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MSPs hit back amid doubt over fairness of election

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Published Date: 19 May 2008
MSPs who won marginal victories in the 2007 Holyrood elections yesterday defended their right to sit in the parliament after the man who led the inquiry into the voting fiasco questioned the validity of poll results.
Ron Gould, the Canadian specialist who carried out an investigation into the election, said he "was not comfortable" that all 129 MSPs in Holyrood received more votes than their opponents.

Question marks were raised about whether they should be in
the Scottish Parliament following publication of the Commons Scottish affairs committee into the election fiasco where more than 150,000 votes were ruled invalid.

The narrowest result was in Cunninghame North where Nationalist Kenny Gibson saw off former Labour minister Allan Wilson by just 48 votes.

Mr Wilson was denied a recount even though there were 1,015 spoilt papers. But Mr Gibson was dismissive of the idea that maybe he should not be there.

"Unless Ron Gould or the House of Commons committee can read the minds of those voters who spoilt their ballots, these comments sound like unhelpful sour grapes," he said.

His SNP colleague Kenny MacAskill took Edinburgh East from Labour with a majority of 1,382, but there were 2,521 spoilt papers. "To think that we shouldn't be there is to assume all the spoilt papers would have gone one way," he said.

Liberal Democrat Jim Tolson took Dunfermline West by 476 with 757 spoilt papers. He said: "I am entirely confident about the result in my constituency, not least because of the massive swing which my colleague Jim Rennie got in the preceding general election."

Labour's Lewis Macdonald kept hold of his Aberdeen central seat by 682. On the night, SNP leader Alex Salmond forced a recount.

"The two results were almost identical and looking at where the spoilt papers came from, they were evenly split, so I feel completely comfortable with my victory," said Mr Macdonald.

The report has also sparked controversy because MPs have concluded that the Scottish Office, which was blamed for the fiasco, should keep control of the elections. MSPs have asked for administrative control to be devolved to Holyrood.

BACKGROUND

THE high number of spoiled papers meant there were question marks over many results. A dozen seats had majorities of fewer than 1,000 – eight SNP wins and two each for Labour and the Lib Dems.

The most marginal was Cunninghame North won by Nationalist Kenny Gibson from Labour minister Allan Wilson by a mere 48 votes.

In Aberdeen North, Labour's Lewis Macdonald held off the SNP challenge by 682 votes after a recount.

Some of the most controversial were Lib Dem Jim Tolson's win by 476 in West Dunfermline where there were 757 spoiled ballot papers; Labour's Mary Mulligan in Linlithgow by 1,150 with 1,722 spoiled papers; Nationalist Angela Constance in Livingston by 870 with 1,634 spoiled papers; and SNP justice secretary Kenny MacAskill in Edinburgh East by 1,382 with 2,521 spoiled papers.



Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 19 May 2008 10:57 AM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Holyrood Elections
 
1

Soosider,

Glasgow 19/05/2008 00:39:00
So in essence what they are saying is that Labour voters were more likely to have a spoiled ballot paper than voters for any other party? Do they have any evidence for this? Are they suggesting that Labour voters are more prone to making mistakes?
If Westminster is genuinely concerned as to the results of the Holyrood election, then surely they should have called it null and void and re run the election. Why not do that now?
It seems as if it is firstly about shifting responsibility awy from where the Gould report said it belonged. Read the full report here
http://tiny.cc/kibZY then make up your mind.
Secondly it is a reflection of MPs views on the Holyrood Parliament
This whole article is based on the comments of Mr Sarwar stating he was shocked when Mr Gould stated he was not comfortable with some of the results. Of course this is not recorded in the minutes of the Committee meeting and of course it is not published vie TV, so basically we have Mr Sarwars word for it, examine Mr Sarwars record and then decide how much credit to put on his opinion.
2

Wee Beardie,

Edinburgh 19/05/2008 01:33:50
Scotland on Sunday's front-page headline stated categorically that some SMPs had no right to be in the Scottish Parliament. No quotes. No qualification.

This is a further example of how low the editorial standards at Scotsman Publications have fallen, for there is no way of SPL or anyone else knowing this. Even one of his Napier students could have pointed out the appalling breach of journalistic ethics to the editor.

The figures released after the election debacle last year have not changed, so what is the point of running such a story now? Was there nothing more important happening anywhere in the world on Saturday?

Let's hope SPL's new major shareholder will conduct an editorial clearout and hire some real journalists. If he doubts the need for this let him look back at some Scotsman cuttings from the last year.

I particularly commend to him the story run at the time of Alex Salmond's visit to the States, which unfavourably contrasted his £10 million wave-energy prize supported by the National Geographic with the ludicrous suggestion by publicist Max Clifford that Salmond should have instead recruited Simon Cowell in a kilt to promote Scotland. The story failed to mention that Cowell was a client of Clifford.

Says it all.

3

Snuffy Ivy,

Aberdeen 19/05/2008 04:37:45
Ron Gould's opinion is just that: An Opinion.
....and opinions are not the same as facts.

What business does a foreigner have in spouting his opinion anyway? Gould is Canadian for goodness sake!
4

RandomWaffle,

Edinburgh 19/05/2008 06:56:58
According to the Ballot Box results produced by the Scotland Office, Kenny MacAskill won or was less than 6 votes away from winning every Polling Station in his constituency.

Hardly evidence that he shouldn't have won.

And there was a re-adjudication of the ballots in Cunninghame North - What there wasn't was a rescan of the ballots which would have been a pointless exercise and something which many Returning Officers had been ruled out as a possibility before the counts even started.

And if there was a by election in either constituency tomorrow the SNP would romp home.
5

john z,

edinburgh 19/05/2008 07:39:03
Is it actually true, that if the English Parliament don't like the result of a Scottish Government election, they can declare it null and void?

That's a bit like the French Government deciding the Westminster elections are unsafe and declaring them null and void.

Of course, never forget, the London parliament has the power to close the Scottish parliament tomorrow if it likes - something which sounds awfully like colonialism if you ask me. To date, the Scottish Government are doing a far better job of running Scotland, than Broon is doing running Engerland.
6

Ubi,

Edinburgh 19/05/2008 07:48:36
Two points spring to mind. If Holyrood is not thought competent to organise an election, should it be organising anything at all?

And the irony that Labour graft in attempting to rig the ballot may actually have cost it victory (and possibly changed the course of politics in Scotland) is simply too delicious for any words.
7

Auld Twa,

Edinburgh 19/05/2008 07:57:05
Did the Gould Commission examine the spoiled papers ?
Unless they did his comments are out of context and not worth repeating, unless you are intent on downing the Scottish Parliament.
8

Grahamski,

Falkirk 19/05/2008 09:04:24
The bottom line here is that we have a first minister who is not legitimate. But we knew that anyway. In Florida we had the hanging chads here we have a bunch of numpties running our country because another bunch of numpties couldn't organise an election.
The next time you see wee Eck preening and strutting just remember that he is there only through a seies of errors. Think George Bush and think about our devalued democracy.
9

Grahamski,

Falkirk 19/05/2008 09:05:57
7
England doesn't have a parliament. Did you think it did?
10

welcoming,

19/05/2008 09:41:33
Soosider (2) said "Are they suggesting that Labour voters are more prone to making mistakes?"

Is that not the definition of being a Labour voter? - That they are making a mistake?

With the collapse of the Labour vote, the definition is progressively less true!
11

frank mcbride,

lusitania 19/05/2008 09:45:41
#10, Grahamski.

Think George Bush.

I did, Grahamski, and do you know the vision it conjured up? Blair, Brown, Howard, Aznar, Cheney, Haliburton, 1 000 000 innocent, dead Iraqis, 4 000 dead allied service personnel, untold maimed and injured, all in the name of Democracy.

I also remember Alex Salmond speaking out forcibly against all the horrors I experienced in my vision.

Grahamski, would you really prefer a NuLab government in Scotland? If so, would you care to explain your rational?
12

brownlie,

19/05/2008 09:55:48
10 Graham

Quite right - Alex Salmond is the First Minister because of a series of errors.

The major error being us unionists taking the Scottish electorate for granted. The errors were compounded by our lack in interest in the interests of the Scottish people when we had the opportunity as a Lab/Lib cabal for eight years.

Add to that the negativity portrayed by all opposition parties since the election and you can work out why the SNP are in power and apparently getting more popular the longer they are in power.
13

Alan B,

19/05/2008 10:01:13
labour ran the election

labour tried to fix the election.

no-one (ie Douglas Alexander) is sacked or resigns becuase of the mess labour made of the election

And now labour refuse to hand over responsibility of the elections to the scottish parliament so that it can fix future elections.

The u get labour muppets like Grahamski blaming the snp.

labour supporters and brains do not seem to mix.
14

Foulkes Off the CyberNat,

Edinburgh 19/05/2008 10:11:17
1

Yep I agree lets have another election but let the Scottish government run it as it should.

10

Do you agree then we need another election soonest??
15

Nikostratos,

19/05/2008 11:19:18
We neen Another election asap to rectify this mishap which allowed a 'chimera' party a toehold in Holyrood.

But to be fair no person who was elected in the last ballot should be allowed to stand the next time around.
That way the augean stable of holyrood can be cleansed of all the bad blood currently swirling around the Scottish parliament.
16

David MacVicar,

web 19/05/2008 11:44:11
17 thikostratos
"But to be fair no person who was elected in the last ballot should be allowed to stand the next time around."

Thankfully you are not making the decisions.
17

The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

19/05/2008 11:48:23
#15 Whilist the governing party has to take the majority of the blame for any electoral cock-up one should not let off the other major political parties too lightly either. As far as I am aware only the Scottish Senior Citizens Unity Party opposed the changes to the ballot paper.
18

Jimmy the Pie,

19/05/2008 12:10:32
Yes - lets have an election now!

Not run by the imbecile Alexander!

Not using the imbecile Kinnock's electric counting machine!

And lets have it run with simplicity and clarity.

Alex will romp to an outright majority and New Labour Sleaze and Corruption will go the way of the Whigs.
19

Arfur,

19/05/2008 12:16:34
Labour ran the election.......FACT
Labour tried to fix the election........FACT

The Scottish goverment should not take the flack for the now every day incompetence of Labour.

P.S Labour would never call for another election as they know that they would lose more seats than they have now.

P.P.S If there was a manual count of the spoilt papers I would expect SNP to actually gain seats. Remember the one that was contested and re-counted swung from a Labour seat to an SNP seat.
20

Miss H,

19/05/2008 13:34:30
2 Actually the Scottish Office has published results by polling district including cross referencing votes for parties/candidates. So you can see that Labour voters were most likely to get the voting process wrong. However you can't assume that every spoilt paper would have been a Labour vote - people do split their votes. In any case it is too late to do anything about it and I don't think the electorate would stand for another election when we have a euro election and a Westminster election coming up.

The whole fiasco is a classic case of Labour being hoist by their own petard and they have no-one to blame but themselves. It would be funny were it not for the fact that so many peoples votes were not counted. Heads should roll over that but I doubt they will.
21

Roger Reckless,

19/05/2008 13:51:15
A vote for the SNP is by definition a spoiled ballot. Am I right, or will Grant Thornton's prediction that an independent Scotland would have an annual surplus of £4.4 billion hold true once the Nats’s precious oil runs out!
22

Suomi,

Salo,Finland 19/05/2008 14:05:56
I have often wondered whether the election chaos cost the SNP a much greater victory than they got.The opinion polls at the time certainly suggest this possibility.However, none of us have a clue about how the poll chaos influenced the result.

It is interesting that the media ignore soething that we do know.The nationalist vote in Cunninghame North was split.This gave the Labour candidate,Allan Wilson quite an advantage.An independent nationalist candidate called Martin Campbell obtained 4,423 votes.He had stood previously in the constituency as an SNP candidate and was a region al list MSP.This gave him 4 years to establish a high profile and support in North Cunninghame.If Allan Wilson cannot win when the nationalist vote is split,then he has a hard task next time,when there is likely to be only one nationalist candidate.Under the circumstances,in a previously safe Labour seat,the SNP did extremely well to win that constituency with any sort of majority.Current opinion polls indicate that the SNP should consolidate their hold on that constituency.
23

Navvy,

19/05/2008 14:28:57
Absolutely nothing wrong with the election except that a larger than usual number of illiterates disenfranchised themselves. If a 90 year old can get it right...... I rest my case

I hope that this Canadian paid for the study and that I did nto
24

Alan B,

19/05/2008 14:43:47
#The Federalist

If the responsibility is with the scottish office to run this election then as far as i am concerned they are responsible not the scottish parliament. If we devolved these powers then the scottish parliament would be responsbilbe. I do not believe in trying to spread the blame but believe the buck stops with those running the election.

It is also important to say what the main problems were and then u can apportion blame.

I do not have any problem with local council and the sp elections being on the same day. To me the problems were.

1)failure to get out postal ballots on time. (there is simply no way u can blame anyone but the scottish office for this). It is also not the first time.

i suffered this before at a eu election. i was down in london. the postal ballot had not arrived on the night prior to the election so jumped on the train walked into the place u vote back home but still could not vote as u are not allowed to if registered for a postal vote even if u do not receive the postal vote.

2) failure of electronic counting: again there is no-one u can blame but the scottish office.

3)failure to educate the electrate about how to vote: there was simply no public information i have seen about how u were meant to vote in that election.

i have seen discussions on these forums about what is allowed and what was not. i still am not sure.
ie if u vote in the regional ballot on the left but not in the constituent ballot on the right hand side is that ok.

some people have said that is not as u have to have a voted on the constituent ballot but u do not necessarily have to vote on the regional.

Test running a sample of people to see if they can fill the ballot paper correctly and then alteriing accordingly.

As such this failure is also attributable to the scottish office.

4)the other problem with the ballot was that the regional ballot used to be on a separate paper. This time the regional ballot, which most would
25

Alan B,

19/05/2008 14:44:04
cont..

4)the other problem with the ballot was that the regional ballot used to be on a separate paper. This time the regional ballot, which most would see as the secondary ballot was placed on the left hand side to make it more prominent. This was done by labour to encourage people that may give their 2nd vote to the greens or ssp to vote labour. The greens and the ssp encouraged this behaviour from labour by only standing in the 2nd ballot (regional) as standing for both split their vote. Yes the other 3 big parties could have tried to kick up a stink but accepted it.

But at the end of the day this point (pt 4) really had little to do with spoilt ballot papers.
26

Neil Waugh,

OLd Strathcona 19/05/2008 14:49:15
Who the (bleep)is Ron Gould? I've been covering Canucklehead politics for 30 years and I've never heard of this clown.
But in Limeyland he instantly becomes a "Canadian specialist."
And he's "not comfortable."
Poor baby.
I smell a big Brown rat here. And an eastern Liberal trying to make mischief in somebody else's country.
27

morris,

edinburgh 19/05/2008 14:50:20
24
The oil would run out irrespective of whether we were independent, or still part of the United Kingdom.The difference to date would be that Scotland would have retained her pro rata taxes, plus 160 billion oil revenues(or around that figure,the accuracy is irrelevant since the principle is sound)in an economy of a 5 million population.In the UK economy of 60 miilion clearly it is a much less effective injection.I believe that the ratio is around 12.1 but again its approximation.

The point is under the Barnet formula where expenditure in Scotland was calculated as 10p in every pound went to Scotland,it follows that even being generous and assuming Scotland got her "fair share", this would clearly only be 1.6 billion where an independent Scotland would have retained 16 billion!Im not making this up.The governments own figures verify this.Arithmetically I cannot see where this can be disputed?Its a fact of history.

A crude but simple comparison is buy a cake,divide it bewteen the neighbours in your street.How much cake would you have eaten if you had kept quiet and only given it to your own family? Its simple enough to understand!
28

morris,

edinburgh 19/05/2008 15:01:15
27

I agree mostly with what you say.
Whilst I do think Douglas Alexander made a complete mess of what could and should have been straightforward,their is a certain poetical justice here.If they are disenfranchising themselves it can only be for two reasons,one of which is they dont know what they are doing. Should we consider the inclusion of people who cannot understand simple instructions to be an extension of democracy? Im sure both those in favour and against could mount a serious argument here.

Of course they could be deliberately spoiling their papers but I think we clutch at straws there .
Scotland may have achieved a first here. DONT KNOWS can record their views (or rather lack of them) in the ballot box!
29

Roger Reckless,

19/05/2008 15:08:08
#31 morris: what you can’t seem to grasp is that “Scots just aren’t like that!” The vast majority are more than happy to buy a cake and divide it amongst the neighbours in their street. This is why you Nats are on a hiding to nothing in the long run.
30

morris,

edinburgh 19/05/2008 15:28:58
33

What you can't "grasp" is we were told Scotland would be bankrupt.
NOT TRUE.
The McCRone report was suppressed.The opposite is in fact true.
We were told the oil does not belong to Scotland,it belongs to multinational oil companies.
WE were deliberately misled here.
What was being discussed and what should gave been discussed were NOT the same! Governments retain oil revenues and they would accrue to an independent Scotland in exactly the same way as they accrue to an independent United Kingdom.
I grasped this forty years ago! The oil lies in the Scottish sector of the North Sea (and yes the Scottish sector does exist currently, and would have to exist anyway under independence).

Had we been told the truth about Scotlands economy instead of being conned by the three Westminster parties,its inconceivable that Scotland would not have opted for independence.Even Labour voters are not that stupid !I agree that we should get on with our neighbours and agree that a common defence policy is desireable on our islands, but the notion that government can only be at Westminster is the thinking of an escaped lunatic .It can be anywhere,and any size of nation can proper economically. Europes oldest identity/ nation Luxembourg is a classic example. One of the highest standards of living whilst one of the smallest economies.Proof beyond possibility that this is correct.Norway is an example of where Scotland would have been. Even Ireland fared better and has overtaken the UK in standard of living.She has nowhere near the resources Scotland has,but she has a governmnet who look after her peoples interests.We have a government who think LONDON is the centre of the Universe.I should point out that in the last forty years over 1 million scots have changed their minds about the UK. Im in the ascendancy,and I understand perfectly what is happening. You dont like it is what you mean !
31

morris,

edinburgh 19/05/2008 15:39:13
36

This is a real problem Spook.

Brown and darling have borrowed money and it needs to be repaid. Westminster cannot afford for Scotland to leave ! The goose that lays the Golden Egg is what we are,and God only knows what those two are preepared to do to protect their own skins.At least Alastair Darling is from London, and his support of the UK is easier to understand .Maggie Broon is supposed to be a Scot!More incredible is they were elected by people who claim to be socialists.
They are socialist in the same way as Ron Brown was a follower of Marx. Unfortunately in Rons case it was Groucho Marx.
32

Calum Crubag,

Dùn Eideann 19/05/2008 15:49:57
Westminster organised this mess. London Labour has to carry the can.
33

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 19/05/2008 15:59:54
#2 soosider said:

"Are they suggesting that Labour voters are more prone to making mistakes?"

Voting for Labour IS a mistake, by definition!
34

,

19/05/2008 16:09:15
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Reason:
35

The Master,

19/05/2008 16:38:07
#44 Spook writes: indeed the Tories are sweeping ahead from Labour, well that has to be good coz the UK as a whole needs a breath of fresh air.

Interesting that you don’t seem to share the hostility of most Scots towards the Tories. But there again, you’re too young to remember the unpopularity of Thatcherism in Scotland. I’m firmly of the opinion that the Tories will win Crewe, just as the Nats would win my native Edinburgh Central if there were to be an SP by-election. What interests me about your preferring Cameron to Brown is that it indicates that the surge of support for separation which Salmond is banking on if the Tories return to power may never happen. Indeed, our mutual friend AM2 recently produced poll evidence to the effect that a Tory government would only persuade about 15% to reconsider their attitude towards the SNP’s separation agenda (if anyone wants more details about this, ask him not me!)

Sorry, but I’m in my Merchant City pad tonight and shall not be returning to Edinburgh until Friday night.
36

The Master,

19/05/2008 17:03:00
#46 Spook writes: But Gordon Broon is thatcher in disguise, surly even you can see up his kilt ?

Are you really implying that the man who introduced innovations such tax credits and the minimum wage has all the concern for social justice of a Tory? What about the increasing numbers who have fallen into the higher rate tax bracket since he took power and the erosion in the value of the IHT allowance? I could go on.

I’ve plenty Stellas in the fridge and a good supply of quality wine and you and that DVD you mention would be more than welcome.
37

Alan B,

19/05/2008 17:04:17
#45

I do not think salmond is relying on anti tory feeling per se to win a referendum, although it could help at the margins.

It is more that a tory government will change the whole dynamics. For a start brown a scot will no longer be pm. Salmond has come to power at a time when scotland have unusually had a high representation in the westmisnter government. This will change.

A referendum where Cameron is pm, and say Milliband is labour leader will find it difficult to mount and lead campaigns against independence. That will really end up being left to the leaders of these parties at holyrood.

Therefore it will be Salmond taking on goldie (assuming she is still there) and Wendy. As wendy probably will not be there if the snp does well at the general election then who would labour have. The quality for labour is dreadful.

Labour will also be in a difficult situation. They will have to argue that a possible 3 terms of carmeron is good for scotland. (Labour in scotland were excellent at negative campaigning against the tories. slating tory policies they had not qualms about introducing themselves.) It will be very difficult for them to advocate the tories as being better for scotland than the snp.

After the election labour who are already in a mess financially will then have to raise cash to fight a referendum. Will milliband really pour more millions on top of probable record debts, to fight a scottish referendum.

There is also the issue that calman could be a damp squib. Then the lib dems will not be too happy. Calman could easily split the unionist camp.

Add to this. What if the tories as seems likely start to address the west lothian question by stopping scottish mps voting on what they consider english issues at westmisnter. This itself will be very difficult without fiscal autonomy.

How will labour and the lib dems argue that. They are on record as saying it would not be fair. Now they would have to say, yes it is not fair and the tori
38

Alan B,

19/05/2008 17:07:59
cont..

How will labour and the lib dems argue that. They are on record as saying it would not be fair. Now they would have to say, yes it is not fair and the tories are betraying scotland (in their view) but still vote for the union.

Add to that with oil prices at such a high level, if this is maintained the snp will be talking about record surpluses and remove the dream up a deficit that labour would try to portray.

There are alos other possibilities. Cameron could try to offer Salmond a deal to put off the referendum. Say offer fiscal autonomy. David davis supports this already and it would help the tories if they could remove barnett.

so their are many dynamics that could shift in the snp favour.



39

Miss H,

19/05/2008 17:36:35
28 Point 3) is a really serious point. There is absolutely no reason why an elector should not have left one side of the ballot paper blank. If they only wanted to vote for the regional list but not the constituency – or vice versa – then that should have been fine. That’s a perfectly valid paper. But I have heard of papers where one side was left blank being discounted which is extremely worrying. Whatever happens I hope that there will be a single Returning Officer appointed and that the administration of future elections is wholly devolved. Obviously we want the whole thing devolved but at the very least the administration must be transferred and there should be uniformity in the rules applied and the way in which the rules are applied.

40

The Master,

19/05/2008 17:42:51
#49 & 50 Alan B writes: Salmond has come to power at a time when scotland have unusually had a high representation in the westmisnter government. This will change.

Fair point, but you overlook the fact that the balance has been redressed to some extent because of the presence of a fair contingent of Tory MSPs in the parliament as a result of the pr electoral system. Most will recognise that the Tories only lack a similarly sized representation at Westminster as a result of the first past the post electoral system, and the Lib Dems may well demand that PR be introduced for Westminster as part of any coalition deal, thus changing the whole dynamic of Scottish politics yet again.

I accept the legitimacy of your other points, but wonder if you are giving them more weight than they deserve.

#51 Spook: I agree with much of your post but, without spending time googling this, do recall that the minimum wage was a Labour election pledge before 1997 and that it was opposed by the Tories at the time. Never buy wine in that Roseburn SPAR shop, by the way: there is an excellent independent off licence on the same side of the street: indeed, it’s so good that it actually caused a downmarket Haddows, which had been on the other side of the street for many years, to close: that’s the class of Murrayfield for you! Btw, the reason I’m not taking issue with your post is that, like the vast majority of Murrayfield, I vote Tory myself! Glad we’ve found some common ground at last.
41

Jimbo2,

19/05/2008 18:59:15
Alan B,19/05/2008 17:07:59

"Add to that with oil prices at such a high level, if this is maintained the snp will be talking about record surpluses and remove the dream up a deficit that labour would try to portray."

Good posts Alan.

Meanwhile, Norway's Oil Fund is on the rise. The value of the fund, officially called Norway's Government Pension Fund -- Global now stands at 396.5 billion dollars (US). Scotland's potential Oil Fund has been squandered by Westminster. This would have been the Scottish Futures Trust. Remember that when the likes of Labour's Andy Kerr & Co tell us that PPP/PFI is best value.
42

,

19/05/2008 19:16:28
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43

Jimmy the Pie,

19/05/2008 20:01:38
Just read about New Labour Sleaze and Corruption's election tactics in Crewe. Just wait till the referendum. Then we'll see the really dirty stuff. "Ill do anything to save the Union" said Comrade Broon

This from the Times

Ministers, MPs and even senior figures in No10 are preparing to blame the invocation of class war if, as expected, they lose the seat held until her death by Gwyneth Dunwoody with a 7,078 majority. Her daughter, Tamsin, a former Welsh Assembly member, is fighting to keep the seat for Labour.
Mr Brown is thought to have personally authorised the use of class as a campaign issue despite the reservations of a number of senior ministers and advisers.
44

weh,

19/05/2008 20:35:16
Ron Gould, the Canadian specialist who carried out an investigation into the election, said he "was not comfortable" that all 129 MSPs in Holyrood received more votes than their opponents.

Ron is quite right! We Scots all KNOW that if slab had NOT rigged the elections, there would have been MANY more SNP reps elected!

If you clowns actually READ the quoted texts, instead of reading the Hootsmans editors anti SNP spin, you would quickly realise the accuracy of the quotes from which the "article " is written!
45

The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

19/05/2008 20:37:17
Good point Spook - the reality is that if the SNP had lost any of the seats that were close then they would have (in most cases) gained via the list.
46

Nikostratos,

19/05/2008 22:00:52
62

I think you are overreacting just a little bit. Until you confirmed it nobody had a clue it was real?.

"conscience" they haven't got one AM2 your gonna have to toughen up....First of your heart you make a stone the rest is easy
47

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 19/05/2008 22:14:28
#62 AM2 fakey. So easy to spot. You are a troll. AM2 posts from Glasgow not Scotland.
48

Saoghal Beag,

19/05/2008 22:22:44
so based on the gross incompetence will Mr UBendy Alexander be sacked and the power to control elections transferred to a more competent authority. Well more competent doesn't rule out much, how about the The Wiggles though they are less entertaining than the Alexander Twins just now.
49

,

19/05/2008 22:55:40
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50

Fairfax,

19/05/2008 23:47:57
AM2 (63): "Please, I’m appealing to whoever did this. You’ve won, if that’s the way you want to see it. I can stop posting. "

It's disgusting for anyone to be treated in this way. I've enjoyed your contribution. I hope this problem resolves itself soon.

51

Fairfax,

20/05/2008 00:04:54
AM2 (62): "I used the name of an old friend"

The situation here is interesting. I used an email address provided by a server belonging to a friend from my undergraduate college here in Cambridge, which would certainly provide sufficient information to google. Fairly early on, during a long exchange, one poster guessed my particular undergraduate college, which surprised me. In the end, given my academic subject and the topic, I decided it was probably simply a good guess. However, in retrospect, perhaps there was more to it than that. If that's so, then the leak would presumably be via the Scotsman, since I have neither a Herald account nor a Gmail address.
52

Nikostratos,

20/05/2008 11:24:17
AM2


Not nice to see grown man blubbing...........
53

The Darkside,

20/05/2008 11:28:44
There is a pressing need for a referendum, organised by Westminster and complete with a simple “separation: yes or no” type question, rather than the Nats’ confusing legalese.

I personally can’t wait to see the SNP neutered, ie deprived of its foolhardy separation policy. It’ll no doubt become more like the mainstream parties and it’ll be fun just to sit back and watch the implosion as fundamentalists are forced to recognise that separation just isn’t going to happen.
54

,

20/05/2008 11:47:44
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