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The changing face of gangland crime

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Published Date:
10 March 2008
THEY were Glasgow's hard men, feared and reviled by everyone they met and living up to their reputations as Scotland's most dangerous criminals. Each had a nickname as sharp as the blades they used: the Godfather, the Licensee, the Torturer.
But the sun has set on the empires each of them built up from protection rackets, armed robberies and extortion. Crime (UK) Ltd is under new management, and it is largely foreign owned. Police across Britain are grappling with a new generation of criminal "kingpins", whose empires span the globe and who model their operations on legitimate multinational companies.

While the "dons" of the past revelled in their notoriety, displaying their ill-gotten gains through sharp suits and flashy cars, today's gang leaders aim to be faceless "executives" as familiar with spreadsheets as their predecessors were with knuckle-dusters. Foreign nationals, including Russian, Albanian and Turkish émigrés, now have a stranglehold on organised crime in the UK.

The authorities estimate there are 400 organised crime bosses in Britain, with an amassed criminal wealth of about £440 million.

So-called "dirty money", or assets derived from crime, represents a staggering 2 per cent of the UK's GDP, or £18 billion. And up to half of that is derived from illegal drug transactions.

Meanwhile, the economic and social costs of serious organised crime are estimated at between £20 billion and £40 billion a year – compared with the country's £30 billion defence budget.

Gordon Meldrum, director-general of the Scottish Crime and Drug Enforcement Agency (SCDEA), said the profile of the criminal gang leader had changed, from a local hard man to an educated foreign criminal whose contacts spanned the globe.

"These people are entrepreneurial in nature and run criminal empires on business lines and see themselves as the chief executives," he said.

"They'll have a board of some kind and often have a structure to the organisation. There are a number of specialities that facilitate the crime groups…experts in transport, legal and legislative systems. The commodity could be heroin, people, firearms, money, drugs. They're interested in power and profit."

Abdullah Baybasin, 46, is an example of the new generation of "chief executive" running a multinational criminal enterprise. The head of a Turkish drug family, he was said to control 90 per cent of the heroin smuggled into Britain and was jailed for 22 years in May 2006. Police took five years to bring Baybasin and his gang to justice in an operation that involved painstaking surveillance of mobile telephone records and private correspondence before he could be arrested.

Another lead player was Tony Singh Hare, one of Britain's most prolific drug dealers, who was given a record sentence of 52 years in 2003. He was found guilty at Leicester Crown Court of drug-trafficking, conspiracy to supply Class A drugs and fraud. Hare, 37, had organised supplies of heroin, Ecstasy and cannabis to dealers in Scotland, north-east England, Nottingham and Derby.

The criminal landscape in Britain has become increasingly volatile in recent years. Previous generations of Italian, Maltese and English gangsters have given way to a new Mafia with its own "Kanun", a code of behaviour similar to the Sicilian "omerta".

Foreign traffickers have managed to infiltrate the British drugs market, but the lead suppliers remain in a state of flux. Smugglers of Pakistani origin are moving in on the heroin trade, which Turkish gangs dominated in the 1990s, while Yardie criminals with Jamaican connections control much of the UK's cannabis and crack trade. The reason for such turf wars is simple: the drugs trade in the UK has been estimated to be worth about £6.6 billion a year.

One consequence of the new global market is that Scottish criminals are now going further afield. Mr Meldrum said: "Organised crime groups from Scotland are going into central Europe and missing out the middle man. They broker the deal themselves, and go directly to South America and Europe."

A recent two-year operation led by the SCDEA's predecessor, the SDEA, culminated in eight tonnes of cannabis being recovered from a British-registered trawler intercepted off the west coast of Spain. It involved months of surveillance, and Spanish police, Europol, Customs and the National Crime Squad all worked with the SDEA to capture the men behind it.

Officers seized £61 million worth of drugs, including heroin and cocaine, and arrested nine men in the UK and Spain. The ringleader, John Gorman, from Ayrshire, was given a 12-year sentence after he was found guilty of being involved in the supply of drugs with a street value of more than £360,000 and laundering £178,000 of drug money.

These days "the commodity" for the crime bosses is anything that generates a profit – heroin, cocaine, firearms, people, child pornography and tobacco.

Global profits from people-smuggling are estimated to be £5 billion annually, and every £1 spent on heroin is estimated to generate about £4 of damage to the national economy.

The underworld bosses operate across global frontiers in tight-knit gangs, display in-depth knowledge of law enforcement methods and exploit sophisticated technologies to conceal their activities from the authorities.

The government hopes that British expertise in areas such as forensic accountancy will make it increasingly difficult for organised criminals to hide their money in legitimate businesses.

The changing face of organised crime in Scotland was highlighted recently when a senior police officer spoke of his fears that the country had become a haven for drug-running Triad gangs. Detective Chief Superintendent Stevie Whitelock, the head of intelligence at Strathclyde Police, said organised criminals had turned Scotland into a cannabis greenhouse. Up to £1 billion of the drug is being cultivated each year in houses and warehouses that are converted into drug farms by a large-scale organised crime gang linked to south-east Asia.

The farms are staffed by illegal immigrants, who are locked inside properties for 24 hours a day. In the past year, 33,000 plants worth £40 million have been seized. It is believed much of the cannabis is exported by Chinese-Vietnamese crime groups, with the profits being channelled back to south-east Asia, where the money is laundered in tourism.

Police have identified about 70 cannabis factories in Scotland since the summer of 2006. Most have been set up by Vietnamese and Chinese gangs, converting houses and warehouses into factories, mainly in west of Scotland suburbs. The factories are capable of producing tens of millions of pounds worth of the illicit crop.

In 2006, it was reported Scottish criminals were stepping up their connections with organised gangs across Europe, including the Mafia, to benefit from lucrative drugs and money- laundering schemes. There is evidence of growing co-operation between criminal gangs in Scotland and those based in eastern Europe and other parts of the Continent.

Emigration from eastern Europe has also led to a surge in the sex trade, which is increasingly run by Albanian and other Balkan criminals. According to Scotland Yard, about 75 per cent of brothels in London's Soho are controlled by Albanians, who annually make up to £12 million from 1,000 prostitutes.

But the problem is not confined to the south of England. Police launched Operation Pentameter 2 last October when it emerged that foreign nationals as young as 14 were being forced into sex slavery throughout the UK.

Strathclyde Police confirmed that a dozen live investigations were under way north of the Border, and it is estimated that in Scotland alone there are 6,000 foreign nationals working as prostitutes, many of them from eastern Europe and south-east Asia.

Scottish criminals are also working with gangs in Estonia and Latvia to launder money, because the banking stipulations and legislation in those countries are less stringent than they are in the UK.

The seriousness of the threat from organised crime is such that underworld bosses are to be targeted by tough new laws making it easier to convict "Mafia godfathers".

As part of a crackdown, Kenny MacAskill, the justice secretary, has proposed new offences of directing or being involved in organised crime.

The planned new laws were endorsed recently at the second meeting of the Serious Organised Crime Taskforce, which brings together organisations such as the Crown Office, the Association of Chief Police Officers in Scotland, the SCDEA, the Serious Organised Crime Agency, HM Revenue and Customs and the Scottish Prison Service.

The government is also planning to add new offences indicating a criminal lifestyle to the Proceeds of Crime Act, including bribery and corruption, and distribution of child and extreme pornography.

Key areas targeted by 'chief executives' of criminal gangs

PEOPLE TRAFFICKING

ADULTS trafficked to the UK are used for sexual exploitation, cheap labour in agriculture and in the catering and construction industries. The main source countries are Albania, Belarus, Bulgaria, China, Malaysia, Moldova, Romania, Russia, Slovakia, Thailand, Ukraine, and Vietnam. Women have been sold in the UK for between £2,000 and £3,000. There are an estimated 6,000 foreign nationals working as prostitutes in Scotland, many from eastern Europe and South-east Asia.

DRUGS

TRAFFICKING of Class A drugs continues to be the most visible form of serious organised crime, providing billions of pounds for the black economy. About 90 per cent of the UK's identified heroin supply originates in Afghanistan and most of the supply to Europe is processed in Turkey.

Colombia continues to dominate the global supply of cocaine, and Spain and the Netherlands are the main entry points into Europe.

Organised criminals have turned Scotland into a cannabis greenhouse, with up to £1 billion of the drug being cultivated every year.

FRAUD

CRIMINALS are dynamic in identifying new opportunities to commit fraud and ways to overcome security measures. Payment card crime is a good example, where the introduction of Chip and Pin has led to an increase in "card not present" (CNP) fraud, especially CNP fraud carried out via telephone transactions. There has also been an increase in cheque frauds, including counterfeit cheques. Changes in technology, particularly the growth of the internet, have been exploited to develop new crimes and transform traditional ones. Criminals have also demonstrated versatility in exploiting IT security weaknesses.

MONEY LAUNDERING

THE initial stage of money laundering often involves moving cash out of the UK through couriers or via various money transmission services. However, many serious organised criminals make use of IT experts, as well as financial and legal professionals to handle their affairs.

So-called "dirty money" – or assets derived from crime – represent around 2 per cent of the UK's GDP, or £18 billion – up to half of which is derived from illegal drug transactions.

IDENTITY FRAUD

THIS area underpins a lot of organised crime and allows people to conceal themselves, their activities and their assets and minimise the risk of detection. Some organised crime groups are known to produce, supply or use false personal identities.

The ability to communicate securely is essential, and criminals make extensive use of face-to-face meetings and pay-as-you-go mobile phones to conceal their illegal activity.

TOBACCO

EXCISE fraudsters smuggle cigarettes and hand-rolling tobacco into the UK. Most smuggled genuine cigarettes come from Cyprus, Greece, Poland and Russia concealed in lorries and containers. More than 50 per cent of all seized smuggled cigarettes are counterfeit. China is the main producer of counterfeit cigarettes, but counterfeit cigarette factories have emerged throughout the EU.

Up to £40 billion a year is the bill Britain is forced to pay because of crimes like drugs and prostitution

THE economic and social costs of organised crime in the UK are estimated to be at least £20-40 billion per year.

• There are about 400 organised crime bosses in the UK with an amassed criminal wealth of approximately £440 million.

• Global profits from people smuggling are estimated to be £5 billion annually.

• 280,000 problem drug users cause around half of all crime in the UK.

• Every £1 spent on heroin is estimated to generate about £4 of damage to the national economy.

• Assets derived from crime represent about 2 per cent of the UK's GDP, or £18 billion – up to half of which is derived from illegal drug transactions.

• Since the Proceeds of Crime Act 2002 was implemented, more than £17 million has been recovered from criminal activity in Scotland.

• Up to £1 billion of cannabis is being cultivated every year in houses and warehouses converted into drug farms by a large-scale organised crime gangs linked to south-east Asia.

• Girls as young as 14 are being forced into sex slavery in the UK and Strathclyde Police confirmed recently that a dozen live investigations were under way north of the Border. It is estimated that in Scotland alone there are 6,000 foreign nationals working as prostitutes, many of them from eastern Europe and South-east Asia.


Page 1 of 1

 
1

Richardinho,

10/03/2008 00:32:54
There's no point. You're never going to stop people taking drugs or using prostitutes.
The success of organized crime is the failure of the nanny state.
you would be better off simply legalizing these things so it comes out into the open and can be regulated.
2

tomi,

10/03/2008 01:50:18
Oh! It is so good to know how concerned the government is, and that they are going after the real criminals and their merchandise!

Retailers who give out free plastic bags!!
3

Richardinho,

10/03/2008 02:14:19
#2 '#1 Richardinho, legalize and regulate? Shows your brain is addled by something.'

Well that's a nice considered mature response. Obviously you think that the streets aren't awash with drugs, that organized crime doesn't have a hold on the country, that prostitution doesn't exist etc etc.

Perhaps you should look at the reality and show a little bit more humility when criticizing other people's suggestions, when all the practiced options have so utterly failed.
4

Julian.,

edinburgh 10/03/2008 02:50:49
#3 Toni,

I agree. Those who are destroying the environment are the real criminals. Those who sell drugs and sex to those who want to buy those things are less of a concern.
5

,

10/03/2008 03:22:49
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
6

Princess Kevin,

raping that Albanian still 10/03/2008 03:39:08
PS - why is it that these hardened criminals always wear turtle neck jumpers?
7

most things - if in moderation,

10/03/2008 04:22:46
the Gov. are always pretty nifty at increasing your taxes, fuel, fags, booze.... never do much about these *ankers though.
MI5/6 should use this as a training excercise.... with assasinations etc

gready lawyers being told not in interfere!
8

Royster,

10/03/2008 05:06:08
#7 An interesting psychological question.
9

Drum Major,

Brisbane, Australia 10/03/2008 07:30:42
South America's sanctioned hit squads that took out the Mr Bigs of crime may not fit in with most views of law enforcement but they were effective. MI5 & MI6 would be protecting a lot more citizens with this approach. Drug users could not have become drug users without drug pushers. Legalised and well regulated prostitution in certain forms greatly reduces crime (and disease) in this area.
10

why can't I use my own name???,

musselburgh 10/03/2008 07:32:52
Post #7

Why? So you can't see the 'Cut here' home tattoo dotted around their neck that they got done when they were in the Young Team!
11

Drum Major,

Brisbane, Australia 10/03/2008 07:33:15
#6 Princess Kevin You're boasting arn't you!!
12

why can't I use my own name???,

musselburgh 10/03/2008 07:34:35
The changing face changed long ago in Edinburgh. Just think of a major George Street bar or two and a couple at the West End. I will not go into them because of their 'connections'.
13

TREV,

Poland 10/03/2008 08:04:03
The problem with the prostitution is that a lot of these girls are kidnapped. Interesting about the Albanians owning the brothels. between that and heroin dealing I wonder how the Kosovo Liberation Army got all its funds.
14

TommyAtkins,

Edinburgh 10/03/2008 08:11:46
"You're never going to stop people taking drugs or using prostitutes." <<< RUBBISH. Whilst it is true that you will never stop ALL people using, people are rational and respond to incentives. Make the cost go up, and people will use less. And it is not just financial costs; e.g. effective penalties for those in the drug trade; like real confiscation of their ill gotten gains, e.g. publish the names and address of all persons found associated with the sex trade, etc. See Tim Harford's 'the Logic of Life'.
15

Richardinho,

10/03/2008 08:24:52
#16 oh right. We haven't stopped people since history began, but suddenly we're going to stop them now! The nanny state approach has failed; either you accept that and try new approaches or else you continue to delude yourself you can stop the tide coming in as things get slowly worse.
16

scottish person,

paisley 10/03/2008 09:33:39
Teflon tony and maggie broon are quite obviously involved in this, just look how our army are being used to protect the poppy growers in afghanistan
17

joppa jock,

Huntingdon 10/03/2008 10:07:55
Our police forces are hamstrung with paper work or too busy trying to win diversity awards to pursue the big time criminals. Much easier to ignore them and get on with the task of pursuing litter louts and motorists. It's unlikely that they will be armed and put up resistance, or that they will have access to expensive criminal lawyers. How did they all manage to set up their bases in this country anyway? Where were the safeguards that should have turned them all back at the border?
18

Miss H,

10/03/2008 10:11:31
Richardino we're actually talking aboutb trafficking here - girls being trafficked and forced into prostitution.

You want to legalise that do you?

Bring back slavery? Hm.... don't think that one works for me, sorry!
19

,

10/03/2008 10:11:35
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
20

TimW1234,

Ottawa, Canada 10/03/2008 10:29:51
Oh God, Draghead is back!

I find his posting incomprehensible and it would seem he is in a state of heightened awareness brought on by drugs, alcohol, or incipient insanity.

And he is a hypocrite for saying that someone else's brain is "addled". If Draghead had a brain to be addled his would look like scrambled eggs. What a waste of space.
21

Air Sense,

South Africa 10/03/2008 10:35:44
I write wrt the crime issues highlighted in the main article . I have read the article and the comments that followed and here's my take for what it's worth . I am also assuming that my comments might survive on the screen unlike my many attempts on the MSN Blogs. Malaysia and Indonesia impose the death penalty for drug dealing however that will be repudiated in the west by the various cowardice governments . Here's another solution . With draw all social and medical benefits from the nanny state . People like athletes should pass a drugs test first before being assessed . THat takes care of the social level iro drugs . Wrt to prostitution , indeed I agree , legalise it and tax it with a madatory sterilisation provisio for the the people plying their trade . Wrt to smoking , micropchip smokers and provider them with a licence to smoke but exclude them from claiming for any nicotine induced ailments . For the rest I fear that there is nothing more effective than the death penalty . So in all these instances everyone is functioning within an informed envirnoment , is aware of the risks they run and if they continue to proceed it is at the expense of the aforementioned sacrifices . Now I have to ask What do you think and comment that Princess Kevs will find himself hardpressed ( excuse the pun) to cope and also do himself a wilful injury !
22

Air Sense,

South Africa 10/03/2008 10:40:23
Now here's a paradox ! My husband who is British - paka born and bred in England and emigrated here 38 yrs ago (as at the time of his return to the UK ) left me behind because he didnot want to be tainted by the suspicions my colour might raise and subject him to in good old Liverpool . Yep he said crime was high there and I might be considered a criminal or associate of one so I had to get with the programme and live in my homeland period ! Now when I examine the stats I see that he was half right . He was after all an ex Merseyside metro policeman . Just goes to show and there I was feeling sorry for myself .
23

zorba,

airdrie 10/03/2008 10:49:52
The local gangland boss in airdrie has made his money through drugs, now owns pubs and a security firm. He isnt a foreigner he is a white scottish male. Now everyone in airdrie knows who this person is except the Police, Why dont the SDEA target these people or are they too smart. Why cant we do what the USA did with Al Capone and get them for tax evasion
24

ddmc,

10/03/2008 10:52:19
cannibus - legalise & regulate = £billions in point of sale taxes

smack, crack & crystal meth - NHS supplied in return for long term contraception injections

mushies - legalise

prohibition has never worked, legalise & tax is the best way forward, also puts a large dent in pockets & less appealing to foriegn criminals
25

,

10/03/2008 10:57:40
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
26

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 11:02:20
What a meaningless, thoughtless, slavish article. The illegality of drugs brings huge dividends to both criminals AND the authorities. It has delivered gun violence, para military policing, and the fear culture. It increases authoritarian government... justifies more and more stop and search... the invasion of private bank accounts... the corruption of our legal system. Illegality is an industry paying great salaries and pensions on both sides. Drugs mean nothing without prohibition. They're less dangerous than walking on the pavement. Legalise and regulate before your children are all criminalized and stripped of the real career opportunities that they're entitlrd to.
27

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 10/03/2008 11:28:05
#30, excellent post. Thanks. The voice of reason and common sense.
28

Sanny,

10/03/2008 11:30:28
Draconian problems require a draconian response.
Anyone guilty of drug use has the option of a lengthy time in jail with no support i.e. they “come-off” drugs on their own. Or they can ‘shop’ their supplier and give testimony; in which case their sentence would then be an enforced period of supported Re-hab.

For those further up the feeding chain a similar process should apply. Life imprisonment and loss of all wealth traceable to the individual and the immediate family (not proceeds of crime – all wealth). Alternative is shop those above and depending on their conviction a significant reduction in the sentence. The more valuable the information the more the punishment is reduced.

This way we could crawl up the feeding chain until we get to the upright citizens in suits that finance this trade. They should hang!

Prostitution: Recognise that this will go on as long as there are men and women. Legalise it. Allow girls to set up their own closely regulated business with no men involved; unless of course they are male prostitutes with their own business. No foreigners permitted anyone guilty of running a foreign girl gets life in prison as a slaver.

Draconian YES!! Effective YES!!
29

boudica,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 11:36:04
If the Police know who all these forgiegn criminals are then why are they still be allowed to operate here also why doesnt the Government ask the UK Underworld to help get these people out ..
30

Sanny,

10/03/2008 11:36:46
To those that call for drugs to be legalised I can only assume they have softened their brains on drugs already. I cannot imagine a worst case scenario than to legalise Drugs
31

boudica,

Glasgow .. 10/03/2008 11:38:38
Excuse spelling errors ..as this subject really makes me angry as to how these people are allowed to keep operating here ..as in the 60`s the Police stopped the American mafia from making any ground here and I wonder why the hell the Police in the 21st Century just dont do anything to stop this going on ......
32

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 10/03/2008 11:40:16
This is vicious....the future of British children could be one of drug addiction and prostitution....good on the polis....fighting a losing battle as its a vicious circle...men will always want to use prostitutes and people will always want to use drugs.....legalise prostitution and decriminalise hash (except for tax evasion)...can you imagine the amount of money, time and energy, that goes into chasing these cannabis farms?....why not take the criminal aspect away...let Brits grow their own....if people can buy booze and get steaming its madness to criminalise hash. I am aware that it can trip mental illness in some people but then so can prescribed drugs, alcohol, abusive relationships and life in general..however...we are creating the conditions for these mafia criminals to profit from....

As far as organised prostitution is concerned...legalise it...support the women that are involved and make it safer for them...for their health and that of the punters (and their wives and partners)..if men want to pay for sex and women want to sell it then take out the middle man....

Something radical needs to happen because the current system aint working...its harbouring criminals..
33

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 11:50:16
#31 Erm... thanks a lot. very kind. It is such a pity that us ordinary people have to struggle against this agenda on the hour, every hour, 24-7, as we're battered by these awful distortions of everyday life. Illegality > high profits > gangsterism > violence > armed police > blood on the streets > posturing politicians > bad law... etc. It's all so relentless and it MUST be so well understood by the authorities whom we pay. It's too sad for words. By the way, I hope I qualify as a Glasgow hard man... a strong, honest, decent hard man. It's the only way to survive this bulls***!
34

Memyself&I,

10/03/2008 12:00:08
#34 Sanny
Perhaps not legalised, controlled would be a better option. Sounds to me as though you are very out of touch with modern day living. Drugs have become part of our culture in the UK. Drugs are here to stay. There isn;t anyway way on earth that the autorities can stop drug use. But they have the means to control it.
Same goes for prostitution.
35

Purlie Wilson,

Melbourne 10/03/2008 12:05:48
H'mmm !! Well if they think that lot are hard men just a as well they did not get to meet the Hoey St lads of yesteryear.
36

Last furlong,

10/03/2008 12:06:53
"400 organised crime bosses in Britain, with an amassed criminal wealth of about £440 million."


Hardly Al Capone.
37

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 12:13:21
# Good luck Daniel... Health and safety would have a role... and just think of all that VAT revenue which could be reinvested in sports facilities and further education... you know, GOOD STUFF. That would be nice.
38

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 10/03/2008 12:39:23
45..I agree with what you say to an extent Clarry, however you will never stop prostitution, its as old as the ground we walk on. Unfortunatly it does mean that women can be subjugated and abused...however if we took away the need for a pimp and 'protection' then this would surely give them some of their power back. The reality is that even if it was legalised prostitutes would still be beaten, raped and abused...

I am for state controlled prostitution...with the emphasis on empowering prostitutes to deliver their services in a safe, non-violent or abusive situation. If the government were ever to agree to this they would have to work closely with prostitute support services in order to realistically address the issue..
39

bruce borland,

oshawa 10/03/2008 13:32:38
"Up to £1 billion of cannabis is being cultivated every year in houses and warehouses converted into drug farms by a large-scale organized crime gangs"..simple, why cannot anyone get it, legalize cannabis, the farmers legally grow it making much neede revenue and eliminating organized crime,tax it and voila we have the defense bill covered and the police will be free to challenge the other serious drugs...when will politicians ever get it that cannabis is here to stay and get over the foolish phobias...prohibition never works...
40

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 10/03/2008 13:35:26
#49, > State controlled prostitution and the legitimising of of drugs is a cop-out and shows the kind of society we want to live in. Is this legitimate? <

Yes. Nothing I can think of would cut crime more, and help the unfortunate victims of prostitution and drug addiction more, than these two simple, common-sense reforms.

Only sunctimonious puritanism keeps us from such a sensible solution.
41

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 10/03/2008 13:36:48
That should, of course, be "sanctimonious", although "sunctimonious" does have a certain ring to it!
42

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 10/03/2008 13:48:19
#54, we'll have to disagree. I'm interested solely in practicalities and in protecting people. I'm not interested in abstract moral stances. Prostitution and drugs are perfectly acceptable, in my view, as long as those taking part do so willingly and are protected from exploitation.

Legalising both is, in my view, the best way to achieve this.
43

Allan(handofgod137),

10/03/2008 13:48:22
#30 Good post, you have to wonder why the politicians regard legalisation and control with such horror, are they getting kickbacks from the drugs cartels, or is it that legalising prostitution wouldn't cover underage prostitutes?
44

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 10/03/2008 13:51:01
#57, glad we agree on that, although I don't see why heroin users shouldn't stay on the drug indefinitely under medical supervision.
45

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 14:04:18
There's always been a huge demand for both contract sex and drugs... so bring it all into the corporate mainstream. Pay secure wages, good medical benefits, early pension plans and holiday schemes... have recruitment interviews for wannabe tarts... create a career path and annual reviews... pass the Prostitution (health and safety) Act... have licenses and inspectors like pubs... create hooker and management courses at Glasgow Caley... bring advertising under Advertising Standards... drop "brothels" and rebrand as "Happy Houses"... ensure the HHs produce auditted accounts and pay tax under threat of losing the license/profits... have a heated shelter out the back for a pre-coital joint or a post-coital cigarette... and then, just like pubs and restaurants, you would have expensive chic, cheap and cheerful and, forgive me, "greasy spoons". Those that want to work there and those that want to go can be happy, non-violent, unthreatened and non-threatening. The tarts could save up and buy a car and a wee house just like the rest of us, and the really good ones would earn a lot just like top sports people. After all, loveless sex is sport, isn't it? I would have no difficulty with my grown-up children participating in such an enterprise either as customers or suppliers. And besides, I might want to myself one day but I doubt it. Oh and watch out for the Holy Willies, the dreadful do-gooders like in Jersey or the Catholic care homes... Time for my nap!
46

Paloma negra,

Leeds Yorkshire (almost escocia) 10/03/2008 16:06:25
Why are we surprised that the nature of crime has changed??
47

Paloma negra,

10/03/2008 16:07:14
Surely the question we should ask is how do we deal with it??
48

On Guard,

Ontario Canada 10/03/2008 16:11:44
Bring back capitol punishment. If you are not with the state, then you are a hinderence to the state. Don't feed them steak! Feed them firing squad lead. Pretty sure the rest will take heed.
49

Air Sense,

South Africa 10/03/2008 16:12:41
Dead Right 32 Sanny . I agree . Drug addicts cannot be rehabilitated - they always relapse . I speak from experience in my practice . Over a period of 12 years I saw the old ones relapse systematically and their numbers grow . THe police don't prosecute because many of the policemen are on the take or drug addicts themselves anyway and many of the victims of such enterprise are their suppliers . It's a vicious circle . There is no single race group to blame either - everybody is in the business and each strives to be the worst there is . Although it is a global problem I have to ask , how did it become so big in the UK and in Scotland of all places when the British had the best police force in the world or has labour been derelict in its duty to protect its citizens ? !!
50

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 16:16:38
#67 Actually it's "capital" not "capitol" punishment, if that helps. I must say that I'm glad that a natural born killer such as yourself is so far away. Don't worry about us too much. We can handle it.
51

On Guard,

10/03/2008 16:18:37
Hey Ike, are you on glue. TAx man needs his cut to support all that crap. They will do it for tax free cash no matter what. Don't declare the income! SHoot them. Buy all the ass you want, remit the tax and quit F'n the state .
52

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 16:25:26
#68 How did it become so big in the UK, you ask. The answer is because it's so very popular with lots of people... all kinds of people... including brave soldiers/officers in Afghanistan... teachers... nurses.... doctors... policemen... ordinary people. They like it... therefore they are the market. They also know how to use it. The casualty rate is really very, very small... smaller than say drinking or driving and drinking and driving... Save us from corruption and gangsterism. Legalise and regulate now.
53

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 16:30:05
# 70 Please raise the standard, On Guard. The Scotsman's supposed to be a quality paper for quality arguements. I think the idea of "buying all the ass you want" coupled with your love of killing people, reveals such a lot about you.
54

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 10/03/2008 16:49:26
68...This is not true...they may not be rehabilitated in huge numbers but there are plenty of ex addicts who have turned their back on their drug of choice...smokers and drinkers also....and plenty of them work to support others still suffering from addiction....they are out there man...dont believe the hype...
55

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 16:51:09
I believe that the law provides for a prison sentence of up to two years for possession of Class C drugs like cannabis. Support the rule of law! Demand that the courts enforce the law and sentence all possession offences to 2 years imprisonment. Send all drug users to jail, everyone of them. Ha Ha Ha. When the law is not enforced - and how can it be - it discredits the rule of law. Big danger. Drugs policy will destroy us - drugs never will.
56

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 16:55:29
# Doreen. I've been reading your posts. Good luck to you Ma'am, for reminding everyone that we are all just folk and we judge the quality of our community by the way we treat those in difficulty.
57

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 17:14:37
One further little BIG point. Drug users are not drug addicts. There are of course drug addicts who need support to break their addiction... they represent the casualty rate. But wouldn't it be helpful to people like Doreen if we had some politicians - and they all know the hard evidence - who were not frozen with fear by the police/media mutual interest in promoting universal rampant addiction. It's simply a big fat lie pushed by police - to apply for bigger budgets - and swallowed on the cheap by the media to cling onto their falling circulations. If all drug users were addicts, then much of our brave military are addicts with heavy weapons - and Prince Harry is an ex-junky.
58

Malc.F,

10/03/2008 17:37:28
I must agree wuth the second post by Richardinho for criricising those like Dragonhead who uses any excuse to blame the current government of the UK for every ill in society, while not attempting to offer a solution.
It is the fault of society and dare I say too many bad influences from the "freeest society in the world"
I was lucky when drugs were all the thing in the sixties,way before Blair came to power, that I had the sense to not partake of the hard drugs, my late brother was not so lucky.
The people who make lots of money from this evil trade are the scum of society and WE should do something about it, the government can only make laws and give guidance to the courts etc. and you can see that the sentences mentioned are pretty onerous so leave out the politicking. Even the horrendous Thatcher would disapprove of this sort of free enterprise.
59

Richardinho,

10/03/2008 18:23:38
'Richardino we're actually talking aboutb trafficking here - girls being trafficked and forced into prostitution.

You want to legalise that do you?

Bring back slavery? Hm.... don't think that one works for me, sorry!'

Oh my god, I'm dealing with complete morons here! If prostitution was legalised and regulated, it wouldn't be controlled by ruthless criminals who do that kind of thing.

A legal enterprise, subject to regulation, cannot get away with kidnapping and enslaving people; an Illegal one can.
60

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 19:11:09
#81 82

I think that what you're saying recommends that non-criminals take over the distribution and supply of these substances and operate well-regulated properly audited businesses, This releases the police and hands ill people over to the health service. It's so obvious a solution that it begs the question why doesn't it happen. The answer is that there is no political will to address drugs. Our authorities and public representatives therefore perpetuate the despair for perverse, scandalous and cowardly reasons. The chaos can only be tackled by NON-criminals taking over the supply chain which depends on legalisation.
61

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 19:13:52
#81 PS...
If the law ever changes, let's talk!
62

Sambo,

The deep south 10/03/2008 19:31:42
First of all the UK courts are far to lenient on criminals. As you have no capital punishment make it a mandatory life sentence without the possibility of parole for anyone caught dealing in narcotics. Also the Scottish public should be encouraged and rewarded for information leading to the arrest of anyone involved in it.
I was a victim in 2002 when narcotics agents broke down the door of the flat I was renting to make an arrest. I had found out there was suspicious activity going on and issued a sherrif warrant for eviction. Only days before they were to vacate the drug task force struck.
By the way, I paid for a new door, the criminals were back on the street a week later.
63

Ike,

Glasgow 10/03/2008 20:06:26
#85
It sounds as if you're in the US - certainly not Scotland. We don't have "narcotics" here... we have drugs. Nor do we have the death penalty or sherrif warrants. And we certainly do not want to turn Scotland into a nation of dnitches. I'm sorry about your personal exeriences and hope things are better. But we have nothing to learn from American drug policy, certainly not mandatory life imprisonment. We would not want to import failed US drug policies which would destroy us all. We have already imported far too much from the US in terms of gangsterism and gun crime.
64

GalacticCannibal,

Murrieta 10/03/2008 20:23:11
Dragonhead,
China 10/03/2008 00:51:49

U WROTE:
...and why target the good old UK for organized crime? Stands out like 'dogs'balls', as, in denial UK, slips deeper and deeper into the morass!
#1 Richardinho, legalize and regulate? Shows your brain is addled by something.
EU+Teflon Tony=Socialist Utopia1 Hahahahahahahha!Who voted for him?Hahahahaha, not just once, or twice or...Hahahahah! Who is laughing now?

---------------------------------------------
Hey Dude I will tell U who is NOT laughing now.

Ur fellow Chinese, all 1.3 billion of them. Who are deprived of voting their conscience, and be able to elect their leaders.

Ur country CHINA, perpetrates the most massive crime , against individual freedom and the rights of its citizens to vote and free speech ,in human history.

No where on Earth are 1.3 billion people deprived of their human rights except in Ur country CHINA.

To put the magnitude of Ur Chinese crime into perspective

Its the same as if Governments in all countries listed below, banned their people from voting.

Russia, UK, Germany, France,
Spain, Italy, Australia,
Holland, Sweden, Ireland,
Japan, USA, Canada, Mexico,
Brazil, Argentina, Denmark, Finland.
Portugal, Norway,.

A massive human rights crime, would u not say Dude.

Yet U live in CHINA where that crime happens.
And from where u constantly criticize these other countries and their people who CAN and DO vote..

Hey Dude don't forget to send that CCP report on the number of Chinese u guys execute every year.

GC
65

Sambo,

The deep south 10/03/2008 20:23:31
Ike,
I am in the US and I did have a court ordered sheriff's warrant to evict, as my first attempt was ignored.
My point being is: the courts are far too lenient and regardless of American influence the drug problem is not going away anytime soon. In fact it's going to get worse. Now criminals are concocting their own narcotics such as crystal meth. which can be made from over the counter supplies such as antihistamines in their own home!
Scots should not be branded as snitches for informing on this activity, for gods sake take the blinkers off!
66

Sambo,

The deep south 10/03/2008 20:31:04
Ike,
Speaking of snitches. Tam "the licensee" was one of the worst in Glasgow. By "snitching" as you say on his fellow criminals, he was given a "free reign" by the Strathclyde police to go on with his own illegal activities. It's true what they say about "no honor in thieves", there's a perfect example.
Also Arther Thompson, the godfather. He was a "snitch" for MI5.
67

MurphyD,

10/03/2008 20:50:44
And who was it that let in all of these Albanian criminals? It was Tony Blair who, in 1999, bombed our loyal allies, the Christian Serbs, for having the audacity to stand up to an Islamo-mafia separatist rebellion by minority Albanians. At the same time, our Tony allowed 1000s of Albanian thugs into our country under the guise of being refugees. Nice one Tone.
68

GalacticCannibal,

Murrieta, CA...bye Bush -Cheney..u. evil leaders. 10/03/2008 22:57:34
91
clarry,
--------------------------------------

Do u live in a country where u are not able to vote. Or do U live in China .

Its Shock and Awe. dude, prosecuted by our Commander in Chief ,the evil Pres Bush and his equally evil VP Cheney.

In Shock and Awe, we used missiles made by Raytheon and Sambo Deep South. was one of the proud dudes who worked on Raytheon's missile programs.

GC
69

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 10/03/2008 23:42:00
#11
I was in Thailand when the government decided to crack down on methamphetimine dealers. Over a 3 month period 1200 corpses appeared in the streets. The paper everyday would have the new body count from the previous nights drugwar. It turns out that half the people who got killed weren't drug dealers after all. Just someone who owed somebody money or cheating spouses. People were informing the police on anyone they had a grudge with. 1 year later the drug business was back in full swing. You will never be able to solve the drug problem through law enforcement. Much better just to decriminalize it at regulate it.
70

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 10/03/2008 23:52:45
"400 organised crime bosses in Britain, with an amassed criminal wealth of about £440 million."
Is he talking about Westminster?
71

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 11/03/2008 00:12:56
#24 Non Sense from South Africa
Indonesia may have the death penalty, but drugs are still very prevalent. You seem to want to target anyone who has any habit you don't like. No wonder MSN pulled your comment, your an imbecile.

A recent study by the National Institute for Public Health and the Environment in the Netherlands has shown that the life time health care costs of healthy people is higher than that of smokers and obese people. This may seem counterintuitive but the fact that healthy people live longer means that they will end up costing the system more.

In the study of three groups of 1,000 people from age 20 onward it was found that healthy people lived to 84 years, the obese live 80 years and smokers lived to 77. Over their lifetime smokers cost $326,000, obese people cost $371,000 and healthy people cost $417,000.

Cancer risk for all three groups was the same except for Lung Cancer which was more prevalent among the smokers. Heart Disease was highest among smokers and the obese while healthy people tended to suffer more from diseases of old age such as Stroke and Alzheimer's Disease.
72

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 11/03/2008 00:18:44
98 continued.

Add that to all the excessive taxes smokers have to pay and all you non smokers are getting a free ride.
73

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 11/03/2008 00:42:44
#85
I don't think the Scotland has anything to learn from the United States when it comes to dealing with illegal drug use. The American solution of locking everybody up has lead you to become the most imprisoned society in the world. The US currently has 1% of its adult population behind bars. And you still haven't solved your drug problem.
74

Trade-wind,

USA 11/03/2008 01:14:37
There is only one way to get rid of the criminal element.
Kill them. First offence last offence. Period!
May take some time, but as you take this course
the regular people who use the services of these
criminal are to be punished with community work
projects. Clean streets, paint buildings, repair roads.
It will not take long to see a vast improvement both in the amount of scum you have and the criminal element.
75

Trade-wind,

USA 11/03/2008 01:28:59
#100
First the 1% you speak of being our population.
How many of them are not citizens but elements from other countries here committing crimes.
Second, if they are in prison it is because of the liberal socialist Democrats who don't want to punish anyone, and especially not with the death penalty.
Why? Well if we don't treat any person who has committed a crime against society badly, then when they are caught doing something illegal we won't deal harshly with them either. The liberals are covering their own asses plane and simple. I don't think I'll be caught, hummm but if I am I don't want them to throw me in jail, or certainly not the death penalty. Smoothing the road for themselves just in case. Worked for the Kennedy clan, Ted get to serve his sentence in Congress.
The rest were gunned down by their own kind. Look at what that influence has done to the US in fifty years.
76

Snowman,

Whistler, BC 11/03/2008 07:24:20
400 hundred crime bosses with an estimated wealth of 440 million pounds? Just over a million each, chicken feed; that's just over two million dollars, that wont even buy a four bedroom house in West Vancouver, Canada's richest neighbourhood average house price three point four million dollars or a good ski-in, ski-out on Whistler mountain. These guys will have to stop robbing piggy-banks and start following the rael money.
77

tassiestag,

rosebery 11/03/2008 09:42:06
what can i say to that?
78

Drek,

Edinburgh 11/03/2008 09:42:45
Ah, but these people just came here to fill a few low paid jobs. Harmless really eh?
79

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 11/03/2008 13:33:16
103...If I am not mistaken you are unimpressed...

 

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