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Hospital staff too busy to wash hands says NHS chief

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Published Date: 28 May 2009
A SENIOR Lothian health official has suggested some hospital staff are simply too busy to wash their hands.
NHS Lothian Health Board vice-chairman Eddie Egan was speaking as it emerged that in certain departments, almost a quarter of staff are failing to wash their hands regularly.

The simple hygiene measure is seen as a key tool in the fight against superbugs.

New figures show that while some Lothian departments hit 98 per cent "compliance" with handwashing, others were as low as 77 per cent. At the same time, board members were told, cases of the potentially fatal C.difficile bug have gone up in the last month.

And while medical director Dr Charles Swainson suggested tougher action against staff who did not follow the guidelines, Mr Egan hit back, blaming over-worked staff and even poor sink facilities.

"If people are not following policy I have no problem with personal conversations.

"But sometimes the nature of the work means people are rushing about because thousands of people are coming through the doors and facilities are not up to scratch.

"That's why we are hitting 77 per cent in some parts and 98 per cent in others."

Dr Swainson is known to be furious that failure of such a simple and old-fashioned procedure could undo other good work which has taken place to tackle superbugs.

He is also aware of the damage bad statistics can do, after it emerged in 2006 that Lothian was the worst health board in Scotland for C.diff deaths, when 40 people lost their lives.

He told the meeting: "The good manners on this subject which has been in place is now coming to an end, and I'm losing patience with some areas of this."

Health Secretary Nicola Sturgeon has demanded a "zero tolerance" approach towards handwashing compliance, though Dr Swainson said at the meeting: "I don't think we've fully worked out what zero tolerance means, but if you work for the NHS you are expected to follow our procedures, and this one particularly, to the letter."

Handwashing compliance is monitored randomly by surveillance teams, who compile results from various departments across a range of time frames.

Board members were told that in April there were 87 cases of C.diff, up from 72 in March and 59 February – which was the lowest number in five years.

Despite the rise, bosses said it was still lower than the Scottish average, and that the health board is well on target to meet Scottish government targets when they come into play in 2011.


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  • Last Updated: 28 May 2009 10:15 AM
  • Source: Edinburgh Evening News
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Health of the NHS
 
1

Grumpy,

28/05/2009 12:07:15
Nothing in this article suggests that nurses fail to wash their hands - could it be that the failures are perhaps administrative & management staff whose roles are not strictly patient care?
2

john3,

28/05/2009 12:08:27
What a load of handwash. The problem nowadays that matron does not float around with her veil billowing. I was too terrified not to have everything immaculate including my hands. We did not have so much time for chatting and socialising. Nursing came first.
3

alfonsa pedrosa,

embra 28/05/2009 12:09:51
I think Eddie Egan must be speaking on behalf of himself and his mates,nurses are spotless.
4

Jam Tarts 1874,

On the Rebound 28/05/2009 12:26:18
This guy Egan is making ridiculous excuses. My late father and my mother both contracted MRSA during spells in hospital.

I have spent enough time as a visitor in hospitals to know that staff are lazy and irresponsible. They don't follow proceedures relating to their own hygene, or the visiting proceedures designed to stop the spread of diseases.

On every visit to hospital I see lots of nurses and doctors with plenty time to be having a laugh and discussing their plans for the weekend, also seen plenty of nurses blethering away on their mobiles. To say they don't have time to was their hands is preposterous.
5

Up the NWO,

28/05/2009 12:30:49
Scary stuff.
6

The Barred O' Leith,

East Kilbride 28/05/2009 12:40:51
Maybe the introduction of the sanitising spray has something to do with it? Empty bottles, taps no longer required, stagnant water etc.
7

Ecto,

28/05/2009 12:49:01
wash your hands or be sacked, simples!
8

antifa,

28/05/2009 12:55:12
"I have spent enough time as a visitor in hospitals to know that staff are lazy and irresponsible."

Nothing like using the benefit of anonymity to make ridiculous and offensive generalisations is there?
9

The Perfect Storm,

Edinburgh 28/05/2009 12:57:30
This is a serious issue and those caught not following this very simple procedure should be given a formal warning. I don't care how many thousands of people are running through the door - if I were a patient in a hospital and caught anybody trying to place their unwashed hands anywhere near me it would probably be the last thing they ever did. Incompetence at its highest level.
10

Spock,

28/05/2009 13:27:18
If the staff can't take responsibility for their personal hygene then they should be sacked.

The best thing patients can do now is to assert themselves by saying to any medic going near them:- "Don't come near me until you have washed your hands"
11

antifa,

28/05/2009 13:42:01
10 - "Incompetence at its highest level."

I don't know, I reckon you could go several levels better. Tell me, what vacuous line of work are you in?
12

NorT,

Edinburgh 28/05/2009 14:14:01
What the article doesn't say is that Mr Egan is the Employee director. That is why he is trying to make excuses for them. There should be no excuse. Wash your hands no matter how busy you are or suffer disciplinary action.
13

Incandescent,

28/05/2009 15:25:45
#9 antifa

"Nothing like using the benefit of anonymity to make ridiculous and offensive generalisations is there?"

Well, you would certainly know that antifa, having had just such a post deleted from #22 on the empty shops thread, not by me I should add.

That said, you're absolutely right on this one. In my experience a very large proportion of people leaving a certain hospital at the finish of evening visiting time are a right sight and far and away the most likely candidates to have brought in infections. What really amazes me is that most of them leave in cars, though they look one step away from being homeless.
14

Toxteth O' Grady,

edinburgh 28/05/2009 15:50:23
The amount of staff finishing their shift and not taking off their uniform beggars belief. You would not believe the amount of cross contamination you get in one shift.
It's a sackable offence, but they still do it.
Doctors who wear ties too, the amount of gunk they pick up is minging!
15

Puzzler,

Edinburgh 28/05/2009 16:15:39
Being busy is no excuse for not following basic hygiene procedure.

My wife when pregnany had to stay in hospital for medical reasons. She insisted upon taking cleaning materials of her own, which she used whenever she used the toilets or bathrooms. She was one of the few women who left hospital without a urinary infection and remember - these are healthy pregnant women, not ones suffering from debilitating diseases.

I once came acros a cleaner using hot water alone to mop a floor. She told me that it was always done that way.

Standards are low and something needs to be done
16

Foo,

28/05/2009 16:17:00
Worlds stickiest bogey? Toxteth O' Grady, USA

17

,

28/05/2009 16:27:48
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
18

Toxteth O' Grady,

edinburgh 28/05/2009 17:04:44
#18

thanks foo, I'm in the "daily mirror big book of facts" if you wanna see my other achievements
19

Artemis,

28/05/2009 17:38:27
#3,#13 - what the article doesn't say is that Eddie Egan is a nurse, or was. He knows what he's talking about.
20

Incandescent,

28/05/2009 19:15:00
#16 Toxteth

No danger of cross-contamination by not changing out of uniform when they finish a shift...unless they then wear the same one for the next shift. This is a common misconception because people who see it usually not around to see the staff in question coming in for their next shift in civvies.
21

sceptic,

livingston 28/05/2009 19:29:32
10% of patients are there due to hospital acquired infections. A few cleaner hands and a reduction in the 25% of slow moving clinically obese staff would soon reduce the workload.
22

Toast,

28/05/2009 19:45:25
Time to make unhygenic behaviour ground for automatic dismissal
23

The real dracula,

28/05/2009 19:47:33
What a load of garbage some of you have written. I work on a very busy dept and I manage to wash my hands between every single patient every single time ,,,,,see I dont want to catch anything from THEM either. And I can assure the person who moaned about personal hygiene my standard of hygiene is way way better than most patients ( and were talking about people who can have a wash they just choose not to) We are frequently at risk of catching scabies and nits ,,,,,,not nice is it , what WE are subjected to.

And I can assure you we rarely have time for breaks let alone chat about our plans for socialising. mobile phones are not allowed.
Dont know where you get your views from but it certainely isnt the reality that I work in.

How typical of the armchair observers to voice their unreal opinions. if you actually worked alongside us I might listen to your gripes but you DONT so what you have written is nonsensical garbage designed to cause bad feeling ,,,,,,,,,,,how juvenile.
24

The real dracula,

28/05/2009 19:49:40
As for uniforms I have seen plenty nursing home workers out shopping in uniform but no hospital staff ever.
Seems my experience different from yours ,,,,,,,,yep mine isnt embellished (oops did I say that out loud)
25

The real dracula,

28/05/2009 19:55:39
Oh and one last thing Im pretty disgusted and amazed at the vile dirty state that visitors come in with ,,,,,,I would hazard a guess that their the ones bringing the infections in. many look like they dont know what soap and water is and I question whether their clothes have seen a washing machine. That and picking their nose , coughing and the ultimate ,,,,spitting. Oh and then they touch the medical equipment spreading their dirt everywhere.

Oh and the amount of non workers I see in the toilets walking out without washing their hands ,,,,,,vile absolutely vile.

They should be ashamed at the bugs they are spreading round the hospital while palming the blame off on the staff ,,,,,,,well sorry it doesnt work , we know you are dirtier than us.
26

ellie2,

28/05/2009 20:13:40
Thanks the real dracula for saying it exactly how it is. My hands are raw from handwashing, yesterday I would have washed them 50+ times and I would never go anywhere near a patient without washing them. Visitors are filthy - touching drips/dressings, sitting on beds, crowding 5 visitors round a bed, bringing children into visit relatives - also the number of patients that refuse to wash properly is obscene, they won't be responsible for giving someone else an infection but will happily sue if they caught anything from the hospital. 99% of NHS workers are breaking their backs and running themselves into the ground to keep the service running and are not the lazy eejits some of you seem to think they are.
27

The real dracula,

28/05/2009 20:26:07
Funny how our tales are totally different Ellie. Still the armchair commenters wont have it they think they are right,,,,,which as you know is quite dangerous as they will continue to deny they spread some of the infection,,,,,,,isnt ignorance bliss!!!!!
I cant remember a time I HAVENT washed my hands. You are right many people are more filthy than my animals and I mean filthy , you can smell the filth.

And as you know its very very unpleasant and dangerous.
28

noswod,

Honestas 28/05/2009 21:30:38
When I wemt into the ERI (Edinburgh Royal Infirmary) in the 1960's wit ya where faced with vis wad the smell O blench. The Sister and Matron wad say wash yer hands its Listers system frae sropping infection. Ya gotta kill the bugs A4 they kill you. 49 years later our bettter paid nurses and PFIed Hospitals seem tae O forgotten the rules O Mr Lister and prevention On Hospital infections. Some may say its symtomatic O the decline of the moral capital and intellectual capital O the Scottisn Nation
29

,

28/05/2009 22:27:49
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
30

krusty the klown,

28/05/2009 23:16:41
#30 or maybe just ignorance and complacency that assumes that hospital staff don't actually carry bacteria and that if there is a problem anti-bios will solve all. Please don't try to suggest that people did not get infections in hospitals in the 1960's/ You'll just make more of a t!t of yourself
31

The real dracula,

29/05/2009 01:42:10
#32 I would hope that by now everyone would realise that anyone can carry the bugs patients staff or visitors in equal measure.
However I think many dont realise that these bugs exist outside the hospital too and indeed some folk can and do unknowingly bring them in with them.

It is while they are in hospital that the MRSA cdiff is discovered due to tests . So of course the hospital is going to have a higher incidence due to discovery more thn anything.

Im sure you know that many of us can and do have MRSA living on us harmlessly. This is then discovered when patients are routinely swabbed.

MRSA is not JUST introduced by staff but by patients , staff and visitors.

Ive lost count of the times Ive asked visitors to wash their hands , stop touching equipment , cover their mouth and nose when coughing or sneezing and not to touch their friend relatives wound or drip.

Unbelieveable you would think so ,,,,, but it happens several times a day , every day.
32

breehill,

CA 29/05/2009 04:04:57
I just found this video on You Tube that really shows how germs and viruses spread. It is so cool. Its meant for kids but I even learned a lot!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56mq1t1BqfY
33

Nurse a4c,

29/05/2009 10:26:28
I find some of these coments very offensive. Eddie is a nurse and knows what he is on about. Some of the older hospital sites in Lothian do not have the same facilities as RIE or St Johns. Staff work very hard in Lothian to keep standards high. Some of you morons need to do a shift with us nurses to see how hard we and other health staff work.
34

The real dracula,

30/05/2009 09:40:12
#35 you are wasting your breath all these negative commenters on here just want to have a go .
They wouldnt last 2 minutes of a shift ,,,,I would love to see them try.
35

yrrabwally,

east lothian 01/06/2009 19:46:28
while my mum was in hospital I personally witnessed nurses/doctors/consultants, going from patient to patient WITHOUT washing their hands. My mum contracted various infections while she was in hospital the worst being clostridium difficile which eventually killed her. I think most of the staff do a great job,but there are still nurses etc NOT following basic hygiene procedures.NOT washing hands,NOT wearing gloves/aprons when dealing with patients A nurse sat on my mum's pillow on the floor to dress her legs,then proceeded to put the pillow on my mum's chair for her to sit on!!She was not happy when I pulled her up about this.To be fair I have also witnessed people not washing their hands after using the public toilets.DISGUSTING
36

Joe Macdelta.,

02/06/2009 18:49:57
#34 It dos not matter what hospital you work in, you can work as hard as you like, but if you fail in basic hygiene then its all for nothing, with no excuse.

 

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