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Blackwash outrage as MPs 'publish' their expenses

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Published Date: 19 June 2009
THE House of Commons last night stood accused of spending more than £2 million on a bungled cover-up, after publishing details of MPs' expenses with huge swathes blacked out.
Critics said the heavily-edited disclosure showed the worst abuses at Westminster would never have come to light without a complete version being leaked.

Records of 1.2 million claims were finally put on the parliament website at 6am yesterday, after a four-year Freedom of Information battle. They included a wealth of detail about the ways MPs spend public money – including on odd items such as matches, a milk frother, assertiveness training and issues of the Racing Post. However, the material bore little resemblance to that obtained by the Daily Telegraph, publication of which has led more than 20 MPs to resign over the past month.

As part of a rearguard action against publication, the Commons passed a measure exempting addresses and other "security-sensitive" information. Huge areas of paper were simply blacked out as a result, meaning many of the dubious tactics exposed by the Telegraph – such as "flipping" second home designation to maximise expenses claims – would have been virtually impossible to detect.

This partial disclosure could also have saved many MPs from being forced to quit at the next general election after having questionable claims exposed.

Freedom of information campaigner Heather Brooke, who won a High Court case forcing MPs to publish their expenses, said the security argument had now been "totally discredited". She added: "I have seen some original documents, and avoiding embarrassment has been the key motivating factor."

Last night the fall-out continued as it was revealed MPs have repaid nearly £500,000 amid public fury over abuses of the Westminster system.

Former Labour minister Elliot Morley yesterday said he had repaid a further £20,000 as his claim for £16,888 of "phantom" mortgage payments continued to be investigated.

Tory MP David Davies was also forced to defend paying a family firm from his parliamentary allowances. The Monmouth MP claimed £1,933.83 he paid his father's haulage firm for stamps, producing leaflets and a screen for an exhibition stand. He said the work was done at cost price and at short notice.

However, former minister Hazel Blears last night survived a vote of no confidence to deselect her at a meeting of her Salford constituency Labour Party.

Liberal Democrat Norman Baker, who has long called for greater transparency, condemned the editing of claims as "censorship".

The redacted claims threw up bizarre anomalies, with Gordon Brown's subscription to Sky TV – which he reclaims from the taxpayer – being partly concealed to hide the name of the TV firm, even though the Prime Minister published the details in full a year ago.

Mr Brown said: "I didn't choose to redact that and I don't quite understand all the rules applied by the House of Commons.

"My principle in this is the maximum transparency – it's got to be consistent of course with security, but I think people have got to be as transparent as possible."

The claims of Sir Menzies Campbell, the former Lib Dem leader and MP for North East Fife, were typical of many MPs. A multitude of entries were blacked out, revealing only his fondness for taking taxis, a bill for £500 for party "away-days" and claims of up to £400 a month for food.

Tory leader David Cameron announced he was repaying £947 after calculating he had overclaimed for mortgage interest and other items.

The sum includes £647 he claimed for the removal of wisteria plants at his constituency home, which he had already promised to repay. He said he was "very sorry" to have made excessive claims and he admitted that taxpayers would be "disappointed" to discover how much information about MPs' claims had been withheld.

Claims made by First Minister Alex Salmond, in his role as an MP, showed the taxpayer footed a £14,000 legal bill for advice on how to force Tony Blair from office over the Iraq war.

In 2004, the SNP and Welsh nationalist party Plaid Cymru jointly attempted to impeach Mr Blair – and then split the bill and reclaimed it on their expenses.

Chancellor Alistair Darling and his Tory shadow, George Osborne, were last night both the subject of complaints to the anti-sleaze watchdog.

Mr Darling is accused of "flipping" his home four times in four years – a practice now banned. Mr Osborne, who was revealed to have charged the taxpayer £47 for two DVDs of himself in a debate on "value for taxpayers' money", was accused of overclaiming for mortgage interest payments.

New laws are expected to be passed before Westminster breaks for the summer recess next month, establishing a Parliamentary Standards Authority, an independent body that will take responsibility for paying expenses.

The committee on standards in public life is due to report this autumn on tighter rules on expenses. Many of the claims exposed in the recent revelations have already been banned – such as the ability to claim £400 a month for food and £250 a month in petty cash without receipts.

WHAT THEY DON'T WANT YOU TO KNOW

HERE is a list of the information MPs were allowed to remove from the expenses disclosure:

• Any residential address of a Member of either House of Parliament

• Travel arrangements of a Member where the arrangements are regular

• The identity of any person who delivers or has delivered goods, or provides or has provided services, to a Member at any residence of the Member (this does not apply to Members' offices)

• Expenditure by a Member on security arrangements

• All names of hotels/guest houses used

• Correspondence or advice letters to or from Department of Resources/ DFA

• All manuscript additions to forms, receipts etc where these have been made by HoC staff

• Dates and times on till receipts where the name of the supplier is included

• Bank and credit card statements (but mortgage or rental agreements or statements will be published to the following extent: names of mortgagee/landlord/chargee, amount of interest and rent and information contained on statements of account such as value of mortgage)

• Itemised parts of telephone bills listing calls to individual numbers

• Personal items on till receipts and invoices for which no claim has been made

• Misfiled pages relating to another Member

• Names and addresses and other details of members of staff on claims for staff expenses

• Other information that is not central to the purpose of the claim or which could aid identity fraud including:

• Personal telephone numbers and other contact details

• Barcodes

• Cost centres and departmental identification numbers

• Personal data of third parties (excluding the name of mortgagees, chargees or landlords)

• Bank/Giro details

• Photocopies of cheques

• Account, invoice, delivery, order, NI or reference numbers

• Signatures


Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 19 June 2009 12:40 AM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Politicians' expenses
 
1

,

18/06/2009 22:57:02
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2

nostress,

grangemouth 19/06/2009 00:19:46
Extraordinary developments in the Jim Devine story - the Labour MP for Livingston now claims a former employee committed fraud in his name. I do hope Mr Devine has alerted the police to this alleged crime. here's how it was reported on the BBC Scotland website late last night:

Labour MP Jim Devine is facing new revelations about his expenses.

"BBC Scotland has discovered that the Livingston MP claimed for new wood flooring for his London flat twice in three months.

Mr Devine, who was deselected by his party this week over other expenses, has blamed a former employee who he has accused of fraud.

The MP said he has discovered many other claims which he said had been made falsely in his name.

He added that he had discussed the issue with the fees office on Wednesday.

BBC Scotland learned he submitted a claim in March 2006 for £690.

In June that year submitted a further claim - purporting to be from the same company - for £1,800 for laminate flooring for the same property which Mr Devine had just bought from another Labour MP"

A by-election looms...
3

,

19/06/2009 01:07:04
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4

,

19/06/2009 01:27:46
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5

somerferg,

perth 19/06/2009 01:47:58

oinky oink oink - lots of little snouts in the ever decreasing trough. Wonder how many schools. hospitals, aged care facilities etc could have been upgraded with the money this lot have squirreled away??
6

donald,

glasgow 19/06/2009 03:37:44
Why is David Marshall immune from press comments

Why are these benefit cheats not being charged?
7

Ubi,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 06:26:14
Let's not forget that in the absence of the Telegraph's revelations this would represent our elected government's definition of open accountability to the electorate.

There must be a better system out there because the democracy that is doled out in this country is a sham.
8

Colkitto,

River Clyde 19/06/2009 07:23:45
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00l94hz/Newsnight_Scotland_18_06_2009/

The Eric Joyce interview - absolute classic !
Hope someone can put it on Youtube before it disappears
9

The Wanderer from the South,

19/06/2009 07:27:55
I cannot see how getting a garden looked after, houses on duckponds, repair to tyres and the list goes on can help an MP to undertake their duty. I can only equate this to wholesale theft. The police will undertake an investigation but of course there will be no charges brought because they are against the administration. It beggars belief that these people are so openly criminal. Brown pays back, Cameron pays back only because they have been caught. Theft is what they have committed and they should be brought before the courts to answer for the theft. It would be laughable if it wasn't so tragic.
10

Retired from Edinburgh,

Gorgie 19/06/2009 07:35:44
Is there any reason that the taxpayer should pay for Sky Sports for a man who 'earns' over 200k per year BEFORE expenses ? Also why should we pay for a second home for someone who has lived rent free in Downing Street for the last 12 years. I see that he has now banned this after lining his own pockets.
11

,

19/06/2009 07:39:48
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12

Tynietiger,

19/06/2009 07:42:11
MP Nigel Griffiths seems to have claimed on two mortgages in his Additional Costs Allowances for 2006/07 for the months of Dec 06 and Jan 07. There is a claim for £2492.13 for 1/12/06 to 31/3/07 which equates to invoice addressed to Mr AND Mrs Griffiths (for his Edinburgh home?) plus another mortgage claim of £450 claimed for period 1/12/06 and 31/12/06. Like MPS from ALL parties, he also claimed the full £400 food allowance for the two months and Parliament was in recess for one month over Christmas and New Year
13

gus1940,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 07:42:45
When nominations for elections both national and local close the full names and addresses of candidates are printed in local papers.

If this is such a security risk are we to expect that this practice will not be followed for future elections?
14

yolanda,

19/06/2009 07:44:14

Just watched the Newsnight interview with Eric Joyce. Hilarious! What planet (or substance) is this guy on? How on earth did he get elected? He is an absolute idiot!

It can be found on -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00l94hz/Newsnight_Scotland_18_06_2009/
15

RDavis,

Vienna, Austria 19/06/2009 07:51:05
Of course the claims made by his 'Staff' will have been paid into the staffs bank account?
16

mr broon,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 08:09:48
One eagle-eyed Daily Telegraph reader spotted that each MP paid several thousand pounds per year to his/her own political party for a whole range of costs.

Some English Tory Associations were charging thousands for clerical work, hire of party premises, mail distibution(?), and other services. Expenses to pay staff wages also appeared extortionate and were well above the national minimum wage rate.

In other words, political parties were benefiting from much of their own MPs expenses.
17

Gdgy,

19/06/2009 08:12:09
THIS just proves again how divorced from reality ALL of the MPs are!
So many of htem seem to need to be told how their dubious actions will be percieved and some like the odious Hazel Bleary still don't get it.....
Are they stupid or just institutionally unaware?
18

Ubi,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 08:14:03
What they're relying on is the electorate having a short memory. Come 2010 the mugs will have forgotten all about it.

Have a good memory. Save this page. Click File/Save Page As/Democracy.htm. Save as Type : Web Page Complete.

Come the election and a sea of smiley faces making promises about what they're going to be doing, open this page again and see what they did.
19

Draco Was a Wimp,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 08:32:21
Anyone got a spare telly? After Joyce's performance on Newsnight Scotland last night, I'm afraid I damaged mine. Oh, and sorry to the wee wumin who was passing by with her dog at the time. It was a bit close, yes.
20

Linda,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 08:46:41
Will Telegraph publish details of former MPs such as George Foulkes .. oh but most of them have been shredded.
21

Boy Wonder,

19/06/2009 08:48:52
I watched an advert on TV the other night about Benefit Fraud and how to clipe on people you suspect of doing it and how they WILL be caught, have benefits withdrawn and "possibly get sent to jail".

Well, if I knew anyone who was doing it ... I wouldn't say a single word ... not until an MP is found guilty of the MASSIVE FRAUD they have perpetuated on the public for years ... and goes to jail!

In other words ... the worst offender is probably your crooked MP ... not the poor bu&&er over the road struggling to make ends meet who has resorted to fiddling.
22

Jay Kay,

19/06/2009 08:51:58
This country has obviously forgotten the word sack, as in to sack. These low life scum need to be facing the jile, and for a very long stretch.

Who in their right mind trusts any politician now, the only one's who seem to be doing any good at all are the SNP and I know before the union trolls get there hands on it, I know these guys arn't the whitest of white, but best of a bad bunch yes. Heart in the right place, yes, making a difference to the Scots, defo yes.

I say complete autonomy from this shower of thieving b*astards at Westminster, the Lards and Commons can go and get fooked as far as I'm concerned. Oh and as for this startling revelation that if Scotland had all the monies from Gas and Oil we would still be 20 billion in the red, aye right, pull the other one you bunch of w*ankers.

Why won't the parliment at Westminster even consider giving the people of this country a vote on independence.

These scum are no better than the regimes they have tried to change through illegal wars. North Korea seems like a nice place by comparison.

Cover ups galore, Brown is a friggin disgrace, I'm ashamed to the core that he is a Scot. Millions spent on what? transparency, yet more spin and lies, HEy BROON its time to go me ol' son to the f*ucking nut house where you belong.

The Chimps at Edinburgh zoo would make a better job of our economy than you.

Answer me this you buffon, what now in your oppinion makes Great Britain Great eh! is it the ship building? the car industry? the Steel Industry? Coal Mining? electronics? clothing manufacturing? NO because we have none of these left.

What Britian is great for is being the Shi*te hole of Europe, for giving out free money to all the rabble and dross of Europe, then we give even more to those shower of even bigger theifs and cheats.
23

The Former Mr. Angry,

Perth 19/06/2009 08:53:27
They could have saved time and phoned the Daily Telegraph to publish the full details rather than the scraps of info it is we, the little people who pay them, need to know. On this need to know basis, we evidently don't need to.

The arrogance is breathtaking and many MPs seem not to be fully switched on to the fact that most of us who earn a living and pay tax are utterly livid about this. Martin in his final speech as a sacked Speaker didn't get it. Blears still hasn't got it and Mr Squeaky Clean Brought up in a Manse, Never Told a Lie Broon doesn't get it either, because his own expenses are demonstrably mis-stated.

He may not have Broken the Rules on his second home but he has certainly used this to his personal advantage at the expense of the taxpayer and flipped his second home to carry out repairs at what must be truly his first home in N. Queensferry.

The main cure for this is a General Election which of course Brown will not contemplate as, in addition to being economical with the verite, he is lily-livered.
24

Nevsky;,

Moscow 19/06/2009 09:06:10
Jim Devine found out again...this from the BBC...i particularly enjoyed the last line:

'Labour MP Jim Devine is facing new revelations about his expenses.

BBC Scotland has discovered that the Livingston MP claimed for new wood flooring for his London flat twice in three months.

Mr Devine, who was deselected by his party this week over other expenses, has blamed a former employee who he has accused of fraud.

The MP said he has discovered many other claims which he said had been made falsely in his name'
25

mr broon,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 09:07:48
This morning on TV, a journalist claimed that the editors of the Daily Telegraph would soon be meeting to decide whether or not to publish further leaked details throughout the summer to reveal much of the "redacted" information!
26

Ferry Resident,

19/06/2009 09:10:18
Mr Brown said: "I don't quite understand all the rules applied by the House of Commons"

Says it all. Does he mean that if he did understand all the rules then the "alleged" expenses fiddles would have been completely blacked out.

You have been in Parliament for a long time Gordon and if you don't know the rules by now then it is time to go. Permanently !

27

Sgian Achlais,

19/06/2009 09:21:57
#29 mr broon

I was under the impression the Telegraph is printing the full details for many MP's along side the redacted details so you can see what is being hidden, fee's office advice, rejected claims, etc.

I think they said it will be a pull out supplement this weekend.

28

The Deil,

19/06/2009 09:38:49
#22 Tam

Great suggestion re a dvd of Joyce's excruciating performance on Newsnicht as a result of Brewer's excoriation of him.
It is common practice for newspapers to increase their sales by giving away free dvds. Perhaps the Johnson Press' "Falkirk Herald" could perform a public service by including a free copy of Joyce's performance in the run-up to the next General Election?
What about it Falkirk Herald?
29

scully,

Colchester 19/06/2009 09:41:58
The Government has bit the hand that fed it. All party,s are being judged the same now, So now the Sun shines on the Good and The Bad, and the Rain falls on the good and the Bad. The Scurvey Dogs have brought everyone down now.

As for Hazel Blears why did you betray the Spirit, I watched you on Question time. and remember it was your like that voted you to stay ,Not the Peoples of Salford.

Tony Blair, What was it that Jesus said. Do not build your house on sand, sand moves. and when the wind blows and the storms come your house will be washed away,. Build your house on rock. and it can rain as much as it likes and the storms can rage but your house will stay put.Remember Jesus and Joseph were Carpenters and builders . they worked on building sites so he knew what he was talking about,hey was no cracks in there walls.Can you work that out . Oh peacekeepers of the Middle east, I dare not write down hear what I think of you the Colchester Police would come and arrest me. And if anyone is interesting the slippery slope started in 1977 and got worse when Margaret Thatcher came to power, The Battle started with the Royal Family, Margaret, with the Masons and the 22 Committee, then all those that succeeded them. Oh and don't forget the Church, After I had Holy Vision in 1978. I was told If I became a Roman Catholic I would have the world at my Feet. But if I did not I would be destroyed I was told They are going to put Di Spencer in your place . They tried but failed. you see God intervened . God had other thoughts on the plans of mice and men.The MPs should have turned down the 50 pieces of silver.Now how about the Royal Family and the Church and The Government telling the truth . All the Truth. Remember only God can forgive and only God can redeem the soul.The balls in your court, I am not afraid of any of you.Gods got my CV in front of him.And even although the Rulers and Politicians Murdered Jesus He survived Death.
30

scully,

Colchester 19/06/2009 09:45:48
If you want to know who I am, Sky News will give you my name and address. Or Ken Bruce at the BBC. Many Many Peoples know who I am. The Colchester Police will tell you.
31

Ewan Oosami,

19/06/2009 09:49:34
A guy died and went to heaven.
He was let in the pearly gates by St Peter and noticed a huge wall full of clocks.
He asked what they were doing there.
St Peter replied "They are called Lie Clocks - every time a person tells a lie their clock move a second"
"That one over there is Mother Teresas - it's never moved ie she's never told a lie"
"That one over there is Abraham Lincolns - it's only ever moved twice, ie he only told 2 lies during his life"
The guy asks "Where is Gordon Browns clock?"
St Peter replies " Oh that one is in Gods office - he uses it as a ceiling fan"
32

Herry Oaksters,

19/06/2009 09:58:17
Labour really do how to waste money ,they are experts at flushing tax payers money down the drain.
This is nothing short of a £2 million sham by the sleaze and corruption labour party.
The Skull should be made to pay the money back,just goes to show how thick he is, cant even fill in a tax return,what a thick idiot.
33

tomislav,

Home 19/06/2009 10:00:43
Our MPs ........ "Britains not got talent"
34

WEEFREE,

FREEDONIA 19/06/2009 11:12:39
Re comment *19 Des Browne MP claimed £5000 for something called Labour Party Properties LTD, between 2007 - 2008.
Are we taxpayers contributing to the Labour Party?
Perhaps we should be told
35

Yeti,

Falkirk 19/06/2009 11:17:57
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/5572694/MPs-expenses-the-20-worst-cover-ups.html

Says it all.
36

Fred Leeson,

edinburgh 19/06/2009 11:19:28
#17 Yolanda
Just watched the Eric Joyce interview. Yes he looked a bit out of it. Tired and emotional maybe. Hiding behind his wife to deflect the questions about CGT was a bit low. I doubt if anyone knew about his marital problems until he mentioned them on Newsnight.
I wouldn't like to get on the wrong side of him though. He's got the strange Ed Balls stare about him.
37

Mrs Broon,

Scotland 19/06/2009 11:19:42
I do not know how any of this lot can survive without an election. Any utterances coming from Westminster are surely being regarded by the general populace with scorn. Surely Britain cannot be regarded as being 'GOVERNED'.
38

Queen D,

19/06/2009 11:28:41
According to the Daily Mail , MPs are to get a £10,000 pay rise!

How utterly shocking!

I read my MPs expenses claim yesterday and started to worry when I realised that I read a claim for £152,00 and thought that was fairly moderate!
Slapping myself about a bit , I did a bit of arithmetic and with expenses realised he tripled his salary and a wee bittie more!
39

Queen D,

19/06/2009 11:29:39
Missed a zero!
Should read £ 152,000
40

Willie Mor,

19/06/2009 11:31:51
Maybe when we meet some of these sleaze bags in the street we should ask them why they are above the law, and how they can steal our money without sanction.

Like child abusers do these scum bags really have a place in our society.

Or would it be better if they just fled the country like their friend Goldfingered Goodwin?
41

Fred Leeson,

edinburgh 19/06/2009 11:38:32
There are some funnier aspects to the expenses story though.
Ben Bradshaw,a Minister of State, called out an engineer twice to repair his digibox. Both times the engineer found that he had tried to fit the scart plug on the wrong way round. The first time there were connections needing resoldered. The second time the engineer asked Ben to make sure he wasn't trying to fit the scart plug on the wrong way round as it would entail a callout fee. But to no avail.
I suppose when you're not paying for things yourself you get a bit complacent.
42

Luigiana,

Aberdeen 19/06/2009 11:46:36
#46

Complacent? - nah, he is just as thick, out of his depth (fitting a scart plug requires two brain cells lol).

Common characteristic of a cabinet minister.

43

WEEFREE,

19/06/2009 12:08:37
On further investigation Des Browne paid £5000 on 22/05/2006 -£5000 on 01/08/2005 & £4000 on 30/04 2004 a grant total of £19000 paid from the taxpayer to Labour Party Properties Ltd. This only covers the last four years. Anew political levy?
44

Canny Mann,

The Kingdom 19/06/2009 12:37:23
Westminster MPs, forced by the courts to come clean, due to the freedom of information act, still deny the electorate the transparency promised.
This is a gross breach of power. Blacked out information, the types of which, hark back to times of war. This is draconian measures to ensure thier secrecy.
Secrecy.
Secrecy.

If they have nothing to hide, why must westminster wrap everything in the National security smoke screen, before being whitewashed, behind closed doors.

Westminster is the "State" versus the People.

Vote SNP, get rid of this morass of iniquity in London.

SNP and independence will deliver transparency. A scottish constitution (Of the people, for the people), tight control on political expenses (an encouragement to MSPs to save scotland money) and a controlled banking sector.


Vote SNP.

Alba gu brath...
45

mr broon,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 12:49:09
Westminster will recover from this momentous scandal but the reputation of the alleged 'Mother of Parliaments' and 'Cradle of Democracy' has forever been shown up as a self perpetuating myth!

To put it politely: Mither o' Parlies, my rear end!
46

Class On Grass,

Plug in your connection 19/06/2009 12:56:17

_______________________________________
( )
| 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 /
| 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 |
(____________________________________)


How can you plug this in the wrong way round twice? Answers to question time, a heated commons debate looms among the half-witted time-wasting pilferers.

47

Edwards Legend,

19/06/2009 12:56:58
49

The SNP is led by a food thief and Donald Trumps enforcer , I think you have picked the wrong thread to back independence

Vote SNP to get a Scottish crook instead of An English one, compelling stuff
48

Class On Grass,

plug out 19/06/2009 12:57:01


Ok, that went a bit awry...
49

LEAL,

19/06/2009 13:01:11
Westminster should not be governing Scotland
50

Richard Lionheart,

19/06/2009 13:09:57
On the bright side, we now have clarity as to what Gordon Brown considers to be “fair, open and transparent”

More empty words from “Superman”.

A bit like “WE have ended Boom and BUST”
51

Class On Grass,

plug out 19/06/2009 13:19:09

Sounds like the 'there is no money in oil' conspiracy, JoeMcT
52

Canny Mann,

The Kingdom 19/06/2009 13:22:48
#52 Edwards Legend.

Ha ha ha, a food thief you say, £400 per month for food. Frequenting the type and style of establishment an MP goes to, will cost you £50 a head per night. Going to the Ritz would cost you even more. Alex Salmond has been on a diet and lost weight, so in effect we are saving money.lol.

As for getting a scottish crook, in exchange for an English one. Pray tell me what offence he has commited and display your evidence, or I will call you a fraud and a liar.

In an independant scotland we could fire our MPs, as we would have transparency and the power to eject from parliament the law breakers.
In westminster, they dont get fired, they get deselected at the end of thier time in power. Prohibited from standing for that particular party at the next general election(no criminal conviction). Keeping thier ill gotten gains, keeping thier pension rights and worst of all keeping thier LIBERTY.
Without the whistle blower and the Telegraph, this corruption would still be continueing and under the speakers direction would have been protected from public scrutiny.

We need more of Trumps kind to invest in scotland. Westminster want to cut the money coming to scotlands coffers. Salmond, Trump and thier ilk intend increasing scotlands income and ability to improve the well being of the scots.

Aye, scots know well what is "Edwards Legend". Scotlands Bard and poet Rabbie Burns told us in Scots wha Hae, "Chains and slavery"
Then Edwards son met "The Bruce".

Vote SNP.

Alba gu brath...
53

Itsanobrainer-Vote SNP,

19/06/2009 13:37:35
Off topic this but as many people as possible must see this. Newsnight Scotland last night, Eric Joyce this is hilarious and a must see. Enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fm20dU5O9MU
54

Linda,

Edinburgh 19/06/2009 13:52:21
Scotsman and Unionist attacks on Salmond's expenses have backfired:
The SNP has enjoyed a massive 13% swing to the party from Labour in the Inverclyde South West by-election – less that two weeks after the SNP won the area in the popular vote for the European elections – with the election of Innes Nelson as the new SNP councillor for the seat.



The SNP vote rose from 23% in May 2007 to 42% today – a 19% increase in the SNP vote whilst Labour fell back to 23% from 30%
55

TWC,

exLabour 19/06/2009 13:57:01
How many wheels are left on the trolley?

Inverclyde not voting Labour??? -- Jesse Dickson Mabon will be birling.
56

Allan(handofgod137),

19/06/2009 14:01:10
#61 You're havin' a laff!

Looks like you'll all have to vote BNP for an honest accountable government.
57

Fred Leeson,

edinburgh 19/06/2009 14:04:03
#53 Class
"Ok, that went a bit awry... "

It's probably a good drawing of what was left of the scart plug.

#60
Aye it was funny. Eric Joyce always seems like a younger version of George Galloway. He seems more interested in Rwanda and Congo etc rather than Scotland. He said in a recent debate that the citizenship test was too difficult for him to complete which says it all really.
58

ddmc,

19/06/2009 14:07:05
just watched Joyce on newsnight,

how is asking if he paid capital gains tax a question about other people, I can see him getting reamed over capital gains tax which by his refusal to answer the question it would seem he never did
59

TWC,

exLabour 19/06/2009 14:14:40
They are falling apart
Joyce
Morphy
Reid
Darling
Blears
Devine etc etc etc etc etc Call the polis.
60

ecosseman,

FACTS NOT PROPAGANDA 19/06/2009 14:20:39
A MESSAGE TO GREEDY SCOTS LABOUR MPs AND-

GREEDY LABOUR LEADERS IN GREEDY LONDON.


PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE

STAY THEIR,DONT RETURN TO SCOTLAND WHEN YOU GET THE BOOT.

YOU ARE BETTER SERVED IN SLEAZY LONDON.

WE DONT NEED YOU,WE DONT WANT YOU.

GOOD BYE TO YOU ALL.

ROLL ON THE ELECTION!
61

JCA REID,

Annan 19/06/2009 14:39:04
It would be really interesting to know...how much of an MP's salary they actually do spend on day to day living, or is it treated as a 5-12grand "wedge/bung" to "invest/speculate"??
62

Arthur G,

Glasgow 19/06/2009 14:53:21
I'm surprised that none of the Glasgow and North Lanarkshire MPs is seen to be claiming their Celtic Season tickets on expenses -surely a legitimate 'business' expense considering how much time they spend at Celtic Park formulating 'policy') It is not as if chauffeur driven visits to the stadium, paid for by the tax payer, are alien to Labour MSPs or members of the Labour faction of the Glasgow City Council.
63

ecosseman,

FACTS NOT PROPAGANDA 19/06/2009 14:58:22
69#

CELTIC FC SHOULD DO THE DECENT THING AND BAN THEM NOW.

THIS GREAT CLUB SHOULD NOT BE TAINTED BY THESE PEOPLE.

ROLL ON THE ELECTION!
64

morris,

edinburgh 19/06/2009 15:22:06

68

Presumably one would need to hire accountants to establish this,(chargeable to you and me of course).
Please do not confuse Freedom of Information with free !
Accountability means ability to hire an accountant !
This is actually worse than it was before.

Brown's assurances of coming clean are not even a whitewash .They are a black out!
That's even more "out of order" than the previous lack of transparency because his promise to be open is a load of worthless tosh,and they are taking the michael now!
The details have not even been excluded as in partly completed.They have been deliberately marked AWOL and that's even less transparent than the pigging we already know about!
For God sake Scotland if you associate with any of the Westmidden parties after this ,you should be deeply ashamed of yourselves.
This is now an international laughing stock all over the European continent.

As for Eric Joyce, he probably thinks "transparent" means send your elderly relative on holiday at the taxpayers expense!
65

morris,

edinburgh 19/06/2009 15:34:48
65

Eric Joyce is an embarrassment to even the Labour party ! I defy anyone to make a bigger fool of themselves than he did .

Gordon Brewer (for a change) was genuinely amazed at the responses he gave which were absolute nonsense, and were more damaging than if he had answered the question. Not only do we now know the answer, we know hes not even honest enough to admit what we already know, because there is nothing to stop him answering the question(apart from stupidity in that he does not recognise that failure to answer is tantamount to a CONFESSION but with even less honour)!

If anybody thinks that Joyce said something sensible during that entire interview ,then you really are even more brain dead than this total numpty is !The man is an idiot.
66

,

19/06/2009 17:04:47
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
67

morris,

edinburgh 19/06/2009 17:15:09
73 I would agree Gogs .

A fine regiment with a tradition and record second to none. They have distinguished themselves again and again in the name of Queen of the British Connonwealth, and to treat them with anything less than the highest praise possible is a travesty of justice.What Browns clowns did was a national disgrace.

Well done Joanna Luvley !


There are some real du MP lings in this UK !
68

morris,

edinburgh 19/06/2009 17:25:06
73 continued .

Are you who I think you are?
An ex army man. That sounds very like someone I have known for many years now .

Does Caithness Sutherland Cromarty and Ross mean anything to you apart from the obvious I wonder ?
69

SouthernSkye,

19/06/2009 17:29:22
Brief point Re CGT.
If, as he states in the interview, his main home was always in Falkirk then he MST pay CGT on any other house, i.e. London, as only the main home is exempt CGT. If he did not do so then that is, pure and simple, tax fraud.
If he did pay CGT then I can see no reason not to say so.
Draw your own conclusions.
The Met, it seems, are going to investigate a small number of MPs WRT possible tax fraud.
70

,

19/06/2009 17:32:50
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
71

,

19/06/2009 17:35:29
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72

morris,

edinburgh 19/06/2009 17:55:24
77
Cheers
Yes it was a reference to Follow the Fiery Cross !

I had realised you meant Joyce ,but you could have been aware of his past because you also are an ex army chap. Thats what made me take notice but not only would my friend know this, his surname is one of the four, and his friend is a Falkirk based journalist.


Obviously you are not who you could easily have been, but Im impressed that you identified the Fiery Cross !

73

Noxious,

19/06/2009 20:56:28
25 Boy Wonder

Maybe the benefits cheats should just admit that they had made a mistake and see if that works. "I'm sorry, I was so busy working on the side that I completely overlooked the fact that I was still claiming unemployment benefit. It was really my wife's fault - I employ her as my personal assistant and she must have fallen behind with the paperwork. To be honest, it was a very busy period for both of us, as we were between second homes at the time. Can I get off with it if I offer to stand down at the next election?"
74

Noxious,

19/06/2009 21:03:04
Just wacthed the Eric Joyce interview - thanks for the link. Priceless - haven't laughed so much for ages. I love it when he tried to turn Gordon's question about avoidance of capital gains tax into some probe into his personal life - where the hell did that come from? As a pathetic attempt to deflect an argument, it's on a par with Gorbals Mick claiming that any attack on him was an attack on the working classes of Clydeside.
75

AWGL,

Palm Desert, California 19/06/2009 21:16:41
Is everyone aware that those of us who live overseas are not allowed to view the "Joyce" television interview? Sounds somewhat similar to the the "controls" in place in Iran!!!!

As is the case in the US, in Britain you've obviously sent a group of morons with few, if any, scuples to London.

These people have no morals, and their only interest is in increasing their own wealth, and in making sure they are re-elected. The interests of the people they represent seem to be of little, or no interest.

Throw the scoundrels out should be the call to arms in the UK, and if they've committed theft, punish them accordingly in the courts.

Good luck!
76

nostress,

grangemouth 20/06/2009 00:02:36
#83 - tam o'shanter - thanks for the youtube link above about Eric Joyce on Newsnight. I've sent it to everyone I know. I've detested this rectum-licking waste of breath for years now. It makes me so angry that he now represents the seat Denis Cannavan once held with such distinction. I can only hope the good folk of Falkirk will waken up to the kind of slimy chancer they voted for and get rid of him at the earliest opportunity.
77

puskas,

East kilbride 20/06/2009 10:46:12
One caller on BBC Scotland 810 a few days ago (AM)mentioned that an increase in salary for MP's would be a good thing. £100,000 was the figure she gave..

I differ.. I favour a decrease... £40,000 per annum.

Career politicions we have no need for (many straight from uni)

Whilst being a member of any parliament ( Holyrood / Westminster ) all other employment should not be acceptable, and banned..
No second home allowance ? I do not have a problem with this. Any profit of second home when sold should be given back to the citizens / government.
I'm sure a good debate regards these profits and what type of fund / use would be had..

MP's, MSP's could have the choice either above or rental flat/hotel.. Hotels/flats to be used at the discretion and organised through a government dept.

Rented furnished flats.. No finance available for televisions beds ect... Any costs other than basics would be paid by the elected MP.. Meals in the Westminster canteen?. A means of getting them to turn up and taking part in debate or whatever committee.

Transport .. Fixed supplement on mileage from constituancy office to Westminster. ( In cases like Joyce ( Croyden) limited mileage and any expense travelling to his constituancy should be paid by the sitting MP. Ridiculous that any Member of Parliement should have any home so far from the electors..

Any staff to be registered by Westminster and salaries fixed by law.. Any office expense claims should be transparent,monthly and shown not only on the internet .. but Local newspaper (s)

Obviously just passing thoughts and a few fine touches to be added in small print..

Adam (5 directorships) Ingram £173,000 salary whilst in parliement is obscene. Canny be very busy with his constituants..
Ingram was a minister with the MOD and believed to be an advisor with at least 2 foreign companies who deal with arms.?






 

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