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Scotland not alone in struggle to hit right notes with national anthem

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Published Date: 05 June 2007
DEBATE raged on yesterday over what should be the national anthem for the Scotland football team, with supporters defending O Flower of Scotland after the song was described as a "dirge" by new Scottish Football Association president George Peat.
O Flower of Scotland replaced Scotland The Brave as the team's anthem in the 1990s, which in turn had replaced God Save The Queen. Peat feels that renditions of the song have been an "embarrassment" in recent years - especially abroad, where it is of
ten played too slowly - and says he is open to suggestion for a new anthem.

The obvious alternative is Scotland The Brave, but when it was used in the past few supporters bothered to learn the words even though they liked the tune.

Coincidentally, it emerged yesterday that there is discontent in Spain over the country's national anthem, which dates back to the 18th century and is one of the oldest in the world. It has never had any words.

Spanish competitors hug, hum or gaze mutely at the sky while their national anthem, The Royal March, is played.

Following a suggestion by the Spanish Olympic Committee, the conservative opposition said yesterday it would present a bill calling for a committee to provide lyrics in three months.

The process of change is unlikely to take place so quickly in Scotland, but Peat's remarks have re-opened an issue that has never been settled to satisfaction.

The Scotsman asked two former Scotland players for their views on the merits and flaws of O Flower of Scotland.

PLAY-LIST CONTENDERS


O Flower of Scotland

The fans' favourite, although can be a dirge. Too easy to sabotage by playing at half-pace. On second thoughts, maybe that's appropriate.

Scotland the Brave

Great tune, and has international appeal. But a bit like our command of foreign languages, learning the words seems to be beyond us.

God Save the Queen

Bubbling under with 'Itsy Bitsy Teenie Weenie Yellow Polka Dot Bikini'.

Caledonia

Nice song, but range is too challenging. Try singing it in the shower, and run the risk of an ASBO.

Highland Cathedral

Rousing tune, but as a song this one should be filed under 'dirge'.

Scots Wha Hae

Words by Burns. Blood, battles, slavery, traitors, graves, swords and chains. Modern Scotland in a nutshell.

Doe A Deer

The only song that the Tartan Army scores full marks for knowing the lyrics and the tempo. Apart from the one about Jimmy Hill.

PROS

Scott Booth
19 Scotland caps
(1993 to 2002)

"EVERY time I hear O Flower of Scotland, it reminds me of my international career. For me, it was a really special time when it was played before a game, looking around the stadium and seeing the Tartan Army singing it and waving their flags. I only have positive feelings about the song and I honestly can't remember any of my team-mates having anything negative to say about it.

"I can understand what George Peat says to a certain extent, because there are times when not everyone seems to be in tune or together when it is being sung. Some people say it is slow, even a bit of a dirge, but I do feel it is a very inspirational song and I can't see any obvious alternative to it. In any case, we can't keep chopping and changing our anthem all the time.

"I believe the vast majority of Scotland supporters love O Flower of Scotland and are very passionate about it. Maybe people from an older generation would prefer to go back to Scotland The Brave, or try something else, but as a former Scotland player and now a Scotland fan, I'm very much in favour of sticking with O Flower of Scotland."

CONS

Pat Nevin
28 Scotland caps
(1986 to 1996)

"I CAN understand the argument George Peat is putting forward and I'm not against the suggestion that we should look into alternatives to O Flower of Scotland as an anthem for the national team.

"There are times, especially in away matches, when it is anything but rousing and can sound fairly grim.

"When it is sung at the right tempo at Hampden, though, it can certainly be really inspirational and add to the sense of occasion. The Scottish rugby supporters seem to be much better at singing it than the Tartan Army, but having said that, it has improved a lot in recent years.

"I've got nothing against O Flower of Scotland as a song as such, although it is certainly not up there with Sunshine on Leith as a football anthem.

"But what is the alternative to it? Until someone can come up with one, I don't really see it changing and I don't believe you will find a really strong body of opinion against it."



Page 1 of 1

 
1

Hobo Harry,

Hobo Harry 05/06/2007 03:00:04

I'm with wee Pat Nevin. Sunshine on Leith for the National Anthem

Arf arf arf

2

Jean's Boy,

USA 05/06/2007 05:30:27

As long as we're throwing Proclaimer's songs against the wall, how 'bout "Scotland's Story"? It you want a real rouser, you can't beat "Will Ye No Come Back Again?" by the Real McKenzies.

3

Martlore,

05/06/2007 06:46:37

Instead of tinkering with an anthem that the vast majority of fans love, it might be more important for George Peat to worry about why Scotland hasn't qualified for a major tournament in 10 years, no?

George, I know this won't make the headlines and raise your profile but maybe your time would be better spent sorting out funding for some all-weather facilities, dealing with the lack of an effective academy structure and the lack of top class coaching at youth level...just a thought.

4

Boris,

05/06/2007 07:02:20

And maybe a tiny look at league structure as well.

5

Fleemie,

Germany 05/06/2007 07:30:47

My complaint against "Flower" is directed against its parochial, warlike nature. Beating the English is hardly the highest good that Scotland can aspire to.

My two candidates would be either Burn's "A Man's a Man" or Hamish Henderson's "Freedom Come All Ye" They are both rooted in the Scottish tradition and they espouse universal values of Liberty, Equality, Fraternity that are worthy of our nation.

6

Gerry M,

05/06/2007 07:49:09

It is ironic that many of the supporters of the current dirge about banishing evil opressors from the land castigate Celtic supporters for singing "terrorist" songs.

7

Stu,

05/06/2007 08:00:01

I think 500 miles would be brilliant

Would get the entire stadium jumping and would psyche up the players

8

BorderGuy,

05/06/2007 08:30:33

As far as anthems go, it's not the song, it's how you sing it!

9

Plooble,

Arbroath 05/06/2007 08:42:07

#10- 'Advance, Australia Fair' is the anthem of Aus. They don't seem to like it, the Aussies at work tell me, it contains some line about '...our land girt by sea...' which they cannae quite get their heeds roond. I think they'd prefer 'Waltzing Matilda' for themsels.

10

Star o' Rabbie Burns,

Ayrshire 05/06/2007 08:57:50

The Irish rugby team - the only united Ireland squad had a bit of a problem, you couldn't expect the Ulster protestant players to sing the Soldier's Song, while God Save the Queen was a no-no for the Catholics from elsewhere, so they came up with Ireland's Call, a great tune by the way.

More than half of the regular Scottish football fans support one or other half of the Axis of Evil - so we come up with a song both halves can sing: something like: "The sash my soldier father wore while guarding the walls around the fields of Athenry."

There we are - sorted.

11

Mike Hocksaw,

05/06/2007 08:59:28

What about something relevant, something that describes the Scotlands NAtional teams history and what it is now.

What about Owen Pauls'

"Your my favourite waste of time."

Scotland are the only team in Britain (after 8 attempts) not to get past the first round of any major competition. Why do we bother?

12

Phil MaGlass,

05/06/2007 09:11:45

FoS for me all they have to do is to quicken the song a wee bit,

13

Grimsby Hibee,

Cleethorpes 05/06/2007 09:16:56

# 8 Got to agree, that is an inspiring song at any time.

14

Ross,

05/06/2007 09:17:01

Loch Lomond

15

Kevin Lomax,

Reachin' for the Stars 05/06/2007 09:23:24

I like Flowe of Scotland too, but as an alternative I would suggest Half Man Half Biscuit's classic ...

All I Want For Christmas Is A Dukla Prague Away Kit

... which might well describe the childhood of Tartan Army supporters of a certain age, in a tale of malfunctioning Scalextric and games of Subbuteo.

"Come to half-time you were losing four-nil,
Each and every goal a hotly disputed penalty."

Ah, happy days!

16

Kevin Lomax,

Reachin' for the Stars 05/06/2007 09:24:00

Flowe of Scotland is the lesser known rave version of Flower of Scotland btw.

17

Neil_Mac,

half way down the M6 05/06/2007 09:24:57

'My complaint against "Flower" is directed against its parochial, warlike nature.'

Utter nonsense. The song's lyrics are about encouraging Scots to show the same commitment and courage as Bruce's troops, who defeated a larger army to gain the country's independence. It's an exhortation to the nation to rise to the standards set by those men, not a piece of anti-English polemic

18

Rab Jones,

05/06/2007 09:37:51

I fear for Scotland on Wednesday.

I think, the Faroes will nick a draw.

Even if we finish third, we still may have to play Denmark, Turkey, Spain, Russia, Holland, Czech Republic etc to get past the double legged play offs.

I'm just not confident, it was a great start though.

19

hendybhoy,

2 in a row. 05/06/2007 09:38:24

14. Too Funny, had me in stitches!!.

20. Couldn't Agree More

20

hendybhoy,

2 in a row. 05/06/2007 09:39:34

21. as far as i'm aware Rab there is no playoffs just the top 2, there is 7 Groups and 2 hosts that are through. so i believe its 14 directly qualify plus austria and switzerland

21

Rab Jones,

05/06/2007 09:46:58

#23

Then in that case Hendy bhoy, my fears have increasd somewhat.

I can't really see past Italy and France.

22

Grimsby Hibee,

Cleethorpes 05/06/2007 09:59:03

# 23 Yeah spot on if you dont finish top 2 your out! Its a really tough ask for us.

23

hendybhoy,

2 in a row. 05/06/2007 10:27:32

it is a tough ask, but we are still in control of our fate, which can only be good for us, fingers crossed we can pull of a major shock ireland did it when holland and portugal were in their group, why cant we :)

24

Ewebasher,

Edinburgh 05/06/2007 10:31:40

Let's face it the aim at the beginning of qualifying wa to improve our ranking and move up the seedings - the fact that we're still in with a shout is brilliant.

25

Calum Crubag,

05/06/2007 11:07:44

Leave FoS alone. It's got a great tune, the fans like it, it remembers the past while looking forward ("in the past they must remain..").

26

Calum Crubag,

05/06/2007 11:10:15

#7 - So FoS is a 'terrorist song'???!! IRA songs have their place in Irish history but none at Scottish league games. A national anthem, albeit an unofficial one, is what you'd expect at a national game.

27

ColR,

London 05/06/2007 14:32:07

Should be Hoots Mon by Lord Rockinghams XI. We need a tune we can dance to.

28

hendybhoy,

2 in a row. 05/06/2007 14:35:10

the archers!!!

29

Steve McGregor,

Dundee 05/06/2007 15:38:40

Why not sing God save the Queen of England and rebellious scots to crush? As long as we are still a part of England, then God save the Queen is the legitimate national anthem for scotland

30

dundee8cologne1,

dundonia 05/06/2007 16:07:25

#20 - its about context. The song may be about the inspring site of the small over coming the mighty but the 'context' it is sung in is purely anti-English.

Personally I switch off the TV when it comes on along with God Save the Queen. I cant stomach either. The Welsh, French and the old Soviet anthems - now thats what you call anthems.

31

Jozi Tim,

Johannesburg 05/06/2007 16:17:13

You lot should be grateful, here in South Africa they went and merged 'Nkosi sikelele Afrika' (God bless Africa) with the old South African anthem 'Die Stem van Suid Afrika' (The voice of South Africa).

Nkosi is a superb anthem in every respect, right up with the Welsh, French or German anthems, while Die Stem is also pretty good too, if a little stiff.

But instead we now have anthems by committee, with a collage version in four languages.

And when the crowd is mostly white (rugby), guess which one they sing and which one they ignore? Vice versa when the crowd is mostly black (football).

If it was up to me I'd have ditched the apartheid relic and just sing Nkosi.

32

Jozi Tim,

Johannesburg 05/06/2007 16:22:00

FoS's biggest fault is that it wasn't written as an anthem, ie an anthem should be fairly short with a climax towards the end. Think 'Gwlad, gwlad' in the Welsh anthem and 'Marchons, marchons' in the French, as focal points in both. FoS has no such equivalent.

Not that it's a bad tune or anything.


 

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