..... and that wasn't us or the Americans. In the old book it talks of someone being told to reap as the crop is over-ripe, and that person is told to use a sickle, ..... so if so many Americans believe in all this "trash" why don't they get their troops out along with ours and allow him to use the "sickle", ..... islam. Sow the wind and you will reap the whirlwind so they say, ... well israel is over-ripe, who are we to say they shouldn't be reaped?

#95--Jim P--shame on you!! you need a good ol' fashioned spanking:-)

CONVICTED TERRORIST CAR DEALER JUNADE FEROZE AND ZAMIR HUSSAIN DELT IN MERCEDES BENZ CARS IN BALCKBURN UK.

ABC NEWS APPEARS TO LINK USED CAR DEALER JUNADE FEROZE'S PARTNER, ZAMIR HUSSAIN, TO THE LONDON CAR BOMB PLOT OF 6/29/07.

It appears Zamir Hussain was the driver of the Mercedes car bomb on Friday night that was left in front of Tiger Tiger, Hussain is linked to Dhiren Barot who has been in jail since 2004

Car Dealer Junade Feroze, 31, was one of four men who pleaded guilty to plotting against the UK and the US in April of 07.

The men admitted conspiracy to cause explosions together with convicted Al Qaeda terrorist Dhiren Barot who has been in jail since August 4, 2004.

Feroze and Zamir Hussain, were returning from a car auction at when police chased them at speds of100mph in Bamber Bridge UK they arrested in 2004, Zamir Hussain was let go for lack of evidence.

BILL WARNER
WWW.WBIPI.COM

71 - whatever happened to concise English ?

It's here, just works a bit slower after 12 hours nightshift and 3 hours sleep, still 12 hours tonight and we are off for 2 days

#97> Cowards are they? Not like the brave US soldiers the world witnessed via their TVs by tape, torturing their innocent Iraqi victims and killing thousands of families and young children from the air with their humane clean bombs unchallenged; as they did in Vietnam and Cambodia when using their humane napalm; chemical and biological weapons and also experimented by dropping their clean bombs on the innocent.
The final number of victims resulting from their cruel indiscriminate and inhumane slaughter totalled millions when they finally had to get out..
Oh; and I almost forgot, the only *brave nation*; not cowardly on planet earth ever to deliberately use nuclear weapons on undefended civilains.
Yes the freedom loving brave Yanks; have much to be really proud off as defenders off freedom and democracy;especially when they choose to attack inferior, weaker opposition when land of the free is getting short of the mighty dollar.

Well now, I have just seen on the net that the Police have a "crystal clear CCTV picture of the man who staggered out of one of the Mercedes car bombs yesterday. And he has been identified as an escaped Iraqi terror suspect who, would you believe??! was out on a "control" order from our courts.

At last let us all hope that this very serious lesson to the British Justice System that just putting TERRORIST suspects 'on trust not to runaway' is actually endangering the lives of everyone in the world!!

Mrs T

For a minimum of rationality please read this article:

www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSL299398720070629

#97
As if the US of A needed an excuse to murder women and children.
Freedom Fighters by very definition live in the towns villages and cities of occupied countries.

You have been murdering women and children from Korea right up to today in Afghanistan when another 50 have died. watch the news. Halman Province!

#108--Leon---sorry, guy...the USA soldiers do NOT hide behind women & children to protect themselves, that honor stays w/the cowards, Al Qaeda,Hezbollah, Hamas..et-al....

BTW--are you referring to Helmand Province??

Okay, okay...you guys are going to LOVE it when China is the world's predominate superpower.

I'm looking forward to seeing that one. From my bunker in Montana.

# never said you hid behind them - you just murder them! Either directly or by proxy as you have done are continuing to do in Palestine

they al queda numpties have driven a car on fire intae glasgow airport - hope they burned to death. bunch of bams.

Whats going on at Glasgow airport today ? Car crashed into terminal , one man in flames runing away?

as it stands , we have no idea who done it, and the whole idea o Al queida is ridiculous. It doesnt exist.

Don't look now, Leon, but the Palestinians are murdering the Palestinians. In droves. I guess they must be secret Mossad operatives, mmm?

"Cowards are they? Not like the brave US soldiers the world witnessed via their TVs by tape, torturing their innocent Iraqi victims and killing thousands of families and young children from the air with their humane clean bombs unchallenged; as they did in Vietnam and Cambodia when using their humane napalm; chemical and biological weapons and also experimented by dropping their clean bombs on the innocent.
The final number of victims resulting from their cruel indiscriminate and inhumane slaughter totalled millions when they finally had to get out..
Oh; and I almost forgot, the only *brave nation*; not cowardly on planet earth ever to deliberately use nuclear weapons on undefended civilains.
Yes the freedom loving brave Yanks; have much to be really proud off as defenders off freedom and democracy;especially when they choose to attack inferior, weaker opposition when land of the free is getting short of the mighty dollar."

US/Israel governments are the worlds biggest terrorists organization.(period)

Well said wattie>x 1

Al Queda is just another way of saying Mad Death Cult. If they kill innocents then thats ok because they will go to paradise, anyone else deserves it and they themselves get 72 virgins in paradise. A shame the crowds didn't get hold of them.

I don't know what they were doing, thinking they could find 72 virgins in Glasgow then...once again, pure numpties...

It's simply childish Chomskyite drivel to imply moral equivalence between American soldiers and Islamic terrorists.

Whenever there is a Haditha, Abu Ghraib, My Lai or crime against civilians, the perpetrators are brought to justice. That is the high standard we should hold as opposed to communists, fascists and jihadists.

These idiot soldiers are the exception - not the rule.

Yes, the civilian casualties in Afghanistan are too high but the Taliban are basically holding uncoperative villagers hostage (like Hezbollah in Southern Lebanon). They simply can't be allowed to take Afghanistan back to its pre-9/11 state. NATO has to be more careful.

Dropping 'the bomb' was entirely justified in WW2. Truman was warned that there would be over a million US and Japanese casualties if they fought the full-scale invasion.

Not much of an option.....but historically justified nonetheless.

And the nonsense about Korea, Vietnam is ahistorical garbage if you don't mention the war against communism.

Too much ignorant Chomsky/Pilger crap and not enough John Lewis Gaddis.

#118 I shouldn't laugh, but that was very funny!

According to the Telegraph hours before the bombs were found, a message appeared on a website used by al-Qa'eda to disseminate propaganda.

It read: "Today I say: rejoice, by Allah, London shall be bombed". It went on to attack Salmond Rushdie's knighthood.

Pakistan's religious affairs minister said (re the knighthood):
"If somebody has to attack by strapping bombs to his body to protect the honour of the Prophet then it is justified,"

Basically this bombing attempt is down to Rushdie's knighthood.

#119

"drivel to imply moral equivalence between American soldiers and Islamic terrorists."

Neither accepts "Thou shalt not kil"l?

I read in reuters a car was explosed in Gasgow airport and they are a great perturbation.

#122

Glib quotes like "Thou shalt not kill"? are wasted on me.

I can tell the difference between an Army fighting for democracy and liberty, and totalitarian scum like communists, fascists and jihadists.

Looks like a terrorist incident at Glasgow. Just happened to be passing the airport in my car. Airport is closed. Smouldering, burning 4 x 4 rammed into front airport terminal. 2 Asian men in jeep came out burning , trying to avoid arrest. Bystander dropped one Asian , running away. Strathclyde Police reporting several arrests, but cant confirm injuries. Other eyewitness , saw one of the Muslims pouring petrol overhimself , before revving up the car and ram it into front terminal.
Looks like another wanton act of terrorism, probably the first to visit Scotland.

Is it time to purge the UK of all Muslims , or is the ordinary citizen expected to sit back and let the Muslim scum step all over us.

117. Billy_w
72 virgins? Jeezo that'd be my idea of purgatory, all that 'of course I won't' and 'go on try it, honest, you'll love it' and 'yes I'll still respect you'.

Am I the only one that finds the timing of this event a bit odd?

Presumably the people responsible for these devices would be sending a political message, but what message?

'People of Britain rally round your new Prime Minister and his Cabinet, you face an increased and deadly threat from us world terrorists on your own doorstep'.

Ten years of waiting and planning his strategy for his first 100 days as PM and already Gordon Brown is fluking results.

Within days of reaching his goal he has already had one defection from his domestic opponents to boost his confidence, now we have the war on terror to thank for another such boost.

Tony Bliar steps aside to give him No10 unopposed, everyone else who might've challenged him are convinced to fight each other for the nothing post of deputy leader.

Cameron's Tories implode over a nothing policy like grammar schools and threaten to kick off all over again over Europe.

Auld Ming the Clueless gets completely wrong footed by the approach to Paddy Ashdown to accept the N.Ireland post.

Have we all seriously under-estimated Big Gogsie?

Just how 'jammy' can this guy get?

If he was getting results like this at the gaming table I think they'd be considering asking him to leave.

The people who use bombs to make themselves important are not true Muslims even if they claim they are.

Most Muslims think terrorists are animals. Many Americans would be surprised to learn that America is respected and liked by most Arabs. If you speak to most people from the middle east you will hear good things about America. You may hear criticism of American foreign policy but not American people.

Al Quaeda is no longer the organized group it had been before 9/11/01, The leaders have now been killed or chased into hiding. Most of the people who are involved in terrorism in the name of Al quaeda are people who do not even know each other. Most are wanna be big shots who brag to each other in internet chatrooms.
we are not fighting a religion, we are fighting young men with no job skills who need an enemy to make themselves more important than they are.

No, Eric, it looks like it is time to improve the education and cultural awareness learning in Renfrewshire.

#124 DSP

Maybe the prayer in this clip will convert you?

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=74f_1182324385

Well said Hezza. This is an event that has JUST happened and Eric has already decided who did it and why.

What an arsehole. Youre not helping eric.

What is really sad is all the teaching these loonie religious fanatics are given, "that they are going to paradise with seventy virgins", is actually a mistranslation when the Koran was written into Arabic.

The origin words were "seven translucent currents of purity"..As Prof. Dawkins says, " What a shame these bombers don't know that they are only blowing themselves up for a few currents"

Mrs.T

What I want to know is what do the female suicide bombers get in Paradise?
Probably the shaft, same as in life.

Should have added, I mean Islamist females. I'm doing fine over here.

They get 72 morphy richards toaster ovens, I think.

ps - that offer is not limited to fundamentalists - it is for all (whilst stocks last).

This story sums up British efficiency as non existant. Imagine having the suspects under surveilance and then letting them do the following:
a) design a bomb
b) buy bomb materials
c) Steal 2 cars and drive them 500 miles around the UK
d) plant bombs outside nightclub
e)leave the country.

MI5/MI6/Poilce etc. Are you serious? Would we have been told the suspects were being watched if the bombs had gone off.
What a Half hearted, unprofesional and frankly unbelievable attitude and comitment shown by our government towards 'terrorism'.

#129

Sorry pal, don't have a quick internet connection.

Would you like to elucidate?

Or do I have to wait 45 minutes for it to download?

119. DrinkSoakedPopinjay

In Iraq or in Afghanistan, as in most theatres of war for generations, the most dangerous place to be is in the gunsights of an American, friend or foe.

As our squaddies have ever had it:
'all gear and no idea'.

The Talliban were defeated in Afghanistan and we promised the Afghans help to rebuild their shattered country for their stance against our enemies the Soviets and then against religious extremists.

We let them down and now the Talliban have got native Afghans growing dope earning an income to maintain themselves in a country left with very little industry.
What do we give them as an alternative?

The Talliban succeed where we fail to win hearts and minds when we are killing families and destroying the homes supposed to be under our protection.

What gains we do have are immediately given away by the allies failure to commit enough resources to the peace as we have also done in Iraq.

That mince about Truman having to nuke the Japanese, no my friend that mission was simply to impress Uncle Joe Stalin.
The USA had the technology and they were hell bent on using it.
Hiroshima and Nagasaki were convenient demonstrations to the Soviets of US military technology.

The Japanese, for all their faults, had been trying to surrender for some time before the Enola Gay mission.

Korea/ Vietnam garbage?
I used to watch Vietnam everynight on the news, it was anything but garbage with or without communism, but how you take communism out of either conflict seems to miss the point.

You know WWII without the Nazis kind of idea?

#136 BooncinMad - Imagine the following

1) Numerous Saudi men practice on flight simulators in America, telling instructors they don't want to learn how to land!
2) Same Saudi men plus accomplices hijack not 1 but 4 planes without any weapons
3) Said Saudi men, organized by a Saudi radical (Bin Laden) destroy WTC
4) America invades Iraq and screws up things even more

What a Half hearted, unprofesional and frankly unbelievable attitude and comitment shown by your American government towards 'terrorism'.

Why didn't the cellular phone work & the Mercedes bomb go off @ Tiger Tiger? Because these rats were being followed by intel types who jammed their cel. phone @ the right moment--when that happened the perpetrators cut & ran, knowing they'd been followed & foiled. They're not supposed to get caught so the rest of their cell of co-conspirators can remain @ large & ready for more terror, death & devastation. Then a tipoff was given so that car's contents could be "discovered" in time, while the other car was carted away from the populous area. Too bad things have to get this far for a civilized govt. in the West to be able to successfully indict & prosecute such crazed vermin, i.e., catch them in the act. The Left in general have made sure of that, enabled by idiot PC-ers & hypocritcal human rights activists who dissect the beleaguered West in its fight against international terror but are always giving a free ride to the likes of murderous, despotic Fidel Castro, Mugabe, Mbeki, Putin, the People's Rep. of China's military masters & others of that ilk. Remember that the next time you go to the urns to vote--if indeed you DO vote--& use your God-given common sense & survival instincts to decide between those candidates who are corrupt PC types allied w/the many enemies of the West, as compared to those candidates who make sense & believe in protecting our lives & western culture. The West has been a model to the entire world for law, order & freedom, sound economics, science & technology, & our ever-readiness to provide emergency assistance, funds, programs & even military intervention to countries impoverished & held hostage by centuries of misrule or hit by natural disasters. Those who would have us all believe that we in the West are the bad guys are just trying to keep the public whipped up in mob mode & reacting emotionally rather than intellectually, so we don't see who

#138

I take many of your valid points my friend.

I think the stereotypes of US troops that people propagate is grossly unfair. Yes, there are a few idiots but generalizations are useless - the vast majority are decent and not trigger-happy.

NATO have let down Afghan's by not buying up the poppy crop and using too much airpower. (The latter is because of a lack of political guts on NATO members who wont put troops in where needed) It's always the US, UK, Aussies, NZ etc....The US was warned also about Iraq needing 500,000 troops but Rumsfeld thought he knew better. Colossal mistake.

The Truman comments are not 'mince'. Gar Alperovitz and Howard Zinn have been shown to be completely wrong by the historical record. The documents are now released. Read Robert H. Ferrell or Robert Maddox on this - the debate is over. It's only crackpot leftists or conspiracy theorists who still parrot the 'scare Russia' piffle.

Or Robert P. Newman 'Truman and the Hiroshima Cult'
Or read "'A Score of Bloody Okinawas and Iwo Jimas' Pacific Historical Review, Feb 2003, pp. 93-132
Or "The Shock of the Atomic Bomb and Japan's Decision to Surrender - A Reconsideration", Pacific Historical Review, November 1998

(Both are available online)

And my comments on Vietnam/Korea were directed at the leftist idiots, in the previous posts, who pretty much claimed the US just goes round killing people and carpet-bombing countries. (Typical Chomskyite garbage). They don't even mention communism, the Soviets, China etc...

Cheers

#105, Reading Pubic - You write, and I quote "The US Bank Rolled Europe and supplied the allies". Did you mean 'bank-rolled'?
If so, I assume you are referring to how Dubya's grampaw, Prescott Bush, financed Hitler from 1923 to 1942 at which late date, Pres. Roosevelt stopped him from "trading with the enemy". Google it.

It's time we got real with these Islamic radicals. What the hell are they doing here if they disagree with the government and everything that the UK stands for?

All they want is to turn the UK and the rest of the West into an Islamic state.

Boot the lot out, back to their own countries. They would soon be squealing like stuck pigs because there is no freedom of speech there. Only dictatorships and factionalized and tribal in-fighting - they cannot agree amongst themselves or live in harmony. It's too cushy here by far. Ship them out and let them stew in their own social order back home rather than allow them access to the UK's welfare, freedom of speech and human rights.

We cannot ever allow their twisted logic and ideals to prevail. One thing is certain this is a battle we must not and will not lose.

Pictus - thanks for setting the record straight!

I might point out, it was a purported German who started in on the US, which led (somewhat irrationally) to the extended WWII-related arguments. My point was simply that the US wasn't running short of genuine will-to-do and genuine sacrifice in this or former conflicts, nor are we ill-intended towards Europe.

Bickering aside, I propose to predict the future:

The great conflict of this century will be Islamism versus the rest of the world. It will occur in the context of diminishing oil resources and vast expenditures (to the enormous financial benefit of a number of Islamist and neo-fascist regimes) on the part of many nations to acquire what they can of the remaining oil.

It could become a very ugly scene indeed.

#88 VS

Vs said:
"actualy, the British DO. (As do YOU)

English is a GERMANIC language."

It's also an Indo-European language. Does that mean you speak Sanscrit?

#84 Fars

"no Sandy .
US presense in Islamic countries is the main cause of terrorism "

Guess what? We don't care if it is or not. We're not the kind of people who run away from 7th Century knuckleheads like you and your friends for any reason. Even if all the terrorism ended overnight we might still stay and smack you clowns around just to pass the time of day.

You want us to leave? Here's how you do it. We give you a list of all the Islamofascists we know about, A'jad and OBL at the head of it. You guys go round them up, put them in chains and Orange Boiler Suits and hand them over to a couple of Marine private we'll detail for that purpose. Then start sending cash, lots of it, and keep it coming. Then maybe we'll get bored with you and leave you alone. Until then, just remember when you're in the middle of shooting off your mouth, there's a Boomer full of Tridents just a few minutes away just in case we start feeling really ornery. Sleep well.

I must confess I was unconvinced by the description of the car "bombs", that seemed to be relying on a thief with an impaired sense of smell lighting a cigarette, as an ignition source.

But I see that a couple of numpties drove a burning Jeep Cherokee into Glasgow Airport's terminal building, leaped out, clothes ablaze and tried to hug the bemused Weegies.

The term "friendly fire" must have lost something in the translation.

#154 CB

"The term "friendly fire" must have lost something in the translation."

If only I could have been there to hear the cries of "Allauh Akbar," turn into cries of "Oh, sh*&!!, my hair's on fire!"

#Col Blimp - Grand to see you up and about and taking nourishment.

One eyewitness reports that he asked a cop if they should put out the one in flames, and he say, "nah. let the ___ burn."

I was so proud.

The presence of Terrorists in any country is bad news indeed. In the case of the Western countries such as UK and USA, they have wittingly or unwittingly helped them to establish themselves in the guise of granting asylum to them. What they are yet to understand is that all the terrorists wherever they are in the world, are working hand in hand since they have a network of their own to maximize their efforts by benchmarking with each other.

It is a common thing in Sri Lanka as opposed to the rare occurence of bomb threats in the West. Unfortunately, UK and USA have seemingly helped them to thrive and allowed to collect money in their own countries to buy arms to kill and maim innocent people helped by some sympathaizers believing that they are being discriminated. The West can be duped easily, due to their empathic nature it seems!

They do not seem to understand that majority of the minority are living safely amongst the Singhalese with no discrimination whatsoever. The terrorists although violating all the human rights under the sun, they expect special treatment from the authorities. There is no exception to this even in the West. They expect the authorities to treat them as gentlemen, although they are terrorists out to kill and maim innocent people.

So, in conclusion, the only way to get rid of terrorists in the West is to bar them coming to Western countries on the guise of humanatarian grounds after which they build their own network and fund their parent organizations. Liberation Tigers of Tamil Elam (LTTE) is a good example of this and they have also shown their presence in the UK recently with a suicide bomb kit found by the Police.

#32. Kiltedblue2

Bet you feel realy silly now after what has just happened at Glasgow Airport

#155. 57Nomad, california

I think they were followers of the Mad Mahdi.

Interesting to note that they were using an American made missile, you lot are as bad as the Iranians.

#157. Pictus, Rainbow Valley

That defibrillator seems to have did the trick after all, you must have called it too soon :).

90. DrinkSoakedPopinjay, Scotland
Dear friend
You wrote : The Bush policy, 2003-2006, has been a disaster but they are trying now, at last, to secure Baghdad properly and help the DEMOCRATICALLY ELECTED government provide security for all the people.
Unlike the Iranian government who is training and arming Shiite militias to kill American and British troops (working under a UN mandate and with Iraqi goverment authorization).
My answer :
They are not able to secure Baghdad . day by day the situation gets worse in iraq . in 2004-05-06 the situation was better than today . sending more troops was not effective and all security plans are ineffective to control the violence in iraq . please note that with millions of troops you can not stop a suicide bomber who is ready to push the botton in less than one second . so what is the best alternative ? one thing , pullout
Almost All American and british forces are killed in suicide or roadside bombings done by Alqade in iraq .no suicide and roadside bombings related to Iraqi shiits has been reported . training and arming shiits by iran is a great folk which you shoud not believe . you should know that nowadays shiits in hundreds are targeted by Alqade .
You have said that the coliation forces are in iraq under a UN mandate. I kindly ask you to mention this mandate in order to help me correct my mistake . like many posters I see the war in iraq illegal and contrary to basic rules of international law .
UN is unable to issue a mandate to kill civilian . today 110 villagers in Afghanistan and 26 civilians in IRAQ were killed by US forces . IS it under UN mandate ?
You wrote : Or bring up Iran's support for Hamas and Hezbollah terrorism against Jewish civilians in Israel.
My answer :
I like my country not to interfere in this case but what about US support of isreal in killing children and women in Palestine ? do you watch tv to see these slaughters ?
You wrot

My idea :
Leave the middle eastern countries with their styles of life and government . don’t try to establish democracy!!!!! in these countries . RESULT : THE WORLD WILL BE SAFE . OTHERWISE WE MUST WRITE THOUSANDS OF COMMENTS ABOUT TERRPRISM IN FUTURE . REGARDS

103 - a shift like that - better you than me. I'm too auld for that caper. It would affect my grammar for one thing.

153. 57Nomad
What is the diferrence between your logic andBen Laden ?

Sandy #89 - a traffic warden lookiing after the public interest ? To quote your countryman, J. McEnroe, "You cannot be serious !"

Billy 117 - 72 virgins in Paradise ? That's only 72 you-know-whats the sui bomber gets, a boring time for the rest of eternity for him imo.

Eric 125 - I'm sure you'll look fine and dandy as a doormat !

#166 Nice idea Farzad, but Israel isn't going away and Iran won't leave them alone. If we ignored the Mid East then Saddam would have continued into Saudi after invading Kuwait. No democracy means corrupt and incompetent governments - Iran is oil rich and yet rations petrol and its people are poor.

#170 I think they hope for some repeat action!

Re-write article: "Worry Worry Worry Worry.........Your masters will protect you.....this is why we're killing folk in their thousands around the world....to stop this from happening........"

Strange that during the IRA's mainland activities the 'uk' media didn't a)attempt to demonise the entire Christian faith and b) fully crank up the "Worry Worry" herd-control routine.

It's quite interesting to note that nation states which do not go stomping around the world killing folk have noticably less events of this type on their own soil.

If you want to reduce 'terrorism', stop participating in it.

#166--Faramars---is that a threat??

Hey morons...you awake yet? If not.....wake up you losers....13. Bob10, 21. Yane, Melbourne ...real morons...here's another one....Are you all morons?

34. von-Scharnhorst, Brandenburg Preußen
We in Europe have had CENTURIES of our lands been torn apart by various groups/Governments BEFORE YOUR PATHETIC LITTLE COUNTRY WAS EVER THOUGHT OF.

39. Covert Action :I'm sorry to say that I think one of these attacks will have to get through before the country wakes up.

It won't matter. Your countries are full of morons.

#165--Faramars----""like many posters i see the war in Iraq illegal & contrary to basic rules of international law""

2-questions..
1) what makes the "war in Iraq illegal"?
2)what are the basic "rules of international law", in reference to the "war in Iraq"??

do you have specific links explaining this??

Thank you my Iranian friend.

Day by day the situation does not get worse. The 2003-2006 policy was failure because they stood back and allowed militias and insurgents to terrorize the locals and establish safe-havens. Only now have they changed strategy and decided to sweep and hold territory. The last troops arrived in Baghdad last week and it will take time to show.

Already, since January strategy was announced, sectarian violence has decreased, Anbar has been turned around and Al-Qaeda is isolated.

Pulling out would create a massive power vacuum which would lead to full-scale civil war and probably genocide. Turkey, Iran and S. Arabia would carve out their respective areas and bloodshed would ensue - the Iraqi people being screwed again.

I agree that suicide bombers against Shia are difficult to stop, as are Coalition troops being killed by roadside bombs. However, for Iraqi democracy to succeed, they need to be taken on by the security forces - withdrawal wont stop the attacks on Shiite muslims.

The resolution for UN mandate is 1546. All legality for the invasion was contained in the previous 17 UN resolutions - especially 687 and 678. Not 'illegal' at all.

Israel is the only liberal democracy in the Middle East, thanks to US help and no thanks to the surrounding countries who have tried to destroy it, since its creation. There's no comparison with anti-semitic fascist scum like Hamas or Hezbollah, at all.

Hariri's assassination (and others) was by Hezbollah terrorists - paid, armed and trained by Iran and Syria. Syria may be ultimately responsible but Iran is culpable too.

The sectarianism in Iraq is a product, not of Bush, but of decades of hatred, torture, rape and mistrust by the Sunni fascist rulers. Al-Qaeda blew up the Samarra mosque which started the sectarian carnage in 2006. The Shia were bound to let loose when they were in power.

Iranian society is nowhere near as sectarian or totalitarian as

Popinjay ...I am enjoying your comments. Hope to see you here more often .Why don't you kids get over your spitting contests about WW2 ?All the Allies won that war by fighting together .The peaceniks and the isolationists in USA prevented us from getting actively involved earlier .I am sorry about that but their decendents are alive and well and we are having to fight them off again today .
I was just reading about numerous measures that Blair tried to implement to deal with your homegrown radicals . The article said those measures were watered down by the human rights bunch and the PC crowd. Is this true ?It also said Blair backed down .
I am thankful that none of your citizens were harmed by the latest attacks .I pray for your safety my friends . Please do the same for us .

Legality of Iraq Assualt:

The very principle of 'legality' is interesting. As we are oft reminded, nothing that Hitler did was 'illegal'. However, a marker of civilisation is adherance to a moral code. The problem we have now is that the people who are writing these 'moral codes' a) have strange morals and b)make the 'rules' up as they go and then further muddy the waters by cherry picking the aspects of each code to suit their current needs.

In terms of the 'uk' law (whatever that is), the viscious attack on the Iraqi people was regarded as illegal by the highest government authority on the subject in that taxation zone. See the following:

http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/issues/iraq/document...

Iraq was (rightly) demonised for attacking Kuwait but the USA received no condemnation for its attack on Panama a few months before (or any of the 28 or so assualts on other nation states). The Siege of Iraq ("sanctions", in Newspeak) was, without any doubt, a genocide on the poor of that country. Because the UN 'sanctioned' this barbaric genocide it was regarded as 'legal'.

The people who create the 'laws' have always had vested interests. We should remember that the only place the two classes meet is in court. Guess which class is in the position of power in that situation.

These people have no right to dictate 'laws', especially when they 'pick and mix' according to their own morally dubious activities.

The UK media has now started it's 'panic panic panic' coverage of these two incidents. The UK news talks about nothing else; had to watch AlJazeera English news to find out that US troops have killed 65 (yes 65) civilians, including women and children, in Afghanistan today. No lives have however been lost in the UK as a result of these incidents (except possibly one of the perpetrators of the Glasgow incident.)

I noticed watching the television coverage today that on at least two occasions the persons being interviewed failed to be drawn into the 'panic panic'.

Why are these incidents happening at this time? No responsibility claimed. No motive stated.

Blair has gone; the new government of Gordon Brown may be more inclined towards the viewpoint of those who oppose the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and towards distancing itself from the arch criminal George Bush.

Yet we are attacked now. The fear is being sustained. The Islamophobia is starting up again. It really makes me wonder who is behind these attacks. The fact that 'Muslims' or 'Asians' may have been the donkeys employed to carry them out does not in any way imply that the 'paymaster' is 'Muslim' or 'Asian'. Texan WASP more likely!

Think about it. Can you imagine the phone call from the CIA to Brown. Stay as close to the US as your predecessor and the attacks will stop. Take away your support and the 'Muslims' will bomb the UK back to the stone age.

PS. Grow up. All terrorist motives are political, NOT religious.

There have also been reports in the media of an 'imminent' attack by Israel (or the US) against Iran possibly using NUCLEAR WEAPONS.

Is this being done to soften us up for such an aggression?

#180
The legality for Iraq invasion is in UN resolution 678, 687 (the ceasfire resolutions) and 1441.

Iraq didn't attack Kuwait, it ANNEXED Kuwait. An unprecedented level of aggression.

And the deaths under the sanctions are a direct result of Saddam taking the oil-for-food money.

No Baath Party children died. I wonder why.

181. Sammy25, London

Aye, keep the herd worried. It's the manipulation of the masses by the media to demonise an entire faith is simply depressing. Alec Salmond has just made a really good statement on the glasgow event in which he stressed that this event was a result of individuals and not entire communities.

7/7: I remember Brown encouraging people to demonstate against the G8 but to do so in Edinburgh. It was an odd comment for a government minister to make. Note too that 7/7 was not fully publicly scrutinised.

I agree that the timing of these events is of benefit to the war-mongers.

183

The point i'm making is that a)the law is a farce, b) the resolutions you cite did NOT satisfy the 'uk's' Attorney General: so the folk who set the laws said that the assualt was illegal and c)any unjustified act of oppression and violence is unacceptable to me.

Iraq 'annexed' Kuwait by invading the place in exactly the same way the US, 'uk', Israel etc do. One gets demonised and the others select the laws and the interpretation of the 'law' as they see fit.

If I punch a man in the street and then say, "He was going to attack me. I have no proof, in fact there was ample evidence to suggest he wasn't going to attack me but I just felt he was so I hit him." The judge would laugh, righly. One rule for us and quite another for them.

As for the oil for food comment: sorry, but that simply isn't true. The money from 'oil for food' (itself a morally empty situation) was put in ESCROW accounts and managed by the UN. Sure, the elites in Iraq didn't suffer but what elites ever suffer is such a situation? Did the queen queue up for rations? No. THe sanctions punished those not in power and the UN knew that but still enforced the siege resulting in the deaths of half a million kids. We did that. We massacred kids.

It's time the UK seriously question whether it can afford to tolerate the presence of a parasitic Islamic fifth column intent on murdering the rest of us. Mass repatriation of the communities where these terrorists fester is in the humanitarian interest of all concerned.

186. Binny

"We asked for Arabic literature on the passenger seat, a map of Whitehall with big red crosses on it and a huge controlled explosion on live television. Someone will be getting their backside felt for this."

Wonderful, thanks!

#177, Sandy, Land of the free, unless you want to visit Cuba
I believe you are right; there likely is no "law" against one regime going to war against another. However, here is what one very prominent American said about that:
"It is much too early to appraise the influence of Nuremberg. But I would disclaim any expectation that it alone is enough to prevent future wars. When stakes are high enough and chances of success look good enough, I suppose reckless leaders may again plunge their people into war, just as men still resort to murder, notwithstanding the law’s penalty. But I do think that we have forever laid to rest in the minds of statesmen the vicious assumptions that all war must be regarded as legal and just, and that while the law imposes personal responsibility for starting a street riot, it imposes none for inciting and launching a world war."

Robert Jackson (U. S. Chief Justice) - speech at Canadian Bar Assoc, Banff, 1 Sept 1954

Pictus, Lantern Hill

Aye, plus during the Nuremberg trials only the 'crimes' of the vanquished were considered not the 'crimes' of the victors.

The Attorney General was satisfied with legality after checking. His answer was given and recorded in parliament.

The US and UK haven't annexed anywhere. (Unless you are counting Mexico and the old British Empire colonies). Iraq, Afghanistan, Bosnia, Kosovo, Sierra Leone are not annexed. I think your confusing annex with invade. Iraq made Kuwait the 19th province of Iraq - that is annex.

Your 'man in the street analogy' is silly. The Western democracies have used pre-emption for centuries. The only difference is Bush announced it publicly in a National Security Strategy.

Saddam circumventing and abusing the sanctions regime isn't our fault. The UN is corrupt and useless. Again, the Baath Party got richer as the people starved. Trying to blame the West is farcical.

Let's face it, these attacks are so easy to perpetrate that it is feasible this could be a long-term and regular phenomenon. Tough decisions lie ahead but the political elite don't have the spine to be trusted with such decisions. It's time the government set up and started training a militarily trained defence force, comprised of volunteers, in readiness for a possible all out civil war. Also, they should call all overseas troops back to the UK and stop the country's world policeman role. We simply don't have enough teeth arms in the UK to deal with major civil strife.

#145
Waspy - Useful fool or a plant? Too smart to be the former so you must be the latter, plus it's typical of the left to discredit a realist with the "nut" label. Good try.

Dougie 187 - considering that most of members of the 'communties' were born in UK - where are they to repatriated to ? In your street perchance ?
Keep taking the medicine, son.

#119>Simply childish drivel ...between US soldiers and Islamic terrorists. Interesting stuff!
No real explanation as to why such terrorism exists.
I assume; you are from the only major country that has never received the carpet bombing it is notoriously reputed for when being used mostly against near defenceless targets from Dresden to the present Iraq, Afghan, recently Somalia and soon Sudan; should your country dare decide.
Now; how would you re-act if suddeny, say Canada decided to bomb wherever you dwell; reduce your dwelling to a pile of dust; killed your family that included 4 or 5 children? Would you seek vengence or would you wish to put garlands of roses around the necks of the perpetrators? Give a sound honest answer to the hypothetical question which puts you in the position off the vast majority of the ever increasing numbers of terrorists around the globe.
The US controlled violence against those who dare to defy their sham democracy and freedom is a complete mockery of what they preach and practice.
The late Saddam Hussein was executed by a gang of handpicked stooge gangsters chosen by the US.
They never had a shred off International legitimacy, legality, justice or morality which has now provided the *terrorist*with tit -for - tat justification for their actions. The sad truth is the hypocricy shown by both the US and UK reveals the fact, this man who has been branded every foul name in the book
by them; was their one time former trusted friend and ally. They were more than willing to give him financial and military aid in the 1980s, when they desired to dominate the oil-wealth in the area and encourage him to wage war against Iran who refused to be brow - beaten and to submit them too. It was only after Saddam and Iran decided to call a halt to the senseless killing of their own people and Iraq attempted to get OPEC to increase the price off oil, he was no longer the friend of the US and their multi-nationa

191 - "the attorney general was satisfied of the legality after checking" ....with his boss (who leant on him).

#19 US Mother:

Your blithe comment infers that the USA is actually a heaven on earth!
Speak to me again when all those fat dollars in the Land of the Free will not bring you one single drop of Middle Eastern oil!
... Then let's see where your heaven on earth has gone for you and all your minions who clamour for all your pretty goodies splattered with blood!

Bring in the ID cards - that will save us. Special cut price cards for Labour Party members into the bargain.
YOU KNOW IT MAKES SENSE ! (copyright; the estate of Lord (Harold) Wilson of Huyton)

#190, Finnking II - Of course. 'Twas ever thus. The ones who financed Hitler should have been in there with Goering et al.

191. DrinkSoakedPopinjay,

The 'annex' vs 'assualt' bit isn't important, I was reacting to your use of the word annex in terms of the Iraq invasion of Kuwait.

The US/'uk'/Israel etc. have 'annexed' other countries by invading them and conducting 'regime change' etc. What's in a word? The western so-called democracies have stomped around the world brutally killing as they go. My point is that there is one 'law' for 'us' and another for 'them'. The notion of legality is absurd.

Of course my scenario about hitting folk in the street is absurd, deliberately so. However, my point still holds in that a tax zone (state) can pre-emptively attack another tax state but I as an individual cannot.

The idea of Saddam abusing the sanctions: Again, my point was that the imposition of the sanctions was morally wrong. THis was a deliberate act by the UN that killed thousands. It was 'legal'. We 'legally' massacred half a million Iraqi kids.

Yes, I blame the 'west'. The elites in the 'west' created the environment for Saddam, helped him to power and actively supported him during his major crimes. (Even shooting down an Iranian civilian aeroplane: 66 kids died: 'we' killed them). AQ? An organisation (extreme right/authoritarian) massively aided in the past by the elites in the 'west'. Suharto? Much more of a monster than Saddam ever was. The 'west', again, helped him.

Does it really matter if the war against Iraq was 'legal' according to some arbitrary definition?

To make war, without just cause, against a sovereign foreign nation is immoral.

There is no longer any pretense maintained by anybody that the original reasons given for this invasion were false. But did we then say 'sorry Mr Hussein, we made a mistake' and restore him to power? Of course not.

We changed our motive to the noble one of 'bringing democracy ....'

But what good is democracy to a nation that is not ready for it? There will never be stability in Iraq until a dictator with sufficient strength to subordinate the various factions comes to power ... we will therefore have replaced the devil we know with the devil we don't know ...

#46 Tweedmouth :
7/7 an MI5 'fake' ? Don't even mention it! - That band of angels are up with the Seraphim; we ALL know that!

#192-Michael- "a militarily trained defence force, comprised of volunteers" Sounds like a good idea, but what makes you think extremists won't be part of the volunteers. Remember, they hide amongst civilians.

Casey Purvis 200 / You sound as if your posts are being written for you by Goebbels .....

Naturally, the adoption of ID cards would create a paradise on Earth. New technology, based on genetically modified plastic, will mean that folk who are sensibly holding these cards will only have to hold them up or, preferrably, staple them to their forehead, will be impervious to terrorist attacks.

The 'terrorists' will not be able to copy the ID cards because they are a bit dim. Any suggestion that a US company will make money out of developing the cards is simply cynical.

CCTV cameras are there for your protection. Note the 100's of fantastic and clear images that easily identified the 7/7 bombers one of whom helpfully wore a light coloured basball cap. The Pentagon cameras clearly showed a passenger jet squeezing itself into a small upstairs window before evaporating.

Also Casey Purvis ....

NO CHILDREN (OR ADULTS) HAVE DIED AS A RESULT OF ANY OF THESE 3 INCIDENTS IN THE UK.

65 CIVILIANS (INCLUDING WOMEN AND CHILDREN) WERE KILLED BY US FORCES TODAY IN AFGHANISTAN TODAY.

DEATH RESULT FOR TODAY

CHRISTIANS 65 / MUSLIMS 0

#180 Finnking II
As to your aside, the US invaded Panama to depose a govt. that was not legitimately elected, that was being run by a murdering drug dealer named Noriega who had turned the country into an international narcotics conduit & safehaven for Colombian narcotraffickers & FARC terrorists, & who was in the process of turning the country over to Castro, just as has been done by Chavez in Venezuela. Noriega was able to do this after helping agents of Castro bump off General Torrijos, who may have been a controversial figure, but he loved his country & refused to sell it out to Fidel, ala Chavez. Until that invasion, Noriega was busily destroying Panama's legitimate institutions (which, by the way, had requested thru diplomatic & other channels that the US come to Panama's rescue) & was torturing & killing some of Panama's best, brightest & bravest citizens, & turning the luckier ones into refugees. Were you aware that there are still 3 murder convictions pending against Noriega in Panama, in addition to other convictions for serious crimes? I guess not. Instead of hysterically mouthing the latest PC rant, knowing the facts (including world history, recent & remote & undoctored by the social engineers of the late 20th century), honestly facing reality is the only course for seeing our way out of the world's current mess. I guess what I mean, Finnking, is open your mind, dig deeper & don't let yourself be used.

Hugh Hefner # 54!!
Right on!
Let's all boycott Muslim oil! - A BRILLIANT IDEA, isn't it?

#196
I was opposed to the initial war, but the ceasfire resolutions speak for themselves and are online for people to read.

#195
I don't think I'll bother replying to that Michael Moore drivel in detail. Nice rant though.

#201
Words are important and the US/UK haven't 'annexed' anywhere.

I'm not a UN fan but to say it 'deliberately massacred kids' is just nonsense.

I get it ok. I've read Chomsky too. Suharto, Allende, supporting the Mujahadeen against the Soviets...blah blah blah......I get it.

Chomsky, Pilger, Tariq Ali, Zinn, Arnove.....I read them all when I was Marxist.

But there comes a point when you have to grow up and take your politics a bit more seriously. Not everything is a capitalist/Neocon/Zionist conspiracy by 'elites' who drain the working class and steal natural resources.

You read more, learn more, grow up and move on.

Good evening comrades.

#39- Covert-Seems people have forgotten their countries & other countries attacks. Besides, the blame will only go against Blair, Bush, the US, & Israel. No blame will be put on those who want to make this an islamic world (with sharia law).

#15-Dutch-Not all of us are frightened by these b#stards! I wouldn't give them the satisfaction. If anything, I would think people would get mad and think "enough already", but that probably wont happen until sharia law takes place and booze is outlawed.

Catch this guy and when it happens hand him to Straythclyde cops, as a spokesman earlier said "we have two suspects in custody regarding todays events. We intend to carry out a full internal search on them after lunch, no cutlary will be used at lunch time for security reasons", so I am guessing extra salt, course ground black pepper, and possibly fillet of puffer fish will be on the chilly burgers today.

So much for 72 virgins in paridise, see what Strath boys trunctions will do to them.

Serves them right,

More chilly on my burger and make it a king raja, "that hurts everytime", said a force spokesman.

Casey 200 - you might well be an intelligent Scotsman, but no need to shout. Besides, whatever impressions you might get from this thread, nit all of us (probably a tiny minority of us) are crapping ourselves with fear.

#57-Binny-What is your conspiracy theory about the Glascow, SUV, praying to allah, airport event that happened today?

#182 Sammy 25!
... OR perhaps the rumour is to serve as a preliminary? ... A nasty false-flag nuclear outrage to wade in there and nuke the nasty little muslims in retaliation for the apparent 'nuke-up' in a European city?
Would that this scenario were impossible ... Unfortunately, it is VERY possible!

#207

Wise up, your statistics are just plain gormless, a war zone is not the same as an airport terminal.

And just to take the wind out of you flabby sails I believe a couple of your statistics were actualy Iraqi Christians. They do exist.

Now go cuddle a suicide bomber, wont see you in Valhalla chum.

to 211/ Can you not understand that NOBODY (except possibly a few cranks) wants to make the UK, the US or THE WORLD and Islamic state with sharia law ....

Nobody with even half a brain could believe that terrorist attacks were being carried out for that purpose.

Israel is bombing Palestine again today ... and killing civilians. Muslim civilians have therefore been killed today by Jews.
The US is bombing Afghanistan today .. and killing civilians. Muslim civilians have therefore been killed by Christians today.
But in the UK, nobody has been killed.

208. Squeptique, Miami

I see.

And who put Noriega into power in the first place? Who supported his regime during his worst attrocities? Suharto? Saddam?

"Instead of hysterically mouthing the latest PC rant, knowing the facts (including world history, recent & remote & undoctored by the social engineers of the late 20th century), honestly facing reality is the only course for seeing our way out of the world's current mess. I guess what I mean, Finnking, is open your mind, dig deeper & don't let yourself be used."

Mmmmm....

Kenny #213 - I wouldn't put much faith in the Strathclyde polis, they aren't the brightest of buttons as any Embra fitba fan visiting Glesca will tell you. They all think they're Taggart.

Well the thing is now, we can blame who ever we want, right or wrong the attacks are happening and it will only be a matter of time before they get their act together and the explosive devices become more sophisticated. So instead of the name calling and accusing and defending, we had better start dealing with this before people here start getting killed.

Naked, burnt guy - but they missed the 'suicide belt'?

#214

Well said, flying out to Africa again tommorrow, no worries, our time is written and thats it. Let these jokers make you in the least afraid and they have won. Dont like conceding defeat especily to cowards who will happily kill old people, woman, childern and other innocents.

You intelligent scotsman is a bit of a fibber one may say.

#185 Finnking II "Iraq annexed Kuwait the same way the US & UK do"???? The equivalency argument is mindless rhetoric. World headlines would scream the news if the US & UK ever overran a hospital, killing everyone inside, including babies in incubators, as Saddam's forces did in Kuwait. Iraqi atrocities against Kuwaitis could go sickeningly on for paragraphs, but the point is, glossing over history & painting terrorists & the US & Uk with the same brush are propagandistic ploys. Such preaching appeals only to the choir composed of George Soros's G8 thugs.

#220 Pilrig

Bloody good at kicking out confessions though, as these two were caught red handed wonder what else they will beat out of them.

Tony Blair is my love child by Sheik "Iman A'Bady "

217 Kenny / Yes, I agree .... but my point is that nobody was actually killed in the airport terminal. This 'attack' was NOT foiled ... it was carried out. But nobody died.

The first incident with the cars displays an unusual incompetence. I really don' think that these cars were intended to explode. And why are the terrorists so stupid? I mean, they even park illegally and apparently a traffic warden gets alerted to smoke coming from the car. And these explosives were hardly volatile.

The 3 stooges who set fire to the jeep in the UK today are a good example of who Al Quaeda really are now. Most of the central organization is gone. What is left are a bunch of amatures who are lucky if they can change a lightbulb.

There are still a few dangerous terrorists around but most are just men with no job skills who play terrorist to feel important.

#188 Finnking II
Binny has hit the nail on the head! ... WHEN wll the public wake up en masse to all this pantomime?
"The oxygen of publicity" Margaret Thatcher called it.
Soon every every bean-fart will get reported as a ghastly real potential threat.

Time for the 'REAL' one now? Are they hatching up a baby nuke in Paris to drive us crying into Daddy Bush's arms and have us beg for forgiveness?

# 218 Sammy 25!
BRILLIANT!

BRAVO!
BRAVO!
BRAVO!

#206 Finnking II

BRAVO!
BRAVO!
BRAVO! To you too!

Dare anyone phone the BBC and ask if Jane Standley's crystal ball might tell us all?

It will be very interesting to know whether the failed suicide bombers, actually lived in Scotland , very interesting indeed..

227 - amatuers indeed. I reckon that Prestwick airport was their real target but they read the map wrong.
And such a sin to ruin such a fancy car, obviously the culprits werenae from Wester Hailes or Drumchapel and the like, unless it was stolen.

#226 Sammy

The attack in Glasgow failed because of reasonably good security measures in place. Have been following the news, one of these jokers tried to set himself on fire and take a copper out after he failed. Not sure about about the leg injury mentioned but I believe it was a civvie chasing one of them who slipped and had a break.
This if not a particularly successfull or well thought out attack does in no way alter the fact these people were trying to kill indiscriminatly. They apart from being miserable failures will be sent to hell in one way or another.

When in the Aemy we had strong rukes of engagement about using live fire, these people have no rules.

Sorry chum, think if it was your daughter, son, wife who was killed or mutilated, especialy if they were only passing through the airport to another destination and they came from a neutral country.

I hope these people hurt for a long time.

Jim 221 - Broon will bring back Hard Man (save Monklands A & E) Reid to sort things out.

224. Squeptique,

Well, we then have to ask ourselves why the 'western' mainstream media do not describe the attrocities perpetrated by the 'western' military. Falluja? Use of Mark 77 (aka 'napalm')? Or how about the total news black out on the massacre of the retreating Iraqi troops? How about the Sudan drug company bombed by Clinton resulting in the death of yet more children because of not being able to get drugs?

We only hear (in great detail) of the enemies' crime. 'Our' crimes are airbrushed out. By any definition of the word 'terrorist' the US/'uk'/Israel etc are 'terrorist' states. We should admit that, recognise it and take into account that such terrorist attacks have an effect, they create more terror.

228. Brightraven

Baby Nuke: I seriously hope not but after 911 and 7/7 nothing would suprise me.

I wonder if the "holy warrior" who died in the burning Jeep in Scotland today is now surrounded with 72 virgins who are telling him what an idiot he was.

234 Kenny / You really cannot believe anything that the media say ... they are in a state of panic. I have been watching most of the sky news/BBC News 24 coverage .... they are really trying to dramatise all this and put words, intended to cause more panic, into the mouths of some of the people that they interview ....

I am absolutely not trying to justify these acts or indicate any approval of them.

What I am trying to do is make some sense of them ......

Why have these incidents occurred at this time?

Why, if they are carried out for a purpose, does nobody stand up and proudly claim responsibility for them and state their purpose in carrying them out? We can speculate on purpose but we can never know .... We can speculate on motivation but we can never know ...

We can assume, we can never know .....

It would appear from what we know, as opposed to what we speculate, that they were carried out by incompetent arsonists just because they felt like it.

Since 11th September 2001 I have been very suspicious of 'terrorists'.

If those who are responsible for these acts read this, defuse the information ... let the public know WHY and WHAT YOU WANT. If your motivations are reasonable (i.e. you are not religious nuts but have a real valid political motive not involving creating an Islamic state or imposing Sharia law), although the public will never condone what you are doing, they may find themselves sympathetic to your problems ...

But like everything since 11th September 2001 .....

#218-Sammy-"But in the UK, nobody has been killed." OOPs, silly me, I was under the impression that people were severely injured or died as the result of the terrorist attack on 07/07/05? How quickly we forget!! As far as the islamic goal- I guess I should have had my hearing aide in when the young extremists, who the BBC interviewed shortly after 9/11, said their goal is to make the UK an islamic state. And, I should also start wearing my reading glasses when I read articles about Sharia law popping up in places like Ontario, Canada & "Islamic sharia law is gaining an increasing foothold in parts of Britain" as reported by the UK telegraph. My bad.

Sammy 25

The car bombs were not done by an organization. lighting a car filled with gasoline is not something an organization does. This is the work of amateurs and not well educated amateurs. This attack was not more deadly because the "bomb" was not really much of a bomb.

#239-Sammy-"let the public know WHY and WHAT YOU WANT"- I can tell you'd be one to give in and give them what "THEY WANT". Maybe it's time folks like you think about giving them what they really deserve; their 72 hermaphrodite virgins.

Madness.

Best quote of today was "if you dont want terrorism , dont participate in it".

Seems we need an enemy to keep us on our toes , and I thought George Orwell was having a laugh.

What they want is attention. If the news networks did not give them so much coverage there would be no point in blowing things up.

Further to post 239 /

A terrorist act occurred in the United States on 11th September 2001.

Did anybody stop and ask 'Hey! Why did those guys do that to us? What have we done to upset them?'

The fact that this question is not asked implies that the answer is known.

So because some Saudis visas are alleged to have hijacked some aircraft and flew them into some buildings, incidentally resulting in highly unusual vapourisation's of aircraft and collapses of buildings, we declare a 'war on terror' and attack Afghanistan and Iraq and threaten Iran .......

On 7/7 some guys decide to blow themselves up on buses.

'Plots' are discovered.

Muslims (Iraqi's to whom we are trying to 'bring democracy' are also Muslims as are our good undemocratic friends in Saudi Arabia) are demonised.

The media panics us (but they panic us about everything).

The government passes anti-terror law after anti-terror law. Civil liberties are eroded. Identity cards are proposed (although because of the Government's total failure to limit immigration they may in fact be genuinely required). We accept so many things 'in the name of security, to keep us safe'.

Perhaps it would be better to ASK the question openly and publicly .....

Now consider this.

We do not give into terrorists.

So we base our (foreign) policy on the idea of not giving in to terrorists. So we cannot change our (foreign) policy because that would be giving in to terrorists.

Now imagine that we wish to change our (foreign) policy for reasons totally unconnected with terrorism.

.... "but that would be giving into the terrorists!"

IS extending the period that terrorist suspects can be detained to 90 days, demonising Muslims, blindly following the US/Israel, sending troops to airports, increasing police powers, spending a fortune on security, extra policing etc etc etc, introducing identity cards, more and more anti-terror laws, mo

#173. (and everywhere beyond) Finnking II

Why don't you take your sickeningly smug Islamapologetics permanently to the Middle East and show the natives the courage of your convictions? Unlikely I think, as you enjoy your western comforts - and freedom of speech - too much. Hypocrite. Coward.

You counter every sickening atrocity committed by renegade muslim fanatics in the west with a never-ending catalogue of what western armies - not terror groups - did or are doing against terrorist atrocities in the Middle East. You invariably fail to say anything about or against vile throat-slittings and savage beheadings of innocent hostages, for example. But then, an ideologically twisted mind knows no bounds.

In the light of today's events in Glasgow your turncoat stance is all the more putrid. Perhaps you actually have Middle Eastern blood ... That would at least explain something about your apparent allegiance to vicious criminals guided by a religion that is rotten to the core.

If not, then your lack of opprobrium for Islamist attacks on the west - now in my native Scotland - show you up for what you are. A bloody disgraceful excuse for a Scotsman. You are a disaffected person, one way or the other, and people from other parts reading these boards should know you are nothing that Scotland can be proud of. Shameful.

Suck up to your mad, bad, poor downtrodden muslim buddies. I am unhappy and troubled about this crap happening in Scotland, as well as in England. I would shut every one of their damned conspiracy parlours, aka mosques, in the western world, for a start. And that is only a start. You, Mr Finnking, should start to look beyond your navel, or migrate to the wonderful world of Islam whose mad-dog acts you clearly support and take your quisling act with you.

With 15 million muslims in Britain, what do any of you think was going to happen? The poll they took, said they prefer Shria law, and there are many activists and terrorists among them, as they were allowed to go into great Britiain seeking asylum.
They mostly believe that it is ok to murder in the name of their religion.
You all have that to contend with. Here in the USA we have our problems too.
Immigration laws are going to be changed here. I look forward to the day when they put the quota system back in place.

I am sure there are many of you there across the pond, who are blaming Bush and Blair for this...but try blaming the terrorists.

Londonstan, and Glascow...this is a signal to your new PM to be careful.

Do not put your head in the sands like we did. We never answered the attacks from 1979 thru 2001. And then we had a lesson..they respect strong..and take advantage of the weak..that was why we had 9/11. ..which was the last straw. Sometimes dialog doesn't work.
They should not be allowed to get away with this.

244 .... What they want is attention. If the news networks did not give them so much coverage there would be no point in blowing things up.

YES, but what is the point if their demands are not stated. The only publicity is for those who want to keep us in a constant state of fear.

242 .... I can tell you'd be one to give in and give them what "THEY WANT".

Depends what they want ...... that is why their demands must be clear. If you dont know for sure just what they do want, how do you know that what they want is not desireable.

I repeat, the establishment of any form of Islamic government or law in the UK is an unrealistic demand.

#245-Sammy-"We do not give into terrorists". You would! allah and hitler would be proud of you son! BTW-Are you gonna give in when they want to make it illegal for anyone to drink, or when women have to start wearing burkas?

Angus Lindsey..#246..that's telling him..he and others like him take the terroist side/ be it muslims in England, now Scotland or Palestinians.. I say to them go back to your homeland..and be happy, since you are not happy here in the free world.

#247-Lynne- Blame the Terrorists!! What a concept! Unfortunately, there are many people out there who think like sammy25. Just read his postings, especially #248. Unbelievable!!

Dear Lynne

I am not going anywhere because I am in my homeland.

And as for the UK being the 'free world', in England one hour ago a law imposing drastic restrictions on personal freedom came into effect ....

#248-Sammy- They have made their demands clear-they want the destruction of Israel! They want sharia law!

#224, Squeptique - If you are trying to suggest by your handle that you are a skeptic, I'm afraid you are not a very dedicated one. That stuff about Iraqui troops killing babies in incubators in Kuwait was exposed long ago as pure invention by a hysterical person with an axe to grind. To be truly skeptical, one must first shed all prejudices.

#252-Sammy-What is the restriction that was just imposed?

#224, Squeptique - If you are trying to suggest by your handle that you are a skeptic, I'm afraid you are not a very dedicated one. That stuff about Iraqui troops killing babies in incubators in Kuwait was exposed long ago as pure invention by a hysterical person with an axe to grind. To be truly skeptical, one must first shed all prejudices.

Sorry about the double post. Up late last night working the defibrillator. Can't find my damned pipe.

255/ The smoking ban in England .... not connected to terrorism .... just thought I'd mention it when Lynn called us the 'Free world' .... at least you can smoke in a public place in the 'NOT-Free world' ..

Enoch Powell had a good idea.
Maybe most of you don't know who he was.

155 / Did they shout ... Allauh Akbar .... even the media have not made this claim ....

#218--Sammy25---if in fact Palestinian & Afghan civilians were killed today, they were used as shields by Hamas & taleban, as they are too cowardly to take the bullet themselves...

#258-Sammy-Got to agree with you there, but only because I'm a smoker.

261 / But I thought Hamas was a democratically elected government? I thought we liked 'democracy' ....

#260-Sammy- Actually, several media sources reported the two suspects at glascow were chanting "allah, allah".

#246--Angus Lindsay----i applaud you for saying what needed to be said, in light of the events of this day....your concern for your country & people shows in every word.....thank you.

#247--Lynne---""they respect strong...and take advantage of the weak""

that says it all, Lynne..

#260. Sammy25

"155 / Did they shout ... Allauh Akbar .... even the media have not made this claim ..."

One of the pair of Islamist ratbags at Glasgow airport did exactly that yesterday, and his arse was well on fire at the time. The biter bit ... Nice one.

#266. sandy

Thanks, Sandy. It's uphill sometimes fighting your own (allegedly) kith and kin who militate against their own.

264/267 ... was just watching Sky News ... not a mention of religious utterances. Very dramatic though ...

But why all this disruption at the airport? Why don't they get the airport re-opened at least partially ... let these people get on with their journeys .... just WHO is causing this additional disruption ....

Gordon Brown looks calm though ... just wish I could trust him not to be influenced .....

it's been reported they have arrested 4-suspects connected with the car bombs & the airport suspects are connected.....they believe this was planned in Scotland..

I just heard PM Brown say on the BBC news ..."The duty of the government is to ensure the safety of "all" the British people" why using the word "all' here, is he trying to be politically correct again, afraid to upset the muslims who might feel excluded again following the recent events in London and Glasgow , come on Gordon, show some 'steel' forget this "PC" nonsense and give the British people some leadership, and don't worry too much about the human rights of those cowards
who were most probably British born, and thus raised, educated, and fed by our welfare state, those so called control orders are not working, so lets not waste our time with that any longer, open those internment camps in Scapa Flow again then at least we have them off our streets and under real control, forget PC and get on
with it.

271/ I hope you are taken to Guatanamo

#246 (Angus Lindsay): While I don't care to comment on #173, I am with you otherwise. As I see it Scotland has been sucked into the middle-east quasi-religious-sociopathy by U.K. imperialism and now gratuitously victimized by another muslim afflicted with consciousness cancer. The Bush Crime Family wants to import 7,000 Iraqis into the U.S.A. where only radicals, crooks, and idiots comprising 23% of the populace support his illegal war in Iraq. Let's hope that none are insourced into the U.K. One can only hope that the missing Iraqi man is soon missing all of his vitals and painkillers. What's to happen with all of your "Packies" as Pakistan is being taken over by the Taliban?

274/ No, certain elements of the US/Israeli governments would like the rest of the world to be at war with Islam .....

#275-Sammy-For good reasons.

Don't worry folks, we are in safe hands, the new Home Secretary Jacqui Smith, previously a school teacher, is now chairing "COBRA" and no doubt, with her experience in keeping order in school classroms and playgrounds, she will sort those terrorist out in no time.
Some chap above said PM Brown looked calm, had he given it a closer look however, he would have realised that he was not looking calm but rather shocked, and perhaps not surprisingly so, since as PM in circumstances like this he carries a heavy burden. thank god for our civil servants team that sourround 'Brown and Smith' at least they have the expertise and know how to deal with the current crisis.

#247. Lynne

Correct me if I'm wrong, but shouldn't that be "1.5 million muslims in Britain"? (Not 15 million!) But 1.5 is still far too many for comfort on the small island that is Britain with the unpredictable fanatics in their midst. The continuing silence of the so-called moderates speaks volumes. And don't expect to that to change with the latest horrors.

The day that they come out en masse and condemn vociferously the actions of the murderous scum in their fold is the day that we will believe that moderate muslims exist. The fact that they don't tells its own story.

All muslims should conform to the (western) society they have the privilege to inhabit. Too much appeasement by lily-livered western politicians has delivered a poisoned chalice to indigenous Britain and the western world at large. The fruits of that stupidity are now being borne. Muslims will never assimilate anywhere in a non-muslim society. Their religion forbids it. Depressing end of story.

I've been reading with great interest the many erudite comments from all and sundry.

I have only a small comment to make: remember that once converted to Islam (or born into Islam) 'tis death to leave.

Carry on, all.

The globalists are coming into power and the terrorists are their footsoldiers!!

Watch your own backs. Nobody else can do it for you.

Well then what about you apologists now for the islamic bambots, trying to blow up Glasgow airport now.
Its time we all put our support behind the government and put these people where they belong, had they penetrated the airport, babies, children, women and men going on holiday would have been murdered and maimed. We must all be allowed to go about our lawfull daily business without fear of being ripped apart by a snide and cowardly act.
If it means pulling out of Iraq, Lebanon, Afganistan and leaving the apparently millions of normal people to their fate at the hands of these murderous bastards then that is a price we will all have to pay, maybe after a thousand years of stone age living they will rise up themselves and get rid of the terrorists. That is the only way it will happen, by the middle Easterers getting rid of their own home grown terrorists themselves

#282

Yes. It's a stone-age religion with stone-age aresholes driving it that perpetuates it. Their creed is to conquer the world. Blindly.

I am all for western withdrawal from the entire Middle East to leave the Arabs and its glorious Islamic neighbours to deal with their own centuries-old problems. A pull-out of western technical expertise would return Arabia properly to its medieval beginnings. But ... multinational western greed is a thing to contend with, so no holding of breath there.

Maybe all these middle-eastern guys who qualified in Scottish universities could return to their native lands and encourage their compatriot masses in western Europe to return with them. Maybe then we could all return to the peace that most of us have known, and freedom from the worry of psychopathic attacks against society from a fringe mentality.

Just a thought.

178# DrinkSoakedPopinjay, Scotland
Dear scottish friend
please follow this link to find a pdf version of 1564 resolution which is about Darfur in Sudan not Iraq . I still see the war in Iraq illegal . Best Regards .
http://daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/N04/515/47/PDF/N04...

And this link :
http://www.cfr.org/content/publications/attachments/1564.pdf

Farzad at 165.......millions of sunnis are living in iran with shiits . why they don’t kill each other like Iraqis
Yes iran is a wonderful place
You can feel the love in the streets
http://tinyurl.com/2akz6z

Thank goodness the americans were there for these children in iraq

http://tinyurl.com/23qar6
OOPS--forgot where the lefties are concerned this is acceptable as it cant be blamed on America or Israel

Since when does a burning jeep constitute a "nationwide crisis" ? The only people hurt were the idiot terrorists themselves.

The Middle East has always been a mess. It was a mess before Israel and it will be a mess 50 years from now.

Islam has been at odds with the rest of the world from its begining. They have invaded one place after another and they destroy the local culture and replace it with Islam. They sometimes kill those who will not convert to Islam. The only place that was originally Arabic is Saudi Arabia, everyplace else that is now Arabic and Muslim has been conquered by force.

I think most muslims are nice people but we must realize this culture does not play by the same rules the "PC" west has recently adopted.

Angus Lindsay, Shenzhen

You wrote:
"But ... multinational western greed is a thing to contend with, so no holding of breath there"

A.L,
Are your Chinese communist friends without greed or is it just their rampant polluting of their cities?

In 2006 I had the misfortune to visit Shenzhen from Hong Kong.
In the 4 days I spent in Shenzhen I found the air pollution unbearable. The hoards of Chinese peasants working in factory conditions that were more like slave labor camps, is criminal by our ISO 9000 manufacturing standards.

My question to you is.
When you go outside do you wear a face mask or an oxygen mask for protection against the putrid, foul air that hangs over these Chinese communist cities?

I just read article by ABC NEWS on Hong Kong choked by growing pollution problem.
And
Shenzhen, just over the border in China, has grown from a small fishing community into a thriving port and manufacturing hub of around seven million people, with huge environmental consequences.

"A lot of buildings were put up in a hurry, cowboy stuff, with no connections to proper sewage plants, because it was cheaper and easier just to connect them to the storm drains. Which means the sewage just flows straight into the bay," Mr. Young said.

"The authorities are planning to build more treatment plants on the Shenzhen side, but the pace of development is such that they cannot keep up."

Agriculture adds to the problem. Farmers are supposed to have their own water treatment facilities, but pumps that consume expensive electricity are often switched off at night when inspectors are less likely to notice.

A.L before you criticize Western greed, I suggest you look at the criminal social system used by your communist friends in China.

Slave/child labor, forced abortions, citizens not allowed to vote, protesting students shot in massacre.
Why would any free thinki

My thoughts and prayers are with the Scots and Brits. Thank God it wasn't any worse. You had at least one regular citizen who helped capture one of the bombers, good for him.

Can someone answer this question? HOW LONG IS IT GOING TO TAKE BEFORE THE BRITS GET THEIR ACT TOGETHER ON COUNTER-TERRORIST MEASURES? They have the MOST RADICALIZED MUSLIM minority in Europe, studies show, bar none! And yet, they don't seem to know how to go proactive at all! Good Lord, they are the laughingstock of the law enforcement and intelligence community throughout the world!

It is jaw-dropping that they have SEVEN TERRORIST SUSPECTS, THE LAST ONE THIS PAST MONDAY, GONE MISSING FROM HOME DETENTION-SEVEN!! And get this, they can't even NAME the missing suspects publicly, because of court decisions banning such information from being made public-so how exactly is the public supposed to help find them, huh?

And you mean to tell me, that after those two bombs were found in the heart of the tourist/nightlife area of London-Piccadilly-that their airports did not go on high alert, that there was only ONE POLICEMAN to confront the Glasgow vehicle crash initially? And the driver and the passenger had time to get out spray gasoline around and punch the ONE COP who responded? Sheesh!

The country has just now gone on "critical" alert-which means that additional attacks are imminent-and yet, they are going ahead with having their Gay Pride parade through the city? Are they nuts?

If someone can please explain how the Brits handle anti-terrorism policy in their country, I'd LOVE an explanation-'cause I JUST DON'T GET IT. And they DON'T call it "Londonistan" for nothing!

Well,
It is the beginning of a Holly War across the Western world! The Muslim extremist are on a Jihad!

It is not important that people are liberals or right conservatives, they are not looking at these things.

They see the western society as decadent.
Provocative, and defile the name of Ala!
these are modern day rebels that are willing to die for there cause.

And this ideology is spreading far and wide.
I would suggest that western culture become
aware of the guests they have allowed into there home!

#289 "..the brits.. don't seem to know how to go proactive at all! ..."

Oh no folks, it's Dubya posting - he wants us to be "proactive" and invade somewhere else!
My money's on Iran..

Angus Lyndsey, Lynne and all the anti-muslim americans -

How come when the chaps planting the bombs were the IRA, (largely funded by the good ol' US of A by the way) none of you was screaming about Christian terrorists?

No blanket condemnation of Catholics. No demands to close down the Catholic churches, ban Irish immigration, boycott Irish shops, chuck out the Christians. Presumably because even the dimmest American can see that would not be awfully logical

So how come you can't see that it is equally illogical to blame ALL Muslims, demand that mosques be closed, ban Muslim immigrants, boycott Muslim shops, chuck out the Muslims?

I was terrorized by the news today!!

It could have been so awful....so very glad it ended the way it did.

I have a place in my heart for Scotland, I love her for her past and her present and I pray for her future.

How will this all end????

Thank goodness for the polis, especially the Glesca polis!

So it seems you folks in the UK and Scotland have been all sold the same bill of goods by Liar in Chief
Roasted Duck President George Wimpyarse Bush that we have about all this bloody nosense,"That we have to fight them over there so they don't follow us back here!" BS The sad thing is that the last poll shows 26% of of Americans still trust Bush!
And I hope all you folks and my friends in the UK
and Scotland and Ireland are all okay! We dang sure need to rethink our security and immigration polices to keep these psychos out my friends!

Why did Alex Salmond laugh when he was told in the televised press conference that one of the Glasgow airport attackers was shouting the word Allah?

246. Angus Lindsay, Shenzhen

Fascinating, thanks.

If I ever need a reminder of red-neck bigotry, ignorance, and hate filled racism, I will take another look at your post. If, after all this time of reading my posts here you don't understand my point regarding the propaganda we in the 'free west' are bombarded with, then you should simply stop reading them.

Lynne

15 million Muslims in UK? Not so but, what the heck, another lie about numbers.

There are approximately 40 million people of Muslim faith in Europe. The vast majority of them live and work within the community in peace.

The UDA,RHD, IRA (various hues), ETA, Welsh terrorist groups, Cornish terrorist groups and even the Scottish terrorist groups, RN (ELA) in Greece, Dev Sol, ad nauseum.....have all committed 'terrorist' acts more deadly and more frequently than any Muslim terrorist group has in Europe.

However, when these people terrorise we do NOT vilify an entire faith/country or culture. What is happening here with regard to the media's anti-Islam propaganda (and with Angus' and others lurid hate filled comments) is exactly what happened in Germany in the 30's.

I am an atheist, by the way. To me it's all mumbo jumbo but I support the right of people to live free from oppression. Whether you, Angus/Lynne/Sandy etc like to hear it or not, the USA/'uk' kill and injure and generally terrorise infinitely more folk around the world than ANY Muslim group does. Just because 'we' use soldiers in uniforms with wee national flags on (except when invading!-bad PR), helicopters and stealth bombers and tanks and 'we' create the laws etc 'we' think 'we' are in the moral right when 'we' kill folk.

There are greedy idiots on all sides who manipulate the opinion of the masses to gain acquiescence (and cannon fodder) for their wars of material gain. One group uses religion to manipulate folk while another group uses the media. Ar*eholes, every one of them.

#284
Hello again my Iranian friend.

I said UN resolution 1546............NOT 1564.

Whether you see the war and occupation as 'illegal' or not is irrelevant.

Ceasfire resolutions 678, 687 and 1441 are what count........not your opinion. You can read them all online.

http://www.usip.org/library/pa/iraq/adddoc/iraq_unsc1546....

Best Wishes

Now criminal Brown is blaming Al Queda for the attacks - I wonder why?

BTW, Al Queda simply means the list or database; generally Moslems, Arabs, and people with oil - another creation of the CIA. Billions of people qualify as Al Queda associates, and Brown (Bush's assistant poodle) is no doubt trying to demonise them all.

#291--nell from falkirk--
""how come when the chaps planting the bombs were the IRA,(largely funded by the good ol' USofA by the way)non of you was screaming about Christian terrorists?""

your implying the USA funded the IRA is just silly, it was in fact the Irsh community IN the USA that gave money to the IRA...
i don't recall "Christian(IRA) terrorists", car-bombing, blowing up buildings spreading their jihad around the world!! they just wanted a piece of the Brits, not the rest of the world........unlike the 'radical islamic jihadists' that want to kill the 'infidel'.

#301 I didn't "imply" that the IRA was funded from the USA, I stated it as a fact.

"...the IRA just wanted a piece of the Brits, not the rest of the world......"
And there you have it. The American view.
The IRA didn't bomb the US, so that's all right then.

#301

even if it was the irish comunity funding the ira , do you not think that your goverment should have stepped in and cut it off like they do nowadays.

the only reason america cares is because of 9/11,
before that it was never hit by terrorism exept oklahoma, byan america at that.

and for you to say its not about cultures is far from the truth.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid...

Finnking is right - George Dubya has learned from the Germany of the 1930's, (no doubt at his grandfather's knee).

Demonise a race of people, a religion, a culture; fill the media with propaganda, it doesn't matter how illogical it is, how much hate there is, whip people up into a frenzy; lay the blame for all your society's ills at their door.
Turm everybody against them, then nobody notices how threadbare your politics or ethics or behaviour is.

Smoke and mirrors.

And if some people have learned the lessons of history and express doubts, call them "communists" and "liberals" and "pinkos".
And in case anybody is listening to them, create panic, a reason to fear. Manufacture a few "terrorist" attacks, then point the finger.

Smoke and mirrors.

I grew up in Boston where much of the funding for the IRA came from. The people who would support the IRA lived in South Boston and were mostly born in Ireland. They saw the "Britts" as invaders of their land. I think most were also born before the 1920s. Boston has a large Irish population and a large population of Americans who trace their family to Ireland as I do. The vast majority are not anti Brittish.

#304

so true, there was reports that a warning about car bombs was issued 2 weeks ago,

if that is true why let them see it throught,
was that the agenda, with the change over with bliar and brown nose.

america has always and always will be a war monger, its fact. weapons are big money making scemes for them and the uk as well.
remember it was us that used to supply iraq against iran, the americans sold munitions to the afgans.

its all about money war makes money.

Sandy

What's the difference between US citizens of Irish background funding a 'terrorist' group and Afghan citizens of Saudi background funding a 'terrorist' group? Or how about the US citizens, tax payers, funding afghan military training camps in order to bog down the USSR's economy?

Also, what's the difference between the Christian Fundies like Bliar and Idiot Boy bombing and killing folk using the justification of "spreading 'our' ideals" (bullsh*t concepts of democracy/freedom etc) and the other bunch of idiots justifying their violence on foreign soil by saying, we are "spreading our ideals" (bullsh*t notions on monotheism)?

What the difference between the Mad Christian Muppets of Bliar and Idiot Boy (and Thatch and Reagan and clinton and and and....) saying, "You are a threat to our way of life so we are going to kill your citizens in the 100's of thousands in pre-emptive attacks" and the, equally derranged, fundies on the other side saying, "You are a threat to our way of life so we are going to kill your citizens in the 100's of thousands in pre-emptive attacks"?

"Clowns to the west of me, jokers to the east, here I am, happily stuck in the northern EU"!!!! (showing my age!)

#305 See? Now is it starting to sink in?
Begin to see any similarities with Iraq?

"they saw the Brits as invaders of their land"
Yes....

"The vast majority are not anti-British"
Yes....

Keep going, you might get there....

308. nell from falkirk

Superb. Well done!

#308

I am unfortunately well aware of the similarities.

Yes exactly. If you have terrorism suspects, what in god's name are they doing on a sort of "partial" home arrest, where they "part of the day" can leave and go away on their own, to do as they like? ASTOUNDING! Do you think ANY NATION IN EUROPE would allow that sort of thing? Much less not know where their "suspects" were once they left the house. GOOD GOD ALMIGHTY, UK!

I have to say this, after some 25 years of being in and out of the UK I'm never seen the country as a whole in more of a psychological mess than what it is right now, never seen it in quite the identity crisis that it is having now-just unsure how to proceed when there is a crisis-crisis handling is NOT the UK's strong-suit, never has been!

#312

no just us capital punishment, then 4 or 5 years down the line find out they were innocent .

god if ever there was a doomsday i bet america would be involved, during ww2 you gave us ships ok , but most of them were rust buckets it was called lend lease and we just finished paying it off last year.

as you say #312 , britain are not like america i lived in london during the ira years and it was just another day when train stations, tube stations or anything else was closed down becouse of the ira.

why you not send some of your nice people to show us how to protect our poor country please incase we are all murdered in our beds.

#303--FtK2-------""the only reason America cares is because of 9/11, before that it was never hit by terrorism""

"Significant terrorist attacks against the US & it's citizens, from 1946-2001"
http://www.armscontrolcenter.org/terrorism/101/timeline.html

"American Victims of mideast terrorist attacks"
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/source/terrorism/usvi...
from 1970-2006 there were 142/terrorist attacks against American people..

von-Scharnhorst, Brandenburg Preußen (ex Bathgate) / 1:39pm 30 Jun 2007 "All Europe, including the whole of the British Isles, would be speaking German today"

actualy, the British DO. (As do YOU)

Oh uh!
My what spleen - I thought the topic was the
rights and wrongs of the car bomb attack at
Glasgow airport?
And the 'gentleman' in question is only hellbent in sniping at
the lady from the US.
Are you sure you two are not a sparring long
distance married couple?;)
You are both off track:) The USA sent
volunteers to help Britain as far back as
1940 Battle of Britain and all that.
And the US officially entered the Second World
War Dec 7th 1941 Pearl Harbour as Roosevelt
said "Infamy infamy".

And as a famous english comedian said
"In for me, in for me they've all got it in
for me"
PS: In the 18th Century the US Congress
lost by one vote whether or not to use German as the official
language of the USA.

There is no excuse, no apology, no justification or no toleration of the acts just perpetrated in Britain.
Britain has provided a home for them, toleration of their horrific religion which does not reciprocate with toleration of any kind towards those of us wise enough to see through this muslim veneer of tolerance.
The muslims in britain have become arrogant, demanding and dangerous demading this and that, stopping Christmas celebrations at schools etc, this just shows albeit from a sinister fanatical fringe what they and I include all muslims in this are about. This is a rant and I make no apology for it because I am angry, frustrated and impotent because what I would gladly do to these bastards who are trying to destroy my way of life is unprintable.
Leave them to it.

I find it particularly abhorrent that while everyone here is outraged by the events of the past few days, there is a man covered with hideous, agonizing burns that will most likely be subjected to unheard-of levels of police brutality in the name of "freedom". Yes, this man attempted to perform an act of "terrorism", but if he had no reason to be performing it, we would not all be here engaging in racist diatribes of this nature. If any one of us were in this poor man's shoes, would we be standing up for what we believe in as bravely as this man? His actions truly represent what the human spirit is capable of if you are all completely honest and search your souls.

#315 Belladona

Are you referring to Kenneth Williams in Carry on Cleo?

The quote is "Infamy! Infamy! They've all got it in for me!"

See, that's the joke. It's a pun.

And yes, my previous comment #317 was meant to be inflammatory, and does not actually reflect my true opinions.

283. Angus Lindsay, Shenzhen
280. Dragonhead, China .

Like two peas in the Chinese communist pod, you love to attack others while you fester in your pit of communist ideology.

You two should look in your communist backyard. Do you see the State forced abortions? The executions of student protestors. The raw sewerage pollution of your bays and rivers.

Your citizens not allowed to vote. The CPC's threat to attack Taiwan. The genocide in Tibet, crushing an entire culture. The deliberate manufacture of dangerous products sold to the West.

And still you have the gall to criticize other people who are religious fanatics who kill at will.

Just like your communist controllers who kill those who protest against their communist ideology in CHINA. This is the pot calling the kettle black me thinks. Hypocrisy A.L. and Dragonhead style.

A.L. and Dragonhead what drives you to live in, and be part of the criminal communist system that is CHINA today.

Try this, both of you take a banner into Tiananmen Sq, with a picture of Hu Jintao with the words

Hu Jintao
Free the Chinese People
Let them VOTE.

I think you would last two minutes before the CPC police dragged you off to prison.

Respectfully
Galactic Cannibal

Many people from the Middle East have one foot in the 7th century and the other foot in the 14th. The culture is not the culture of the west.

Many of them do believe the world will someday be made fully Islamic. I hope that with time they will become tolerant of other religions and cultures. I think right now it is a mistake to invite Muslims to live in western countries.

315. Belladona

The information now coming out about Pearl Harbour is quite informative and educational in connection with the current 'situation' and 911 (the New Pearl Harbour) etc.

Note: the above comment is meant to be inflammatory/stimulating and fully reflects my true opinions at this point in time.

#304--nell from falkirk---
""fill the media with propaganda,"".......they don't need the 'fill', they've got their own!!

""it doesn't matter how illegal it is,""...........eh?
""how much hate there is,""............you & your ilk have enough 'hate' for all!!

""whip people up into a frenzy;"".........you & your ilk do that daily in blaming 'Bush/Blair' for everything that happens!!..

""lay blame for all your society's ills at their door.""

again, you & your ilk have been doing just that!!, only at USA's door.....
Pres. Bush is to blame for all terrorist attacks, terrorist murders of civilians everywhere, soldiers killed by insurgents(Iran) & taleban, & the most delicious of all...Pres. Bush is to blame for Blair's own action in going to war.......can you folk do nothing w/out blaming others??

319. Disambiguation, USA

There's a few million Arabs in Palestine who feel exactly the same way about Zionists.

Come to think of it, as a Pict I feel there simply wasn't enough resistance to the Christian invasion of my homeland. The liberal "owners of defeat" (Sandy) at that time rolled over and allowed the Christian fundies to come to Alba and spread thier christian law! We had our own laws and our own culture! These liberal/pinko/christian lovers sold us out and look at us now! Under the control of Anglo Saxon Christian fundies! It's outragious!

Where was Fox News/Scotsman News then, eh?

#317--Gordon--

Honestly? i hope...no!...wish ""the man covered with hideous, agonizing burns (will) be subjected to (the most) unheard of levels of (total abuse)........

""his actions truely represent what the human spirit is capable of if you are all completely honest & search your souls""........

what a lot o spineless garbage!!..""human spirit""?? one has to be "human" first!! don't ya think???

Sandy..
Bravo and thanks!! You have said everything other Americans have wanted to or tired to for the past few years. It fell on deaf ears.
We all have to get rid of these folks and return them to their countries of origin. They hate the west, they dislike our freedoms, they want to end our way of life. So what are they doing among us? They are trying to broaden their caliphate. They want the world to be muslim..and if immigration laws don't change, and we don't watch what is going on aound us, and in the mosques..we might as well give up now and save the lives of thousands, maybe millions before this is over.

Drastic isn't it?. Sounds insane, doesn't it. But it is true, and unfortunately now a fact of life.
We have to take responsibility for ourselves..place the blame where it belongs...on the terrorists.
They are evil. They love death..more than they love their children and themselves.

We could trust the other "good" muslims more if they would only SPEAK UP.. and condemn what these people are doing. But they don't. Why?

#322--FinnkingII---hi:)...your a stinker & i almost never(6%)agree w/you, but i still love-ya..after all, how can you not like one who writes this...
""clowns to the West of me, jokers to the east, here i am, happily stuck in the Northern EU""!!!! :~)

#325--Lynne--thanks---i know it fell on deaf ears, but it felt oh so good posting:)

#325--Lynne--check this out..if ever you wanted a true account of the muslim movement.....

http://www.jcpa.org/JCPA/index.asp

click on 'radical islam'..then the article;
"New demographic balance in Europe & it's consequences""

#322 Finnking II

There are Arabs in Israel who want to kill Jews, There are Sunni Arabs in Iraq who want to kill Shiites. There are Sunni Arabs traveling around the Darfur region of Sudan attacking villages and killing any non Muslims they can find. Muslims in India set off bombs to kill Hindus. Muslims in Kenya, Tanzania Nigeria, Zambia, Zimbabwe etc etc. do similar things because it is the culture of Islamic conquest. They feel that conquest of infidels serves Allah

This is not something that will stop if we can just find a new way to be nicer to them.

The Christian church was very similar in the past to the current Islamic faith. I doubt there was any choice about conversion. Once they had defeated the local militia in your town it was convert or die, just as it is now in many parts of the world with Islam. If you tour the basement areas of very old churches you will find torture rooms, they ruled through fear.

325. Lynne, USA

Seriously, Lynne, does it never strike you that what you write (see 325) is exactly what the Nazis said about the Jews in 30's europe? THe parallels are crystal clear.

Sandy

a) You will find that 317 was having a laugh.

b) A 'stinker'? Why so? For making you think, a bit? Come on, have a go answering my questions above. We cannot, by any rational moral standard, critisise others actions without first looking at our own. Of course these guys are idiots and will be taken through a legal system and imprisoned with due respect for their human rights. It's the civilised way to do it. If you set up camps and deny basic rights and cherry pick the laws you are then behaving in a manner that is uncivilised. (Think how you react when you hear of other peoples denying the human rights of US citizens).

We are all humans and there idiots on all sides determined to divide us (nation states, cultures, religion, football teams etc) so we can be easily manipulated towards war and for more mundane taxation reasons. There is no USA in nature, no Finland,no Scotland. The lines on the political maps are not natural and no longer, if ever, reflect a single cultural identity. We the people, of all hues, are being fed a line to a) divide us and b) tax us. Wealth is now 'global', without barriers, so should we be. Nation States are static, culture is a river with many, many attributes.

Stealers Wheel. Interesting band name. :)

Sammy 25...Do you have plans to appease them...give in to them, tell them they are the good guys? Are they misunderstood? Do you not get their meaning? Do you plan to turn your country over to them?

GET REAL.. This is just the beginning. Like someone else said.."More to come". STAY TUNED folks, and fasten your seat belts...this is going to be a bumpy ride!!!

FINNKING YOU ARE NUTS!!!
you are the biggest apologist for the terrorists there is!!
Thru all your threads...in the Middle East etc. you have taken the side of the terrorists.Are you friends with Sammy 25?

329. Disambiguation,

Yes, that was my point. However, the convertion from 'paganism' to christianity was a time in history when many folk were ignorant of philosophy and science. In effect, 'we' were ripe for picking hence the largely unopposed adoption of that faith in what became known as scotland. (and elsewhere). The argument that Muslims want to implement Sharia Law is simply absurd. First, only a few of the extremists hold that view and the VAST majority of, say, EU Muslims simply want to get on with life without fear etc. and b) the majority of the people of the EU have either rejected the need for a dualistic faith, have already adopted a faith that works for them and are simply not 'ripe' for seeking out another faith.

The Muslims in EULand, 40 million, give or take, have during my lifetime simply got on with life to no ill effect in the local community or have, over the generations, dispensed with the more oppressive aspects of Islam. Look into the history of Islam and you will find that it has always adopted and adapted to local 'culture', over time. For instance, you will learn that Muhammed's wife had many husbands and that she controlled the 'wealth', such was Islam at that time. The oppression of women, for instance, is not an aspect of original Islamic life and such practices were adopted from the christian cultures that Islam moved into.

However, I stress that the world has moved on and certainly in EU, the people are not ripe for faith change. Even in Islamic Iran, the numbers of people attending mosque regularly is suprisingly low. Regime change is simple and quick but divesting the people of hundreds of years of conditioning takes longer and can only be achieved by good practice and over generations. Look at how the average Indian immigrant to the UK has changed. You cannot legislate for human behaviour, you cannot force people into a behaviour pattern that will last. Bombing them simply entrenches the beliefs and

291 / Very good question. I have been wondering this for years.

297 / Probably because NO media report has mentioned this claim which appears to be being put about to further demonise Muslims.

300 / Yes. Just what does Al qaeda 'inspired' mean? Just what does 'links' with Al qaeda mean?

304 / I agree absolutely.

316 / The Muslims in Britain have become arrogant, demanding and dangerous demanding this and that, stopping Christmas celebrations at schools etc,

NOT correct. It is not Muslims who stop Christmas celebrations in schools etc etc .. it is left wing non-Muslim local government 'do-gooders' who take it upon themselves to do these things probably without even consulting any Muslims .... most Muslims find these things funny .... the result is media coverage of the thing 'banned' and further adverse publicity for Muslims ....

317 / Yes ....

331 / Sammy 25...Do you have plans to appease them...give in to them, tell them they are the good guys? Are they misunderstood? Do you not get their meaning? Do you plan to turn your country over to them?

This is a very good question.

Perhaps if the posters here were to debate the question 'What exactly motivated these individuals to carry out these acts at this time and what is the ultimate objective of these acts' instead of engaging in Nazi like anti-Muslim propaganda, these questions would be easier to answer.

331. Lynne, USA

"You are Nuts" Mmmm...great argument there.

How about you answer my question about your comment above? The similarities between your comment and the thought process of the Nazis towards the Jews (who were mostly on the 'left', by the way)? Try and argue it, please.

As for me being an apologist for the terrorists: not so. I am simply responding to the polarised nature of others' posts. I abhore all forms of oppression. I simply seek a balanced view on these events: IE: 'we' use state terrorism and 'they' use non state terrorism. Folk kill, folk die. Madness.

Debate me, don't just say, "You're Nuts".

332. Lynne

"FINNKING YOU ARE NUTS!!! you are the biggest apologist for the terrorists there is!!"

Don't throw your title away Lynne, I'm sure it was hard-earned.

You are the biggest apologist for the terrorists USA, UK and Israel I know, and unlike Finnking you have the additional charming quality of not being troubled by fact or reason.

Further to post 334 /

In Spain the Basque terrorist group ETA not long ago announced it's intention to resume operations. These individuals are probably catholic. Imagine that they commmit a further atrocity (I believe that there was some sort of alert at Palma or Ibiza airport yesterday). Will Catholics be subjected to the same degree of demonisation, as a group, to which Muslims are being subjected. Somehow I don't think so ....

It looks to me as if there is 'something going on' in respect of some members of the PAKISTANI community in the UK, probably for Pakistani reasons involving Pakistani politics. If the demonisation was directed at Pakistanis, as opposed to Muslims in general, I might possibly find it easier to stomach as at least the blame would be placed on those who appear to actually being the persons carying out the terrorist attacks (7/7 and yesterday).

Numbers 8-13-32 55, and all those others that think the London attempt was propaganda by our own Government/Security forces will no doubt attribute the Glasgow Airport attempt as pure fabrication on the part of The Scotsman. Whats the expression you use "Numpties". I bet you believe in fairies at the bottom of your garden.

332. Lynne, USA

As for the "are you friends with Sammy 25?" comment....

No, this is the first day I have read 'his' posts. His posts are interesting and he attempts to combine humour with critical analysis which leads to good debate; debate which provokes thought and challenges opinions.

Yet to see him write: "You're Nuts" as a suitable debating point. Friend? Never met the guy but it seems that we share similar views and would get on great until I start on about the destruction of state and the elimination of money, which is where I tend to fall out with fellow leftists (or, as you may call them: "Commy scumbag pinko faggots"...I was called that once! :) Maybe twice!). Over to you Sammy 25!

Sammy 25

Regarding ETA

http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1027392007

#335

this is what the americans want to press on us but the americans love it it must be a rush sort of thing. ask rose gentle who lost a son in iraq is war worth it no, why does america not go into zimbabwe,
america want to be the world police and want us to be deputy at the expence of the rest of europe hating us for it.

Before blaming Muslims for 'terrorism' etc etc give some study to the events of 11th Spetember 2001.

http://www.911truth.org/

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid...

and

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline.jsp?startpos=...

would be good places to start.

Devote some hours of your time.

Even if, like me, you find yourself unable to agree with any particular conspiracy theory the conclusion that, at a minimum, there was involvement of 'certain elements' within the US Government cannot be avoided.

Why are so many people in the US calling for the impeachment of their President and Vice Prrsident?

328 Sandy

I followed your link. Unreal. As a European, I can honestly say that the last time I read such drivel was in school when we taught about how the nazis managed to manipulate the masses. Here's a goo link for you, a translation of Nazi propaganda in the 30's. Notice the parallels between your contemporary post and this one: http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/geisenheim.htm

Or here's agood graphic of a poster of the time. Not so different from the sentiments expressed in your link: http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/posters/derjude.jpg

Translation: "The Jew--- The inciter of war, the prolonger of war"

Here's a great one: http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/posters/sieg2.jpg The caption reads, "One Battle, One Will, One Goal: Victory at any Price"

Mmmm... now, where have I heard a similar war cry?

Here's a great site for you. Sure, you will have to swap the term 'jew' for 'Muslim' but is actually gives advice on how to argue against 'jews/muslims'.

http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/responses.htm

# 333 Finnking II

I agree with most of what you have said.
I will take issue on Islamic history. North Africa was not Arabic or Islamic, North Africa was conquered and made what it is now. The same is true of most of the Middle East, southeast Europe and Asia. We may view that as ancient history but it is still going on in Africa. Islam is spreading south through Africa and it is not a peaceful or philosophic transition.

I agree the vast majority of Muslims just want to live a peaceful life. The problem is that the few who use violence to make themselves powerful most often use that violence on the Muslim population they seek to lead.

A small group of violent people can easily lead a large group of passive people to accept Sharia law. Most Muslims think that terrorism is a curse on Islam but they are usually afraid to say so publicly because they fear retribution.

One reason Muslim leaders dislike western culture so much is that young Muslims relate to western television and values more than the local culture and the fear is they will become western. I hope that Islam will adapt to the modern world over the next few generations.

There is a large Muslim population in the US that has been here for generations and they have a much more modern point of view.

Muslim people can not choose to live the way they want if there are masked "holy police" who beat and even kill people who do not dress and act Islamic.

Of course Muslims are responsible for so-called 'terrorist' attacks in countries under occupation by the US/UK/Israel ... as the populations of Afghanistan, Iraq and Palestine are Muslim by definition resistance against foreign occupation will be by Muslims.

But are these people supposed to simply submit to the occupation and the theft of their country's resources? Resistance against occupying force is regarded as a legitimate act ... I don't recall the French Resistance being branded terrorists or demonised!

Saddam Hussein was removed from power years ago and is now DEAD. What on earth are we still doing in Iraq?

Arab terrorism has grown out of the Israel/Palestine problems. I noticed however while watching a documentary on the Palestinian hijackings in 1970 (Leila Khalid) that UK public opinion at that time appeared rather pro-Palestinian and totally lacked any form of 'demonetisation' of those involved.

However, I do not personally think that the events currently occuring in the UK are connected to traditional Arab terrorism.

Demonetisation of Muslims helps nothing. It is clear that Turkish Cypriots, Malaysians, Indonesians or even 'Arabs' are not directly involved. The terrorists are not Muslim refugees from Iraq, Afghanistan or 'the back of beyond'. The 'terrorists' are members of a very specific group which also happens to be a Muslim sub-group: UK born persons of Pakistani origin.

I think more information is needed on just what exactly is going on in Pakistan and the Pakistan/Afghanistan frontier areas. Why during one of the recent terrorist trials did one of the accused refuse to continue to give evidence because of threats made to his family in Pakistan by the Pakistani Security Services? This fact alone gives rise to the question of what the hell the Pakistani Security Services had to do with something that happened in the UK???? Could THEY be behind these attacks for their own reasons ... there is after all evidence

#312 "you have terrorism suspects"
yes, SUSPECTS, look it up in a dictionary. Doesn't mean proven criminals, does it?

#321 """it doesn't matter how illegal it is,""...........eh?""
you really need to get someone to read these posts to you - not illegal, pet, ILLOGICAL. Logic, however idoesn't figure much in all the Islamophobia, so I suppose you can't be expected to recognise this word.

""how much hate there is,""............you & your ilk have enough 'hate' for all!
I don't know what "my ilk" might be in yourworld, but I don't hate all that many people, and certainly not on the wholesale basis of all you who are condemning ALL muslims.

#325 years. "We all have to get rid of these folks and return them to their countries of origin. They hate...they want to end our way of life. So what are they doing among us? They are trying to broaden their caliphate. ..."

Any Iraqi could use exactly these words about the illegal invaders from the US & UK.

343. Allan christie

Oil is a worldwide commodity. US oil companies do not buy much oil from the Persian gulf because of the shipping distance. The US does not take oil from Iraq. The US has spent much more money fighting wars than the oil is worth.

You could make a good point that private companies make a lot of money "rebuilding" Iraq with Iraqs oil money.

Many people would say that oil is a strategic resource that must be controlled but the truth is there is much more oil available in Canada and the USA than in the Middle East if we count oil sand and coal that can be cheaply converted to oil. (cheap by todays oil prices)

346 cont /

The US Government now wishes to attack Iran. The US Government actually wants to use NUCLEAR WEAPONS on Iran.

Can you imagine this? Can you really imagine this?Since 1945 no nuclear weapons have ever been used in combat. We survived the cold war without nuclear weapons ever being used. The use of nuclear weapons is unthinkable by any rational person.

The UK media caries on ad-nauseum about 'terrorists' and is tryting to panic us, even though nobody has actually been killed in the UK in these recent incidents.

345. Disambiguation, USA

Thanks for the constructive and informative nature of your reply.

As an atheist, I find the whole thing simply bizarre. I watched a BBC documentary some years ago. The BBC had a camera crew aboard a US carrier as it steamed (or whatever nuke driven vessels do!Yeah, they steam too....) towards the middle east. During an interview with the captain of this huge vessel, an F18 (whatever) could be heard taking off. The captain raised his hand and said, "Ah, when i hear that noise I hear the right arm of God." Now, aside from the mixed metaphor, I see no difference between that (religious lunatic in charge of a huge roving WMD) and the 'mad-mullahs' usual comments.

As for the 'dress code' enforement: it's an interesting issue. If we are arguing against the radical Islam's oppression and lack of freedoms, then we should look at our own. Try walking down your street naked. You will be arrested. In other words, there are limits we place on 'freedom' and we do so by man made law. Where do we draw the line? My view is that law cannot mandate for human behaviour without oppressing someone. Laughably, if it wasn't for the US laws (forget which state) stating that women couldn't dance showing their vagina, we wouldn't have the sight of women in G-Strings! These garments, created via an act of oppression, have become fashionable. In extreme muslim coutries the women get similar marketing about the Hijab etc....they become products, fashion, desired. Funny world.

With humour, yours Finnking.

346. Sammy25

"It has been suggested that I am a 'leftie'. Actually, I have never voted for a 'left wing' party (including the Labour party) in my life."

Ah, keep posting and you will eventually receive the formal title of "Leftie, Pinko, Commie, Faggot, yank hater, terrorist apeaser", trust me, it will happen!

All the best...........

348 /You could make a good point that private companies make a lot of money "rebuilding" Iraq with Iraqs oil money.

Companies owned by WHO exactly. Members of the US Government?

348. Disambiguation, USA

Control of Chinese econonomic growth by price setting at the OPEC table and ensuring that China and Russia do not gain control of Iranian reserves?

Peak oil?

I'm not worried about a bunch of fanatical terrorists who have absolutely no hope what so ever of imposing shria-law in the west (It's an excuse used by US/UK/Israel to kill muslims). However, i am worried about US/UK bombing Iraq/Afghanistan killing hundred's of thousands to impose 'democracy'. Now thats REAL state terrorism.

Eventually, what we'll be seeing is a fully nuclearized middle east, especially Iran (can you blame 'em) They'll be thinking 'never again will we be Iraqed'. Russia and China will be worried about US hegemony in that area, which could effect their share of M.E oil, causing friction and possibly laying the stage for WWIII.

There is apparantly a documented case of a prediction being made on 10th September 2001 by a non-Muslim child to the effect that-

"Tomorrow WWIII will start. The USA will loose."

Thank you very much Sammy25 and Finnking II for speaking the truth about world events in an unbiased and open minded way. With honest people such as yourselves, there is still hope for this world.

God bless you folks!

#352 Sammy25
Halliburton is the largest contractor doing business in Iraq with 11 billion in contracts. Dick Chaney turns out to have been the former chief executive officer of Halliburton for 5 years before becoming Vice President of the United States. He was paid 44 million dollars during that time.

You will be relieved to know that Cheney and Halliburton have insisted that he had no part in the government’s decision about the Iraq contracts. Vice President Chaney has said “I have absolutely no influence of, involvement of, knowledge of in any way, shape, or form of contracts led by the Corps of Engineers or anybody else in the federal government.”

The Bush Administration picked Halliburton to receive a noncompetitive contract for up to seven billion dollars to rebuild Iraq’s oil operations. Only the most jaded would suggest that Chaney had anything to do with it.

354 /I'm not worried about a bunch of fanatical terrorists who have absolutely no hope what so ever of imposing shria-law in the west (It's an excuse used by US/UK/Israel to kill muslims). However, i am worried about US/UK bombing Iraq/Afghanistan killing hundred's of thousands to impose 'democracy'. Now thats REAL state terrorism.

How true. Especially when the 'democracies' have already been established for some time and our armed forces are still bombing and killing. 65 Afghan civilians including women and children yesterday. You have to watch AlJazeera English news for proper coverage of international events. The UK news media concerns us with panic panic panic coverage of whatever they are panicing about this week.

#347--nell from falkirk---thanks, i actually read it twice & came up w/the same word!...logical?:)

355. Sammy25, That child could be right.

The bigger they are the harder they fall.

355. Sammy25

THe 911 'Commission' actually reported Tenet's statement that the "system was blinking red" prior to the 'attacks'. Also, the government released (at the Commission's request...IE: late) a memo from the CIA titled: "Bin Ladin Dtermined to Strike the US". This memo even mentions "hijackings" on US soil. However, the Commission reported, "THe threat was seen as being from overseas and no one was looking at foreigners operating with the US." Amazing. Well, amazing that the US citizens didn't riot and demand another Commission.

John Ashcroft, refused to travel by planes in the run up to 911 because "of information given to him by the FBI".

Look into the David Schippers comments that the FBI gave him info on attacks planned for lower manhatten. Then again, you just need to look at the Put and Get option trading to see that the event was known by the authorities.

353. Finnking II

China and India will likely be the big customers of Iraq and Iranian oil. Some people suggest that the reason the US is still building large scale weapons systems after the fall of the Soviet Union is to counter an expected Chinese naval build up to protect Chinese access to mid East oil.

My personal opinion is that the weapons systems are being built because they are worth a lot of money to those who pay for political campaigns.

When oil cost 20 dollars per barrel it made no sense to sell "alternative energy".

Many people think we will someday run out of oil. The truth is we have already run out of "cheap" oil.

The higher price of oil has opened up a whole new supply of alternative energy.

Canada has large amounts of "oil sand", as the name implies it is oil mixed with sand. The cost of separating the oil from the sand is about two dollars per gallon. (roughly a half Euro per liter) This was not done when there was a supply of cheaper oil. Estimates of exactly how much oil sand there is vary some but all estimates are huge. There is more oil in Canadian sand than in the entire Middle East.

The United States has very large reserves of coal. Coal can be converted to natural gas and then condensed to oil for about two dollars per gallon (a half Euro per liter). There is enough coal to make oil at current needs for about 200 years. The coal conversion process is very clean because the coal is not burned. The coal is pressurized to release methane. The methane is then condensed to make very clean burning oil. The processed coal is then returned to the same place it had been mined. The process is known as Fischer-Tropsch technology.

There is a problem with both fuel supplies and that is global warming. Burning the oil releases Carbon Dioxide which is a greenhouse gas that contributes to climate change.

#344--FinnkingII---your actually equating your links to mine(drivel?) @328??....but then, i suppose it's difficult to see the 'writing on the wall' w/a closed mind....

btw---access to your 1st & 4th link was good..
2nd & 3rd restricted access.....

#355--Sammy25--is that a threat & are you that child?? perhaps it's one of your relatives?? close friend? neighbor?

#339, 351--FinnkingII---you seem to want someone to use those terms of endearment your posting..
""commy scumbag pinko faggots""..""leftie, Pinko, Commie, Faggot, Yank hater, Terrorist appeaser""

why??

#343--Allan Christie---do you have a link for that tripe your spewing, or are we to take your word??

#317--Gordon---re-#323--apologies, i hadn't read #318.....

363. sandy

Are you honestly saying that you do not see the similarity between the tripe form your link and the tripe I posted from Nazi germany?

Regarding the links: All links are open over my ISP. Why are yours not?

Regarding the "Pinko, leftieetc" bit: I was called that by some guy on there threads last winter! Serious!

349. Sammy25

You said that the US wants to attack Iran with nuclear weapons.

I agree that the US will probably soon attack Iran. I very much doubt the attack will be with nuclear weapons.

I think the two nuclear power plants Iran is building will be destroyed before they are finished. If Iran finishes the power plants they will be able to build nuclear weapons within several months.

President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad of Iran has made Irans nuclear program a point of national pride for Iran. When the power plants are destroyed the country will be seen as having been humiliated. Most military people think President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad will be overthrown if he does not fight back. The problem is if he does fight back Iran will lose most of their navy and air force in a few hours. That would probably lead to President Mahmoud Ahmadinejads execution.

I do not think an full invasion of Iran is likely, but some military action is almost a sure thing.

362. Disambiguation, USA

I agree. Venezuala's oil is now profitable (it too is of a type that's costly to refine).

On alternative sourses: It's funny but we have been living in cloud cuckoo land. Electricty here is something like .60€ a KW/h. You ride a bicycle and generate that power, see how long it takes you and all you get is 60 cents!

Also, one aspect of the 'wind power' debate that never seems to get mentioned is that for every MW of wind power you design systems to provide you must also make a MW of switchable power. If the demand requests x MW and the wind stops blowing, you must be able to switch in other forms.

Most of the power stations are manufactured making huge use of concrete. Guess which material is seriously bad in terms of CO emissions?

We need to use less power, end of story. I'm going wood fired!

364. Binny,

Well found!

#364 Binny

Not sure what you're getting at. Domains by Proxy is owned (founded?) by Bob Parsons, former US Marine, and Go Daddy CEO. He used to run a firm selling Christian Clip Art. (???). Sounds like he has a talent for business.

Is there something more we should know?

364. Binny

There are many services that can hide your identity online, some are free and others charge for better service. The basic idea is they send your feed through a different country so any trace is lost there. These services go outside the US so the US government can not simply raid an office in Arizona.

# 168 Farz

"153. 57Nomad
What is the diferrence between your logic andBen Laden ?"

That's a good question. Your unspoken assumption is the key. The nuances of logic do not pertain to this situation. The only logic to conflict is win or lose. They started the fight and they did it in a way that reflects their methods and intentions. They attacked American civilians. That's their quaint way of saying that all Americans are the enemy. It's also a tip off into their mode of attack.

Keeping those two things in mind, our response will be, has been, and is, this; we fight to win. The other side tossed out the rules when they chose to attack New York and Washington. So, sweetheart, the gloves are off. We Americans are good people, but we are not particularly nice people. That is a subtlety you and your saliva drooling pals don't appreciate.

We like to help the kids out when we can. We like to build hospitals and schools. See what I mean? Good people. But when our existence is threated by a bunch of heartless 7th Century throwbacks you should understand something. We have no intention of being bound by any rules whatsoever. This is a fight to the finish. Got that?

We've been up against much tougher guys than you jokers. We're still alive, they're still dead. We're not really all that nice, see what I mean? We don't care about logic or rules, in this situation those concerns are for suckers. Suckers who won't survive. Now, instead of sitting at your computer writing, maybe you should get a part time job so you can pay to fill up your car.

357. Disambiguation

"The Bush Administration picked Halliburton to receive a noncompetitive contract for up to seven billion dollars to rebuild Iraq’s oil operations. Only the most jaded would suggest that Chaney had anything to do with it."

Substitute 'nothing' for 'anything' and you've got it right.

204. American: "...what makes you think extremists won't be part of the volunteers. Remember, they hide amongst civilians?"

Stringent background security checks would have to be undertaken on all volunteers, the same type and standard that members of the UK armed forces and security services are liable to.

Furthermore, it would be possible to create this defence force as an extension of the Territorial Army (UK equivalent of the National Guard), although its mandate would be territorially limited to the UK during times of national emergency. Making the defence force an arm of the British Army would also go some way to limiting the amount of terrorists among its ranks. There are hardly any Muslim recruits within the armed forces. The vast majority of Muslim members of the army belong to a mysticism-based and intrinsically peaceful branch of Sufism that is as far removed from radical Islam as, say, Buddhism. The Shi'ite, Sunnis and the Wahhabi generally despise the British Armed forces. If some did get through they would be found out and dealt with.

375. edward_w

Great post

I think we should consider two things.
1/ Islamic fanatics can only threaten people if the local government allows them.
2/The weapon of mass destruction that Islamist fear more than any other is CNN, The Cartoon Network, Nike, Starbucks and Christina Aguilera. Western "culture" has stolen the hearts of young Muslims.

376. 57Nomad,

Well done. Perverse, violent and historically flawed but it was the most sincere post I have read of yours.

Keep it up.

Terror networks can only function if they have a large money supply. The largest supporter of international terror now is Iran. If the Iranian government is replaced with a moderate government the middle east becomes a much less violent place.

#364--hey Binny!!! wake up!! that's old news here!!
you can twist it anyway you want..make it go anywhere you want, but you'll only be whistling in the wind...it is what it is, some idiot radical jihadist posting..

#369--FinnkingII--""regarding the links: all links are open over my ISP. why are yours not?""

<<""on-campus only access""
<<""a valid login or password is required""

379. Disambiguation

"The weapon of mass destruction that Islamist fear more than any other is CNN, The Cartoon Network, Nike, Starbucks and Christina Aguilera. Western "culture" has stolen the hearts of young Muslims."

If the Islamists can get rid of that sort of 'culture' they'll be doing us all a good service.

#376 57Nomad

That's some scary talk, Nomad. You sound just like those jihadists we're meant to be fighting against.

We gained a couple of new heroes of our own yesterday. The guys who floored the terrorsist at Glasgow Airport didn't say things such as "fight to the finish" or "the gloves are off". It was more along the lines of "well, you've got to help the police, haven't you". Guys like that make me feel a hundred times more secure than you.

Sandy 365 / No. It is documented

370 / And after the 'attack', then what? Another occupation paid for by Iran's oil?

381 / read 'US Puppet Government'3

#385--Selgovae---you think, ""fight to the finish""or""the gloves are off"", is ""scarey talk""?

i'd rather *57Nomad* had my 6, than your 'buddies' the jihadist terrorists....

""scarey talk""??..LOL

#380 Finnking

Finns said:

"Perverse, violent and historically flawed but it was the most sincere post I have read of yours."

Thanks, I guess. Your post also reflects your biases. All my posts are sincere, except for the ones where I'm just having fun. You have a particular view of history. It is biased because events must be stuffed into categories that reflect the "scientific" view of history and the notion of history as the unfolding of the class struggle. It is no such thing. It is the struggle for individual rights and freedom. It never ends and we know it. "The price of liberty is eternal vigilance," Thomas Jefferson.

Eternal vigilance, that's why we're in it for the long haul. Human nature never changes, the eternal dictator is only a lapse of attention away. Keep your eyes open, mind sharp, powder dry.

#386--Sammy-

""Sandy 365/ No. it is documented""

might you supply us w/a link to that document??

#388--57Nomad--

""keep your eyes open, mind sharp, powder dry""

your going to frighten *Selgovae* again with that ""scarey talk""!! :~)

386 Sammy

I do not think anybody is sure how Iran will play out. They hope to achieve "regime change" without a full invasion. If that happens then Irans military would probably take control. If there is an invasion it is anybodys guess what would happen. Hopefully a few lessons have been learned in Iraq.

The obvious goals would be to stop Irans nuclear program and to stop Irans support for Hezzbollah, Hamas and other terrorist groups. The less obvious goals might involve who gets to award the contracts.

#376 nomad - thanks for the best laugh I've had today!

Come on now, own up - you ARE George Dubya!!

(How do I know? -
Perhaps it was the sheer weight of cliches per sentence?

Perhaps it was the script, Hollywood, circa 1954?
classic lines - "the gloves are off. We Americans are good people, but we are not particularly nice people"

"We have no intention of being bound by any rules whatsoever. This is a fight to the finish. Got that?"

"We've been up against much tougher guys than you jokers. We're still alive, they're still dead"

The last one would knock 'em out in the aisles!!

Fade out: John Wayne lies dead in ditch, flag flies overhead, orchestra plays "star spangled banner....."

Vintage Hollywood, and about as credible!!

388 / It is the struggle for individual rights and freedom. It never ends and we know it. "The price of liberty is eternal vigilance," Thomas Jefferson.

Very good point. Individual rights and freedoms are being lost as a result of these 'terrorist' attacks. Therefore the persons responsible for them are the persons who want those freedoms to be lost. It is unlikely that immigrants and refugees from dictatorial regimes are the persons who want our freedoms to be lost.

(note: the person or persons 'responsible' for them are not necessarily the 'mules' being used to carry them out. The big drug dealer does not travel with drugs in his own luggage)

By the way, on the subject of drugs and drug dealers, I trust that you are all aware that the (CIA assisted?) production of drugs outlawed by the Talaban is now once again in full swing following the introduction of democracy and the US/UK occupation ....

#393, Sammy - you have tried hard today, and I agree with