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Syria linked to 'secret supplies' of nuclear equipment

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Published Date: 15 September 2007
SYRIA may have had contacts with "secret suppliers" to obtain nuclear equipment, and officials from North Korea have visited the country, a senior US nuclear official said yesterday.
Andrew Semmel, the acting deputy assistant secretary of state for nuclear nonproliferation policy, did not name the suppliers, but said he could not exclude that the network run by disgraced Pakistan nuclear scientist A Q Khan had been involved.

He was responding to questions about an Israeli air strike in northern Syria last week. Neither side has explained what exactly happened, but a US government official confirmed Israeli war planes were targeting weapons from Iran and destined for Hezbollah militants in Lebanon. The Washington Post said on Thursday that Israel had gathered satellite images showing possible North Korean co-operation with Syria on a nuclear facility.

Mr Semmel, who is in Italy for a meeting today on the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty, said Syria was certainly on the US nuclear "watch list".

"There are indicators that they do have something going on there," he said. "We do know there are a number of foreign technicians that have been in Syria.

"We do know there may have been contact between Syria and some secret suppliers for nuclear equipment. Whether anything transpired remains to be seen.

"So good foreign policy, good national-security policy, would suggest we pay very close attention to that.

"We're watching very closely. Obviously, the Israelis were watching very closely."

Asked if the suppliers could have been North Koreans, he said: "There are North Korean people there ... just as there are a lot of North Koreans in Iraq and Iran."

Asked if the so-called Khan network, which supplied nuclear technology to Iran, Libya and North Korea, could have been involved, he said he "wouldn't exclude it".



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  • Last Updated: 14 September 2007 8:39 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Syria
 
1

Cobbie,

Dauphin 15/09/2007 02:21:23

Fancy that, who'd ever have guessed Syria would be sticking their grubby little hands in the nuclear pie?

2

Guga II,

Rockall 15/09/2007 02:36:45

And, of course, the Israelis get their satellite images from their paymasters, the Americans.

3

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 15/09/2007 03:36:12

And, of course, Guga gets his lies from his from his paymasters, the Iranians

4

StewartB,

15/09/2007 04:16:25

Iran must be displeased with all this publicity over their pawn, Syria, doing naughty things for their Iranian masters. Iran probably gave Asaad such a scolding he went out and kicked the first Hezbollah cat he saw.

5

Conan,

Here 15/09/2007 04:23:18

No, no, #3 - Guga is correct, most likely. I certainly hope so.

Guga, like many who post here, has a hard time in dealing with facts and the realities 'on the ground' in a region where it seems he has no connections.

The fact that what seems to most sticks in Scots craw is that the US and Israel are allied. Guga believes this is not right and should be ended.

Guga - deal with the real world - whether you like it or not the US and Israel are somewhat 'chummy', allied, partners in crime, call it what you prefer - it does not really make any difference - except to you, apparently.

Like I have attempted to point out to you (and those posters like you) before, and as you seemingly still are unable to accept, there is no 'black and white', no absolute 'good and bad', in the Middle East. Both Israel and its enemies have done wrong and continue to do wrong. All nations have at one time or another - depending on the hand they are dealt.

In Israel's defence, they are surrounded by hundreds of millions who wish them ill - or, in some cases, dead. They have to deal with that, for it is real.

Those who have taken that position towards Israel are very greatly supported and encouraged by the likes of your very good self and thus see no need or impetus to come to any accomodation with the Israelis. Indeed, whenever the Israelis have made such gestures, such as returning territory (Gaza, or ther Sanai, for example) or in freeing likely terrorists or other so-called 'Palestinian' criminals, always resultsd in more attacks from the nutters on the 'Palestinian'/'Arab'/'Jew-Hating' side. In other words - nothing Israel can do short of 'disappearing' will suffice. And, that's NOT going to happen.

How would you prefer to see this situation resolved - in your 'ideal world', Mr. Guga?

6

Jinky's oars,

Israel 15/09/2007 06:04:34

"And, of course, the Israelis get their satellite images from their paymasters, the Americans."

Don't be so sure! The Israelis have their own satellites. Bear in mind also the fact that the Turks and the Israelis are far closer than diplo-speak would sometimes have you believe.

6 million Israelis surrounded by over 20 times that amount of arabs and they're still classed as the bully in the playground! Some people's ignorance really is beyond reproach at times.

7

Guga II,

Rockall 15/09/2007 06:13:42

#6 Israel is the only country in the region with nuclear weapons, approximately 150 of them, i.e. as many as the YUK has. They are armed to the hilt by the Americans who, incidentally, have just recently agreed to give them another $30 billion for more arms.

The bully in the playground is the one with the big stick that beats up the other, relatively defenceless, kids,

8

honest, jock,

Leith 15/09/2007 06:19:53

Not a shred of evidence produced to back up the claims as usual but our neocon cowboy posters dont care. Israel now admits to after initially denying the raid which the self same posters also agreed never happened and argued themselves hoarse on these very threads that it never happened because unimpeachable sourses in Washington and Tel Aviv said so.
And here we are again. Yes it did happen but only because it was a legitimate terrorist target in a sovereign state which at present is at peace with Israel. And its a legitimate target because unimpeachable sourses from Washington and Tel Aviv say so.

Will they never learn?

9

Conan,

Here 15/09/2007 06:43:50

#7 - a poor and weak analogy.

10

Conan,

Here 15/09/2007 07:41:50

#10 - agreed - however, where they got them is apparently of paramount importance to poster #2, I think you'll agree? But, I take your point - we two digressed from the essential thrust of the story.

11

49th State Yank,

As Stated 15/09/2007 08:07:53

The trouble with all of you and your thinking is that Isreal got intel from some where and made a bombing run on Syria, when in fact, they should have bombed all of Syria and more of the Middle East. Most of us Americans are angry to core with these terror sponsoring countries. We want to bring our troops home and get ready for a real war this time; a war where we call the timing and take our time to prepare for it properly. It's time to put the extremists back into the Dark Ages in which they belong.

12

honest, jock,

Leith 15/09/2007 09:08:10

12

Unbelievable comment! the biggest sponser and arms supplier of international terrorism in the world today is the US.
And its posters like you who are already living in the dark ages. Dustbins willing to take anything in.

13

Guga II,

Rockall 15/09/2007 09:08:10

#12 49th State Septic. I suppose like all the other neocon republican numpties, you want to nuke the whole of the middle east into non-existence?

Where are you going to get your oil then? And what will all Bush's pals at Halliburton and similar have to say about that? What will happen to all their huge war profits?

14

desert rat,

qatar 15/09/2007 10:08:05

Conan #
may I answere for Guga, how would the situation be ressolved?
Legally, no occupation of land by armed conquest (1948-1967 ), right of retund after war.
This is all that is needed,as set out in international law, but like most bullies the USofA and Israel want to cherry pick what parts of laws suit them. A good exaple this week when an American court awarded million agaist Iran for bomming a Marine base in Lebanon

15

Hillary R. Clinton,

NY 15/09/2007 11:55:51

14. Guga II, Rockall

Guga, just remember, "It's not the size that matters, it's how you use it"

16

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 15/09/2007 12:07:35

#8

Not one bit of truth in your post.

Israel never denied the attack
Israel has never confirmed the attack
Syria is still at war with Israel.

But why deal with the truth? You hate Israel, so any lie about her will do.

17

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 15/09/2007 12:11:21

#7 Guga

Israel has had nuclear weapons since at least 1967. It has been attacked by the Arabs you defend 3 times since then, twice coming within days of total destruction yet still never used them
The Arabs you support have waged genocidal war after genocidal war, and have each time lost (or there would have been a genocide)
And you want to pretend its Israel, alone against Syria, Iran, Saudi Arabi, (formerly Jordan and Egypt) as well as the rest of the Arab world, that is the bully?
Wow

18

Guga II,

Rockall 15/09/2007 15:02:46

#18 Of course Israel are the bully. They have their paymasters to back them up to the hilt with with weapons, including, as I pointed out, the recent allocation of anothert $30 billion for arms for them. They also have total backing from the yanks for whatever they do, and the real bullies, i.e. the yanks have got the biggest stick, haven't they.

19

The grouch,

Ontario 15/09/2007 15:36:42

I love the moral high ground hypocrites...Hi y'all, still without Sun I see. "Sun over Leith yet Jock?"
So.....there's no special relationship between, Brit'eys and Amis, Huh...Perchance that naughty twosome did not venture into Persia. ..Hello,,,You lot can stab in the back, faster that a Frenchman can throw down a rifle.
You lot, have as much blood on your hands as the rest of us, When it come to the Free Market Economy,, Tools of Death. Your nice standard of living, comes in part, from the sales these nasty naughty's.." Never to be mentioned in nice company." generate!!!!!!!

There are without doubt, more than a few extra well nourished keyboard warriors, who would like to see Israel Fall..Take care of what you wish...You live too close to the epicentre of that Blackhole....There is a TOY STORE, IN the Sabra land, of milk and honey, Which would boggle your nerdy mind and make your soft jelly body, have severe shakes........

OK, look on the bright side, you beat the other half of the Auld Alliance one-zip..enjoy the moment..

Toast a bagel.. Shalom

20

Orwhmale,

Oregon 15/09/2007 16:36:44

American bashing prevails where logic and fact do not exist. Be thankful there is a country as imperfect as the US that carries a big stick - otherwise you fools would be speaking German!
Be thankful you have a free forum to spout your ignorance - I doubt the Iranians will be so generous.
THe bullies in the middle east keep slamming their little neighbor and someday the little guy will have had enough and resolve the conflict handily once and for all.
Islamofacists wallow in hate, barbarism, ignorance and theological lies! Without that they have nothing to ride to market on!

21

Trond,

The cloud to the left. 15/09/2007 17:37:48

#15 Desert rat
As Palestine was not Arab land but Palestinian in 1919 (It was given bu the Arabs to the Zionists, See: Faisal Weizmann agreement). Do you intend to allow Syrian Arabs e.g. Hamas, and Egyptian Arabs e.g. Fatah to return to Syria and Egypt ?

22

Carolyn 1,

you can't get there from here 15/09/2007 17:42:26

In an interview with Newsweek, the Syrian VP declared that until there is peace in the Middle East Syria is in war with Israel. "Israel will pay a price.
It will. And there will always be a price for everything."

Its the Syrian constant declaration: "and always" ..

Since Syria believes Israel his no right to exist, the war will never end.. How long is never?

How does the world expect Israel, as a nation, and its people to survive with a constant threat of annihilation?
Unfortunately, as sharia and radical islam spreads through the world, the world is becoming more and more dangerous, to Israel, and to all mankind whether or not we are pro-Israel.

23

James Donald,

Corstofyn 15/09/2007 17:59:30

#21. Orwhmale, Oregon - "otherwise you fools would be speaking German!" - Not this crap again. The US fights for US interests and always has done, WW2 being no exception. I already speak German, so does that mean the US war effort in WW2 was in vain? Typical skin-crawling Yankee arrogance.....

24

Quiet John,

Tinley Park, IL, USA 15/09/2007 18:20:19

All,
It is not in the US's interest to let Syria or Iran have Nukes. These unstable nations would probably use them, even though it would mean there annihilation.

Any own who wants nuclear weapons needs to understand the deal you make by owning nuclear weapons. You will be politely welcomed to the club, and told you are now programmed into our nuclear target list. The US and the USSR have lived in this world for years. Why any other nation wants to join us in this expensive and insane stand off boggles my mind.

By the way, how about those Russian Bears flying down towards Scotland?

25

Conan the Librarian,

Cimmeria's smallest council estate. 15/09/2007 18:26:38

Hmm.The Grouch..Maria la guapo...under bridges.
Orwhmale,when you carry a big stick...speak softly;)

26

Biker,

Ayr 15/09/2007 19:04:12

I general terms I agree wholeheartedly with Guga. The Isrealis want to be the only state in the Middle east with Nuclear weapons and the US backs they why? For Oil interests. Its true to say that had the US not supported (and continue to) Isreal then the whole map of the middle east would be profoundly different.
Orwthmale. Absolute crap. The US has promoted itsself as the worlds policeman for decade at the other soveriegn states expense, but only where there is gain to be made. I dont see them in a hurry to enter Darfur to protect the people. I dont remember them covering themselves with glory with regard to Rwanda or indeed many of the southern countries bordering the US.
Much of what the US (and UK) involve themselves in is Illeagal at best, and unforgivable.
Aid without Arms.

27

Zyskandar A Jaimot,

orlando, fl. u.s.a. 15/09/2007 19:29:19

Now why would SYRIA a 'dirt-poor' excuse of a nation that can barely feed, clothe, or supply its citizens with with electricity and basic sources of subsistance - want 'NOOKIER' WEAPONS???[have deliberately used JIMMIE'afraid-of-wabbits-i-am'CARTER'S pronounciation/spelling of nuclear!] Maybe this NOOKIER WEAPONS cache was in response to DENNIS'set-the-Cleveland-River-afire-and-wear-a-Turd-on-my-head'KUCINICH rant against U.S. POLICY in the MID-EAST. SYRIA only gets the 'best' most important' diplomats to speak for them. SYRIA WANTS TO BE A 'PLAYAH' AND CAN'T EVEN FEED OR SUPPLY ITS PEOPLE WITH ELECTRICITY OR OIL. BRILLIANT AS YOU UKers SAY. YEAH SYRIA A WORLD 'PLAYAH' WITH A DICTATOR NAMED 'BASHIR' ASSAD - WHY DON'T YOU 'SCOTTS' SEND EM SOME 'HAGGIS' SO THEY COULD ENJOY THEIR NEW STAUS AS WORLD NOOKIER PARVENUES??? Ha!!!

28

Brian,

15/09/2007 19:36:13

WMDs in Iraq = lies

Iran building a nuclear bomb = lies

Syria's secret supplies of nuclear equipment = lies

More Zionist/neocon lies in the push for more war in order to rearrange and control the Middle East. It is all lies and propaganda in the build up to war against so-called rogue states.
And yet there are those, mainly American, who eat this nonsense for breakfast and believe it all with eyes wide open and mouth agape.

Like Zombies in the mall

And in their heads

Sh!t for brains.

29

49th State,

As Stated 15/09/2007 19:38:57

Oil? Is this really merely about oil? The Bush family is done with the white house. Our next leader will most likely not be a neocon, but the war will still go on. Let's not forget that certain elements in the middle East invision a global Muslim commuinty with in the next 175 years. By the way, the USA actually gets most of its oil from Africa these days. Furthermore, Shame on all you limeys, Scots, and French out there who do not have the presence of mind to know your own histories or that of the world; my father fought in Europe in WWII - a war that the English begged and then forced us into by not telling us about the Peril Harbor attack by the Japanese. An attack that killed my grandfather. So all you shameful writers out there who gave your freedom up for socialism and the Euro, try to keep you future out of Muslim hands if you wish to continue to freely have these discussions.

30

Quiet John,

Tinley Park, IL, USA 15/09/2007 19:52:22

#29 Brian,
Do not forget the Germans; they seem to have some nuclear fears also.

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=1480862007

You proudly pronounce that everyone who disagrees with you lacks intelligence and is being deceived by lies. You label them Neocons, Zionists, and unthinking zombies.

Oh my goodness, I can see it all now! Your convincing argument has opened my American eyes. If only we had supported Osama bin Laden, and helped him, he would have never attacked us. We should have given him money, and weapons (like the Stinger missile.) Then he would have loved America.

I have repented and will start voting for my local Socialist Party. Sorry for all the bother.

31

Brian,

15/09/2007 20:08:51

Quiet John

The Americans (the CIA) did give Osama bin Laden money and stingers. He was a CIA agent and probably still is. He and his ilk were very useful when the USA financed them against the Soviets in Afghanistan.

There is no more unstable nation on this earth than the USA, the only nation ever to use nuclear weapons against humanity, and it has nearly 17,000 nukes at the ready. The USA along with the warmonger state of Israel are a serious threat to humanity. And with the US economy heading downward with no return ticket then the world is heading into dangerous territory.

32

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 15/09/2007 20:25:31

#32 Brian

I guess then North Korean having nuclear weapons is also a lie?
Oh wait, no it isnt.

Nor is Irans building of 3,000+ centrifuges good for much beyond a desire to build nuclear weapons.

It seems that if it has a chance of killing Israelis, then you will support it with whatever propganda happens to be at hand.
Unfortunately, the truth never seems to be one of the arrows in your quiver.

33

57Nomad,

california 15/09/2007 20:27:38

#24 JD

JD said:

"The US fights for US interests and always has done, WW2 being no exception."

JD if you will look it up we fought in WWII because the Japanese attacked us without a declaration of war. Then the Germans actually declared war on us.

You may think that the US effort was marginal in defeating the Nazis but Churchill didn't. I think he knew more about it than you do. By the way, skin crawling arrogance is a European invention and you are better at it than anyone or anyone ever will be.

You're a bitter guy. I don't blame you a bit. Loser, number 2 on a good day, has-been, eclipsed, impotent, effeminate, hopeless and fading in the dust. All your rants and bitter vile can't mask the fact that you are toothless old women. So, you can stand back and watch the men get the work done, creep.

34

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 15/09/2007 20:29:39

#19 Guga

So the fact that the Arabs spend well over 6 billion a year in armaments and that is DOUBLE the amount you whine about Israel doesn't matter?
And why not?

Oh, I get it, because if you told the real numbers it would quickly become apparent that the Arabs, who have fought 5 genicidal wars against Israel and each time lost (thus preventing a genocide) are the bullies and Israel must remain strong so as not to suffer a genocide at the hands of ther Arabs you support.

I see your 'logic' now.

35

Scoot Man,

Nashvegas, Tennishoe 15/09/2007 20:36:37

#30.... 49th State

As an embarassed 'Teddy Roosevelt Republican' I've lurked here for a while, and have avoided the temptation to write... but your inability to use grammar or spell correctly, and your apparent lack of any history education whatsoever, are the kind of things that just make it so much harder for anyone to take Americans seriously. FYI:

1. Roosevelt knew, through intercepted Japanese communiques, that Pearl Harbor was going to be bombed and let it happen. Don't blame the Brits.

2. The USA actually gets most of its oil from Mexico and Canada, and then Saudia Arabia.
Africa's not even on the list.

3. And of course the war is about oil, you damned fool... there isn't anything else over there worth fighting for. When's the last time anything got done for 'humanitarian' purposes in the Middle East?

And no, the Bush family, sadly, isn't quite finished with the White House.

Now hurry up and get back to Senator Ted Stevens' house and finish those renovations that your oil exec uncle asked you to do, then finish building that 'bridge to nowhere'. When you're done with that, it's time to hit the books again - and really study this time... no more propaganda for you, young man.

36

Scoot Man,

Nashvegas, Tennishoe 15/09/2007 20:43:10

34. 57Nomad

And gosh, while we're at it, how 'bout a return to civilized discourse? Part of the reason the world's where it's at is 'coz everybody seems to have a pretty thin skin.

Do you really feel better after typing that response? Did #24 feel better reading it?

Did it help the two of you understand each other better?

Could you have handled it better? Discuss.

37

,

15/09/2007 21:03:44
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason: Scotsman Import, Original comment id: 968132, Article id was mapped to record!
38

Conan the Librarian,

Cimmeria's smallest council estate. 15/09/2007 21:13:25

Scoot Man
You seem sensible and or sober.
What is the price of beer in Nashvegas?
I visited Tennishoe once(whisper)I thought it smelled a bit.

39

49th State,

Computer Room In My Own Home Sweet Home 15/09/2007 21:36:22

Beer and reason make poor bed fellows. I just can't believe that so many Westerners in the UK these days. It all reminds me of when PM Chamberlain tried to play footsie with Hilter. His actions nearly brought to ruin London and England in general. Where are all you brave Highlanders these days to protect you? Oh, yes! I think you shipped most of the out during the clearances in the 1740's. Perhaps you should see if you have any left in Ulster or some other plantation in Ireland. Its a good thing so many Highlanders came to the USA because we will help you keep your flag flying if only because we share an ancient blood line. Let freedom ring, baby!

40

Scoot Man,

Nashvegas, Tennishoe 15/09/2007 22:05:15

40. 49th State

Huh? Your post rambles on like you had all of the beer and none of the reason....

If your grandfather died at Pearl Harbor, and your father fought in WWII, and you're not in your 90's, how is it possible that you're reminded of Chamberlain? Stop spouting nonsense, man....
Didn't I tell you to get back to work?!

39. Conan the Librarian

Beer's about $7.50+ US for a 6-pack; I can't get McEwan's or Newcastle for less than $10, sadly.

Tennishoe only smells near the toes.


40. 49th State

Seriously.... stop embarrassing yourself.
Hush now, child!

41

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 15/09/2007 22:46:10

Scots Man

You really should wrap the tin foil tighter around your head - those evil CIA braqinwaves might be getting through.

How else to explain the whacked out conspiracy theory that Roosevelt knew about the attack on Pearl Harbor. No respectable journalist has ever wrtitten such claptrap and no respectable historian has ever even alledged it. But it Must be true because some loudmouth on the internet says so, right?

And I doubt you've ever been to NashVegas. Its a fine town.

42

Quiet John,

Tinley Park, IL, USA 15/09/2007 23:03:54

All,
Not that it matters, but it possible that the US Government had clues to Pearl Harbor. But just like 9/11, we did not put the pieces together until later.

This breach lead to the OSS and then to the CIA. Sometimes we just have to learn the hard way. At least we did not openly court martial anyone after 9/11.

I think we have two world views on display here. I find it very interesting. I am learning how far left Europe seems to be leaning.

43

Silence of the Yams,

15/09/2007 23:23:48

Israel can kiss goodbye to its existence if regimes that are openly bent on its destruction like Syria and Iran arm themselves with nuclear warheads. That is NOT in dispute. And if Hilary Clinton gets in the White House they will have carte blanche to do so.

44

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 15/09/2007 23:57:59

#44 Silence

Again and again it seems that the only form of discourse Republicans are capable of is the Karl Rove pure venom and vitriol.

Hillary is every bit as ardent a supporter of one of the most important US allies as the rest of the candidates. Some better, some worse, but NONE are as bad for the US and its strategic ally as Republican Candidate Ron Paul - the only presidential candidate (and one of only 4 House members) to vote against H.RES.921, condemning the recent attacks against the State of Israel, holding terrorists and their state-sponsors accountable for such attacks, and supporting Israel's right to defend itself.
Republicans have as much, if not more to answer for in that regrd than Democrats do.

45

Conan the Librarian,

Cimmeria's smallest council estate. 16/09/2007 00:02:10

Scoot Man;)
Have you tried Innes & Gunn? Choice beer,brewed in Edinburgh using Whisky casks to mature it :)
Home Sweet Home? gettin mixed up with your posts?
Scoot Man is the voice of reason on this post(he likes beer)
49th State-Beer and reason make poor bedfellows?
Aye I'll give you that.But your point is?

46

Conan the Librarian,

Cimmeria's smallest council estate. 16/09/2007 00:10:51

#44 45
Israel can take care of itself.Nukes can do that to a nation.
We trust Israel not to spread them about willy-nilly
We can't trust Islamic fundamentalist states.
Ergo.Stop Islamic Fundamentist governments getting fissionable materiels.
If only they drank beer...

47

Conan the Librarian,

Cimmeria's smallest council estate. 16/09/2007 00:24:46

Quiet John
Left Leaning?
My commisar wants to know what you are asking.
Obviously if I can't give him an answer he'll shoot me.Please tell me liberated westerner...have you got a gun? My commissar is waiting for his liscence.He obviously can't fire it without it.
Being beaten to death with a .22 pistol is a shame I can't take-So quiet John ANSWER...please

48

57Nomad,

california 16/09/2007 04:24:57

#37 scoots

"Part of the reason the world's where it's at is 'coz everybody seems to have a pretty thin skin.

Do you really feel better after typing that response? Did #24 feel better reading it?

Did it help the two of you understand each other better?

Could you have handled it better? Discuss."

Except for the mama's little helper tone, your question deserves a thoughtful answer. I'm not so sure about the contribution of thin skin to the worlds problems but if you have data you can cite to support that, I'll take a look.

It may seem to you that I was taking a reactionary
and bellicose position. I was not. I was responding to this:

"Not this crap again. The US fights for US interests and always has done, WW2 being no exception. I already speak German, so does that mean the US war effort in WW2 was in vain? Typical skin-crawling Yankee arrogance....."
Perhaps you can locate points of interest to be discussed here.

This is simply a gratuitous insult. If one defends oneself, for instance pointing out any of the myriad instances of American altruism, to rebut the "interests only" argument, and that can serve as a place holder for any perceived American deficits, then you have granted the insulter the right to spit in your face and admitted that you have to explain why you should not get your face spit in. That is a very, very, bad move. Not only that it is the stupidest thing you could do.

Anyone witnessing it will assume that the insulter may have the moral upper hand and is in an undisputed position to hector you. You have to explain to him. You don't ever want to be in that position, ever. Furthermore, the underlying psychological principal of positive reinforcement insures that you will be subject to endless abuse. What seems like the reasonable and mature approach is, in reality, adolescent sentimentality. Grown-ups are expected to reflect on the nature of r

49

Quiet John,

Tinley Park, IL, USA 16/09/2007 05:15:08

To: 48Conan
I certainly hope your commissar does not shoot you (or beat you). That seems a bit harsh. When I say left leaning, I mean people that support things like having the National Health Care System, or outlawing guns. These things seem to be taken for granted in Europe. In the USA they are considered rather far to the left.

As to your direct questions:
-What I am asking? I was not asking, I was stating that US intelligence failures have resulted in a revamp of our intelligence systems over time. Pearl Harbor, Task Force Smith, the fall of the USSR, and 9/11 have been foreseeable, but we missed them.

-“liberated westerner…have you got a gun.” Yes, but are you asking so that you may borrow it to defend yourself from this “commissar”, and free yourself from this apparently abusive relationship? I would hate to think that you are scurrying about looking for a less shameful way for your commissar to execute you?

Now to ask two questions:

-Did you not find the Conan stories racist?
-What license is your commissar waiting for that would allow him to shoot you? That sounds too good to be true?! You can get a Hunting License to stalk communists over there? Maybe I was all wrong about left leaning, and I understand some of the bitterness now.

50

Scoot Man,

Nashvegas, Tennishoe 16/09/2007 05:18:34

42. Home_Sweet_Home

Lighten up with the tin foil, already, and read:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pearl_Harbor_advance-knowled...

There's certainly more evidence there than there is about 9/11, and an independent commission and two FBI field offices say we knew about that beforehand......
And you shouldn't hardly assume I don't live in NashVegas (13+ years now, actually) - what from my posts gives you that idea?

46. Conan the Librarian

Please, for the love of God... if I send you my address, will you send me a keg?


49. 57Nomad

Have to respectfully disagree with you; realizing that these are words, and not projectile saliva, is the first step in providing a response that is rational and not mired in bile. That and the poster's comments are neither rational or civil, but obviously based on a negative opinion of the US and its policy. You don't need to defend the US, and you don't need to be vehement. Our altruism speaks for itself, and when we display it, we generally ask nothing in return. The excesses of the current administration and years of asinine Middle East policy aside, I think most civilized people would agree.

51

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 16/09/2007 06:10:57

#51 Scoot Man

I assume you dont live in Nashvegas because I do (well off Vietnam Vets anyway).
As to the rest, there are ALWAYS conspiracy theories. As the article states, the evidence is mostly circumstantial. So to pretend it was a reality is to be kinda loopy - thus the tin foil hat comment.

As to the beer, you should try Jefferson's Reserve Stout - also aged in bouron barrels. Or did you not know that Scotch is now aged in used American bourbon barrels?

52

Homo Sapiens,

16/09/2007 10:12:07

(2) Guga II - Again your anti-Israeli, anti-jewish and anti-American sentiment coupled with your lack of knowledge is getting the better of you. Your assumption that the Israelis are getting their intelligence from US satelites could be very wrong, the Israelis have their own spy satelites (since the mid 1980's) which have been monitoring the middle east.

In your post at (7) again you show your rather one sided view. The US Military Aid to Israel has been increased from 24 Billion (over the next 10 years) to 30 billion (a net increase of 6 billion over 10 years), and this was done as a balancing act for the 30 billion arms deal with Saudi Arabia... Need I mention that the UK has not demonstrated an equally balanced approach to armament sales, when it entered the multi billion arms sale with Saudi Arabia (allowing its ministers and managers to pocket hefty backhanders)... When it comes to "Bullying" in the middle-east, let's remember that the aggressors have been the arab states, against Israel. The fact that Israel survived and won the wars imposed on it, was seen by the majority of the world, as a miracle. I assume that you would call the UK the bully, and the Germans the poor victims just because the UK was on the winning side in WWII beating the hapless Hitler?

I am sure that if you could prove your assertions that Israel has 150 nuclear weapons, you could become very rich. However, for the time being except for allegations, rumours and smoke screens there is no proof that Israel has Nuclear weapons. Whereas Syrai is known to have Chemical weapons (and maybe hiding the WMD transferred into Syria by Sadam before the US & Allies attacked Iraq.

53

James Donald,

Corstofyn 16/09/2007 13:18:11

#34. 57Nomad, california - "JD if you will look it up we fought in WWII because the Japanese attacked us without a declaration of war. Then the Germans actually declared war on us" - these were the catalysts which enabled Rooseveldt to get in on the act. But then why should I continue with any furthe attempt at rationl debate when he rest of your post is simple insult.
I spent the last week working at a Royal Marine base in North East Scotland where real"men get the work done". You know the Royal Marines, a superb military unit of which the USMC is a (much larger) pale imitation.
Spare us any more bile from your festering twisted mind.

54

James Donald,

Corstofyn 16/09/2007 13:21:27

#37. Scoot Man, Nashvegas, Tennishoe - There just aint no discussin with ol' Norma Nomad...no sir. Ein einfache Scheisskerl.......

55

Scoot Man,

Nashvegas, Tennishoe 16/09/2007 15:04:37

52. Home_Sweet_Home

"I assume you dont live in Nashvegas because I do"

But I do. Between the Titans, the Nashville City Paper, Mayor Purcell's ribbon cutting at the Shelby to Two Rivers bridge, the sh#$%y Green Hills traffic, and Ronnie Steine's bizarre re-election to Metro Council, I'm as Nashville as it gets.

And when it comes to circumstantial evidence, plenty of people have been put to death for less than what we know about Pearl Harbor..... Alright. I'll put on my hat! And then I'll drink a Jefferson's - nice mental picture, eh? ;-)

56

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 16/09/2007 15:24:56

#57 Nomad

Be aware, thats James style. He posts insults that he then turns and pretends he doesnt mean as insults - or leading statements that when you answer he insists he never said.
After all, the US should have just allowed Pearl Harbor to be bombed and done nothing. He says the same thing about Israel being invaded by Hizbollah.
Wonder how he feels about Brittian and the Faulklands?

57

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 16/09/2007 15:28:15

#56
And dont foget your new Mayor Dean (we have our own up here in Sumner).

As to Pearl Harbor, like I said, there is always a conspiracy theory, but most of it seems to be around what 'should have' been known, even according to the article you posted.

Anyway, if you cheer for the Titans (and the Cats) you can skip the hat.
But try the Jeffersons (although its expensive -$10 for a 4 pack - and its 7% beer so its in the liquor stores), I'll bet that's something we can agree on.

58

James Donald,

Corstofyn 16/09/2007 16:28:54

#57. Home_Sweet_Home, Who Cares? - "Be aware, thats James style. He posts insults that he then turns and pretends he doesnt mean as insults - or leading statements that when you answer he insists he never said" - says you - bit like the pot calling the kettle black as you are no stranger to insults and smears yourself both in your current incarnation and as the vitriolic Tikun.
"After all, the US should have just allowed Pearl Harbor to be bombed and done nothing. He says the same thing about Israel being invaded by Hizbollah" - said nothing of the sort; a typical Tikunesque lie.

59

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Care 16/09/2007 17:25:36

Like I said, James says one thing and then denies he said it.

And then he smears anyone who points out his particular style.

Still the same lack of substance. Still the same name calling.

60

James Donald,

Corstofyn 16/09/2007 18:00:48

#60. Home_Sweet_Home, Who Care - only one smear-merchant here and you are it. Still the same high opinion of yourself, which I do not share.

61

Conan,

Here 16/09/2007 18:03:26

James is an independent contractor who has the contract to clean out the toilets at the RM base at Arbroath and the rifle ranges beside Carnoustie. He is another one of these hate-the-US crowd who suffers from some form of persecution syndrome that manifests itself as a complete inability to post without insuylting those who challenge him with facts - he simply cannot deal with facts when they get in the way of his own prejudices and hatreds. He has shown himself to be a dwarf in both stature and intellect. Don't waste you time on this nitwit. The laughable comparason between the miniscule modern day RM and the USMC is evidence of this. The RM, totally lacking in armour, artillery (besides a borroed army unit) and air power, and manned at about 7,000, or so (should be more like 50,000) while grand people and excellent soldiers, simply cannot compare to the USMC which is almost larger than the RN, RN, RAF + British Army, all inclding reserves, combined. The RM 'wannabe' capabilities are unending is you listen to the likes of JD, but THE FACTS - THE REALITY - that he is unable to grasp, or rejects that grasp, is that it is like comparing a scout troop (RM) with an army (British Army), for example. But, don't waste your time on this nitwit, JD, he is far beyond reach .... away in his own little world of make believe.

62

James Donald,

Corstofyn 16/09/2007 18:43:28

#62. Conan, Here - "James is an independent contractor who has the contract to clean out the toilets at the RM base at Arbroath and the rifle ranges beside Carnoustie" - and Conan is jealous as he lost the contract as he did not invest in a brush and had to clean the kludgies by hand.
He is also another pea-brain with an over-inflated opinion of himself. I would invite him to the Sgts Mess of 45 Commando sho he could put forward his theories about the merits of the Royal Marines. However, he is, in all likelyhood, a physical coward who would run a mile (assuming that Yankees can still run a mile) rather than do so. He hurls insults around hiding behind a ficticious name, safe in the knowledge that his annominity is assure on a forum such as this. A contemptible little toad with a Walter Mitty complex.

63

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who cares 16/09/2007 21:19:13

Like I said, James says one thing and then denies he said it.

And then he smears anyone who points out his particular style.

Still the same lack of substance. Still the same name calling.

64

James Donald,

Corstofyn 16/09/2007 22:30:25

#64. Home_Sweet_Home, Who cares - No one needs your particular "style" to be pointed out; it is obvious that you were the same odious Tikun as soon as you started posting as Home_Sweet_Home (lost you login, aye right). I see nothing of substance coming from the Nashville "Trommeler" just propaganda, smear and falsehoods.


 

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