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UN investigator defends Islam

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Published Date: 15 September 2007
THE United Nations investigator on racism yesterday condemned rising Islamaphobia, especially in Europe.
Doudou Diene said increasing numbers of politicians, journalists and intellectuals were "equating Islam with violence and terrorism" and some were seeking to "silence religious practices by banning the construction of mosques".



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  • Last Updated: 14 September 2007 8:42 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Muslim issues
 
1

Suck McCrunchie (the eighth),

Doomster Hill 15/09/2007 01:18:06

The americans in here seem to be the worst I have noticed.

2

Doxx,

15/09/2007 01:48:01

If it weren't for all the terror attacks in the UK, US, Africa, the ME, Spain, etc... perhaps people wouldn't have this "phobia."

A phobia (from the Greek f?ß?? "fear"), is an irrational, persistent fear of certain situations, objects, activities, or persons. The main symptom of this disorder is the excessive, unreasonable desire to avoid the feared subject. When the fear is beyond one's control, or if the fear is interfering with daily life, then a diagnosis under one of the anxiety disorders can be made.

A far left misnomer if I've ever heard one. It is not irrational or unreasonable to believe these nutters are capable of even more vile acts. To recognize a threat, identify it, and discuss it does not make us racist or "fearful." It simply makes us forewarned.

3

Doxx,

15/09/2007 01:48:51

If it weren't for all the terror attacks in the UK, US, Africa, the ME, Spain, etc... perhaps people wouldn't have this "phobia."

A phobia (from the Greek f?ß?? "fear"), is an irrational, persistent fear of certain situations, objects, activities, or persons. The main symptom of this disorder is the excessive, unreasonable desire to avoid the feared subject. When the fear is beyond one's control, or if the fear is interfering with daily life, then a diagnosis under one of the anxiety disorders can be made.

A far left misnomer if I've ever heard one. It is not irrational or unreasonable to believe these nutters are capable of even more vile acts. To recognize a threat, identify it, and discuss it does not make us racist or "fearful." It simply makes us forewarned.

4

Cobbie,

Dauphin 15/09/2007 02:17:47

Some call it Islamaphobia, some call it self-preservation. Mr. Doodoo Diene is another United Nations minion who is biased in favour of Muslims, I wonder why.

5

doublescotch,

U.S.A. 15/09/2007 03:22:42

#1 you are totally wrong in your assumption. The A.C.L.U. are allowing Muslims to pray in schools here,where no other religion can. PLease do not put your phobia on Americans. Go suck something else it might cheer you up.

6

The Daleks,

15/09/2007 04:20:58

Europe has reason to fear.

7

Conan,

Here 15/09/2007 04:32:47

While the 'Great Satan' is certainly in the sights of radical Islam, it is and will in fact be Europe, especially the UK, that will succumb first - and certainly within the next fifty years if current trend lines continue - which they most certainly will. The groundwork has been laid and the plan is moving along just fime.

So, while certain posters here, if illustrative of the general attitude and trend in the UK and Europe, are playing right into the hands of the Islamists by wasting their energies in criticising and gleefully harming the one nation that might well be their salvation - the US.

On must deduce that this is a consequence of wrong anf flawed thinking on their part, some form of demented death wish on their part, or, perhaps they are just too lacking in intellect to be able to foresee the consequences of their selh-harming delusions?

8

oder,

Scotland 15/09/2007 05:50:18

"equating Islam with violence and terrorism"
Not me! Mr Doudou Diene
I look at places like Sudan where the religion of peace have wage war for years on the Christian south, is this not violence? and this is only one of six or seven little peaceful (Islamic) wars were there is no western involvement.
Any rise in ""Islamaphobia" is fully justified, given the fact that the so called moderate muslims do
nothing or very little prevent or condemn Islamic
terrorism, no problem when it comes to cartoons, the moderate muslim knows what to do, Yet they squeek like a mouse when acts of terror are carried out and claim this is not Islam.
If moderate muslims are concernd about the Image of Islam they should tackle the people who created that Image namely, terrorists who claim to be muslim.

9

Lee Morgan,

15/09/2007 06:15:39

Conan, Here, I have been following your posts and like most of what you posted, sharing the same views with you regarding Islamism. I also like your comment #9 in this link.
http://news.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1462422007#new

10

Conan,

Here 15/09/2007 07:06:18

Lee, I thank you for your comments.

I realize that it will be an impossibility for me (or anyone) to please everyone with what I post here and I do understand that there are fair and valid differences of opinion in the very heated 'theater' of what we have come to call the 'Middle East'.

Frankly, it is hard to argue with the proposition that, notwithstanding whatever one's views might be on the existence of the State of Israel - pro or con, the mere existence of the modern State of Israel, commencing in the middle of the last century, has unquestionably complicated and compounded all aspects of life and politics in that sad region.

That said, my point-of-view is essentially practical and utilitarian. Israel exists. It is not going away, any time soon. And, therefore, it can and will do whatever it takes - and rightly so - to ensure its continued security and existence.

I fail to see how anyone could take issue with such an obviously true and correct assessment of the actual situation.

It so happens that one way or another many countries have furnished, then not furnished, the Jewish State with varying degrees of support in many and different forms over time.

In the case of the US, obviously, this assistance has taken many forms - but has been generally consistent and predictable.

Where Israel has gotten into (and stayed in) trouble has been in its ability to defeat those who seek to do it harm - including to destroy it.

This success, much like the angst one hears when another's favourite team is defeated, naturally produces some 'blowback', both in the region and outside the region. Perfectly understandable - and probably totally unavoidable.

The point is, again, that the State of Israel - faced with all manner of daily, ongoing attacks of every form, especially in the form of organized terror sponsored by parties beyond its immediate borders (I'm think especially of Iran, and formerly by Iraq) MUST defent its

11

Boy Wonder,

15/09/2007 07:55:38

I am not an Islamophobe. I am not irrational in my belief that Islam, as well as other religions, is a clear and present danger to the well-being of the human race and should be eradicated!

12

Cadgers,

Perth 15/09/2007 08:04:25

#9 oder, well said

#12 :-))BW

13

Conan,

Here 15/09/2007 08:27:48

Boy Wonder - a question about religion in our times:-

When did you last hear of an active Methodist flying an aircraft full of people deliberately into a building full of people?

Another; when did you hear of a practicing Anglican cut of the head os a non-believer?

Have you ever heard of a Presbiterian being killed because he renounced Presbiterianism?

OK - you got me on that one ..... but .... when did you hear of a Catholic driving a truckload of explosives into a group of Orthodox Jews?

Religions, religions, religion is what i see you saying.

No, it ain't.

Islam is in a class all by itself - and it is not the advanced studies class. More like the special 'how to force as many people as possible to join my cult, and threathen them is they don't or won't, and kill them if need be because the prophet/profit said so' kind of class.

Just like ALL the other religions out there, right?

Right?

14

thatscottishwoman 2,

15/09/2007 08:40:15

#11 Conan:

I now very rarely post on the Scotsman due, mainly, to the polarised views of posters particularly with regard to the Israeli/Palestinian conflict.

However, I feel your comment at #11 deserves a response:-)

"Frankly, it is hard to argue with the proposition that, notwithstanding whatever one's views might be on the existence of the State of Israel - pro or con, the mere existence of the modern State of Israel, commencing in the middle of the last century, has unquestionably complicated and compounded all aspects of life and politics in that sad region........I fail to see how anyone could take issue with such an obviously true and correct assessment of the actual situation."

I agree. My contention with the state of Israel is the manner in which it conducts itself vis a vis the humanitarian crises that have resulted from the failure to reach an acceptable agreement with Palestine.

15

honest, jock,

Leith 15/09/2007 09:19:09

The investigator only has to read this thread and his investigation is over.

16

Conan,

Here 15/09/2007 09:23:43

#15 - Indeed, it is my honour to have been blessed with the pleaseure of your thoughtful response.

The polarised postings, herein, are but digital manifestations and annonymous views of the intractable nature of the problems 'on the ground' in the Middle East - and I for one sincerely wish that this were otherwise, as should anyone with any degree of sense.

But, while I was most encouraged with your 'I agree', my crest fell in reading that the first issue you thereafter raise was the 'manner in which Israel conducts itself'. Which, if I read on, seems to be in some manner connect to and .... perhaps by extension .... leading to the 'humanitarian crises that have resulted from the failure to reach an acceptable agreement with Palestine'. I have a few points:-

1. Only Israel in singled out for 'the manner in which it has conducted itself'. It has defended itself ably in the face if insescent attacks. What else should they do?

2. The 'humanitarian crises' are not entirely and uniquely of Israel's making. Israel was atacked and the attackers - its Arab state neighbours, and terrorists - created the conditions which led to the turmoil, including the creation of the refugees and the attacker's unwillingness to take any rssponsibility for them. Why is this only Israel's doing?

3. An 'acceptable' agreement. As defined by who? 'Acceptable' to who? For decades the 'Palestinians' would not even talk to Israel and since the first attack Israel has been under constant attack, icluding being subjected to actual warfare on a massive scale. For the majority, they claim Israel should not even exist. Why is this Israel's fault?

4. Palestine? What 'Palestine'? Palestine was an adminstrative region leftover from the Ottoman Empire, then awarded to the British as a Mandate territory. Then it simply went away. Israel has attempted to come up with some formula that would put that Humpty Dumpty together again, but each time it seemingly achieves some

17

james 1st,

nz 15/09/2007 09:43:11

i fear the united nations more, the organisation is certainly biased against europeans and christians.
the un make many statements none of them ever seem to give europeans rights only muslims or indigenous races. to be fair they also discriminate against men

18

Logie Almond,

15/09/2007 09:45:40

Many Islamic countries such as Saudi Arabia do not allow the construction of churches. They also prescribe the death penalty for any Muslim who converts to another religion.

19

thatscottishwoman 2,

15/09/2007 10:15:30

#17 Conan:
One more post just for you:-)

I did indeed state "the manner in which it [Israel] conducts itself". This statement was in response to your post at #15 which focused specifically on Israel.

1. I do not have a problem with any country taking steps to ensure the safety and security of its citizens, for the avoidance of doubt this includes Israel.

2. I did not state that the humanitarian crises are entirely or uniquely Israel's doing, I don't think I have ever stated that. That said, a few posters on these fora have, and continue, to make spurious allegations to the contrary.

3. Acceptable agreement? As defined by all protagonists. The Saudi Initiative, as I have mentioned on previous occasions, is a valid framework.

Why is this Israel's fault? Again, my point was in reference to the focus of your initial post. Israel has been as guilty as the other protagonists of political posturing and failing to declare the terms of an "endgame".

4. Palestine, What Palestine? As with Israel, Gaza and the West Bank exist in the here and now they are not going away, Israel has to deal with it.

Capitulation, an emotive word. I prefer negotiation myself!

I'll leave the discussion at that as I have commenting to do on another site.

I sincerely hope that my response has gone some way to re erecting your crest:-)

20

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 15/09/2007 10:29:02

The UN investigator was invstigating racism. Being Islamic, as far as I'm aware, is not a seperate race, is? I can change my religion to Islamic type can't I?

Islam [ íz laam, íss laam ]


noun

Definition:

1. Muslim religion: a monotheistic religion based on the word of God as revealed to Muhammad during the 7th century


2. Muslim world: Muslim people, their culture, or their countries considered collectively

From the above definition, anybody is free to enter into Islam and adopt the Muslim culture etc. Therefore this investigator can be largely ignored.

21

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 15/09/2007 12:28:05

#20 Scottishwoman

Again I see you post words which seek to establish that you believe in reason.
Yet the fact that you repeatedly criticize Israel for every slight, both real and imangined and have never taken the same tact with any of the Arabs, be they Palestinians or othes, certainly seems to show that you do not hold to those actions.
The Saudi Initiative may well be a good framework for peace, but your statement "Gaza and the West Bank exist in the here" seems to state that the Saudi Plan is done - Israel should accept it and whatever lands the Palestinians claim, they should have or Israel is in the wrong.
Similarly, you speak out often against the plight of the Palestinians who either left, or were expelled after 1948, yet you refuse to speak out for the 900,000 Jews who were explelled from Arab lands after 1948.
You go on about Palestinians who are imprisoned at 16 for attempted murder yet remain silent on Israelis who are murdered by these same Palestinians.

Peace will come when BOTH sides are willing to make compromises. That means the Palestinians will not get ALL of the West Bank and Gaza. They will recieve payments for any losses, real or percieved, as opposed to a 'right' that does not exist in International Law to go to Israel and claim any land they have under a twisted version of the Israeli Right of Return (if they wish, they can certanly enact their own Right of Return and allow any Palestinian living abroad to move to the future Palestinian state and be granted citizenship).
But until they take responsibility for their own actions and realize that their own land comes with a price, and that to get there, they need to recognize that independence means no longer being able to kill Jews or allow their countrymen to kill Jews, any peace efforts Israel agrees to will continue to be as fruitless as Oslo.

Israel has done wrong. It is in a hard situation in a bad neighborhood. It is forced to make t

22

I'm no really here,

15/09/2007 12:55:59

"equating Islam with violence and terrorism" There is a lot of evidence to suggest this statement is true.

23

Boy Wonder,

15/09/2007 15:12:44

Conan, I believe in equal opportunities for all. Therefore I dislike ALL religious superstitions that are a carryover from the days our ancient forebears needed gods to blame for everything.

The human race is proving quite capable of monstrous deed without the need of gods.

It's time we all grew up and believed in the capability of ourselves to deal with the real world!

We harmed it ... it's up to us to cure it!

24

Maria Thomson la guapa,

15/09/2007 15:14:41

(on telephone to the Doctor's receptionist)

"Aw hi can I book an appointment?"

Receptionist: "... aw sorry not possible the doctor had to go buy some nails and t.n.t. and fill his S.U.V. with fuel for a bombing raid at Abbotsinch"

25

Maria Thomson la guapa,

15/09/2007 15:20:35

#24
Boy Blunder you and I actually agree ...

...on something at last...!!!

The sooner there are no more religious eejits left and everybody on this planet is an atheist or an agnostic ...
... the better ...!

... and the safer this world will be.

Burn all churches / mosques/ etc etc ... they only produce numpties with the intellectual reasoning skills of a wasp ready to sting anything which does not fit with its world.

People who believe in god are fools; eejits; war-monger; racists ... and mad.

Belief in god only produces self-deluded eejits who think they are smugly superior to the infidels; non-believers etc etc.

Kill the F**kin' lot of them ... religious eejits and wa**ers ...!!!

26

Coffee Lover,

15/09/2007 15:46:24

20. thatscottishwoman 2

You dug your own grave when you contantly bad mouthed the Scotsman and defended the Troll Djookers. Now why don't you go away!!!

27

TimW1234,

Ottawa, Canada 15/09/2007 17:56:25

Conan/Onan (joke)

I went to that link and you have many wise words to impart to us.

If some Islamists were not such murderous thugs then we would not have this supposed "Islamaphobia".

Doudou Diene sounds like a real Dodo (one of the stupidest birds to have ever existed, now extinct) and he is NOT a good representative or spokesperson for the United Nations.

May he and his finding go the way of the Dodo bird.

28

Food Bank,

Africa 15/09/2007 18:13:24

20. thatscottishwoman 2

You disgust me you hypocrite

29

Trond,

The cloud to the left. 15/09/2007 18:16:29

# 21. Dave From Barra:

The alleged racism is not in entering Islam, but that Muslims are not free to leave Islam.

When counting gods you forgot both Little Satan and Great Satan.

30

Food Bank,

Africa 15/09/2007 18:16:48

#15 thatscottishwoman - Liar!

"I now very rarely post on the Scotsman due, mainly, to the polarised views of posters particularly with regard to the Israeli/Palestinian conflict"

Just in the last 24 hours you have posted more comments than the average poster on the International pages.

31

Dave From Barra,

Western Isles 15/09/2007 18:35:52

Ah Trond @30. Very good. Like your comment, thank you.

32

Maria Thomson la guapa,

15/09/2007 19:06:07

Ach the sooner we just drop nuclear bombs on all the Arab countries the better ... get rid of all of these dodgy Islamic jihadi numpties ... who would miss them anyway??

33

Conan,

Here 15/09/2007 19:52:27

#20 - Oh, most wonderful and fair of all the lovely Scottish women - indeed, the reading of your gracious and thoughtful post has my crest standing as full and erect as the Gods ever intended - all is well in the universe .... and forgiveness and understanding to all who may disagree with me. It is not my purpose to convert anyone to my own point-of-view, as i probably lack that power. I will settle for some dimunition of the cowardly and myopic 'Death to Israel' mantra chanted continually by some who post here .... although I understand that they can't help themselves, much like when a snail shrinks when doused with salt, or, in their case when an anti-Israel/Zionist/Jew/Bush/Blair/US/etc. cultist is doused with the truth and the facts; the effect being about the same.

34

Rose Clan,

Perth 15/09/2007 20:04:29

34. Conan, Here

Most eloquent words I cannot disagree with.

35

Eric D,

Glasgow 15/09/2007 20:08:49

Islamaphobia - fear of islam.
After rudimentary research ,I'm proud to be Islamaphobic. In fact I think there should be annual awards.

No 8 : I disagree with the 1 st paragraph Sweden 1st, Uk 2nd.
Things are not going well in Scandinavia, but probably not worse than here.
http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/2278

No 25 : That's funny, but not so funny when two of the Islamist terrorists bombers were brought her under New Labours' "fresh talent initiative"

36

Maria Thomson la guapa,

15/09/2007 20:18:45

#35
Yea well said Eric ...
Islam is dodgy by nature


... I am always amazed at those who harp on about Islam being a broad church

... and they are not all jihadis etc etc

Well these so-called Moderate Muslims

... go to the same mosques and madrassas

.. as the jihadis

... then they are shocked after the latest atrocity

... and wheel out the usual ...
..."ohh but his family are respectable Muslims"
etc etc etc etc ...!!!


No I think the sooner we scrap all religions the better ... and safer this planet will be

37

oder,

Scotland 15/09/2007 20:21:17

"silence religious practices by banning the construction of mosques".

and this you claim is racism? Islamaphobia?


Saudi Arabia forbids religious worship of all faiths other than is Islam and bans construction of churches
and places of worship,this then is racism,Christianphobia and this
country is clearly guilty state sponsored racism.
Mr Doudou Diene we have an old saying here
'clean the dust from your own door step, before you try to clean mine.
Suggest the UN find a more appropriate representitive who is`nt biaist!

38

Maria Thomson la guapa,

15/09/2007 21:04:53

Arab countries ... who'd miss 'em??

LET'S JUST NUKE ALL THE ARAB COUNTRIES NOW.

39

Boy Wonder,

15/09/2007 21:22:52

#38. Maria ... having been a contributor here for some time now, I think most regulars know how much I feeel about religious superstition. It's very much a case of you're coming up to speed with the long term posters.

You might just get your wish about the Middle East, because I think some idiot somewhere is going to think a tactical nuclear strike is worthwhile and will press a button.

In the long run, no matter what we think or believe ... it will be the wrong decision. But that won't matter be then!

40

2dogs in D.C.,

15/09/2007 22:50:06

Boy Wonder-I fear you may be right.

41

Silence of the Yams,

15/09/2007 23:35:49

It's quite obvious in the nuclear age that Islamism is more dangerous than Nazism and Bolshevism combined. Liberals still prefer Osama to Bush of course.

42

Home_Sweet_Home,

Who Cares 15/09/2007 23:59:33

#41

He said they hated us for our freedoms
So he took our freedoms away
That'll teach them, he thought

43

thatscottishwoman 2,

16/09/2007 10:01:05

#34 Conan:

And forgiveness and understanding to all who may disagree with me;-)


 

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